K974

7 minutes ago, Parley said:

It is a fact that many hang out for citizenship to keep their options open and then immediately bugger off back to the UK.

They are not committed to Australia at all.

Is this what you are planning to do also ?

It would be interesting to see what would happen if dual citizenship was dropped and people had to renounce their UK citizenship whether they would still want to become Australian citizens.

Some people on PR have built business and large asset base here,  no one wants to be on a visa when that much is at risk

And you don't build that without contributing  and employing Aussies 

By that principle the government, never make a wrong call.  Which governments Do, and it's our right to challenge it 

1 minute ago, Parley said:

Obviously it isn't or they would have done it.

4 minutes ago, ali said:

Pretty much like now, there was an announcement that the rules would change and if you hadn't arrived before July 1st.  but a few months grace. 

Exactly there was a few months grace / some form of grandfathering 

that's reasonable and fair to expect 

1 minute ago, ali said:

Some people had PR and wouldn't have validated and would have then fallen into the new rules.

Ok , but they got notice to validate /enter and people that were here went under old rules , they got benifit of "grandfathering "but in this instance , we have people here 4+yrs in some cases 10yr and all of a sudden you gotta do another 3yrs . 

Grabfthering should apply shifying goalposts is wrong 

2 minutes ago, wombatinabox said:

This is the MAIN problem, while I am eligible under the new rules to apply in June 2017 anyway, I completely disagree and oppose the fact that these new changes are "back dated".

Exactly , cos in 3 yrs they may make it 8yrs and so on . You can change the rules fair enough, but changing the goal post is different . Anyone eligible/ with PR on 20/4/17 should see it through to completion on the old rules . Otherwise you have no certainty

same as playing a soccer match and on 70min one team want to make it 110min game ,  you can add 20min to all the games in the new season then it's a level playing field 

1 minute ago, ali said:

Moving the goal posts is something that they have always done, when we arrived they also changed the goal posts for citizenship in that if you arrived after July 1st 2007 then you would then have to wait 4 years and not 2 for your citizenship and they introduced the citizenship test..  We were fortunate that we fell into the old rules by 6 months, had we not, we'd have been put out but with nothing else to do about it, we would, like thousands of others have waited the 4 years.  It's not the first time the goal posts have changed and it won't be the last.

Change was different tho, there was a notice periods and it was for people that didn't have PR prior to the date , wasn't it ? 

1 minute ago, BadgerLady said:

All empathy. I work with Australian NGOs on their projects in developing countries, which might mean for example spending 3 months in Kenya or Vietnam talking to women about their health needs. I have a choice to either abandon that work (ouch!) or abandon my chance of ever becoming an Australian citizen.

It's this reason and the whole principle of a retrospective change , there is no security that in 3yrs time they won't make it 8yrs and so on , therefore the theoriectcial possibility you never achieving citizenship. 

If your  on a pathway under a set of rules you should be able follow it to completion

chnage tbe rules to anything they like and people have a choice to go down the pathway or not ,  but not after you have committed everything to it 

27 minutes ago, Parley said:

What is the problem ?

If you are a permanent resident and committed to life in Australia it shouldn't worry you as you are already living here anyway.

 

If citizenship is just a convenience and you are planning to leave back to the UK then really you are not committed anyway and don't deserve to be citizens.

Not really , if you are on the journey and have PR pre 20/4/17 and they have moved the goal posts what's to say they won't do it again, thereby never achieving citizenship , changes should only apply to new PR approvals . 

The governemt went abroad to attract certain skills and made representations regarding the route to citizenship , some of these people were the most highly skilled in the world and could have gone to any country  it's unreasonable to move the goals posts

also a visa is a visa it can be changed its highly unlikely but theoretically possibly all PR's would be cancelled. Not a good position to be in if you have a big asset base built up here.

also in a case I know the guy needs to travel to PNG weekly to develop his Australian business that employs Aussies , he spends 2-4 days a week in PNG, he will never comply with the minimum residency requirement if he does this so now has a choice to grow his Australian business and keep people employed in australia or obtain his citizenship , he's talking about closing the business and going back into employment as he wants citizenship asap for the security of assets etc  thereby Australian 5people will loose their jobs . 

Besides all all that the principle of moving The goal posts is unfair and not an Australian value , one of  supposed reasons for the changes are to ensure Australian values 

by all means make the changes it's their country but they should be grandfathered for this with PR 

I have same question , applied today 20th about 2pm. I had my year done on pr since feb.

what will happen ? Surely there could be an argument you applied at 8am ahead of announcement , wouldn't it surely come into effective as of a certain date in the future , seems very strange it can be back dates and implemented with warning .

not to mention it should only apply to new pr approvals people have bought into a pathway and if they are on that pathway they should be able follow it thru, australia campaigned for workers overseas and provided the 3 457 & 1ye pr as a pathway it's now like adding 20min to a soccer match in the 70mim

if they wanna make it 110min it should be from the next game