33512- Production Manger (manufacturing) need some help

[eddypk]

Hello Guys!

 

I am new to this forum and need your help and guidance.

I intend to submit my skills assessment application to Vetassess as production manager manufacturing (133512) for migration purpose (through state nomination).

 

However, I have little confusion about assessment process and need to ask couple of questions. I hope you will be kind enough to answer these below questions.

 

1. I have a Associate degree as per AQF standards and my occupation (133512) requires a bachelor degree or higher.

But someone told me that at least five years of relevant experience may substitute for the formal qualification under this occupation. Is that true?

I have total 9 years of experience, so is it possible for someone to get positive assessment based on experience (+5 years) without any formal qualification under this occupation?

 

2. If above is true and suppose I get positive assessment (based on my experience) and get full experience points then would Vetassess also consider/evaluate my associate degree and will I get points for AQF Associate degree as well?

 

Thank you for your time.

Hope to hear from you soon.

 

Kind Rgds,

Adnan

[Ozmaniac]

VETASSESS are extremely inflexible. Their skills assessment requirements for a Production Manager (Manufacturing) are:

 

A qualification which is assessed as comparable to the educational level of an Australian Bachelor degree or higher degree, in a field highly relevant to the nominated occupation.

 

In addition to this, applicants must have at least one year of post-qualification employment at an appropriate skill level completed in the last five years which is highly relevant to the nominated occupation. If employment is not post-qualification, then five additional years of highly relevant employment are required.

 

If the degree is not in a highly relevant field, three years of employment at an appropriate skill level completed in the last five years in a field which is highly relevant to the nominated occupation is required. This is reduced to two years if there is an additional qualification at least at AQF Diploma level in a highly relevant field.

 

A positive assessment of both qualifications and employment is required for a positive Skills Assessment Outcome.

 

If you have only an Associate Degree, you don't meet the VETASSESS requirements for a positive skills assessment, regardless of what 'someone' has told you.

[eddypk]

VETASSESS are extremely inflexible. Their skills assessment requirements for a Production Manager (Manufacturing) are:

 

A qualification which is assessed as comparable to the educational level of an Australian Bachelor degree or higher degree, in a field highly relevant to the nominated occupation.

 

In addition to this, applicants must have at least one year of post-qualification employment at an appropriate skill level completed in the last five years which is highly relevant to the nominated occupation. If employment is not post-qualification, then five additional years of highly relevant employment are required.

 

If the degree is not in a highly relevant field, three years of employment at an appropriate skill level completed in the last five years in a field which is highly relevant to the nominated occupation is required. This is reduced to two years if there is an additional qualification at least at AQF Diploma level in a highly relevant field.

 

A positive assessment of both qualifications and employment is required for a positive Skills Assessment Outcome.

 

If you have only an Associate Degree, you don't meet the VETASSESS requirements for a positive skills assessment, regardless of what 'someone' has told you.

 

 

Noted, but on immigration site, it says "This occupation has a level of skill commensurate with a bachelor degree or higher qualification. At least five years of relevant experience may substitute for the formal qualification. In some instances relevant experience and/or on-the-job training may be required in addition to the formal qualification (ANZSCO Skill Level 1)."

 

What does that mean? I mean the part which says "At least five years of relevant experience may substitute for the formal qualification."

 

I though it means, (+5 years) experience in highly relevant field is a substitute for bachelors degree requirements. Which is clearly misunderstood by me. Can you please explain that point.

 

Thanks

[Pumpkin]

Noted, but on immigration site, it says "This occupation has a level of skill commensurate with a bachelor degree or higher qualification. At least five years of relevant experience may substitute for the formal qualification. In some instances relevant experience and/or on-the-job training may be required in addition to the formal qualification (ANZSCO Skill Level 1)."

 

What does that mean? I mean the part which says "At least five years of relevant experience may substitute for the formal qualification."

 

I though it means, (+5 years) experience in highly relevant field is a substitute for bachelors degree requirements. Which is clearly misunderstood by me. Can you please explain that point.

 

Thanks

 

It is generic wording. In some occupations experience may (note "may" as in might not will) substitute for qualifications. But this depends on skills assessment criteria and if the skills assessor wants a degree then they want a degree, no flexibility on that.

[wrussell]

May I suggest that you consult a registered migration agent for advice about strategy?

[Diane]

With the demise of the manufacturing industry here in Australia, and the consequent large number of Australians with manufacturing skills and experience flooding the job market I am very surprised this is still on the list of jobs supposedly needed to be filled by migration in Australia!

[Pumpkin]

With the demise of the manufacturing industry here in Australia, and the consequent large number of Australians with manufacturing skills and experience flooding the job market I am very surprised this is still on the list of jobs supposedly needed to be filled by migration in Australia!

 

Well it is just on the SOL not CSOL which means it requires either employer or state sponsorship. At the moment, WA, SA and NT are sponsoring this occupation.

[Diane]

Well it is just on the SOL not CSOL which means it requires either employer or state sponsorship. At the moment, WA, SA and NT are sponsoring this occupation.

 

 

Well I can suggest from a position of insider knowledge that anyone looking for a job in manufacturing crosses SA off their list!

[Pumpkin]

Well I can suggest from a position of insider knowledge that anyone looking for a job in manufacturing crosses SA off their list!

 

The lists often do not appear to reflect current reality. I do not know why my occupation is appearing on lists either.

[Alaska]

We had the same problem regarding the skills assessment.

DH had plenty of experience but not the degree.. It meant that he was eligible for a 457 sponsorship but was NOT eligible for one of the PR visas as he couldn't pass the VETASSESS skills assessment (also Production Manager) without the degree.

We were told this by 2 highly regarded migration agents.

 

We came over on a 457 and after 2 years the company sponsored us on the 186 (Transition stream) which was the only way we were eligible to get our PR.

[eddypk]

It is generic wording. In some occupations experience may (note "may" as in might not will) substitute for qualifications. But this depends on skills assessment criteria and if the skills assessor wants a degree then they want a degree, no flexibility on that.

 

Yes, its a big "MAY" but how will I know for sure? Who do I contact for answers, a consultant/agent or the assessing authority which is Vetassess?

 

If Vetassess wants a bachelors degree for production manager assessment then it should be the standard requirement for every production manager assessment OR if bachelors degree is not binding if one have +5 years exp then it should be the same for every assessment under 133512. Right? OR do they evaluate the requirement of degree for each individual separately?

 

Or is it depends on the assessing officer? I mean one assessing officer may require a degree but other officer may consider experience for the same individual? what is the policy?

[eddypk]

Is there any one here (or know someone) who got the positive assessment without a bachelor degree under any occupation based on his/her exp?

[eddypk]

Well I can suggest from a position of insider knowledge that anyone looking for a job in manufacturing crosses SA off their list!

 

 

Hey Diane, what about supply and distribution manager? Do people under this category have job market?

[lebourvellec]

Yes, its a big "MAY" but how will I know for sure? Who do I contact for answers, a consultant/agent or the assessing authority which is Vetassess?

 

If Vetassess wants a bachelors degree for production manager assessment then it should be the standard requirement for every production manager assessment OR if bachelors degree is not binding if one have +5 years exp then it should be the same for every assessment under 133512. Right? OR do they evaluate the requirement of degree for each individual separately?

 

Or is it depends on the assessing officer? I mean one assessing officer may require a degree but other officer may consider experience for the same individual? what is the policy?

Have you tried finding out the information on VETASSESS? It clearly states that it is a group b occupation which requires a degree.

 

A RMA to assess other options would be your best course of action at this time.

[Pumpkin]

Yes, its a big "MAY" but how will I know for sure? Who do I contact for answers, a consultant/agent or the assessing authority which is Vetassess?

 

If Vetassess wants a bachelors degree for production manager assessment then it should be the standard requirement for every production manager assessment OR if bachelors degree is not binding if one have +5 years exp then it should be the same for every assessment under 133512. Right? OR do they evaluate the requirement of degree for each individual separately?

 

Or is it depends on the assessing officer? I mean one assessing officer may require a degree but other officer may consider experience for the same individual? what is the policy?

 

 

I thought this had already been covered clearly enough. Vetassess requires a degree for this occupation.

 

It is the *immigration* website that uses the generic language at times, because they do not set the skills assessment criteria. But Vetassess is perfectly clear.

 

If you don't want to believe what is written in black and white on Vetassess website and what other people have told you here, then consult a migration agent or apply anyway, then you will know for sure.

[Alaska]

Everyone is right. Vetassess clearly set out their requirements for a positive skills assessment on their website which requires a Bachelor Degree (unless it has changed since we looked into it).

As I said before we checked this information with 2 very highly regarded agents on this site who confirmed it was the case and we weren't eligible for a PR visa.

[eddypk]

You were right Pumpkin, I received following reply from Vetassess today.

 

"In a full skills assessment, both qualification and employment will be required and only accredited academic qualifications can be assessed. Additional years of employment cannot compensate for the lack of relevant qualifications."

 

I clearly misunderstood the situation. Thanks for correcting me.

 

However, I have a another situation/confusion. As you said, skill level 1 and 2 requires a bachelor degree but what about senior managers occupations (skill level 2) assessed by AIM (Australian Institute of Management)?

 

For example, Supply and Distribution Manager (133611) which is skill level 2 occupation. AIM said on their website (FAQs page) as follows:

 

Q: I have many years experience as a manager but no formal qualifications. Will my request for migration assessment be successful? A: Educational qualifications are not mandatory in order to gain a positive skills assessment. Applicants should check the Criteria as to the level of management responsibilities required.

 

http://www.aim.com.au/migration/faq.html#5

 

On criteria page for Senior Mangers they said "For all applications, the years of experience may be reduced if the applicant has qualifications in management studies or business administration assessed as comparable to an Australian Bachelor, Post Graduate or Master degree, or in a discipline relevant to the field in which the manager is working. This applies where the qualification concerned has been completed immediately prior to, or within the relevant time frame of years of management experience being assessed. The Country Education Profiles prepared by the National Office of Overseas Skills Recognition are the basis for an educational assessment."

 

http://www.aim.com.au/migration/criteria.html

 

Do you have or anyone else have any information on this?

 

Thanks in advance.

[eddypk]

I thought this had already been covered clearly enough. Vetassess requires a degree for this occupation.

 

It is the *immigration* website that uses the generic language at times, because they do not set the skills assessment criteria. But Vetassess is perfectly clear.

 

If you don't want to believe what is written in black and white on Vetassess website and what other people have told you here, then consult a migration agent or apply anyway, then you will know for sure.

 

You were right Pumpkin, I received following reply from Vetassess today.

 

"In a full skills assessment, both qualification and employment will be required and only accredited academic qualifications can be assessed. Additional years of employment cannot compensate for the lack of relevant qualifications."

 

I clearly misunderstood the situation. Thanks for correcting me.

 

However, I have a another situation/confusion. As you said, skill level 1 and 2 requires a bachelor degree but what about senior managers occupations (skill level 2) assessed by AIM (Australian Institute of Management)?

 

For example, Supply and Distribution Manager (133611) which is skill level 2 occupation. AIM said on their website (FAQs page) as follows:

 

Q: I have many years experience as a manager but no formal qualifications. Will my request for migration assessment be successful? A: Educational qualifications are not mandatory in order to gain a positive skills assessment. Applicants should check the Criteria as to the level of management responsibilities required.

 

http://www.aim.com.au/migration/faq.html#5

 

On criteria page for Senior Mangers they said "For all applications, the years of experience may be reduced if the applicant has qualifications in management studies or business administration assessed as comparable to an Australian Bachelor, Post Graduate or Master degree, or in a discipline relevant to the field in which the manager is working. This applies where the qualification concerned has been completed immediately prior to, or within the relevant time frame of years of management experience being assessed. The Country Education Profiles prepared by the National Office of Overseas Skills Recognition are the basis for an educational assessment."

 

http://www.aim.com.au/migration/criteria.html

 

Do you have or anyone else have any information on this?

 

Thanks in advance.

[wrussell]

You were right Pumpkin, I received following reply from Vetassess today.

 

"In a full skills assessment, both qualification and employment will be required and only accredited academic qualifications can be assessed. Additional years of employment cannot compensate for the lack of relevant qualifications."

 

I clearly misunderstood the situation. Thanks for correcting me.

 

However, I have a another situation/confusion. As you said, skill level 1 and 2 requires a bachelor degree but what about senior managers occupations (skill level 2) assessed by AIM (Australian Institute of Management)?

 

For example, Supply and Distribution Manager (133611) which is skill level 2 occupation. AIM said on their website (FAQs page) as follows:

 

Q: I have many years experience as a manager but no formal qualifications. Will my request for migration assessment be successful? A: Educational qualifications are not mandatory in order to gain a positive skills assessment. Applicants should check the Criteria as to the level of management responsibilities required.

 

http://www.aim.com.au/migration/faq.html#5

 

On criteria page for Senior Mangers they said "For all applications, the years of experience may be reduced if the applicant has qualifications in management studies or business administration assessed as comparable to an Australian Bachelor, Post Graduate or Master degree, or in a discipline relevant to the field in which the manager is working. This applies where the qualification concerned has been completed immediately prior to, or within the relevant time frame of years of management experience being assessed. The Country Education Profiles prepared by the National Office of Overseas Skills Recognition are the basis for an educational assessment."

 

http://www.aim.com.au/migration/criteria.html

 

Do you have or anyone else have any information on this?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

From what you have posted, you have no prospects of making a successful AIM application.

 

May I suggest that you consult a registered migration agent for an assessment of what is possible?