InnerVoice

Trust me, I do. I did my teacher training in a special measures school, and then worked supply in inner-city school in Manchester (c.2010) where the kids had to walk through a metal detector on the way in. It isn't that bad here yet thankfully, but if you compare the average state school In Australia with similar in the UK then there seems to be more academic rigour in the latter. That's just my opinion based on experience - no stats to back it up!

Well you'd like think so, but that doesn't seem to be the case. More people are studying useless degrees than ever. I've been telling my senior students for 15 years don't do a degree just because some teacher said you're good at the subject. It never went down well in UK where schools are all about the league tables and getting as many kids into uni as they can, but further education in Australia seems to be a lot more goal-orientated, and not just about learning for learnings sake. Some of the TAFE courses are excellent in terms of vocational pathways. According to SEEK the average salary for a painter/decorator in Queensland is $75-80k although I'm sure more is possible if you work every hour God sends, but that rather defeats the object of moving to Australia for a better lifestyle. Point taken about the travelling between jobs, but then there's a lot more competition for the big jobs where you're based somewhere for a week or two. We all know how hard it is to get a tradie in to do a small job. Half the time you end up doing it yourself!

Indeed it does, but it's worth pointing out what that actually covers. CTP Insurance covers your liability, and the liability of anyone who drives your vehicle, for injuries caused to others in a motor vehicle accident. This can include injuries to your passengers, and the driver and passengers in other vehicles. If you’re involved in a car accident while driving, whether partially or wholly your fault, your CTP policy covers the compensation costs for the person if they’re injured or die. Compensation costs involve rehabilitation, treatment, payments to support income or funeral expenses. It's a brilliant system because even if someone steals your car, and runs into half a dozen people at the bus stop then they, or their next of kin, can all claim compensation. Effectively, it's the vehicle that's insured rather than the person. The downside to this system is that a 17-year-old who's just passed their test can go and buy a three litre sports car, then hoon around your neighbourhood like a lunatic. There's no way of pricing them out of the market with exorbitant insurance premiums like they do in the UK. It'd be a really easy thing to legislate against so that young people weren't able to buy such powerful cars, but hey this is Queensland, so it will probably take some politician another 50 years to realise what a great idea that would be. I digress, something that many don't realise is that CTP insurance only covers people, it doesn't cover damage to the third party's vehicle. If you're deemed to be at fault then the third party can sue you for the damages to their vehicle and any personal effects. So regardless of the age and condition of your vehicle, you'd have to be an absolute berk not to take out fully comprehensive insurance because you never know what - or who - is just around the corner. I should clarify all the aforementioned relates to Queensland, and rules and regulations relating to Rego and CTP differ from state to state.

My default position when people get the jitters is to say we tend to regret the things that we didn't do in life, more than the things we did. I think I said as much on one of your earlier posts. However, through this and previous posts, you have painted a very clear picture of your personal and financial circumstances. My gut feeling is that you are really going to struggle financially in Brisbane or S E Queensland on that kind of income, even with two of you working. Bear in mind to earn $80k/year you're going to need to be working 40 hours a week, every week, and never be ill, and that's somewhat unrealistic given that you might not always have work on, and the travelling time to get jobs etc. As @Cheery Thistle said, the general cost of living here isn't that much more expensive than in the UK (25% seems a fair estimate), and depending on your lifestyle it could be more or less the same, but your mortgage is going to be the real killer, and at 48 you're no spring chicken. Don't take that personally as I'm in my late fifties and I have a huge mortgage that won't be paid off until I'm 83, which clearly is never going to happen. Fortunately, there's only my wife and I to consider, so we'll downsize when the time is right and hopefully we'll have enough equity in our current home to be mortgage-free. I'm going to stick my neck out here and say I think you should pull the plug on your house sale until you've got all your ducks in a row. As both @Marisawright and @bluequay have suggested, coming over on your own initially and trying to get yourself established is going to be a far more sensible approach. After a few months work you're also going to have a more realistic idea of your annual income, and how that aligns to living expenses and what you can actually afford. The other option is ignoring Brisbane completely, and look to establish yourself in regional coastal Queensland. Property prices in places like Hervey Bay, Mackay, and Cairns are much lower than in SEQ, and you can still have a fantastic lifestyle there too. With regards to standards of education in Queensland (I've taught here for over a decade), I can say with hand on heart that your daughters will receive a much broader education in the UK state school system than they will here. There's a reason why so many Aussies send their kids to private school, but then that's going to be another expense you'll to have to consider. Sorry, I don't want to come across as a doom-monger either, but I think in your case it's more than a wobble. I reckon you're pretty much feeling like you're on the edge of a precipice.

It seems a rather odd law (I'm not disputing), but it's hard to imagine a scenario where an Australian citizen would ever need an Australian visa.

I just had a look on the GOV.UK website and under the section 'Who does not need and ETA', it states the following; You also do not need an ETA if you have either: a visa permission to live, work or study in the UK a British or Irish passport https://www.gov.uk/guidance/apply-for-an-electronic-travel-authorisation-eta#who-does-not-need-aneta It doesn't mention anything about being a UK citizen, so maybe if you no longer have a British passport then you will be able to apply for an ETA as a citizen of another country.

Well they'd never find out if it was one of your databases!

If you applied for an ETA (when they are introduced) as an Australian citizen, do you think they'd check if you were already a UK citizen?

I think the world could do with a bit less data - you've probably done us all a favour.

@JMcKie just realized I've dropped a massive clanger! That information was from the Australian High Commission UK website, so those were the costs for renewing Australian passports in the UK. https://uk.embassy.gov.au/lhlh/passportfees.html As you've pointed out, it's much cheaper to renew the UK passport so it seems a no-brainer given that (if British citizens can't get an ETA) you're going to need one anyway. Apologies to everyone for the earlier misinformation, and thanks for pointing it out.

The ETA will cost £10 which is considerably less than renewing a British passport, although I can imagine there'll be some expats who'll renew their passports out of indignation.

That's always a possibility, although I will politely challenge your use of the word 'home' given that the kids will have grown up in Australia, so that will be their home (unless they've emigrated as older teenagers). I know the process is very straightforward if you have a current passport and it can all be done online these days, but is it really that much hassle if it's expired and you have all the relevant documentation? Unless you have more than an inkling that you might return to the UK one day then it doesn't seem to make sense, although I appreciate that there will always be some who'll never quite be able to cut the umbilical cord with the old country. I was one for a while, but since my mum passed on I know there's no way I'd ever go back there to live. You state this on nearly every post about UK passports, but is there any evidence of this?

Hi @Lavers, nice to hear from you! Personally, I'd say 'no' unless you think there might be a chance that you'll move back to the UK in the next 10 years. I recall you've got a young family of 3, so it's going to cost over $1,500 to renew all your UK passports (if we ignore the middle daughter who has to renew hers). Given that you're all going to become Australian citizens and should all have Australian passports within the next 2 years, it seems like a lot of money for some bits of paper stuck in a drawer that you're never going to use. Bear in mind when you renew a UK passport from overseas there's a hefty surcharge to pay.

I'm sure a discussion about semantics isn't going to be of much benefit to anyone, but clearly the term better off going down the skilled route implies a greater chance of success, where as better than means exactly that. I totally agree that the 189 or 190 are better visas to hold, but you might be waiting forever to get one - if at all. Bird in hand, as they say.

I wouldn't dispute any of this for a moment but beggars can't be choosers, can they? Not everyone is in demand as much as Liam Neeson with his very special particular skill set. Most of us at one time or another have worked in job for a couple of years that we didn't enjoy as a stepping stone to greater things, and once you've done those two years you're a free agent. 'Character building', my father would've called it.

Respectfully, it was you who steered the conversation away from the original topic with your earlier post (above). Whether you could've got the job independently is irrelevant if you couldn't have obtained a visa. I'm sure there are many Australian employers who would be happy to employ overseas workers if they didn't have to sponsor them. As you mentioned, the reason you didn't go down the skilled route was due to unknowns in processing times, but given the competitiveness of the skilled pathway there's absolutely no guarantee that you (or anyone for that matter) would be granted a 189 or 190 visa.

Bit of an assumption there. My friend (a fellow teacher) was offered a position in a state school in Brisbane, and moved down from Cairns over the holidays. The Department of Education paid for all her removal costs, and all costs incurred selling her property in Cairns and buying in Brisbane - including the stamp duty on the purchase. We're talking tens of thousands of dollars here. The deal is she needs to stay in her new job for 3 years to get the full benefit. If she leaves after the first year she'll have to pay the department back two thirds of the costs, and if she leaves after two years them one third of the costs.

It would be helpful if you could add mention what your job is? There are only a few professions (teacher, nursing, doctors, spring to mind) where you'd be better off going down the skilled route (189/190) as opposed to a ENS/186, which pretty much guarantees the applicant and their family PR in Australia.

I'm guessing you were living in Sydney long before I arrived. I have very similarly fond memories of my early years in Brisbane, but I think it's going the same way as Sydney and Melbourne. The appearance of those monstrous cube homes that fill the entire block are usually a clear sign of the changing demographic!

I loved surfing, drinking, and the hot weather (and still do, to a lesser extent), but after spending a year in Sydney when I first moved to Australia, I came to the same conclusion about Sydneysiders. I found them incredibly self-centred, superficial, and obsessed with material wealth. I left because I didn't like the people and had no desire to be part of their rat race, but I still think it's a beautiful city and a great place to visit for a few days. I'm sure Sydney's in no way unique in that respect, and you'll find the same mentality in any of the world's major commercial centres where people's main objective is to get rich and flaunt it.

You're right, you can only compare places that have a similar population and demographic, which is quite hard to do given that there are very few places in Australia and the UK that are closely comparable. Although London and Brisbane are both major cities, it wouldn't be a fair comparison because London is so much larger, densely populated, and diverse. The probability of being a victim of crime will vary significantly depending on a person's location, age, gender, time of day, personal circumstances. However, you can't become a victim of crime unless you're in contact with someone to perpetrate it, so it's less likely to occur here because Australia is so sparsely populated. A recent article about Queensland's crime rate decreasing, despite media reports of surging youth offences... https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-09-30/queensland-youth-crime-long-term-data-downward-abs-police/102917994

Indeed I do like a statistic, and well spotted - but on this occasion I was so certain that crime is worse in the UK than it is in Queensland, I didn't bother to look it up. But anyway, here goes... there were approximately 600,000 recorded crimes in Queensland in 2023, compared with 8.4 million offences in England and Wales, and about another 300,000 in Scotland, for a similar period. Obviously there are a lot more people living in the UK, and I'm sure that crime rates are comparable with Queensland when you are comparing areas with similar demographics etc. However, the chances of being a victim of crime here are a lot lower, simply because there is a lot less crime. Breaking and entering to steal cars may not be a problem in Scotland but it certainly is in England, and I know two people personally who were broken into in the last 5 years for exactly that reason. It's also worth noting that some of us have lived in both Australia and the UK for considerable periods of time, so our 'bubble' may be a little bigger than you think

To put the handbrake on this, not in anyone's wildest imagination is the crime in Queensland as bad, or even remotely as bad, as in the UK. Everyone is talking about the grandma stabbing at the moment because people are genuinely shocked. We're not used to seeing that level of violence directed at vulnerable members of society. It totally goes against everything Australians value. To be honest, if you're moving to Brisbane I'd be far more concerned about being run over by a 16 year-old on an eScooter than stabbed by one.

Exactly right, but there's no guarantee that property prices are going to keep increasing at current rates. To buy and then sell a $1m home in QLD it will cost $30k in stamp duty on the way in, and about the same in agent fees on the way out. Add to that legal fees, mortgage registration and transfer fees, moving costs, possibly LMI, and you aren't going to have much change out of $70-80k. That kind of money would pay the rent for two years. Renting for 6-12 months makes more sense because people will get to know their local area and hopefully be settled in their jobs, so they'll be in a much better position to make an informed buying decision. And if they decided in those first few months that Australia really isn't for them, then it's much easier and cheaper to do a U-turn from rented accommodation.

Good point. Many of the them used something called 1form, but that is now called Ignite. @Simontucks you could create an account on there and start adding your details, so there's one job less to do later. https://ignite.realestate.com.au/rent/rental-applications