DanO

I would agree...it would be a nightmare living in limbo like that!

Enjoy your memories and go make some great new ones in the UK.

Personally I would like to retire back to the UK, but financially it just doesn't make sense for me (after 26 years here)...so I have just accepted that "it is what it is" and am looking forward to making the most of my life irrespective of where I live.

There is no doubt for me. Travel absolutely does broaden the mind!

I love the UK, but on my last visit I found it very much more parochial than I remembered it. The life experience of living overseas and especially somewhere as multi-cultural as Melbourne really does stretch your horizons. I know when relatives visited us here, they were constantly surprised by things which we take for granted here (car prices, petrol prices, range of fresh foods, coffee quality, blue skies, distances, house sizes, the tax system to name a few). That doesn't make Australia better than the UK, but it does make it notably different. 

You can never have everything, so it's a case of settling for a solution which BEST fits my needs. On balance, for me, that will entail retiring in Australia and making the most of travel overseas. 

My mid-80s Aussie in-laws (until recent ill-health) ate out more often than me, knew more about Melbourne restaurants and recent films and had a wider social circle than me.

I would imagine they had a lot more about them than someone who grew up and lived in Scunthorpe (insert other parochial town here) all their life. 

I think it is a ridiculous generalisation to say older people of one nationality are ipso facto less worthy of being "engaged with" than another. 

33 minutes ago, Blue Flu said:

Another measure of preferability of ideal fit /location at least in the personality sense (something seemingly overlooked on here) is being around people of that age . Often it's         not the place but the people. Done a few cruises with numerous older Aussies, Outcome a bit  scary to entertain the thought those could be representative of the people that would be forced to engage with in declining years.  

I'm sure they speak very highly of you...

2 hours ago, friedparsley said:

However I dread the UK winter. 

I fondly (NOT) remember going to school in the dark, and walking home through icy sleet...in the dark!

I actually prefer a cooler climate overall hence I prefer Vic ( I would consider NZ or Tas weather-wise at least). In Australia, if I had to live year round in QLD, NT or WA...I'd probably move to the UK. NSW and QLD were fine when I was younger, but as I get older I just don't enjoy the heat and humidity there.

The UK is not part of the EEA since leaving the EU, as I understand it. 

After a few weeks of agonizing, I have decided to retire in Australia and make do with regular trips to UK and Europe for holidays.

Why? Well here are my reasons, as some food for thought for others in a similar situation:

Australian state pension for myself and my Aussie wife (nearly $40,000 per year eventually), and the stress security blanket that provides.

Zero UK pensions

UK inheritance taxes 

UK council tax rates 

Tax free Superannuation income stream  in Australia 

I think the Australian economy has a stronger long term outlook 

I am sure we could be happy in both countries, with swings and roundabouts for each, but for financial peace of mind after 26 years working in Australia, it's a no brainer overall.

As I read it, it will mean anyone who worked in Aus for X years prior to 2001 will not be credited with those years on National Insurance...so they will effectively lose those years of UK state pension.

Oh dear, it looks like the Poms are about to close the minimal "loophole" for National Insurance contributions of those who worked in Australia prior to 2001...

The GOV.UK website confirms that from January 1, 2022, you will no longer be able to count periods living in Australia (before March 1, 2001), Canada or New Zealand, towards calculating your UK State Pension if both the following apply:

• you are a UK national, EU or EEA citizen or Swiss national

• you move to live in the EU, EEA or Switzerland on or after January 1, 2022, including if you move to live in another EU, EEA country or Switzerland on or after January 1, 2022

4 hours ago, Sloth said:

The other thing I should have mentioned is you can also split your pot any way you like, and only put say a quarter or a half of it into pension mode according to your needs.

Of course any interest you earn in accumulation mode then becomes taxable. In Income stream mode it is tax free as I understand it?

We aren't desperate to leave Australia. We could retire here quite happily, but the UK option presents some interesting lifestyle and family opportunities. Europe is much less appealing including the reasons @Blue FluFlu mentions.

As I stated previously, the financials for Aus (large house, tax free Super, no inheritance tax, cheaper cars and fuel, eventual pension safety net) are highly compelling reasons to stay. 

We can still enjoy great European holidays, and once both retired can make those stays more extensive (6-8 weeks at a time).

I note France doesn't have a reciprocal pension agreement yet.

I wonder if the UK may change with all the free trade deals and AUKUS stuff that's been happening....

20 minutes ago, Marisawright said:

That's exactly our thinking.   None of us knows how long we're going to live, and the prospect of having to up sticks and move back to Australia in our 80's, if we live that long, would be too daunting.

Worth noting, though, that if you moved to a country with a reciprocal agreement with Australia (like several European countries) then you could claim your Australian pensions there no worries.   Post-Brexit, your British passport doesn't give you any special access to Europe, but it's easier than you think for an Australian to get residency in Europe.  There is irritating red tape of course, but it's a case of proving you have sufficient assets, which by the sound of it, you would have.  

A sunny retirement in Italy or Cyprus, perhaps?

Sunny retirement isn't a particular incentive for me. If it was, the simpler solution would be QLD...yuk!

We may consider Netherlands or France or Italy, but to be honest I don't think the appeal is the same as the UK (local pubs, National Trust and family).

It's great to have options though!

Well this has drifted off my original point! 

All very interesting however - thanks all. In my case, at the moment I am leaning towards remaining in Australia and going on holiday to UK and Europe every 18 months. I know it costs, but the idea of walking away from (eventually) a secure $37,0000 a year in Australia to zero on the UK is just not sensible.

I have some time to think further about it, but at face value I can retire here and live very comfortably for 25 years before having to rely exclusively on the pension. Considerably fewer comfortable years  the UK and knowing I would never have that pension safety net is likely to shorten my lifespan through stress!

57 minutes ago, Sloth said:

The way around the minimum percentage rule is to leave it in accumulation mode and withdraw lump sums as you need it once you meet a condition of release.

Thanks Sloth.

Sounds like a fair suggestion!

Oh I see. Yes I hadn't considered that. I just assumed the NHS would take care of us?

Not quite 60 yet, so health hasn't been a big consideration.

Thanks for the suggestion.

45 minutes ago, Parley said:

Aged Care can be expensive. Not sure if you are impacted by not having worked there much.

Sorry Parley, I'm not sure what you mean?

55 minutes ago, Marisawright said:

No, you can't.    

Super in a self-managed fund is subject to the same rules as any other super fund. It MUST stay in the fund until you reach eligible age.

If you've reached eligible age, you can transfer the whole amount straight into your bank account from your ordinary super fund, no need to faff around creating a SMSF.  

Once the money is in your bank account, it's just savings, and you won't be taxed if you transfer it to the UK. 

However, IF YOU ARE ALREADY OVERSEAS WHEN YOU TAKE THE LUMP SUM, the British taxman will grab a very hefty chunk of it.  So it's a strategy that works ONLY if you are still living in Australia at the time you do it. 

The current plan in my head goes like this:

• Before we go to the UK (aged 60), we would just convert our Super accounts to an income stream and withdraw equivalent of 25,000 GBP a year, to minimise UK tax.
• We have some savings which we would take to the UK as a lump sum (tax free), and use to purchase ISAs over a few years, meaning we could draw down on those after we exhausted Aus Super funds. That would also be tax free as ISAs are untaxed and would probably give us another 5 or so years income.
• We would buy a house outright, from the proceeds of our (mortgage free) Aus house and if the ISA s ran out, we could downsize to a cheaper house and generate several more years of tax free funds.

However...that still assumes that we would both cark it by our late 80s....

Beyond that obviously we would have no more income. Hence agonising over losing the safety net of an Aus pension.

An alternative would be to stay here and enjoy holidays to the UK every couple of years and relax knowing we had an Aus pension at the end of it all.

Ah - the agony of choice!!!!

5 minutes ago, Parley said:

It is a good problem to have to be too wealthy to receive the state pension.

I kind of agree...however it's just that fear of cutting off a "safety net".

I'm trying to stop imagining a scenario where the money runs out and no fallback from a pension! Just a matter of working it through and not catastrophising!

45 minutes ago, Cup Final 1973 said:

Are you old enough to turn your super into a self-managed super fund?  You can then transfer the money into your bank account.  As it’s not an income it’s not taxed.

I will be soon, however I am quite happy with the fund management by my Super provider, so I would likely just convert it to an income stream and limit my withdrawal amounts  to minimise UK tax... I think? 

My internal debate at the moment is probably around walking away from my Oz state  pension forever, by returning to the UK. This smarts after paying hundreds of thousands of dollars in tax over 25 years.

My dilemma is more a case of retirement lifestyle in the UK (history, landscape, pubs and ease of European travel etc) vs comfort of having an Oz pension until I die (security in a country that doesn't really float my boat anymore). 

34 minutes ago, Ken said:

If you can legitimately keep your income below £12,570 (approx. AU$23,000) each there's no tax to pay.

May be doable...but I realise there is a minimum withdrawal % of income stream. So given my super...it may not be possible.  Thanks for the input ever.yone, plenty of food for thought.

So if I ditch the wife...I get a 25% discount?

17 minutes ago, Tulip1 said:

Another thing worth a mention re council tax.  Single occupancy gives you a 25% discount 

4 minutes ago, Amber Snowball said:

Exactly!

my water is about £90 per year. I can’t have a water meter so pay a different amount. It’s worth getting them out to check to fit a water meter because if you can’t have one you pay less than someone who chooses not to have one!

Cheshire is nice, I’m liking it. I’m from SW London originally, 13 years in Victoria and moved up here in 2018.

My preference would have been Shropshire but work was limited there.

It’s a big decision so I wish you well.

 

Thanks 8-)

We will not be working so can live wherever we want. Probably 2 years away however (wife's ailing parents here).

I have been here about 26 years - twice in Bris, Syd and Melb...currently enjoying Ballarat. I just think there are more things to enjoy in retirement in the UK than in Australia...we are most certainly not beach people, and hate hot weather!

We are open to multiple areas.

I grew up in Scunthorpe, went to Uni in Leeds, worked in Berks, Bucks, Newcastle and spent 6 years in York....

Probably somewhere in the North, but Solihull gets a good rap...and Cheshire seems lovely.

2 minutes ago, Amber Snowball said:

My brochure when I bought 3 years ago had it on but maybe that was an anomaly, I thought they all had it. My bad.

The estate agent will know the band, so you can ask. Band C or D seems to be the “average” price but that’s going to depend on area I suppose. Where are you looking at?

Thanks @Amber Snowball. I couldn't believe how expensive it looked!

It's still a shock...but I'm thinking water rates will be much less than Ballarat at least? We are charged about $1500 a year in water rates (multiple times higher than we paid in Melbourne).

Plus...I won't be paying $3500 a year for private health insurance!