Surf N Turf

Dusting off my membership just to say, EW, that as your partner I think there is only one reason to get citizenship. It's not for all those sensible reasons already stated. Even though they make a lot of sense. It's simply so that I can frame it, hang it on the wall and have something that really makes me laugh every day. Snorting, eyes streaming, loss of bladder control laughter.

Go on, do it just for that

I'm getting worried about the threats.

I think I have no choice but to report them to the authorities.

I'd pay good money for a transcript of that conversation.

I agree that it's a completely crap service. They don't bother to knock around here but they used to. I've a friend who works for Australia Post. I asked him about this and he said that complaints soared when they privatised the parcel delivery service. So they hired someone to follow the delivery people around and film them. Much to no-one's amazement they discovered that they were sitting in the vans writing out the 'you weren't home' slips before even leaving the depot!!! That's what you get with privatisation. I think the profit margin on delivery must be pretty small. Not that this is a good excuse for such a poor service.

Hi Stuart, there are quite a few regular posters on PIO who are struggling with the 'mixed marriage' scenario so I hope you get lots of useful input. I'm Australian and my partner is a very homesick Brit. We moved to Australia in 2008 and then headed back to the UK in 2010 as his homesickness was so great neither of us could cope. It was a reluctant move on my part but, as you know, it's horrible seeing your partner so unwell and knowing that it's due to your desire to live in your own country. Guilt! Our move back to the UK proved to be a disaster, due to lots of reasons I won't bore you with, and so five months later we arrived back here. This time to Melbourne, a new city for us both. It's so easy to type out those words but impossible to describe the emotional cost of the whole experience. What I do know is that we'll fight to the death of our relationship. But I also know that being together brings one of us, whoever isn't 'home', a lot of pain. Damned either way.

For now, we're here. And that's what I've learned. You can only ever talk of 'for now'. Because to make long-term plans for either country makes one of us feel miserable and trapped. My partner, who will hopefully be along later to give you his perspective, is currently 'taking one for the team' because life in Melbourne is good. But at some point I'll need to do the same. Our main hope is that we protect our daughter from any fallout from too many international moves.

I also know that this issue will never not be 'live' for us. Don't imagine that a two year stint in the UK will be a fix. If you're very very lucky your wife will decide that Oz is where she wants to be. But you may also find that this turns into a life-long negotiation for you both. It's not easy but a good relationship is worth it. Particularly when there are kids.

Just watched the Federal Budget.

Joe Hockey was quite inspiring I thought.

 

But is the average Australian willing to look past self interest, in the knowledge that we all have to play our part in repairing the budget ?

 

Are we all selfish, just caring about the impact to our own wallets and purses or are we willing to make some sacrifices to ensure the prosperity of Australia for our children and grandchildren ?

I've always thought voting Labour better protected society as a whole, including my own family. Each to their own.

the men

the men

the men

the melbourne men

the men haha

Dunno about this one. Have you seen all the Ned Kelly beards around at the mo? :nah:

When you read enough of these threads where the criticism of Australia is so unbalanced, you can't help but sit back and wait for the follow-on post outlining the almost inevitable crushing disapointment of life back in the UK. (That's assuming that this poster is genuine). If you can't look around you now and find some redeeming features to life in Oz, I reckon you're far more likely to find yourself in the same position in the UK. So jb, my two cents worth: being less negative and disparaging now will help you not only be happier in yourself but you'll be setting yourself up for better times ahead. Because as people have already pointed out, you'll be seeing lots of these problems again.

I was actually joking, it was a positive thing for her.....in a sad way.

 

I can now see how the 'living the dream' comment may have made it look negative

No worries. I was being a bit thin-skinned. Carry on

Some of the best beaches in the world - never go myself, but my 7 y.o. daughter is a fan.

Outstanding sea food / sea food restaurants - sadly I'm allergic to it, but my neighbours regularly tell me how good it is.

AFL - some of the best AFL teams in the world are Australian.

Coffee - Melbourne (where I live) is known all over Australia and maybe even internationally for the quality of it's coffee. We even have schools where Baristas can learn to be even better at making coffee.

Boating, camping and fishing - loads of places where you can go and do these things for very little money. My neighbours do this most weekends.

Australian comedy and drama- Dave Hughes, 'Summer Heights High,' 'The Block,' 'MKR.'

There's got to be a 'dislike' button around here somewhere.....:mad:

As a child, being wrenched from family and school-friends to come to Australia, was hard to cope with

 

Once in Australia, our parents were always seeking greener grass. So more moves, more friends lost, more having to make new friends and get used to new (not necessarily better) places

 

Siblings and I spent hours discussing why our parents were the way they were, did the things they did. We decided they were narcissists. It was all about them, their wants and fantasies took priority above everything else

 

Children have to pretend they're coping when their parents move them somewhere new. Perceptive parents would work out how hard they're making their kids' lives, but selfish parents expect their kids to tough it out and adjust. Very often, those parents had stable backgrounds themselves

 

Like my siblings, I left home early. We were sick of being dragged along in what felt like a travelling circus. Then, our parents claimed that by leaving home, we'd 'broken up the family'. My father admitted he 'just hadn't noticed time passing' and had been taken by surprise when my siblings and I left home. Of course he hadn't noticed. He and my mother were always chasing the dream, from here to there and back again

 

Those who can't settle have problems of their own. Until they resolve their own problems, they shouldn't drag kids into the mix. Maybe they should remain childless. Those who already have children should accept their responsibility to provide a stable environment for their children. Damage caused by repeated moving around cannot be fixed later

 

Needless to say, along with my siblings, I did all in my power to provide my own children with stability and continuity. And it was appreciated. They're free now to join the wanderlust club as adults, but it's not the option they've chosen

 

Some parents behave as if they've never heard the adage: ' A rolling stone gathers no moss'

We should compare notes! Although I suspect you'd win the hardship factor as I consider my parents restless and adventurous rather than narcissists. But like yours, equally deluded about the difficulties their choices made for my brother and I. I do think there's a middle ground. My mothers sister married, bought a house in a small village in the midlands and raised two children who, to this day, have never lived anywhere else. One cousin is raising her family next door and the other has never married and still lives with his Mum. To me, and possibly only to me, there is a bit of a 'failure to launch' going on here. I want my daughter to have a sense of belonging, which I've recently realised I will never have, but also to seek out adventures and to feel confident to explore and try out different places and lifestyles. Does that happen if your roots are too firmly planted? I don't know but I don't want the pendulum to swing so far in my own life that she never leaves our suburb!

Hi Blobby, thanks for being so honest about the whole experience. I reckon your threads should be required reading for Brits moving here:) Despite being Australian I relate strongly to your experience. I started moving back and forwards with ping-ponging parents and continued as an adult. All through my 20's and 30's I was always in one place thinking about the other. U2's 'I still haven't found what I'm looking for' was my cliche back-packing anthem. The only things that have slowed me down are becoming a parent and wanting the stability for my child that I didn't have, hitting my 40s and becoming less tolerant of the incredible amount of stress that comes from international moves, and starting to rue the money I've spent on the whole spectacle. Unfortunately I've dragged a reluctant Brit into this life and so the turmoil continues

As other posters have said, once you've got one country move under your belt I don't think you ever look at life back home the same way. Those that are purely grateful to be home are very very lucky. It's a lot more complicated for most of us no matter which way round the globe you moved. Just as you now suspect that trying Cornwall first would have given you a better shot at Oz, would finding a new, more satisfying version of the UK be the next most logical step? I agree with NSP, it's only the teenage moves that are brutal. The shuffling back and forwards in my early and primary years were a doodle. The one at 13 stuffed me right up. So IMO you have time before you need to commit to a place.

So, dream on and work out where would suit your family best. (I strongly suspect it's not here You clearly have a need for more adventure. Good luck.

Dear Paul,

I read your post this morning and was moved. Your endless negativity, sweeping generalisations and constant misery are an inspiration. Not just in this post but in many more before. Yes, I thought, today I change. Today is the day I'm going to right some wrongs. If Paul can do it then so can I. No more contentment, enjoyment of the sunshine and easy way of life. Today I'm going to do battle. Let people know where they're going wrong. Where they're letting me down. How they should be. After all, who knows this better than me? They just need to ask. No, strike that. They just need to listen.

So forth I went with my critical eye and cutting tongue. But dammit Paul, Australian really let me down. Yet again. Public transport ran smoothly. My colleagues made me laugh. My first coffee of the day hit me right where it needed to. My clients all turned up and seemed grateful for my help. My lunch was scrumptious. No matter where I looked I couldn't find fault. There were no wrongs to right. I couldn't emulate your mastery at fault finding. I failed.

But on reflection, it occurred to my that I've had a good day. A happy day. And I'm quite likely to have one again tomorrow. You don't sound like this is true for you. So, I hope that your path takes you somewhere that doesn't cause so much ire. Or a place that really appreciates your particular brand of critical reflection. And that it brings you some good days.

Yours cheerfully and unrepentantly,

The People of Australia (circa 1994)

Quote: I love all the pomp and circumstance because we don't do it very much, the Aussies are imo unbearable with 'aussie owned and made' on everything. Hell you ask for something that's not Australian and they look at you as though you've slapped them. I remember trying to buy pounds sterling from the NAB they looked at me with horror, and the girl at the airport was absolutely staggered when we said our tickets were one way. Creepy.....singing the national anthem is lovely if it's about pride, I found it to be about drilling it in.

Righto! :shocked: a bank teller looked horrified when you asked for foreign currency? Come on:rolleyes:

Me and my partner have managed to fly out of the country on one-way tickets without people being 'staggered'. We see what we expect/want to see. One persons simple, slack-jawed, brainwashed, unthinkingly patriotic Australian is another's immigration official doing their job. Whatever brightens your day.

I have no problem with Australia Day (just the daily singing of anthems in schools seems inappropriate). I did feel a sense of pride in the UK in August/September 2012. The organisers, volunteers, athletes and spectators at the Olympics excelled themselves. Britain's finest hour IMO. On the flip side royal weddings, jubilees etc are a tad awkward and embarrassing.

I'd be very surprised if singing the national anthem was a daily event in schools. It was a weekly event when I was growing up and it's the same for my daughter now. I certainly don't know all the words and I'd be surprised if she did. Seems to involve lots of mumbling. It's not the best anthem out there. If that's an attempt at brainwashing then it's a slow-burn approach. Her class held assembly in their first year and ran it as a celebration of where they and their parents were all from. Hats decorated with flags from loads of different nations. Sometimes patriotism is just pride in where you live and if often runs alongside pride in where you came from. Doesn't have to be sinister unless you choose to interpret it that way.

When we arrived in Melbourne three years ago I networked fairly ruthlessly at kindergarten with a view to setting up some shared childcare arrangements when the kids reached school the following year. It never made sense to me that all the mums troop up to the school gates every day when we could be taking it in turns, making life easier for ourselves and giving our kids their friends to play with afterschool. My daughter is now in grade 2 and has one afternoon at aftercare each week. I could do away with that too but I want to keep it in her life so that it's not too much of a shock if our circumstances change. I pick her up, with one or two of her friends, two days a week and she goes home with her friends on the other two days a week. One of them even takes her to swimming lessons. This year a neighbour has started taking her to school each morning and in return I bring her daughter home twice a week. I'm self-employed so I take 6 weeks off a year to cover half the school hols and the other half is a blend of her dad, vacation care and friends. Today she's off to the museum with her best mate while we both work. All these arrangements make our lives easier but also enrich her life. She's sociable, confident, independent and has a sense of community.

I'm laying this out just to say that you don't need to get too caught up on the need for paid childcare. When you land in a place without family it's good to build up a patchwork of families with kids of similar ages that you can share care with. They can become an extended family of sorts.

On another note, my daughter is an only child. We're a very happy trio but I sometimes feel that not everyone who was supposed to got to join our party. If I could roll back the clock I'd give her a sibling. But since I can't, I've packed her life chockfull of friends! It makes all of our lives better.

I wish you much happiness with whatever direction you take.

I have been asked that a few times, and a couple of times I have actually know the guy. But then I guess Perth is a small place.

I've also been asked by Brits if I know their friend/relative in Australia. If only i had a dollar for every negative trait assigned to Aussies on here that is actually universal.

I've worked as a professional in both Australia and the UK and didn't see any difference in how my qualifications were viewed. How much weight is given to them will depend on the sector you work in. I'm in health and so they are essential as is continued professional registration. For you I would imagine that it's the same. There may not be the same snobbery around the amount of initials under your name but that doesn't mean they're not important. Like Paul, I don't bother quoting quals on my business cards but I wouldn't get any work if I didn't have them. What does differ between countries is that many who've moved here struggle to get equivalent work as their experience isn't local. Not much you can do about that until you get here and get working. Good luck with the move.

I'm also an Aussie who has returned from a long stint in the UK. More than once actually I think a lot of whether we settle back is about life stages. When I came back in my 20's I bounced back to the UK again as I felt that it offered me more at that time in my life. But now having moved back in my 40's with a partner and child, Australia ticks lots of boxes for me. Achieving a good standard of living in the UK feels more difficult. But again, that's because I'm not interested in shagging my way across Europe. A good school and affordable real-estate is what gets me going these days! At least I have the memories

Apologies for only skim reading (great post BTW) but I got the impression you're back out of a sense of obligation rather than a strong desire to be here. Moving back when parents are elderly, but in good health, can create a long wait until you get to do what you want to do again. And living in a city that you don't like will only make that harder. I do recommend Melbourne for someone who loved living in Europe. It ain't London but my English partner finds it easier to live in than further north. And after many years in Queensland, I really love it.

There are narrow-minded insular people everywhere. I was starting to bristle slightly at Aussies being portrayed that way yet again until it struck me that I was being a bit of a hypocrite. Most of the friends I've made here in the three years I've been in Melbourne are ex-pats. That's partly because I connect with their experiences better but also because they're more open to new people without having a life-times worth of family and friends around them.

It might be worth you coming south and giving Melbourne a try before heading back to the UK again. Good luck with whatever you decide.

Congrats NSP. It looks like the kind of house you and your family can create lots of wonderful memories.

I'm really not sure, but I don't like the way she's tried to make money out of the whole situation.

I read somewhere that all the money from her book went towards her massive legal debts. Not sure if she's personally made much. This situation reminds me a bit of Lindy Chamberlain and Joanne Lees. Women who aren't very soft or feminine in their appearance or speech, or not very forthcoming in general, tend to get a raw deal in the media. I don't really know the truth of her involvement.

Last time round I found you unrelentingly dismissive of anything australia had to offer. But it sounds like its been so tough back home that a re-think is warranted. One word of advice. I love Australia, and Melbourne in particular, but I'd still struggle to enjoy my life in the burbs. You seemed to most struggle with boredom and a lack of stimulation last time. I'd seriously consider a different location that will give you more. Perhaps paying a bit more for housing closer in or heading to a beach. Whatever floats your boat but I'd aim for something completely different this time round. For those that find life here dull, nothing's changed.

There's nothing personal in what I am about to say, but have you really thought this thing through? Are you just going through a bad patch atm and are making a hasty decision?

 

I remember how enthusiastic you were about your return to the Uk and your pictures taken when you took your stroll through the village...............you seemed quite happy then.

 

I also remember (and again, this isn't personal) how "vitriolic" (for want of a better word) some of your posts about Oz seemed to be............you hated the drivers, the tv, and the education system amongst other things...........if your kids are still of school age, how do you feel about bringing them back to that education system.

 

Whatever it was that you disliked about australia will still be here when you return............. whatever it was about the uk that drove you to return, will still have that pull once you are here. Ask yourself is it really what you want? Whatever it is, I wish you all the best but please assure yourself that you have thought long and hard.

Australia now collectively dons its tin hat and waits for the other shoe to drop :goofy:

Great post your right.

 

I believe the perceived view of an over sensitive Australia kicks in when someone realises they aren't fitting it to the way of life, suffering from home sickness or the realisation they made a mistake emigrating, it's just another coping mechanism to pass the blame for things not working out.

An unhappy immigrant can feel very isolated here where Aussies (rightly or wrongly) are quite proud of their country and many migrants around them will be settling well. So it can be hard to find someone who shares your view point and is happy for you to vent. But I think it's a mistake to assume that what you're going through is unique to Australia rather than part of human nature. But PIO might get a little dull if we focused on the overlaps rather than the differences

This is a wonderful posts and eloquently describes what I have been trying to say for years.

 

Australia is not so bad but it's exhausting moving somewhere where you don't feel permitted to be honest and say what you think about a country. Living in Australia is a bit like popping round your Grandma's house and holding in a fart all afternoon.

This overly-sensitive Australian thing is really over-played IMHO. Try putting the shoe on the other foot: Be openly critical of the UK, in the UK, but with a foreign accent. About as welcome as that fart in your Grandmothers house. Many of you seem to think that because you complain like a good un in the UK, and hear it all around you, that the whole country is a sea of robust self-reflection, open to all opinions. That only works if your accent blends in. As someone who had an Australian accent in the UK, I wouldn't have dreamt of wandering around pointing out what I perceived to be flaws. A few may have escaped out of frustration but I never expected my hand shook and appreciation for my input.

It's like criticisms of your own family. Only welcome from those who belong. This is pretty much true no matter where you're from. Same with countries.

I think in hindsight you need a few things to be a success in this country, this is just observations I have made along the way.

 

a) Work hard and accept things are done different here. Some worse.. some better....just accept it as different.

 

b) A bit of Luck.

 

c) Do not bring a sense of entitlement, Australia owes you nothing ........just because you qualify for some sort of visa doesn't mean you are automatically entitled to a well paid job, big beach side house with a pool and a fantastic life. A visa just gets you into the country its up to you to find your way no one is going to hand it to you on a plate.

 

Number 1 mistake migrants make is they think because there is a perceived skilled shortage and they qualify for an occupation from the 'Wanted list' (also known as the Skilled Occupation List) they think it means they are better than locals and deserve to be treated as such.

 

Not true .....you start from the bottom and make you mark accordingly.

 

 

 

I read somewhere that 1/3rd of British who migrate to Australia return to the UK, that means there are still 66% that has made a go of it.... wether they are success stories I would say yes but to varying degree of success.

 

 

It doesn't mean that the other 33% are failures, some will have found that its not just for them.

 

Although it would be acceptable to say that some of those who returned are probably epic failures which explains why some of them are very bitter towards Australia........ of course they will never admit it.

Thank you. This is the best advice I've read on here in a long time.