Guest macfamily Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 (edited) Hi We're having the very unfortunate nightmare every renter dreads! We rented a property in Perth for almost 2 years, treated it like home, were very happy there and left it spotless (cleaner than when we moved into it!) Upon leaving we wrote a thank you letter to the owners (who were moving back into the property) and wishing them luck on their return to their home. The only issue here was a very small area of damage done to the wood floor by a computer chair, we never denied it and even offered to fix it or pay towards the cost of repair. The wood floor ran the whole way through the house and there were scratches on it before we moved in. When we vacated we had a professional carpet cleaner in to do all the bedrooms etc and provided a receipt. 3 months later and we still haven't got our bond back! There have been several emails with the estate agent trying to come to some sort of settlement but they are not playing ball at all. We have offered to pay over half the quote for repair of the wood floor. The owners took it upon themselves to have the carpets cleaned again because they weren't happy with them and when we asked our carpet cleaner to contact them he offered to redo them at no cost - the offer was refused! The estate agent came up with all sorts of bogus claims such as accusing us of owing rent (as if they wouldn't be on your tail if it was 1 day late!!). We provided bank receipts showing everything was paid up to date (as she well knew). Thye also threw in painting, gardening (even though part of our lease included gardners looking after the garden), maintenance....the list went on and on until eventually they wanted us to pay $650 ABOVE our bond!! We couldn't believe it............still can't believe there are such dishonest people out there. Eventually it has come to a head and they have applied for an order from the magistrates court to release the bond money to them....so basically taking us to court! Initially we were just going to let it go and put it down to a really bad experience and horrible people until they started adding all this bogus stuff and demanding that we pay them all our bond money plus more?????? As I said we left the house spotless (I even had a professional cleaner come in to make sure we hadn't forgotten anything) plus the garden was left fully weeded and the area cleaned. It doesn't feel right letting people who bully like this get away with it. After this long tale.........has anybody been in a similar situation? Has anyone had the unfortunate experience of having to go to court? We just hoping the magistrate will be fair on hearing both sides and can see how much these people have tried to rip us off! Any advice would be appreciated.....thanks. ps. Thankfully we have all our comments re damage/dirt recorded on the Property Report prior to moving in to the property which clearly states there were scratches on the floor and the carpets were stained. Somebody had also given me very good advice to take lots of photos for evidence before we moved in and lodge them with the estate agent! :arghh: Edited March 21, 2012 by macfamily Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moirclan Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 it should go to the small claims court and you represent your self , so if you feel you have a case go through the courts [ i would ]take your photos and any other evidence you have , copies of the letters offering to pay for damage to the floor etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calNgary Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Hi In QLD we have these guys - http://www.rta.qld.gov.au/ who help and advise you in situations like this, i would contact the WA equivalent as it sounds like someone is trying to pull the wool over your eyes. Whatever you do , fight it , do not just walk away.. Cal x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissofthegypsy Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 HiWe're having the very unfortunate nightmare every renter dreads! We rented a property in Perth for almost 2 years, treated it like home, were very happy there and left it spotless (cleaner than when we moved into it!) Upon leaving we wrote a thank you letter to the owners (who were moving back into the property) and wishing them luck on their return to their home. The only issue here was a very small area of damage done to the wood floor by a computer chair, we never denied it and even offered to fix it or pay towards the cost of repair. The wood floor ran the whole way through the house and there were scratches on it before we moved in. When we vacated we had a professional carpet cleaner in to do all the bedrooms etc and provided a receipt. 3 months later and we still haven't got our bond back! There have been several emails with the estate agent trying to come to some sort of settlement but they are not playing ball at all. We have offered to pay over half the quote for repair of the wood floor. The owners took it upon themselves to have the carpets cleaned again because they weren't happy with them and when we asked our carpet cleaner to contact them he offered to redo them at no cost - the offer was refused! The estate agent came up with all sorts of bogus claims such as accusing us of owing rent (as if they wouldn't be on your tail if it was 1 day late!!). We provided bank receipts showing everything was paid up to date (as she well knew). Thye also threw in painting, gardening (even though part of our lease included gardners looking after the garden), maintenance....the list went on and on until eventually they wanted us to pay $650 ABOVE our bond!! We couldn't believe it............still can't believe there are such dishonest people out there. Eventually it has come to a head and they have applied for an order from the magistrates court to release the bond money to them....so basically taking us to court! Initially we were just going to let it go and put it down to a really bad experience and horrible people until they started adding all this bogus stuff and demanding that we pay them all our bond money plus more?????? As I said we left the house spotless (I even had a professional cleaner come in to make sure we hadn't forgotten anything) plus the garden was left fully weeded and the area cleaned. It doesn't feel right letting people who bully like this get away with it. After this long tale.........has anybody been in a similar situation? Has anyone had the unfortunate experience of having to go to court? We just hoping the magistrate will be fair on hearing both sides and can see how much these people have tried to rip us off! Any advice would be appreciated.....thanks. ps. Thankfully we have all our comments re damage/dirt recorded on the Property Report prior to moving in to the property which clearly states there were scratches on the floor and the carpets were stained. Somebody had also given me very good advice to take lots of photos for evidence before we moved in and lodge them with the estate agent! :arghh: Been there bought the T Shirt unfortunately, we got hammered for our full bond plus costs and it came to 2550 we lost in the end. We had to replace one carpet due to a cat mishap and they went to the most expensive places they could find, didnt get three quotes and basically rorted us out of the whole amout and then wants 550 more (which was downgraded from 1100). THe estate agents are working on behalf of the landlord not you, so they are just as guilty normally. If you have a strong case then go to the tribunal, you might lose your bond but with your evidence, you may have a strong case to only lose a proportion of it. Just write down every mishap and balls up they have made, the lack of contact, etc. I ended up in an arbitration phone call with the estate agent who was a complete w4nker. By the end of it I had just had enough and gave in as it was stressing us all out. Good luck Sean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Sorry to hear this it seems unlike QLD and Vic that all bond disputes go to the magistrates court. All you can do is get all your evidence together, emails, photos etc and present these. Good luck and please let us know how you go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markntracey Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 i spoke to a lady who's neighbour was taken to court with a bond dispute and the magistrate laughed it out of court and basically told the landlord he was wasting his time. He said wear and tear is expected and the bond was released. So keep faith there may be light at the end of the tunnel. Good Luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harpodom Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 (edited) I ofen ave Bond disputes with me mate Gaz who works @ WhSmiths in Preston. Hes a Connery fan, wereas I'm up Brosnen to the hilt! it can get quiet heated i tell yer! Edited March 22, 2012 by Harpodom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markntracey Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 I ofen ave Bond disputes with me mate Gaz who works @ WhSmiths in Preston. Hes a Connery fan, wereas I'm up Brosnen to the hilt! it can get quiet heated i tell yer! :animal-frog::biglaugh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quinkla Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 (edited) Wood floors get scratched - it is fair wear and tear. The same as carpets wear out over time. It should not be your responsibility but unfortunately offering to go halves on it has pretty much admitted liability. Never, ever expect landlords or agents to treat you fairly - they just see you as a cash cow. They will make all sorts of spurious claims just so you can negotiate down to a bill that you end up believing to be reasonable - even though you probably shouldn't have to pay anything. Nobody gets all their bond back. Edited March 22, 2012 by Quinkla Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LojaChica Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Wood floors get scratched - it is fair wear and tear. Nobody gets all their bond back. Oh noooooo That's not what I want to hear after 4 years of living in a property with "easily scratched" wood floors haha I can just see this will be me posting a similar thread in 3 months :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cartertucker Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 (edited) www.taswa.org ^^ Try this link Wishing you good luck, we have just broken a lease & wont be getting a penny of our bond back....Even though I found them a new tenant to move in 2 days after we vacated!!! Grrrr! Edited March 22, 2012 by cartertucker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pintpot Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Oh noooooo That's not what I want to hear after 4 years of living in a property with "easily scratched" wood floors haha I can just see this will be me posting a similar thread in 3 months :rolleyes: If you're leaving the country for good (I think you are?) then just stop paying before your lease is up. By the time they get round to chucking you out, you're leaving anyway, and who needs a reference? I wouldn't normally advise behaving in this manner, but in a system where all the cards are stacked in the landlord's favour and most appear to abuse that position, stuff them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gpo1971 Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 If you're leaving the country for good (I think you are?) then just stop paying before your lease is up. By the time they get round to chucking you out, you're leaving anyway, and who needs a reference? I wouldn't normally advise behaving in this manner, but in a system where all the cards are stacked in the landlord's favour and most appear to abuse that position, stuff them There'll be a 50 page thread about how you've got no morals if you're not careful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HappyTravels Posted April 21, 2012 Share Posted April 21, 2012 Maybe try contacting the department for employee and consumer protection. We contacted them – just dropped - in when we had trouble renting. We moved into a place that was really dirty – was meant to have been professionally cleaned. Luckily I put everything down on the inventory and took photos of when we moved in, and when we moved out. We had to have the carpets cleaned when we first moved in as they smelt really bad and had horrible stains. When we moved out the agents tried to get us to pay to have the carpets cleaned again – it was in our contact – but as we left them in a better condition than we moved in we didn’t think this was fare at all. The agents insisted “It doesn’t matter how fifty they were when you moved it – it’s in your contract.” However we spoke to someone at the Department, and confirmed this was an unfair term and legally we cant be made to leave the place in a better condition that when we moved in. We wrote back to the letting agent mentioning we spoke to them – straight away they backed down – and claimed of course they wouldn’t charge us for cleaning the carpets. I think agents really try it on – but don’t let them get away with it. Do you have before and after photos? That really helped in our case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mattytrot Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 How did it pan out for you, we ended up in court with our first rental as we sued the landlord for breach of contract for failing to maintain the property , we got great advice and assistance from the tenants rights office in fremantle and they advocated for us in court , we ended up negotiating with the landlord and got all our bond back in full . The importance of photographic evidence was the clincher and dont be afraid to stand up to the estate agents. It sounds like you have been on the ball at keeping records which are also vital Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest macfamily Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Thanks Sean sounds like you had a nightmare of a time.........can't believe the way tenants are treated when they adhere to all the rules and regulations. We're going to fight as we really believe these people are just out to get what they can and they've been making stuff up all the time. Thankfully I've kept a complete record of everything and hopefully the Magistrate will give it a fair hearing. I agree its very stressful and I'll be so glad when it's all over but we just couldn't let them get away with all the lies they were telling!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mattytrot Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 good on ye and good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest macfamily Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Hi Happy Travels, Yes I have all the "before" photos (and looking back on them we definitely left the place in a much cleaner condition!) We didn't take any "after" photos as we truly believed (very naively!) we would not have any bother as we had been given a reference from the Estate Agent and the owners that we were "excellent" tenants and there were never any issues with the 3 monthly property inspections!! I guess when the owners moved back they had forgotten what they had left in the first place and now want us to pay for their improvements!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest macfamily Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Hey everyone thank you so much for your advice/support. Court case next week so I'll keep you posted......fingers crossed.....nervous as hell but just have to see it through now! :eek: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quinkla Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Hi Happy Travels, Yes I have all the "before" photos (and looking back on them we definitely left the place in a much cleaner condition!) We didn't take any "after" photos as we truly believed (very naively!) we would not have any bother as we had been given a reference from the Estate Agent and the owners that we were "excellent" tenants and there were never any issues with the 3 monthly property inspections!! I guess when the owners moved back they had forgotten what they had left in the first place and now want us to pay for their improvements!! Hi Macs. Please don't believe the bond claim is in any way related to whether you were excellent tenants. I am sure you were excellent as the reference says. It is just the agent is now advising the landlord to make a claim on as much bond as possible - even with spurious claims - in the expectation that they will get at least part of the money off you. The agent and landlord just see this as part of the income they expect when leasing a property - it's not personal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest macfamily Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 Thanks Proud Pom I'm sure you're right - it might not be personal but it's disgraceful! I rang Consumer Protection (advice from Happy Travels) to ensure I had everything ready to go for Court and they told me this first hearing is just with the Registrar and not the Magistrate to see if some agreement can be brought! Apparently he can't look at any evidence or make any judgments so it's not the end yet........was so looking forward to seeing the back of it and moving on.........we'll have to see what happens! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoandJon Posted May 6, 2012 Share Posted May 6, 2012 Keep at it - as you paid for professional cleaning, I'd make sure you've got statements from them about the condition of the property. I reckon you've got a pretty damned good case!! We suffered the same problem when we left the UK (ba$tards), but as we'd already left the country we really struggled to argue against it. (They deliberately sent the letter when they knew we'd already gone, despite the date on the assessment being well within the time hubby was still on shore!!) Even from the other side of the world we argued the case and managed to get most of the bond back. Be calm, be organised and be persistent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anya Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Went through a similar thing recently. The fact that you noted down all the issues in the condition report will most certainly help in your case. Also, a fair amount of leeway is provided by way of normal 'wear and tear'. This includes minor scuffs and scratches on floors etc. I was advised that I would be charge around $700 for cleaning the property and like you, I had kept it spick and span. I simply told them I'll see them at the tribunal and that I had over 300 photos to show how much better the place was when we left. They finally backed off and I got my entire bond money back. I think most agents simply try it on and I suspect a rort where they get a cut/commission from the cleaning companies (quite often owned by a brother-in-law or some other relative ;-). I say fight them and get all your money back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest macfamily Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Hi everyone, we've finally put this behind us and can now move on hopefully a lot wiser and less naive! When we arrived at Court the agent asked if I wanted to chat to her which of course I did. She had the whole list of stuff in front of her that we had spent months thrashing out and discrediting and which she said the owners were going to let us off paying! What it boiled down to was the full amount of the wood floor, the carpets and $100 for the water (the bill arrived after we had left and was never in dispute albeit they tried to include filling their pool for us to pay until we pointed that out!).I told the estate agent to forget about all the stuff she was saying that were "discount" as they should never have been there in the first place and were just beefing up their claim. I said we were not paying for the carpets as this matter could have been resolved without costing anybody money, we had already made an offer for the wood floor which we thought was fair and the water bill was never in dispute. There was a difference of $900 between what we offered and what they wanted but I stuck to my guns and said we were prepared to go to the magistrate if necessary. She went back to the owner to see if she would compromise in some way having pointed out my stance so when she came back to me I couldn't believe the owner would not budge - no compromise at all! When we arrived in to the registrar and told him we hadn't reached agreement he said the next date to suit both parties was in August and asked if there was no way we could compromise and both leave court unhappy. The owner got her say in very quickly and started banging on about the floor, the carpets and all the other bullshit stuff saying the area of wood floor damaged by the chair was a lot bigger than it actually was (surprise surprise). When she had finished I said the area was a lot smaller than she was stating and that I had tried several times to resolve the issue and compromise but the other party had not made any compromise and wasn't willing to budge. At that stage I could see the Registrar looking at the letter I had written to the court in response to the Order wherein I had addressed all of their claims with facts and how we had tried to resolve them. I also included photos. He suggested meeting in the middle and going from there to which I responded I would be happy to do that as the whole thing had been so stressful it was not worth going to court for. After a bit of banter both ways we finally agreed on paying the water (which was never in dispute) and probably 85% if the wood floor but NOTHING else! It wasn't a great result but to be honest I'm so relieved to be finished with it and so glad they didn't get a cent for their dishonest bullshit claims plus we get less than half of our bond back. It's definitely been a lesson learned that unfortunately there are some nasty people out there and will look to grab what they can. Thank you all for your encouragement and advice - it all really helped keep me strong on the day!:smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k8bug79 Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Glad it was all resolved. Like you said the stress is sometimes worse. I am def learning from these posts to photograph anything on the way n and out if a property and fight it all the way if they try anything on. Hope your next rental is better for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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