Concerned about quality of education in Australia

[michelle659]

Hi

 

My husband is keen on emigrating to Australia. I have a few concerns regarding the education system. My daughter is in year 7 and is in the top 10% achievers in her year, currently predicated excellent marks, as well as being a level higher in expectations in her current year.

 

I am worried that if I emigrated my daughter could potentially leave school with no qualifications and also concerned the curriculum is not upto par with the UK?

 

My son who is 8 is also top of every class he is in and predicted Grammar school when he becomes of age, but I am also concerned for him.

 

I just cannot get my head around the fact I would either be making a wonderful decision or a terrible decision.

 

I am currently going for the IELTS in April, then lodging skills assessment afterwards. I am really concerned.

 

Any advice would be fantastic, it also doesnt help my daughter is not happy about moving either.

 

 

 

[Quoll]

Australian education produces some highly qualified folk so in general terms, by the time a kid graduates with honours or, more likely these day, masters then they will be on a par with any other first world graduates. One of mine graduated from an Aus uni and his qualifications were accepted without problem in his UK career structure.

 

The Aus education system is only really an issue if you want to return to UK before a kid has finished their education - once off the GCSE/A level merry go round it is very hard to get back on it (although not impossible).

 

As an immediate impact then, yes, it is likely that you will see the work being at a lower level and some folk have reported that their kids were bored and some even dropped out which was very sad for them. However, at the end of it all, they will come out with something equivalent and which will be accepted world wide. Selective High Schools are highly competitive and not available everywhere you go (Aus is a very egalitarian place so streaming and grade based placements are not usual) and where there are selective HS the competition from Asian kids who are tutored outside of school to within an inch of their lives is very hot.

 

If you are only planning a short stay then I wouldnt be mucking around with your kids' education beyond the time they need to start GCSEs. If you are staying for the long term, it is irrelevant. If you plan on leaving before your kids start uni then be prepared to pay international fees in UK and perhaps make sure they have an IB grade rather than a state University Entrance score because the state scores dont travel back to UK as well as A levels do in the opposite direction and the IB is internationally recognized.

 

If your kids are doing well and happy in good schools, unless you have a brilliant opportunity to move to then I wouldnt bother personally.

[Guest Andy]

Hi

 

My husband is keen on emigrating to Australia. I have a few concerns regarding the education system. My daughter is in year 7 and is in the top 10% achievers in her year, currently predicated excellent marks, as well as being a level higher in expectations in her current year.

 

I am worried that if I emigrated my daughter could potentially leave school with no qualifications and also concerned the curriculum is not upto par with the UK?

 

My son who is 8 is also top of every class he is in and predicted Grammar school when he becomes of age, but I am also concerned for him.

 

I just cannot get my head around the fact I would either be making a wonderful decision or a terrible decision.

 

I am currently going for the IELTS in April, then lodging skills assessment afterwards. I am really concerned.

 

Any advice would be fantastic, it also doesnt help my daughter is not happy about moving either.

 

 

 

If your 2 children are as you say top of everything they are in and predicted to stay there and you are that concerned then i would not bother going anywhere as you will only blame yourself if they dont do as fantastically as you think.

[Guest The Ropey HOFF]

Thing is your kids can do great at school here in the uk, but that doesn't guarantee them a good well paid job, theres lots of degree holders, in low paid jobs, or even unemployed, at least they are almost certain to get a good job in Australia, i wouldn't worry too much, the future in Australia looks really bright, unemployment is roughly 5 per cent, i don't ever recall it being so low here in the uk.

[Quinkla]

Thing is your kids can do great at school here in the uk, but that doesn't guarantee them a good well paid job, theres lots of degree holders, in low paid jobs, or even unemployed, at least they are almost certain to get a good job in Australia, i wouldn't worry too much, the future in Australia looks really bright, unemployment is roughly 5 per cent, i don't ever recall it being so low here in the uk.

Australia's booming in the mining sector. Everything else is looking problematic. Victoria has lost something like 33000 jobs in recent months. You are not guaranteed to get a job now and who knows what the future holds? Please don't base emigration decisions on likely job prospects for kids some years in the future.

[John2012]

If you don't fancy it, dont go. The education system is superior to uk. If your kids don't become top of class it's because there not as bright as others, not because the education system is inferior.

[Quinkla]

. The education system is superior to uk. If your kids don't become top of class it's because there not as bright as others, not because the education system is inferior.

Do you have evidence to support this? And if so, what does it mean? My impression is that the Australian system does not serve the top students as well as the UK system, but I have no evidence one way or the other. In world university tables, the top Australian universities (currently Melbourne and ANU) are some way below Oxford and Cambridge.

[Murta]

if you don't fancy it, dont go. The education system is superior to uk. If your kids don't become top of class it's because there not as bright as others, not because the education system is inferior.

 

i too am interested in this thread john2010 and i would be interested to know how you know it is more superior. Good to get as much positives. I

 

live in ni was has the highest (superior as you say) achievements wihtin the uk and would be worried about educ system comparisons. So far in my research oz seems to have a "happier educ system for kids".what do u think in ur experience of the superior education.

Thanks

murta

[Bonnie11]

My twin boys were in grammar school in the UK and we moved them in yr 7 also they didn,t want to come either. They are presently at a public school, and as we are currently on a 457 cannot go into the grammar stream but they have something similar called an enrichment stream. They did a term in yr 7 and it was fairly low key, but since being in yr 8 the homework has stepped up. It seems a lot more laid back here but they have made lots of really nice friends and 5 mths after arriving they announced they didn,t want to go back to the UK. Remind yourself that Australia also produce doctors and professional people so the schooling can,t really be that bad. Good luck, loving Sydney and Balmain area been here now for 8 mths

[rahrah]

Agree with Bonnie -

My kids were also deemed bright sparks when in UK - had a fairly easy first year (go to a Public school and I had an abdab when I saw the content of their text books at beginning of the year) It was predominanatly revision in subjects like English, Maths, and Science - but was pleased that they had quality learning in new subjects such as SOSE, and loved the new experience of Australian system. However, as it is a new culture, the kids needed time and space to adapt to it, so an easy year was actually beneficial as it took the pressure off!

This year (Year 9 & 4) the tempo has definately picked up, and they are learning tons. They remain in the top of their groups and I honestly don't think it is as backward as people initially say, or I had thought.

Good luck with the dilemma.

[Freckleface]

A friend who has taught in both Australia and the UK once described the differences in education systems to me as – “in Australia children are taught to ‘think’ whereas in the UK they are taught to pass exams”.

Her observations appear to hold some validity when the results of the International Educations surveys PISA and TIMSS are considered.

 

Both of these surveys provide information about different aspects of students’ mathematics and science learning.

 

• PISA assesses careful reading, logical thinking and the application of general mathematical and scientific processes and principles to everyday problems.
  
• TIMSS assesses mastery of the factual and procedural knowledge taught in school mathematics and science curricula.
  

By comparing the PISA and the TIMMS results, it would seem that the following applies:

 

• Australia and New Zealand students perform better (on average) in applying general mathematical and scientific principles and skills to everyday problems than in recalling and using curriculum-based factual and procedural knowledge.
  
• UK students perform better (on average) in recalling and using curriculum-based factual and procedural knowledge, compared to the application of these skills in everyday situations.
  

At the end of the day I believe bright children will succeed regardless of the system they are in.

[LKC]

I can't speak with experience about the later years, but I would agree wholeheartedly with what Freckleface says about children being taught to think. My eldest is just in year 1, but last year (kindy), which is the first year of school in NSW, she was taught to read and write. They did two hours of literacy every morning, and right from the very first day, she was taught to write a story. On her first day (bearing in mind she hadn't done very much in the way of writing before), she wrote "I love my mum" and drew a picture of her and I holding hands. She copied the words from the blackboard, but because what she had written had meaning, she was hooked. I saw her go from that to writing stories with a beginning, a middle and an end at the end of the year. My nieces go to school in the UK. They have been taught to write by rote. That is, they were given worksheets with dotted letters on, and they had to trace those over and over. I don't know if this is the case at all schools, but I can see that here the children are being taught in a way that interests and engages them. They are being taught to use their imagination, and I think that if you have a clever child it allows them to use their intelligence, rather than just learn stuff.

 

I am hoping that this carries on through school, because I would far rather that my children were taught how to think for themselves and work things out, than being taught lists of facts and figures from a book.

[Paul1Perth]

If your kids are doing well in the UK there's no reason to think they would change when coming here. If they are bright kids with a good work ethic the schools seem to have streams to cope with clever kids.

 

Nothing to say though that your kids will carry on being bright sparks they may change overnight and become moody, lazy and not do so well at school. Who knows what goes on as kids grow up, especially as they near their teenage years.

 

I think it would be unusual for your kids to be behind the move. They will have friends, know there school and the place they live and know exactly what is expected of them and where they fit in. A move to the other side of the world would be frightening I would imagine. When I was about 10 my parents moved from the centre of Chesterfield, 4 miles down the road and I hated it for a few weeks and was a nightmare to live with, until I got to know a few people and got a circle of friends again.

[starlight7]

I think Australian education is much broader than in the UK but not so 'in depth'. Not so exam focussed, either, except for the last 2 years. In the end it is all pretty much the same because the in depth stuff occurs at university. I prefer the Australian system because I think children have more chances to change their direction because of the breadth of study. They are not so locked in to arts or science though of course they need the core subjects like English and math. They do some fantastic projects here and also a lot of public speaking and presentations which help a lot if the child is a bit on the shy side.

[michelle659]

Hi

 

Thank you so much for your help. Its a huge decision and both my husband and I are up for emigrating. I worry so much about the children, I personally feel emigrating will benefit my children in many ways, this was my only gliche. However, it is true one day my children could wake up and change thier mind. To be honest if the boys do not pass the 11 plus then one boy of mine at least would with the potential school he would have to go to.

 

I am doing my IELTS in April, then my skills assessment afterwards, with plans to put in a sponsored visa request in September ;0).

 

Thank you so much, all your opinions have really helped.

[supa]

My DD has just earned a place at grammar school for September and we will, fingers crossed, be looking at going out early 2013, so I understand your concern. However, there is just so much emphasis on passing exams in the UK, that I can't help thinking they are just being turned into robots. There's no point leaving school with armfuls of qualifications but having nerves shot through due to too much pressure. My daughter's friend (at another school) is spending her entire year 6 doing tests and exams; she literally hasn't learnt anything this year at all. Consequentially, she's is being fitted with a teeth guard because she grinds her teeth so badly, is developing a bowel problem due to stress and fainted at the weekend. I have read many times over the years that I've been looking into Oz the fact that their system seems to produce more thinkers. To me this is an essential lifeskill and, as an employer, is something I would look on favourably. Providing they have enough qualifications (which from what you say of your childrens' natural ability this shouldn't be a problem) to get an interview in the first place, a thinker will be happier and more efficient in the workplace. They've also got driven parents who are on the ball and would take action, be it by tutoring or moving school. Perhaps looking into private schooling in Oz (which in the main is very much cheaper than here) may be an option and then going flat out to pay for it. Good luck.

 

Good luck for your IELTS.

[realitynotincluded]

Just to add a positive note. you will be pleased to know that Aussies do offer very bright children a gifted and talented program... my son is 13 turning 14 and is in a class that have kids who are or will be turning 15 this year and that is in the extended program.... they are expected to achieve high scores always to stay in these classes and is extremely competitive to get into, It is government funded (GATE-gifted and talented education) and some schools run the same program along side the government one ( SBAE....School based academic extension) both use the same program. The only down side is they are only offered once a year and you might have to wait a year before your daughter can sit the exam, and maybe your son. Another bonus my son has the oportunity to participate in exams that are from new south wales university. Hope this is helpful to you

 

Hi

 

Thank you so much for your help. Its a huge decision and both my husband and I are up for emigrating. I worry so much about the children, I personally feel emigrating will benefit my children in many ways, this was my only gliche. However, it is true one day my children could wake up and change thier mind. To be honest if the boys do not pass the 11 plus then one boy of mine at least would with the potential school he would have to go to.

 

I am doing my IELTS in April, then my skills assessment afterwards, with plans to put in a sponsored visa request in September ;0).

 

Thank you so much, all your opinions have really helped.

[Guest The Ropey HOFF]

Australia's booming in the mining sector. Everything else is looking problematic. Victoria has lost something like 33000 jobs in recent months. You are not guaranteed to get a job now and who knows what the future holds? Please don't base emigration decisions on likely job prospects for kids some years in the future.

 

 

What else can you base emigrating on, but current facts? And the facts are that currently unemployment is averaging about 5 per cent in Australia and in the Uk it is 8.6 per cent, but that only paints half a picture, new jobs are mostly part time, low paid and temporary contracts, plus millions who are lucky to have jobs are having their terms and contracts altered and pay freezes for the last few years, so ......... Its clear to me that Australia has alot more to offer our kids than the uk has to offer and who knows what the future holds, the so called collapse of the mining industry boom has been wrongly speculated about for ages and its still going strong. Like i said before i don't ever recall unemployment being as low as 5 per cent here in the uk.

[blobby1000]

Does anyone on here have kids that are of average intelligence? They all seem to be in the genius catagory.

[Guest Andy]

Does anyone on here have kids that are of average intelligence? They all seem to be in the genius catagory.

My kids are certainly not of average intelligence :nah:, they are just like there father which is smarter than the average bear and well into genius standard :wink:

[blobby1000]

Yes Im praying mine take after their father as well being that my wife thinks Brisbane is the capital of France......or something like that!

[blobby1000]

Mr Smart bear Andy I think you will find you should have used "their" and not "there" (or perhaps you were being ironic!)

[Guest Andy]

Mr Smart bear Andy I think you will find you should have used "their" and not "there" (or perhaps you were being ironic!)

No i was not being ironic i constantly get their and there mixed up for some reason, although spelling is not strongest point.

[John2012]

When I said Australian education was superior to the uk, I should have anticipated the usual rhetoric of comparison, I.e. The Oxford and Cambridge vs the rest of the world ramblings.

 

Because the Australian education system is focussed on child strengths and abilities from entry level age, the child is not robotically moulded and labelled as in the uk. If a child is seen to have a specific natural talent, they can then enter the schools of excellence be it sport, art etc. Many children in the UK are held back from self achieving and realising their potential.

 

I was not suggesting children in Australia are more intelligent, they simply have more opportunities to grow and be all they can be. For me, that is a superior education system from the grassroots.

 

The statistics clearly show higher levels of academic success rates in the world educational rankings. Australia is 3rd and the UK is 17th.

[Quinkla]

Does anyone on here have kids that are of average intelligence? They all seem to be in the genius catagory.

I imagine some would, but they are unlikely to be the ones who post wondering how their kids are going to get on in a different education system - probably because education systems tend to be pitched at exactly their level. It's the very bright and the very dim who tend to find the system doesn't cater for their needs without careful parental intervention.