Mamma Midwife

41 minutes ago, Ballaratburd said:

 

Can I just say they have an absolute cheek, I know it doesn’t help your situation but the UK nursing and midwifery training is miles ahead of Australia! I have had plenty students here and the amount of placement and contact hours they have is laughable. Good luck with it all

 

I have to say, I agree with you there!! The whole model of maternity care in the UK is centred around continuity of carer with the midwife being the coordinator of womens care - even high risk women. I don't think there are better trained midwives anywhere in the world, other than possibly NZ!!

1 minute ago, Ballaratburd said:

 

The only reason I say this is because when we moved here 5 years ago, my husband quit his job and decided he would just “get a job doing anything” until he decided what to do in Australia (he was very burnt out from the UK police) however it took almost 6 months to find permanent work and after two years of working in admin jobs and realising that Australian university wasn’t an option he gave up and reapplied for the police here! Luckily he is very happy with his decision, but it was a lot of hard work and effort to get into a job that he could have just transferred over to in the first place. What is AHPRA’s issue with UK midwives? I’m an RN but I was very lucky to apply and get registered just before all the issues with diploma vs degree etc arose.

 

They say that UK midwives lack the continuity of care aspect from their training and therefore require a period (I think of 12 months or until the paperwork/ experience is comlpeted) of supervised practice. I did have continuity of care experience as part of my training but my transcript doesn't specify this I'm hoping a copy of my program syllabus is enough to convince them. I've also had great continuity experience since qualifying but I'm not sure they take this into account?? I won't know the situation until I apply for registration which is the most frustrating part for me lol

11 hours ago, Ballaratburd said:

 

Think very carefully before you do this. If you were to retrain what would you do? Australian university courses are very expensive and you wouldn’t be entitled to fee help as you are not a citizen. Where are you moving to? Casual bank midwives are generally always being advertised at my local hospital.

 

Yes, it's definitely something to consider in full detail and not just in a whim! But as @Amber Snowball mentions below, it's more the conditions that AHPRA may place on my practice (as they seem to be placing on most UK midwives). It appears to be putting off hospitals from employing us as the paperwork is too much hastle I am considering completing some management masters modules as a backup in case I struggle to find a willing employer in midwifery. I have lots of transferable skills and the extra modules should ensure I can get a job on a comparable salary. They'll also help with my midwifery career in the future so it's a win win I guess. 

2 minutes ago, Amber Snowball said:

I don’t think it’s a lack of jobs that’s the issue, it’s AHPRA’s conditions for registration and practice on UK midwives. Bit of a pain.

8 hours ago, starlight7 said:

I'd say 'go for it'. We need more good midwives here and although you will find they don't really have things like home births here ( too much litigation- we are similar to the USA in that) most of the hospitals round here are happy places with good morale- that is Victoria, can't speak for other states of course.  A lot of the private hospitals are very good, too ( not all, obviously). The weather is a big plus factor, too even though it seems to be trivial.

Thank you! the weather is a big plus for us

Brilliant, thank you both!

57 minutes ago, ali said:

We didn't have 'the dream' but after visiting my brother in QLD it was hubby who had the inkling that he would like to live in Aus.  We read a lot of (for want of a better word) 'negative' posts about people not settling/what they didn't like/why they wanted to go back - some resonated with us and we discussed the "what if that happened to us" scenario's and others just didn't fit into how we would approach the move so were easily dismissed e.g. we read one woman who made her mind up on the journey from the airport that she didn't like it and that was it they went home lol.  We did come out as a united couple and that if one of us wanted to return we would - although our pact was also that Australia was a big place and if we didn't like Perth we'd try somewhere else.  Whilst it sounds simplistic - we're not a couple to over complicate things and being a family unit was and always has been what's important.  It's helped that neither of us have ever been homesick - just 'people sick' in the early days.

We treated it as an opportunity to live and work in a different country .. we've never looked back.  Cal one of our moderators was on the pilot of WDU, she'll happily tell you how it was edited - after all it is an entertainment programme lol.

Good luck with the job - King Eddies has a good reputation if you end up working there.

Thank you, this is really helpful!  

Hello

I am looking into applying for PR with the independant skilled migrant visa. I have enough points and I know my profession (midwifery) is on the skills shortage list at present.

My concern is that I keep hearing it is hard to get a job as a UK trained midwife at the moment in view of the conditions AHPRA place on the majority of UK midwives - I know I have completed the required training with continuity however it is not on my transcript and so I may struggle to prove it (I am currently waiting for my uni to get back to me about this).

So, down to my question...

If we make the move and I struggle to get a job as a midwife, can I change my career and work in another profession or am I bound to midwifery for a certain length of time as this will be the skill I am entering the country on?

The reason I ask is because I do not want to make the move and discover I can't get work after all and then we'll be up the creek without a paddle!

TIA

Do you think they would take post registration experience into account when assessing you for registration? Working in a community setting, you get this experience threefold! 

On 21/01/2019 at 11:40, tracybayliss said:

Hi

 

i have been following your post with interest. I am a uk midwife now in Brisbane and did many many years of research on midwifery group practice.  I had been a community midwife for over 14 years with a high homebirth rate and was looking for a model of care similar to community midwifery. Over several years I had been offered jobs but still couldn't take the final plunge until we arrived here in 2014 with only 8 days left on our visa.  I loved my community job in the UK and my passion for normality and homebirths is what was holding me back. What an experience I have had so far plugs being taken out of baths to prevent women from labouring in water, social inductions so many un necessary interventions and mention homebirth then it's like you've committed a sin. 

I have some family here so came out 3 times on holiday before making the final move I still don't think holidaying can prepare you for the move. For me your job takes up such a massive amount of time in your week and you need to be happy I became a midwife to be with women to be an advocate and provide continuity of care, it is so different here. No matter where research has been done how long we have done waterbirths in the year 2019 some hospitals in Australia still do not allow women in water even for pain relief.

 

Midwifery group practice is case loading and I didn't have to go through any supervision. Most hospitals actually do respect that UK train midwives are trained differently and have more experience than students here, as students often have very little experience out in the community with antenatal or postnatal care.  Don't get me wrong I would never want to work in a hospital environment in the UK as that has its own problems with staff shortages. But coming here I realise even more I did have the best job in the world community midwife.

private midwifery is very interesting and I often wonder how doctors get away with the lack of informed choice they fail to provide women with. 

 

If I was asked honestly if I've felt supported by members of staff as this was an issue for me coming in from the community to a hospital setting I would have to say absoluetly not and I've worked at two different hospitals now whilst I've been here. 

Good luck

 

 

Hi tracybalis

Your experience so far sounds awful I'm so sorry to hear you've been through all of this. It is very helpful to know what kind of culture you may be getting in to before you've decided to make the move!

I did used to be quite the fierce protector of birth but sadly the system here has beaten it out of me so I'm sure I could just get on with the job if my lifestyle was better than it is at present it's quite sad reading that back to myself! 

Have you gone over on a PR visa or is it a temp one? Do they have midwifery group practices or independant midwifery in Australia? How long do you have to work as a midwife before you can consider changing careers?

I do hope things improve for you soon.

Take care of yourself xx

On 21/01/2019 at 10:06, Wonderingaloud said:

No problem at all Mamma Midwife Happy to help. Feel free to PM me if there’s anything you want to know. Though I can only comment on the locality of where I work and not really Australia as a whole.

I don’t want to put you off, it’s really not all doom and gloom, there are things they do exceptionally well here compared to the UK, but you are right, it comes off a bit rich APHRA asking UK midwives for continuity of care, because the entire system is based on that principal. We never needed to make a special effort to get 10 follow through cares because where I trained and worked in the UK we would book women st 10-12 weeks, see them antenatally, be on call if they opted for a home birth and visit them postnatally. That here, minus the homebirthing part, is a special model of care. Most women here are lucky to see the same person twice and everyone delivers in the same place- the obstetric unit so they’re all at the mercy of the intervention-happy doctors.

Private is far far worse. So many social inductions it’s unreal. Weird medications prescribed, odd protocols. That’s another thing to get your head around- public and private. Maybe that’s a story for another day lol. 

BUT, woes aside, coming home in the sunshine and having a glass of wine by the pool after your shift kinda makes it not so bad

All the best

X

 

Which locality are you in, if you don't mind me asking?

Also, does the midwife still hold the same role working within the hospitals as uk midwives ie full autonomy in low risk care and referring to obstetricians when appropriate or is it more of an obstetric nurse role and you have to just do what the doctor says?

In your hospital, what are shift patterns like? How many nights would you normally work per month? And doors the advertised salary include extra pay for shift work or do you get that as an extra allowance depending on what shifts you have worked?

X

On 19/01/2019 at 21:30, Wonderingaloud said:

Thanks for the tag @Amber Snowball

Yes I work as a midwife here, I can’t comment on the visa side as I came on the old 457 and then got the 186 PR visa so never had to do points. Having said that I still needed to do IELTS to register with APHRA.

Yes, the supervised practice is a big issue for UK qualified midwives. When did you qualify Manma Midwife? It sounds like the program has now included continuity of care cases formally in your training which is where the problem lay. As long as the number meets APHRA requirements and is detailed your university  transcript perhaps you might avoid the whole supervised practice. It will make life A LOT easier for you finding a job too. I would be interested to hear what your skills assessment finds. 

Good luck with it all. Happy to answer any midwifery related questions you may have. You may already know but just be aware midwifery here is not the same as in the UK. Very obstetrically focused, high CS and IOL (general intervention) rates. Yes there are birth centres but they are the exception rather than the rule. You have to take it in your stride rather than fight the system but I have seen some very passionate UK midwives get very frustrated and disheartened with it. 

Hello and thank you for all the information!

I qualified in 2014 but I have just liked at my transcript and it isn't actually on there despite it being an integral part of the course  I'm going to call the uni later this morning and find out why and if there is anything else they can provide. I'll keep you posted re my skills assessment but it's probably going to be later this year before we apply. 

I do find it very confusing with midwifery in Australia. The high expectations of midwives to provide continuity of care and the exceptional quality of research that is produced by Aus and is used globally suggests a very good Midwifery led model of care. But reading blogs and speaking to those working as midwives in Aus you realise it's the exact opposite it is slightly disheartening but, to be honest, it's how the UK is going now

Would you mind if I send you any messages if any questions pop up?

On 19/01/2019 at 17:41, Flossy82 said:

Thank you! And congratulations on taking the first steps into investigating this new adventure for you. I'm sorry to see that the thread has been highjacked with so many negative comments, on what I'm sure was meant to be a humorous throw away comment.

I totally understand why PR is the best option for you - the schooling thing is something I wasn't aware of. I'd have liked to go out on PR but didn't have time on the job availability, and not sure I'd pass a PR medical at the moment as I had (early stage) cancer in 2017, so will apply once we're there.

If you want any more info about Women's Hospitals in Perth feel free to message me.

Good Luck!

x

Thank you I'm sorry to hear of what you've been through but I'm so glad you're on the mend! You have to do what is right for your own personal situation, which it sounds like you are. 

X

Thank you that's fantastic! I'll head over and search for the thread now. Haha yes times have changed a lot! But it's probably for the best for the country in the long run thank you

Just now, Amber Snowball said:

Just a thought but I think some midwives have had to do some supervised practice before being able to register. There is a thread on here somewhere I’m pretty sure. I’ll try and find it. Might need thinking about as it can be hard to get somewhere to take you on and provide that.

Bummer about the points.

There are lots of threads on here about IELTS and PTE the 2 english tests and some information on studying for them as they are a bit tricky apparently.

Yes, I think it usually does come with the need for supervision because of a lack in experience with caseloading. I am hopeful that I'll be ok though as caseloading was a formal part of my degree and, although I don't work in a caseloading model, due to the small nature of the unit I work in I have had the opportunity to follow women through from the antenatal period, labour and delivery and also postnatally. Well have to see what comes bank from the skills assessment. 

I've just read the thread comparing the IELTS and PTE and was thinking I'd go with the PTE. I did also look at the Cambridge test but haven't heard much about that one. Have you done the English test? Which one would you recommend?

Yes. I do fully appreciate what you are saying. I am not a naive and uneducated person. I am not asking for ways in which to convince my husband to go along with what I want. He needs to make this decision for himself and be 100% happy with it. And if he's not happy with it then we don't go. Also, before going anywhere we'd have contingency plans in place and access to savings.

I am on this forum to gather information about a possible move down under and for support from fellow immigrants, not to be berated for calling the desire to relocate 'my dream'. What I was saying in my reply above was that my dream isn't just a whim, it is an adventure filled with risks, stress, uncertainty, potential unhappiness etc, I accept that fully and completely understand my husband's thought process. 

I do appreciate messages of concern, but I feel there is no need to keep going on about it when that is not what I am asking for help with. 

33 minutes ago, Quoll said:

Sorry, a lot of our readers have “the dream” because they’ve grown up watching Home and Away or Wanted Down Under and think that is what Australia is all about. In essence, they’re both first world countries with all the pluses and minuses that brings with it. Neither is inherently better than the other and moving to a foreign country on the other side of the world requires not “a dream” but a sense of adventure, a considerable dose of self reliance and well over the average selfishness (not meant in a pejorative sense, rather a survival sense) along with a willingness to take risks and not get hung up if it doesn’t work. If someone isn’t 100% committed and 110% raring to go, then it’s likely to flounder.

oh, and please don’t start watching H&A, it’ll sap your brain!

Ah I see, thank you! I did used to watch H&A (I feel good now that I know what that is ) as a child but haven't watched it in years.... I'll keep away

As for WDU, I'm usually in work when it's on but I do enjoy seeing the houses of I ever do get to watch it... it's the only bit I've ever been interested in.

My dream encompasses all you have described. My responsibility now is to not pressure my husband into following it and allowing him to make up his own mind. He is the more cautious one out of the two of us

7 hours ago, Flossy82 said:

Hello Mamma midwife. 

I’m in the process of emigrating to Perth (hopefully early March but waiting on visas) and am an obstetrician. I’ve got a Consultant post at KEMH (Kind Edwards Memorial Hospital) in central Perth. I did a fellowship there 2013-15 and loved it. It’s the tertiary women’s hospital for all of WA and is a fantastic place to work, with great teamworking. I’ve just had a look on the recruitment website and it looks like they have a recruitment pool at the moment (they usually do). Even in you’re not ready to apply for a job yet, it might be worth enquiring.

http://jobs.health.wa.gov.au/page.php?pageID=160&windowUID=0&AdvertID=220392

There are also a number of other public  hospitals that you could work in eg Joondalup, Fiona Stanley, Osborne Park, SJOG Midland as well as the private hospitals. I haven’t worked there, but have friends/ colleagues who love it. 

Im actually going over on a 482 (4 year) visa sponsored by the health service. I don’t know if they will offer this for midwifery positions, but it may be worth enquiring, then you could apply for PR once there, unless you prefer the lengthier application time to get everything in order for an emigration. 

Good luck with it all. Maybe I’ll get to work with you in the future! 

Alex x

Hello Alex! 

And thank you for your post

I'll certainly look into the link you sent me and see what I can do. Because of our children, we are going for the PR visa. I don't fancy paying the elevated school fees as this will detract from the reason of moving. But it's definitely a good option if you don't have children in the equation!

I hope we do get to work together in the future, O&G and Midwifery is a small world so I'm sure we will at some point. 

Congratulations on your Consultant post by the way!! such a big achievement

58 minutes ago, Quoll said:

One man’s dream is another man’s nightmare! I always shudder when the “it’s been my dream to ...” is produced as the reason for a move (too much WDU & H&A will do that to you lol)

Sorry to be dense, but can you please elaborate on WDU and H&A? Thank you

10 hours ago, rammygirl said:

When you say ‘we’ score 85 points can you clarify. 85 is high without English and over claiming can lead to refusal. Best to post how you added your points up so people can advise. 

I say 'we' as in my family, myself, my husband and our children. I used the following website to determine our eligible points:

 https://immi.homeaffairs.gov.au/visas/getting-a-visa/visa-listing/skilled-independent-189

Is it the right one to use? (I was recommended it on another forum).

I have just re checked our points and I actually misread one of them I have a masters but I've just realised that it's only relevant if it was obtained in Aus  I guess I'll be doubt that English test after after all!!

As for any concerns about my marriage, thank you! I think we will be good... but then I would say that, wouldn't I? We have already moved away from all family and friends to one if the channel isles. I know it's not the other side of the world but it has been a test!

I've not 'brow beaten' my husband.... at least I don't think I have jk 

I have researched the cost of living and compared it to where we are currently living - which is ridiculous by the way!! And I have presented my findings to him which are that we can have a better way of living in Aus than where we are currently. We have zero chance of ever finding a property here that suits our needs, a small two bed flat costs around £500k and we really need a 5 bed which will cost millions. And he agrees, it makes sense on paper. I've made him fully aware that if he's not happy then we won't go, or we'll come back. 

That brings me on to the Hague Convention.... I've read about it, watched the video and told him in full about it - he thought that was me telling him I might leave him *note to self - don't have these conversations when he's had a few beers while watching the football!!*

I have then explained that I am more than happy for us to sign a contract before we go, if we go, to avoid any issues in the future. I know others have been duped by the empty promise of return which is what I'd want to avoid!

We are a strong family unit and we have been through some awful times. Our family motto is 'as long as we have each other, we have everything' so I know we will be ok. We always make it through difficult times and are closer for it. 

Oh that's good to know! So perhaps we won't need the English test for points then!

thank you!!

Do we still need the English test with UK passports? I thought we didn't need that if we could prove we've been in an English speaking country through school? 

We score 85 for the visa, is that still fairly low?

Thank you for your reply

Hello! 

I have just joined your lovely forum and have had a good look around. I have dreamt about making the move to Oz for at least a decade! And I've finally managed to convince the hubby that it is a good idea!! (I hope I'm not wrong )

We are just starting our in-depth research now so I know we are a while away from the big move. We are thinking of relocating to Perth, however this would be dependant on the availability of jobs for us both.

We also have 4 children (ages 6, 8, 11 and 13) so at least 2 of them will be teens when we move. Has anyone else successfully made the move with teens? Any tips on making the process easier for them?

I know it can take a while before you are in invited to apply for your visa after submitting your EOI so would you recommend submitting asap just in case? My concern is that it all happens to quickly and we won't have time to complete our research - I know this is unlikely, but I'm just being cautious! Perhaps it would be better to wait until we've done all our research before submitting the EOI?

Thank you for your time and I look forward to reading your replies