colinmaclec

I am not saying you didn't do an apprenticeship, It does not matter how you do it as long as you complete the required coursework, site experience and trade test then you have done an apprenticeship! Does the NICEIC really allow people to become members after a six week course? The company i owned was in SELECT which is the Scotish ECA and they run our building certification system which is similar to part P and the technical person from the member company must be an approved electrician who has completed a full apprenticeship. I would have thought the NICEIC would be the same as their standards would be out the window pretty quick if they let anybody in making their membership pretty much useless. I know the bigger sites will fill extra labour from agencies as its easier than hiring and paying the associated costs of holidays and NI contributions but they will have a core squad of decent sparks who have worked with them for a while. The reason i find it hard in OZ is that i would walk into a contracts manager/supervisors job in the UK but here i am a bloody apprentice again! I have on a more positive note found a better job now with a company that has recognized my previous experience

Must be different in England to Scotland as no electrical contractor would employ someone who done a six week course. In Scotland no apprenticeship means no spark simple as that.

Traveling around on a WHV working in temp jobs is not the same as emigrating to the other side of the world with a family to support. I don't regret moving either but i do give honest answers. Your dollars don't go far here and jobs are not as plentiful as you would believe nor is the pay rate when you start paying living costs. And believe me after spending a huge sum of money to get here then been made to be an apprentice for a year again in your thirties is a sore one to take.

I am pretty sure vetassess require a full apprenticeship. Have you tried doing a points test as well as you need a minimum of 5 years post trade to claim points for migration.

Hi everyone!

We fly out to Perth in June. Hubby has an OTSR which means he'll be given his provisional electrical license when he registers with EnergySafe after arrival. But my question is this: do employers even consider taking you on with a provisional or is it a no go until you get your A license??

 

Any help greatly appreciated and i'm sorry if this has been asked before but this thread has soooooo many pages!! lol

 

Thanks

There are jobs without the A grade but it can be quite hard to get one as there an increasing number of people on gap training so that means less positions available as people are not getting upgraded to A grade quickly anymore and firms can only employ so many. I applied for loads of jobs and am on my second job in 5 months as i hated the first. I never really heard anything from jobs on seek, recruitment agencies were a waste of time and not really interested as i did not have a license,I sent CV's to tons of companies and got a few replies but no offers most just said i had an excellent CV and they will let me know when they are hiring and then never heard anything again. Both jobs i got from the job section of the West Australian paper. Oh and apply for your provisional before you leave otherwise you will wait over 4 weeks for the electrical workers permit and wont be able to book the gap training course until you get it either.

does the logbook require evidence? can it be lets say..........fabricated? i'm going to ring TRA tomorrow and see if i can still go down that route. this way is just all over the top.

The logbook has to be signed off by your employer and i believe they can also be audited from time to time as well so the answer would be no unless your employer wanted to risk it. The TRA will tell you that you are not allowed to apply for an ARTC and that if you do you risk your license being revoked completely. Although someone said they got away with it on another forum. They do love to make you do courses and stuff here. You need a ticket to take a dump here.

I am doing the same thing and i reckon i will complete the logbook in around 7months but i average at least 45- 50 hrs a week. The key for me really will be how quickly i can get the final exam booked, i am going to find out about this soon as the TAFE has been shut for summer holidays. But i wouldn't be surprised if there's a 3 month wait for the Capstone as its the same as the Australian apprentices do so will probably be booked well in advance!

It changes a lot and i missed the changes by 2 weeks so i am one of the first lucky buggers to become an apprentice again!

Vetassess is only for visa purposes. Once you get here you will still need an ARTC to apply for a licence.

Thats not true. Vetassess is for migration but it gives you your provisional license same as ARTC but some states WA, SA have a kind of loophole that allows ARTC holders to do a 1 week course. If you have a Vetassess OSTR you are not allowed to apply for an ARTC and if caught doing this you could be refused the provisional license alltogether.

http://www.commerce.wa.gov.au/energysafety/PDF/Forms/R098_1112_Fact_Sheet.pdf

Hi guys,

I'm trying to get this nailed down. Can I get a WHV travel to perth and get an "A" license in a 3 month course and later return to Australia on a PRV and not need to do a 1 year GAP as I already have my A license?

 

If so were can I apply for the 3 month course in perth to do this?

 

I'm just trying to work this out because this would make life abit easier for me and atleast I could do some more travelling then staying I'm one place for 1 year.

 

Cheers for reading

Its a 1 week or 2 week course but an artc will take about 3 months from applying from what i hear but this loophole may close, then again it may not!

Hi there. this is a massive thread so im just going to ask a couple q's. hope someone can help.

 

im in perth and i've just got my provisional from energy safety. it also has the next step on there which is the gap training course (at the balga campus). im trying to find out if that once i've completed this 2 week course can then i apply for an A class licence??? my company is desperate for me to get it asap but i'm hearing that i have to do a yr experience. which i think is a load of old tosh really.

 

Thanks

Well that depends on if you have an OSTR (vetassess) or an ARTC, ARTC yes, OSTR 1 year gap training, logbook, homework and trade test.

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well how are you getting on wit the gap training? eprofiling system? you think it can be completed within the year?

I should have my complete around the 8 month mark due to working overtime and doing differant types of work, but it all depends on how quickly i get the capstone done and receive the results then license which knowing everything else probably wont be quick. Still not finished the homework but i am doing a bit every night now until its done! There is a lot of it especially when you are trying to settle in to a new country with a young family!!

Help needed artc.

Has anyone who as been granted the artc certificate used self employment towards the 7 years experience?

 

I haven't completed an apprenticeship but I do have nvq3 and c&g level 3. I have worked as an electrician as an employee for 4 years and 3 years self employed. Do you think I will meet the guidelines? I have 3 years of accounts with 10 references so far from clients.

It may be a problem, i know vetasses require a full apprenticeship and i have heard of people having problems with gaining an artc due to not having completed an apprenticeship.

Well if you go on a WHV you would apply to the TRA which you do when you get there. It can take up to 3 months, then you do a 1 week nobody can fail course and that's it. The TRA application is a watered down version of the vetassess paper application, you need to provide proof of apprenticeship, references and declaration about your work activities (If you look at another migration site called british expats theres an electricians forum in there with a lot of info on the TRA application). But........... You can only do this in WA and SA currently, and you can work in NSW without a license, all the other states make you do gap training as well. I was told it was getting changed in WA to gap training for all soon but wether it does or not is anybodys guess. They seem to change the system state to state a lot. If you are intending on coming long term then you would be better jumping through the hoops and getting PR as you may find an employer to sponsor you but if you lose the job you have 28 days to find another and i personally wouldn't like an employer to have that kind of hold over me. Its a minefield and it depends on where you go and it could change by the time you get there!

I've had some more information to read today with regards to the possibility of using my electrical route. Looks like I can use the 190 or 489 Visa route, SS or Regional. I've got 3 years exp, mainly Domestic & New Build with an NICEIC Contractor. I'm being told 3 years would be enough? Perhaps this is to do with the Sponsored route & not the 189 Visa applicants? I wouldn't also be too discontented with any Gap Training or Australian certification as I've only finished my qualies 2 years ago, so I'm still kind of in a books mindset. I'm Single, not bringing over a family or Mortgage concerns, so it's a little easier that way too & I've not got any aspirations as to what State will have me! But I am concerned with the Vetasses route of skills assessment. I know I haven't got the broad range of ability and although I'd be OK on most of it, some of the containment & Motor sections etc are out of my scope due to lack of experience in that area. Does any of this get taken into consideration & you may have to show additional training in OZ or is the assessment a straight acceptance or rejection? I'm not trying to pull any fast ones, I know where I sit in the UK Market - Electrical Improver/Mate and wonder what the situation is for this level? I'm realistically imagining that you're either an Electrician or you're not and nothing in between.

You wouldn't pass the paperwork requirement for Vettassess that you have to pass before you are allowed to sit the skills test. They require you to have completed a full apprenticeship. Call Vetassess and speak to them or look at their website and the requirements should be on there. I had to provide a lot of documentation including proof of apprenticeship, 10 years work history, references, copies of further qualifications. My fried who is a carpenter had trouble with his as he couldn't get a reference from a company he served his apprenticeship with over 20 years ago as they no longer trade. To get PR for OZ you will need an apprenticeship and 5 years post apprenticeship experience.

You need to be working in your nominated occupation for 12 of the last 24 months as well.

When you apply for your ARTC it isnt the same form as for your skills assessment from TRA, thats why you see Electrical Mechanic and Electrical fitter. I am too from the same background, maintenance PLC's, SCADA, VSD's etc but although I didnt do too much install work I was capable, like most sparks with our background (17th edition regs certified).

 

If you look at my previous posts on here you will realise what trouble I went through to obtain my mechanics ARTC and last month I was awarded that so now my ARTC says both electrcial fitter & electrical mechanic. sorry to say but You WILL NOT be awarded with your mechanics ARTC if you were assessed as an electrician special class. If you manage to convince TRA that the majority of your work was installation then you may get the opportunity to sit a trade test. This is not easy, questions that you get no preparation for and although the college tutor assessed me as a competent electrician, TRA thought otherwise. I did not get the required mark on sections of my trade test...you needed to get 75% on each section and for example there were 2 questions on lighting, I got one wrong therefore I failed that section !!!!!! The college couldn't believe it and were on my side but even they said TRA are impossible to deal with !!!! I had to do several courses in lighting, checking & testing etc....and with this I then applied again to TRA which is when I was awarded the Mechanics title.

I stuck with the process as I knew what I was capable of, in total, from first applying it took just under 18 months to gain my Mechanics ARTC so now I am able to sit the ETL course in WA (JAN 2013) this will get me the unrestricted license. If you read other posts of mine you will realise that I wanted the 2 weeks course that the mechanics ARTC allows you to sit. Unless you know the answer to questions like : what is the minimum working pressure of ox-acytelene gas? then you may struggle to get your electrical fitters license in WA !!!!!

And now after all that you get to go and do a 2 week no one can fail course the same as somebody on a holiday visa with little experience and some false references does to get a license! Its a crazy system that seems to reward those with less experience!

Thanks dear for sharing information.

eh

I have found myself over the last 18 months that I work just as many hours (generally) here in oz than I did in the uk. We start earlier which is nice but my total hours are the same, I still do a half day on a Saturday , so the only real difference is we work in the sunshine. Not 100% sure you have a better quality of life...? That's just my experience

Did you expect to work a half day everyday? I was referring to life outside work. Such as taking the kids to the beach or park when i come home from work which was something i could rarely do back home apart from a couple of months of the year at best. I plan on buying a boat as well which again is something i would have been unlikely to do back home. There is more to life than money. I spent years trying to make as much money as possible only to see most of it wiped out because the banks got greedy.

I didn't come to Oz to make money. I made good money back home, i cam here for a better lifestyle but i still expected to earn more than what i currently do. Although i have just been offered a better job with more money so hopefully i am finally making some progress. And once i get the license it should allow me to move back into a supervisors or PM role!

Has anyone on this forum or someone that you know come over to Australia and actually made some progress in their electrical career? I haven't been here that long but i am finding it extremely difficult to get anywhere on the job front. I am still doing gap training which is obviously part of the problem. I don't mean mining jobs either as that does not appeal to me . I have a very impressive CV and i have very broad experience yet i barely even get a response for jobs i apply for. I am finding it increasingly frustrating especially when i see the quality of workmanship and workrate that is present here. I am working at the moment but i feel i have went completely backwards in my career and am beginning to wonder if i am ever going to find a job that i am happy in here. If i was still in the UK i would have no problem in finding a good job despite the recession and i am interested to hear other peoples experiences.

Sounds like a total nightmare !! Will probably be picking your brains when we get out there? Are you working aswell??

 

lou

Yes i have been working for a company for the last 3 months. The money is so so but there's overtime pretty much when i want it and they have gave me a vehicle now as i am supervising for them and they recognize that they have a good very experienced spark even if i don't have a A license. But its not easy to get work here. I think it is a who you know place and your past CV counts for nothing, you have to start from the bottom again. I don't regret the move here at all but i have found it very hard to go so far backwards in my career.

Just how difficult is it to get work on a Restricted License?

 

Are some states easier to get this type of work in than others? I'm at the beginning of this process and am wondering what states I should consider.

 

I'm prepared to do this nightmare of a year in or near any town resembling modern society. Long-term I'd like to settle in a big city but that seems a long way off.

 

What states should I target?

 

What are my chances of finding work for this year?

 

Thanks

You have no chance of getting work this year as you need to first obtain a visa. You will never get a sponsored visa from the UK for a sparky job unless you have a friend or family who works in a company that will sponsor you. Companies here do not recruit sparks from the UK as they have too many hoops to jump through with licensing etc. you may get sponsored if you were here working for a company on a holiday visa and if the company wants to keep you long term. Talk to a migration company and ask them if you will score enough points for PR as i don't think you will as you only have 1 years post trade experience. You first need to obtain a visa which could take you up to a year, by then the licensing system may have changed again. It changes all the time and i missed the old system by less than 2 weeks and so i have been stuck with gap training now.

Hey Colin,

How you finding the homework? Just had a first look at it after finishing the course 2 weeks ago. Can't believe you have to do all this just for the license, and you can't do it quickly. And just as summers about to start....

I only really looked at it and started it on Sunday and i was shocked at how much work there is!! I thought i would complete it all in a day. How wrong was I!!!!!!! Its really something you should be doing on a weekly basis i guess. Its very time consuming finding the correct clauses in the regs book even when you already know the answer. It forces us to spend a lot of time reading the book and seems more about the regulations etc than what the 2 week course was, it mostly was basic power calcs and how to wire 1 way and 2 way lights ffs! Im pretty pissed about it tbh as i think we already have enough on our plates trying to settle in to a new country and deal with our kids and now homework too!

Ok, it's becoming a little clearer.

 

Assuming I don't find a sponsor and decide to apply for PR (the most likely scenario), can I then seek employment in Oz once i've passed that exam in London and received my OTSR?

 

At what stage do I apply for the PR? You said I can't look for an employer without having a PR or a sponsor. I presume you mean without having applied for a PR?

To get PR you must pass the vetassess exam( i dont think 1 year post trade experience is enough but someone may correct me on this). pass an english exam IELTS then you apply for an expression of interest, Then they will invite you to apply if you are suitable ie: have enough points. then youy have to do police checks and medicals and thats pretty much it but it is a fairly long drawn out process.