Moving super before relocating to uk

[scuffythetugboat]

Thank you .... Thats good to know... I might just take them both out and pay the Aussie tax on them.... I topped up my UK pension to the 30 years years back so I expect a full pension there....although I think they might have extended it to 35 years . I came to Aussie in 97 so you say I can ask for that time too 2001 to be taken into account ? If not I might top it up..

thanks again for your advice..

 

Be careful. Paying tax on your lump sum in Australia may not mean that you won't have to pay more tax in the UK. Residency for tax purposes is the key to it, so find out the facts first.

[Marisawright]

Be careful. Paying tax on your lump sum in Australia may not mean that you won't have to pay more tax in the UK. Residency for tax purposes is the key to it, so find out the facts first.

 

He's talking about taking the lump sums BEFORE he leaves Australia. Once the money is in the Australian bank it's just money.

[Keith and Linda]

Does anyone know what the process is for transferring my oz super funds to the UK when I go back later this year ? I am 57 this year and eligible to access my super at 55... I have two funds with a value of approx 650 k.. Think of leaving one of the funds here and would try to leave it until I am 60... I believe that would save on tax implications in oz.... Really dont know which way to go ? Would anybody have an idea of what you must do with the fund assets once they are in the UK ?

 

I would agree with what others have said regarding financial advice on this especially with the amount involved, but a couple of things come to my mind and the first is why have two funds? you are paying two account fees. Secondly turning 60 does not I believe give you access to lump sums, it gives you the opportunity to open a 'transition to retirement' pension fund but lump sum payments are not allowed until you reach retirement age.

The rules are further complicated (and potentially costly) for when you are a non resident, and that applies to both lump sums and pension payments from super in how they are treated for tax purposes in both Aus & UK. However your Super fund should be able to give some basic advice on this for free (at least mine does) however you may have to pay them for more detailed financial advice regarding Aus Super/pension rules. This link may give you some guidance https://www.ato.gov.au/Individuals/Super/In-detail/Withdrawing-and-paying-tax/Withdrawing-your-super-and-paying-tax/

[Thom]

i've been back over two years and my GESB pension has grown & better than my UK pensions in the same period. I'm not worried at all that two of my pension funds are in Australia

-

 

 

Can I ask how you manage your Australian pensions from overseas? I think we may end up doing that.

[NickyNook]

Secondly turning 60 does not I believe give you access to lump sums, it gives you the opportunity to open a 'transition to retirement' pension fund but lump sum payments are not allowed until you reach retirement age.

 

There's nothing to stop someone retiring at 60 and receiving a lump sum. The cashing restrictions relate to retirement status not age.

[Keith and Linda]

There's nothing to stop someone retiring at 60 and receiving a lump sum. The cashing restrictions relate to retirement status not age.

 

But you still cannot automatically get a lump sum at age 60, However if you meet certain criteria such as preservation age, and have a medical condition or severe hardship ( https://www.ato.gov.au/Individuals/Super/Accessing-your-super/ ), it is possible. Though if you were a temp resident you can get the full amount payment, if you had permanent residency or citizenship then the super taxation rules apply

[NickyNook]

But you still cannot automatically get a lump sum at age 60

 

You can if you're retired...

 

It says quite clearly in your link that you can access your super:

 

 

• when you turn 65 (even if you haven’t retired), or

• when you reach preservation age and retire, or

• under the transition to retirement rules, while continuing to work.

 

 

And everyone (currently) will meet the preservation age at 60.

[Keith and Linda]

You can if you're retired...

 

It says quite clearly in your link that you can access your super:

 

 

• when you turn 65 (even if you haven’t retired), or

• when you reach preservation age and retire, or

• under the transition to retirement rules, while continuing to work.

 

 

And everyone (currently) meets the preservation age at 60.

 

Still has to be special circumstance - You can access your super:

 

 

• when you turn 65 (even if you haven’t retired), or

• when you reach preservation age and retire, or

• under the transition to retirement rules, while continuing to work.

 

There are very limited circumstances where you can access your super savings early. These circumstances are mainly related to specific medical conditions or severe financial hardship.

Your preservation age is not the same as your pension age. Your preservation age is the age at which you can access your super if you are retired (or have started a transition to a retirement income stream).

The poster asking the question is not retiring just moving country and that is the given information I am working to. He needs better financial advice than he is receiving with all the mixed responses being posted on here, would you not agree?

[Marisawright]

I would agree with what others have said regarding financial advice on this especially with the amount involved, but a couple of things come to my mind and the first is why have two funds? you are paying two account fees. Secondly turning 60 does not I believe give you access to lump sums, it gives you the opportunity to open a 'transition to retirement' pension fund but lump sum payments are not allowed until you reach retirement age.

The rules are further complicated (and potentially costly) for when you are a non resident, and that applies to both lump sums and pension payments from super in how they are treated for tax purposes in both Aus & UK.

 

If you read my posts, that's exactly what I have been pointing out - that's why I'm saying that if he wants to take the lump sum, it's absolutely critical to withdraw the money and get it into an Australian bank BEFORE he leaves Australian shores.

 

I am not aware of any obstacle to withdrawing a lump sum from your superannuation at 60. Preservation age is 55.

[scuffythetugboat]

Still has to be special circumstance - You can access your super:

 

 

• when you turn 65 (even if you haven’t retired), or

• when you reach preservation age and retire, or

• under the transition to retirement rules, while continuing to work.

 

There are very limited circumstances where you can access your super savings early. These circumstances are mainly related to specific medical conditions or severe financial hardship.

Your preservation age is not the same as your pension age. Your preservation age is the age at which you can access your super if you are retired (or have started a transition to a retirement income stream).

The poster asking the question is not retiring just moving country and that is the given information I am working to. He needs better financial advice than he is receiving with all the mixed responses being posted on here, would you not agree?

 

 

The advice I have been given by my Superannuation fund is that if I retire from the workforce in Australia and I am over 60 then I can take the whole amount with no tax deduction. I can go where I like after that and work in another country if I choose, so long as I don't work in Australia again.

[Marisawright]

The advice I have been given by my Superannuation fund is that if I retire from the workforce in Australia and I am over 60 then I can take the whole amount with no tax deduction. I can go where I like after that and work in another country if I choose, so long as I don't work in Australia again.

 

Exactly. In fact, I've been told that even if you retire and take your lump sum, you are still entitled to change your mind and go back to work in Australia in the future. They won't come chasing after you to get the money back. They recognise that people's circumstances change.

[Keith and Linda]

Exactly. In fact, I've been told that even if you retire and take your lump sum, you are still entitled to change your mind and go back to work in Australia in the future. They won't come chasing after you to get the money back. They recognise that people's circumstances change.

 

Lets hope they do then! The poster did not say he was retiring just that he was leaving the country the only relevant part of tax/super I knew about that is for non-permanent residents along with Aus citizens.

PS, do you think they may chase after you for the tax element though?

[Marisawright]

Lets hope they do then! The poster did not say he was retiring just that he was leaving the country the only relevant part of tax/super I knew about that is for non-permanent residents along with Aus citizens.

PS, do you think they may chase after you for the tax element though?

 

In order to leave the country he will have to give up his job! So it will be his last job in Australia, and that's all that matters.

 

What tax element are you referring to? If you mean the usual tax that's payable if a 57-year-old withdraws a lump sum, then I'm not sure what happens - I suspect the super fund may deduct it.

 

Anyhow, that's why it's so important to get it all sorted before he leaves the country, so there's no question of whether he's resident or non-resident etc.

[Keith and Linda]

In order to leave the country he will have to give up his job! So it will be his last job in Australia, and that's all that matters.

 

What tax element are you referring to? If you mean the usual tax that's payable if a 57-year-old withdraws a lump sum, then I'm not sure what happens - I suspect the super fund may deduct it.

 

Anyhow, that's why it's so important to get it all sorted before he leaves the country, so there's no question of whether he's resident or non-resident etc.

 

The tax man works in mysterious ways and his sniffer dogs too........... agreed and as already said expert advise is needed.

[STEVEPEACOCK]

I would agree that this is something that needs research, I am being made redundant in the near future so option of gaining PR after 4 years on a 457 now a none runner. I am over 55 and was under the impression that I could access 1st 180k tax free (I must have read that in the financial pages) however after consulting my fund today they advise that is for residents & none residents are taxed at 35%. That's on to of 15% taken off contributions !!

[Marisawright]

I would agree that this is something that needs research, I am being made redundant in the near future so option of gaining PR after 4 years on a 457 now a none runner. I am over 55 and was under the impression that I could access 1st 180k tax free (I must have read that in the financial pages) however after consulting my fund today they advise that is for residents & none residents are taxed at 35%. That's on to of 15% taken off contributions !!

 

Yes, non-residents are taxed very differently, which is why I've been advising the OP to get his super out of the fund while he's still a resident.

[Marisawright]

The tax man works in mysterious ways and his sniffer dogs too........... agreed and as already said expert advise is needed.

 

I'm still mystified what tax you think the tax man would be after - I'm not suggesting he avoids paying the tax due on withdrawing between 55 and 60. What other tax is there?

[Keith and Linda]

I'm still mystified what tax you think the tax man would be after - I'm not suggesting he avoids paying the tax due on withdrawing between 55 and 60. What other tax is there?

 

I think you may have answered this with your post in response to STEVEPEACOCK. If he is leaving the country for good he will no longer be a resident. There may be ways around it by how to time things and maybe by not being entirely truthful.

[Marisawright]

I think you may have answered this with your post in response to STEVEPEACOCK. If he is leaving the country for good he will no longer be a resident. There may be ways around it by how to time things and maybe by not being entirely truthful.

 

The clue is in what you've written. If he is leaving the country for good he WILL no longer be a resident - in the future. If he withdraws the money fulfilling all the legal requirements WHILE HE IS STILL RESIDENT, what he does in the future is irrelevant.

[Keith and Linda]

The clue is in what you've written. If he is leaving the country for good he WILL no longer be a resident - in the future. If he withdraws the money fulfilling all the legal requirements WHILE HE IS STILL RESIDENT, what he does in the future is irrelevant.

 

the op on this said he was leaving the country and wanted to cash in his super (well 1 anyway) and take the money with him. based on that info he would be hit for tax would he not? change what you tell the tax man but your intent is still to as original plan! Tax avoidance? tax evasion?

[Marisawright]

the op on this said he was leaving the country and wanted to cash in his super (well 1 anyway) and take the money with him. based on that info he would be hit for tax would he not? change what you tell the tax man but your intent is still to as original plan! Tax avoidance? tax evasion?

 

IF the OP is resident in Australia, and notifies his superannuation company that he is leaving his job and will not take any further employment in Australia (which is true), then he is eligible to take a superannuation lump sum because he has reached his preservation age. No lies necessary.

 

He will have to pay tax on that because he is not 60 yet, and I am not suggesting he try to avoid that.

 

If however he waits until he is no longer resident in Australia, the whole picture changes and he might face tax as a non-resident. So that's why it's important to carry out the whole transaction while he's still resident and therefore it is all perfectly legal. If he does that, it is irrelevant whether he subsequently leaves the country or not.