paulv

Just because people work hard it doesn't mean they can't be misguided or wrong about something. You were the one making generalisations, and you've done it again.

Arguing from a false supposition - as if there aren't genuine points worth debating!!

You sound like a s*****ist. They don't like them in these parts.

But we do trade with both at present! And we are not stopped from trading with 'x' just because we also trade with 'y'.

Again it's a case of what do you want? We have an ageing population that is living longer - it has to be paid for and currently at least 40% of welfare is spent on pensions. We have better healthcare so previously fatal conditions can now be treated and life expectancy is longer. We have an economic system that demands continual growth at all cost - look at the way 'business' is explicitly pushed as the primary cause of concern for both major political parties regardless of voters concerns being more about the social cost of immigration We have a generally overskilled workforce with not enough Brits wanting to do the low pay, or manual work needed. We have a very small manufacturing industry - so no products to sell abroad to improve trade figures. Something has to give so we either rethink what we want economically, or we rethink what we want politically and socially. Some people want to have their cake and eat it and at the moment that is not possible.

Why are you getting your knickers in a twist? Churchill fought against Mussolini. So does that make him a lefty as was originally intimated of anyone who called out fascists?

Do you kiss your mother with that mouth?

UKIP want less regulation in the markets (as if the banking scandal never happened), they want a flat rate of tax which benefits the highest earners the most, and they want us to stop giving aid to our commonwealth cousins. This is isolationism, and corporatism - they want corporations to have little to no interference from govts so tax avoidance will not be tackled, small businesses will be further squeezed by large ones that can avoid tax legally. I'm not sure how our african and asian commonwealth countries can replace the huge trade we do with the EU - the last figures I can find show that trade with the Commonwealth accounts for just over 10% of imports and less than 9% of exports.

I'd like to see how much we trade with Commonwealth countries and how this is going to take up the slack for whatever we may lose if we leave the EU...

So Churchill was left wing now?

You need to try and relax a little Thom, so much pent up anger in there. Google is your friend - try it, it's amazing what you can find if you put the time in.

I thought Cameron and Milliband showed how monolithic and tribal their parties are. The election will see a massive change in the political landscape as coalitions are most likely to be the norm from here on in as we have all had enough of finger pointing and hand wrenching. The SNP did themselves a great favour last night and Tories are all over the press being nice about them this morning. I wonder why that is? I thought Plaid Cymru and Greens did themsleves no harm too. As for UKIP - they showed how lacking in any policy they really are, and how little they have to offer after blaming immigration, the EU, and foreign aid for all our problems. There was even a bit of thinly veiled homophobia thrown in for good measure to keep the core vote happy too!

"Having looked at all the information, they calculated that "6.8% of the UK's land area is now classified as urban" (a definition that includes rural development and roads, by the way). The urban landscape accounts for 10.6% of England, 1.9% of Scotland, 3.6% of Northern Ireland and 4.1% of Wales. Put another way, that means almost 93% of the UK is not urban. But even that isn't the end of the story because urban is not the same as built on. In urban England, for example, the researchers found that just over half the land (54%) in our towns and cities is greenspace - parks, allotments, sports pitches and so on. Furthermore, domestic gardens account for another 18% of urban land use; rivers, canals, lakes and reservoirs an additional 6.6%. Their conclusion? In England, "78.6% of urban areas is designated as natural rather than built". Since urban only covers a tenth of the country, this means that the proportion of England's landscape which is built on is…" http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-18623096

We can pick on many things that x government did wrong - money wasted, soldiers sent to wars that only benefit oil and construction companies, IT projects over running etc. But these are the mistakes that all governments make - and hindsight is a wonderful thing. By all means vote UKIP but don't buy the propaganda about labour causing the GFC as it was a worldwide crisis and we came out of it much better than might have been because us taxpayers bailed out the banks. Look at borrowing figures and they were well within average range up until 2007/8 when the crisi hit / and its increased ever since. Only this morning the Tories were blaming the GFC for poor growth in the last 5 years so even they know they are being disingenuous blaming Labour. i too care about those in need in the UK but you can bet your bottom dollar any money supposedly 'saved' from foreign aid will be lost in tax breaks for businesses that already avoid tax - your old and infirm loved ones will be left to the dogs.

I hear you about Labour and UKIP also most likely to usurp them where I live but for me UKIP have no policies that will benefit the working class in the North - otherwise they wouldnt be bankrolled by finance and housing developers as they are. They just want more of the same as the Tories do - and its hard to tell the difference between Labour and the Tories on most policies.

But you say you'd vote UKIP as a protest. And if they deliver the referendum and we stay in the EU - then where does that party go?

I guess it depends where you choose to look. Whilst the exchange rate may fluctuate i don't think your money would be so wildly affected - 25% depreciation is almost unheard of for major currencies and as we are such a good bet on the bonds market there would be no run on the pound like there was on Black Wednesday.

It is a quaint little town aye - but beware the snow as it tends to get lots of it! If you do get here I would recommend Bakewell too, as well as places like Hathersage and the Ladybower Reservoir which is where the Dambusters practiced with 'Bouncing Bombs' before they used them in Germany. They have a flyover by Lancaster bombers each year to commemorate this event.

Would you be satisfied if the public said 'lets stay in'?

What do you think/hope UKIP will do for those in your position Danny?

Less than 10% of the UK is developed. There is PLENTY of space for more house building etc so this argument is not really relevant. The economic system we follow demands continual economic growth and for that you need more consumers and more workers. Present birth rates do not provide for this so migration is a necessity for living standards to improve. Therein lies the quandary. We cannot demand more prosperity, better living standards, higher wages etc and also want to severely limit immigration. It's not a left v right thing, it's an economics thing and left v right positions are not going to help us sort it out. Re the 'seven new cities' thing, again thats ridiculous to suggest as majority of economic growth has been confined to London and South East and that will continue.

Who cares what investors think? This is where we get things wrong. They are there to make money and not interested in what affects the voters. Whereas as a voter I care about the crime and poverty near me, the library closing, my police and nurse friends being undervalued and squeezed more and more.

Hmm...he may have won the battle but then immediately froze out the Scots who voted to stay together by backing plans to stop their MP's voting on English laws. This may see the SNP back a Labour minority government. Then will he feel like he won?

The population is growing. It's no coincidence that the NHS is overstretched, schools are struggling etc and we have a govt that thinks the best thing for the country is to cut investment Whilst also cutting taxes to the wealthiest people and corporations.

Here is an article that highlights 14 main pillars of fascism. Its amazing how many of these points are seen on a daily basis on this board. But the question is - can you accept that you are a fascist? http://www.ellensplace.net/fascism.html