Brissybear Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 Is that it over for good? I have my permanent residency however the right to return expires in feb 2017. I know you can get resident return visa but the main one requires you to have lived in Oz 2 of the last 5 years when you apply as a pr. I lived in Brissy from 2008 to 2012 when I left but only 5 months as permanent resident before that I was on a temp spouse visa (NZ) citizen. Back home I have since met a new partner and we have had a wee girl together who is now 16 months. The problem is we have a step daughter who will not be 16 until June next year. I am desperate to go back to Oz but we can't do anything until my step daughter is 16. My partners dad and half sister are Australian citizens living in Brisbane. I am going to put my partner and the girls on my visa as Spouse 309 (100) visa. However the clock is ticking and I just can't see us having the money to pay for the visa's in time. If you don't return after the travel date expires is that really the end ? Is there nothing you can do? Also could you apply onshore? My OH dad would put us up and help financially but it would mean putting everyone on cheaper tourist visas while waiting on the visas being processed. Anyway hope you are all good first time poster! Any advice greatly appreciated x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calNgary Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 just bumping your post for you Cal x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozmaniac Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 No, it isn't necessarily 'over for good' when your right to return expires. As you've seen, the standard RRV is a 5 year one which you get without any further requirements if you've lived for at least 2 out of the previous 5 in Australia on a permanent visa but for people who have spent less time than that in Australia (even if their right of re-entry has expired), there are still 1 year and 3 month RRVs. They're not as easy to get as the 5 year variety, but provided you can satisfy the processing officer that you should have one, a 1 year or 3 month RRV is still possible and that would allow you to re-enter Australia as a PR. The granting of 1 year and 3 month RRVs is very subjective with all manner of undefined terms like 'compelling', 'substantial', 'benefit to Australia' so it will depend on how well you present your application. It shouldn't cost much to get advice from a good RMA to make sure you make the best possible application. http://www.immi.gov.au/Visas/Pages/155-157.aspx See Visa applicants > Who could get this visa for conditions of shorter RRVs If you get an RRV and stay for 2 years, you will then be able to get a 5 year RRV, or, when you've met the citizenship residency requirements (not out of Australia for longer than 1 year in total in the 4 years immediately before applying including not more than 90 days in the last year), apply for citizenship which provides a permanent solution to the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brissybear Posted January 9, 2015 Author Share Posted January 9, 2015 No, it isn't necessarily 'over for good' when your right to return expires. As you've seen, the standard RRV is a 5 year one which you get without any further requirements if you've lived for at least 2 out of the previous 5 in Australia on a permanent visa but for people who have spent less time than that in Australia (even if their right of re-entry has expired), there are still 1 year and 3 month RRVs. They're not as easy to get as the 5 year variety, but provided you can satisfy the processing officer that you should have one, a 1 year or 3 month RRV is still possible and that would allow you to re-enter Australia as a PR. The granting of 1 year and 3 month RRVs is very subjective with all manner of undefined terms like 'compelling', 'substantial', 'benefit to Australia' so it will depend on how well you present your application. It shouldn't cost much to get advice from a good RMA to make sure you make the best possible application. http://www.immi.gov.au/Visas/Pages/155-157.aspx See Visa applicants > Who could get this visa for conditions of shorter RRVs If you get an RRV and stay for 2 years, you will then be able to get a 5 year RRV, or, when you've met the citizenship residency requirements (not out of Australia for longer than 1 year in total in the 4 years immediately before applying including not more than 90 days in the last year), apply for citizenship which provides a permanent solution to the problem. Thanks for the reply! Yeah I am genuinely staring to worry about my health around this issue. It's like a black cloud hanging over me thinking I could lose it. Would you apply for these shorter RRV visa's from the UK or would you plead your case at the airport? Another worry I have is my step daughter. Do you wait until she is 16 before applying as a dependent or after she is 16? I've been told as long as she is 16 when the visa is issued then there should be no problem but other people have told me that even though she is 16 we will need some sort of court order that says she can decide who she wants to live with legally. The court order is a bit of a grey area as I was given advice that it was nothing more than a letter from a lawyer to an actual order from a judge? Really confusing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
engaus Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 Thanks for the reply! Yeah I am genuinely staring to worry about my health around this issue. It's like a black cloud hanging over me thinking I could lose it. Would you apply for these shorter RRV visa's from the UK or would you plead your case at the airport? Another worry I have is my step daughter. Do you wait until she is 16 before applying as a dependent or after she is 16? I've been told as long as she is 16 when the visa is issued then there should be no problem but other people have told me that even though she is 16 we will need some sort of court order that says she can decide who she wants to live with legally. The court order is a bit of a grey area as I was given advice that it was nothing more than a letter from a lawyer to an actual order from a judge? Really confusing. Definitely don't try at the airport - you wouldn't even be allowed on a plane if your travel right had expired on your visa. You apply for a RRV before you book your flights and I believe that you provide as much evidence as you can and they grant you a RRV - it's length will depend on the evidence you supply (that's if you don't meet the 2 years in 5). I can't help with the question you have about your step daughter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozmaniac Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 You can apply for your RRV in Australia or overseas but you can't turn up at the airport needing one. According to a recent post by @wrussell who is a knowledgeable and respected RMA, if you want to travel to Australia and apply there for an RRV, you must get an ETA to travel to Australia and you must apply for the ETA at an Australian visa office outside Australia. You cannot lodge the ETA application online or through an airline or an approved agent. If you do it the wrong way, you risk cancellation of your permanent visa - in most cases, the grant of a new visa cancels any previous visa. http://www.pomsinoz.com/forum/migration-issues/224455-resident-return-evisitor-visa.html#post1936655156 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lebourvellec Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 Your step daughter would need to be 16 at time of visa granted not to require other parents permission to leave UK. Offshore partner visas take about 10-14 months to process. If you plan it right you could have visas granted after she is 16 with still 6 months on your own visa. Prob look to apply nearer the end of this year nov time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brissybear Posted January 9, 2015 Author Share Posted January 9, 2015 You can apply for your RRV in Australia or overseas but you can't turn up at the airport needing one. According to a recent post by @wrussell who is a knowledgeable and respected RMA, if you want to travel to Australia and apply there for an RRV, you must get an ETA to travel to Australia and you must apply for the ETA at an Australian visa office outside Australia. You cannot lodge the ETA application online or through an airline or an approved agent. If you do it the wrong way, you risk cancellation of your permanent visa - in most cases, the grant of a new visa cancels any previous visa. http://www.pomsinoz.com/forum/migration-issues/224455-resident-return-evisitor-visa.html#post1936655156 Thanks so much for the information. What is an ETA btw? My PR was originally granted in 2012 however I was back for 10 days on 2014. This seems as if I have 5 years to get a RRV from last year as a former permanent resident. However you can't apply to sponsor spouse etc as a former resident. If my partner gets her divorce money through then we can easily afford to apply in November and that's the perfect scenario. However I can't see that happening. Does anyone know what evidence you need to supply for a 16 year old from the UK? Is it just a letter from a lawyer or do you have to go to court? Thanks again but it's looking more and more likely that without getting the money we won't be able to do this. The only other thing I could think of was I fly back before my visa expires and apply for my partner and the girls while they are in the UK ? Can this be done ? I was thinking they could come over on 3 month holiday visas while the applications were being processed but they would need to offshore if they were granted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozmaniac Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Thanks so much for the information. What is an ETA btw? My PR was originally granted in 2012 however I was back for 10 days on 2014. This seems as if I have 5 years to get a RRV from last year as a former permanent resident. However you can't apply to sponsor spouse etc as a former resident. If my partner gets her divorce money through then we can easily afford to apply in November and that's the perfect scenario. However I can't see that happening. Does anyone know what evidence you need to supply for a 16 year old from the UK? Is it just a letter from a lawyer or do you have to go to court? Thanks again but it's looking more and more likely that without getting the money we won't be able to do this. The only other thing I could think of was I fly back before my visa expires and apply for my partner and the girls while they are in the UK ? Can this be done ? I was thinking they could come over on 3 month holiday visas while the applications were being processed but they would need to offshore if they were granted. An ETA is an Electronic Travel Authority and is a 3 month Visitor visa. A UK citizen would normally get an eVisitor visa for a stay of up to 3 months as a visitor but they're purely electronic and it seems that a paper application is needed for this purpose, hence the need for an ETA instead. You don't apply for the Partner visa; your partner applies for the visa and you are the sponsor. I think though that just being located in Australia without actually being resident here when your partner applies, could be a problem - not positive about that though. If you could actually move back to Australia before they apply, that would solve the problem. "Thanks again but it's looking more and more likely that without getting the money we won't be able to do this." I think you've overestimated the difficulty of getting an RRV. It all sounds terribly difficult when you read the info on the DIBP site but I've heard of many cases where they appeared to have a very weak case and were still able to get one. And you wouldn't be a 'former permanent resident' - you would still be a PR; you don't lose your PR just by staying out of Australia beyond your travel rights date. I know you've read a post on another thread that seems to indicate that you will lose your PR but that's not how it works. I really think that before you get too depressed about your options or do anything at all, you should consult a highly experienced RMA like @wrussell or @Alan Collett (FYI the first 2 digits of their MARN tell you the year they were registered) for advice. It won't cost much for that kind of consultation and you'll have professional advice that can be relied on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrussell Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Please do not commit yourself to a course of action before you have written professional advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awelter Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 ..... And you wouldn't be a 'former permanent resident' - you would still be a PR; you don't lose your PR just by staying out of Australia beyond your travel rights date. I know you've read a post on another thread that seems to indicate that you will lose your PR but that's not how it works.... Reg. 1.03 http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_reg/mr1994227/s1.03.html "Australian permanent resident" means: (a) in relation to an applicant for a Return (Residence) (Class BB) visa or a Resident Return (Temporary) (Class TP) visa--a non-citizen who is the holder of a permanent visa; or (b) in any other case (other than in the case of an applicant for registration as a migration agent under Part 3 of the Act)--a non-citizen who, being usually resident in Australia, is the holder of a permanent visa. Section 82(5) of the Migration Act http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/ma1958118/s82.html (5) A visa to travel to and enter Australia (whether also a visa to remain in Australia) during a particular period or until a particular date ceases to be in effect at the end of that period or on that date unless the holder of the visa: (a) has entered Australia in that period or on or before that date; and (b) is in Australia at the end of that period or on that date. How do we call a status of a person whose visa has ceased in the way as described above? It is surely true that ETA cannot cancel a PR visa but a visa that has ceased cannot be cancelled by the grant of any other visa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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