New Points Test - Details Released 11 November

[Guest Gollywobbler]

Well they ****ed that up!!!

 

I already have my application in, so can really put forward what I think impartially.

 

I am an elec eng (Chartered), all the bells and whistles. now I only just scrape 70 points here (with state sponsorship).

 

So a tradie with a few years post experience and a bit of cash with him could well be over 32, therefore 25 points. Add 10 for IELTS 7.0 (using UK passport), 15 points (8+ years experience), 10 points (recognised apprenticeship) and 5 for the misses (assume that you have not moved heaven and earth to keep teacher misses at home with little one). Grand total is 65.

 

So your experienced tradie with a bit of survival cash cannot have a stay at home mum, or needs to learn a foreign language, or prove his standard of English, work in Oz for x years, get state sponsorship etc. Crap, not enough people qualified to that level need to go through this.

 

This points test is a thicko tool for trying to keep out non, Irish, Brit, Yank, Canadian etc. I can imagine the office conversation at DIAC now "so how do we whiten things up"!

"Easy, use a points test to keep out non English speaking potential immigrants".

"Are you sure"?

"Yeah what can go wrong"?

"Erm, we make it so hard no qualified people apply"?

"Nah, will never happen".

 

Personally I can see a few holes with this particular points system, what it is aimed to do and how it is trying to achieve it. Be surprised if it is not altered before implementation next year.

 

What do I know, I'm just an electrician.

 

Hi Doc 53

 

I haven't read the details of the new points test yet, but my own instinct is that you are right about the thinking behind it.

 

I also don't think that any of this is Chris Bowen's doing. He has only been in the Minister for Immi's job for 5 minutes and Joolya has told him to concerntrate on Asylum Seekers. I reckon that DIAC devised the new Points Test in order to please Senator Evans, who seems to have White Australia written all over him as far as I can make out.

 

Cheers

 

Gill

[Guest MOTO]

Well they ****ed that up!!!

 

Add 10 for IELTS 7.0 (using UK passport)

 

What do I know, I'm just an electrician.

 

It is my understanding that under new points system certain passport holders (we all know which countries are included) are exempted from needing to prove that they have ‘Competent English’ or IELTS 6. As it is the case with the current points system, if someone wants to get extra points (and it is my understanding that under a new points system this corresponds to IELTS 7 & 8) such persons would be required to take the test regardless whether they are exempted or not.

Hence, almost everyone now would be required to sit and achieve IELTS 7 score and above. Unless you are 25-32 year old, Phd holder from an English speaking country. HA-HA.

 

I am actually glad that it is the case now, given the fact that every other factor (e.g qualifications, work experience) must be met by everyone, regardless of whether they come from English speaking country or not.

 

I am sick and tired people repeating it again and again, but I am British, Canadian ( or whatever), why do I have sit that silly test. Well, because people that come from non-english background have to do it, that’s why.

 

PS.

 

Passed Academic IELTS with 8’s and 9’s July 2010.

[RockDr]

Hence, almost everyone now would be required to sit and achieve IELTS 7 score and above. Unless you are 25-32 year old, Phd holder from an English speaking country. HA-HA.

 

 

25-32 = 30 points,

PhD = 20 points

you're still 15 points short there... And bearing in mind most people don't finish PhD until at least 26 yrs old, there's not that much scope for experience points, so IELTS it'll have to be... Though one would hope that a native english speaker with a PhD would fly through them.

[Guest MOTO]

25-32 = 30 points,

PhD = 20 points

you're still 15 points short there... And bearing in mind most people don't finish PhD until at least 26 yrs old, there's not that much scope for experience points, so IELTS it'll have to be... Though one would hope that a native english speaker with a PhD would fly through them.

 

 

Well, i made an assumption that our Phd prodigy has at least some relevant work experience

[RockDr]

Well, i made an assumption that our Phd prodigy has at least some relevant work experience

 

The most a PhD could have and still be under 32 is 6yrs experience, if that's overseas, it's only 10 points and not enough to qualify, if it's in australia, they'd just scrape through, but if that was the case they'd be going ENS long before they'd clocked up those 5 years. And that still doesn't help the 26yr olds. So yes, even prodigal PhDs would need to take IELTS.

 

Regardless, think I'll be sticking with my original plan of going for the partner visa next February :wink:. Though at least I know that I could actually qualify for a work visa without needing state sponsorship under the new system, I was quite a bit short under the current system.

[Guest MOTO]

Well, one of my friends got her Phd’s in Computer Science at 25 and she has no intention of moving to OZ . She is more than happy in the US.

 

 

I qualify both under current and new points system. In fact I have 175 visa application in the pipline already.

 

Cheers.

[RockDr]

25/26 same difference, still doesn't get her up to the 8yrs overseas experience needed to avoid IELTS

[jess1983]

Why does everyone keep saying that just because they have chosen to increase the English language requirements because they are being racist or trying to revert to 'White Australia' policy?

The UK, the US, Canada etc are all highly multicultural countries where those born there (and therefore native speakers) are a massive variety of ethinicities. In the UK I went to school and university with many many non-white English speakers who were born and bred there!

This is about language and the ability to speak it in the country you move to! Im sorry but I do think native English speakers and or those who have a very high level should be advantaged-just the way I would believe somebody who spoke fluent French should be advantaged over myself if i wanted to move to French Canada.

[RockDr]

Jess, the issue is mainly with the way of measuring english ability, rather than the fact that it should be measured. Many people with good everyday english, i.e. plenty good enough to get by in day to day life and to carry out 'tradie' jobs, will really struggle with getting good IELTS scores (what DIAC have forgotten is that this difficulty applies to natives as well as foreigners, so they're effectively shooting themselves in the foot).

[Guest tyasawa]

I personally do not have any issue with the English requirements by itself, after all I did come across few fellow international students with less than adequate English. It was a hindrance especially when you are in a group with them and have to constantly fixing their part in documentation.

 

However, I doubt it that IELTS can test the ability properly, after all people with less than adequate English can pass it with proper training. Not in the English language itself, but learning how to do well in the IELTS. In my home country there are even learning centers specifically for IELTS. On the other hand, people who are fluent in English would sometimes face problem since they are not familiar with the format of the test.

 

I do not think IELTS even serve it's purpose if we are looking at it that way. I have no idea off course how to properly test it. This is their homework to do.

[Guest Rami]

Totally agree with Rockdr and tyasawa

 

According to a recent survey, 50% of Australians don't have the literacy levels required for their professions costing billions to the economy. the Australian Government should ask its citizens to sit the ielts test -)

[Guest MOTO]

Totally agree with Rockdr and tyasawa

 

According a recent survey, 50% of Australians don't have the literacy levels required for their profession costing billions to the economy. the Australian Government should ask its citizens to sit the ielts test -)

 

I was horrified when i read that article (in The Age i think it was) but by no means i was surprised. On a daily basis i deal with native english speakers in the middle management that cant's spell properly .They really need to sharpen up their own english language skills before they start imposing them on others.

[Guest Rami]

I was horrified when i read that article (in The Age i think it was) but by no means i was surprised. On a daily basis i deal with native english speakers in the middle management that cant's spell properly .They really need to sharpen up their own english language skills before they start imposing them on others.

 

you are so right. statistically, there is a 50% chance that federal ministers don't speack English :biggrin. The latest point system particularly the english system is all about politics. Labor knowing that their asylum seekers policy have failed, they tried to compensate this deficiency by announcing tougher rules for legal migration. Unfortunately, some people fell for this trick. The Latest policy will hurt Australia economy so hard they will have to go to to beg Chinese and Indians to study in Australia. It is time the liberal get back in power and clean this mess.

[virtual_bajwa]

I am trying to be optimistic after going into the details of New Point System. It says No family sponsored applicant can apply permanent application. They can only apply for Regional Provisional visas. It gives me a little bit of hope. I am also sitting on the Provisional application(496). It means they will process my application. When and how I do not know.

 

Will family sponsored applicants still be eligible to apply for a permanent Skilled – Sponsored visa?

No. As part of the changes accompanying the introduction of the new points test, from 1 July 2011 applicants for the Skilled – Sponsored subclass 176 or 886 visa subclasses will need to be sponsored by a state or territory government under a state migration plan.

There will no longer be a permanent family sponsored skilled migration visa however eligible family members can still sponsor relatives under the provisional sponsored skilled migration visa. Holders of a provisional sponsored skilled migration visa may be eligible for a Skilled Regional (Residence) visa (subclass 887) after meeting certain eligibility criteria.

Will family sponsored applicants still be able to apply for a provisional Regional Sponsored visa?

Yes. The new points test will continue to award points to applicants for a subclass 475 or subclass 487 who are sponsored to a regional area by an eligible family member or a state or territory government under a state migration plan. Holders of either of these provisional sponsored skilled migration visas may be eligible for a Skilled Regional (Residence) visa (subclass 887) after meeting certain eligibility criteria.

[Guest JSHAN]

Guys,

 

I am sure @ this moment they are saying the existing applications will not be impacted.....just to make sure that more and more eligible people apply urgently and keep their cash boxes filling..

 

Come may 2011 - State Migration & DIAC will get together and say the new points system will have priority 2 as per the ministerial rights on 1900 century(ex1948) the minister has rights to whip all CAT 3's arses and put the people applying on new points system a higher priority (i.e max 2)

 

The other CAT3 and CAT 4 can patiently wait for their allocation of CO's or you know what 2 ways of PR.

 

1. Employee Sponsored Visas (PR)

2. New Points Test(PR) - 8-14months something like that to lure new applications.

3. Or recall your old applications and you will not get your money back.

 

Australia destination has become a joke now... !!!!

 

I will tell you the IELTS 7 is already discriminatory saying people with competant english which were able to work in Australia for last 10+ years the new ones are not welcome...

 

Regards, JSHAN.

[Guest mpogr]

JSHAN,

 

One may say your exaggerating things, but, actually, according to very recent historical experience with DIAC, the scenario you're describing is very likely.

 

Just think about what happened this year: a 175 applicant say, from Dec 2009, had his 2231-79 (Computer Specialist NEC, with Java/C/C++ etc.), thinking his application is going to be processed in a sweep thanks to MODL/CSL... which got abandoned in Feb! Then, in June, he would learn his occupation is not on the new SOL, so he's CAT 4 now, with indefinite wait and a real prospect of cap and cease... I'm sure there are dozens if not hundreds of cases like this!

 

Who said they can't do anything similar once again?

[Guest JSHAN]

I agree, but DIAC has got into a bit of a habit of doing this...

 

Currently as you know they are processing CAT2's and odd CAT1's , looking at the number of CAT2's they have to get through like 25000 applications and only touch CAT3's after that,by the time they finish 25 k applications of CAT2 and CAT1's the new financial year will come i.e July 2011 and again processing of new CAT1 and CAT2 including the new points test will kick in.

 

CAT 3 and CAT 4 are according to DIAC Loser 1 and Loser2.

 

Regards,

JSHAN

[Guest mpogr]

I think the biggest problem with their habitat is that they just keep changing the rules for, seemingly, money-milking.

 

Just using my previous example, that Dec 2009 applicant can lodge a new application today, which would either put him into CAT 3 (if he changes his nominated occupation to the one on SOL, which is not a problem at all for most IT people) or even into CAT 2 (even without changing his occupation, but by obtaining VIC or ACT SS, both of which include the good ol 2231-79). But this means more money to DIAC (and, subsequently, migration agents) and a new timeline. And no guarantee this exercise wouldn't need to be repeated.

 

I just wonder wouldn't taking this case to the court be justified...

 

As for CAT 3 and CAT 4... CAT 3 is meant to be the mainstream, at least by declaration, for any people without SS. There is a substantial difference between the yearly SS quota and the general quota, so, as long as this is the case, CAT 3 applications should be processed at a significant rate.

But, again, who said this will remain the case for long?

 

One last thing. Australian migration officials/politicians keep saying they want employer-sponsored migration to become a mainstream. However, with the current situation, where 99% of Australian employers won't consider even interviewing someone overseas (just look at job ads and you'll get the picture), this is a completely unrealistic wishful thinking. Even being onshore (on a 457 visa), I'm reluctant to request employer's sponsorship for PR. Why? Because, at the moment you ask your employer for PR sponsorship, you owe them. When you OWE them, they OWN you. Meaning they can, even subconsciously, mistreat you. E.g. give you less salary increase than you deserve, or anything of this kind. Just because they know you can't leave them.

[Guest MOTO]

Read this :

New points test won't solve skills shortage: industry group - iPRIME Tamworth

[Guest chajath]

Read this :

New points test won't solve skills shortage: industry group - iPRIME Tamworth

 

Maybe its a little bit of conspiracy theory but I think what the government is really on about is Labor protectionism. Keep meddling with the GSM scheme, make 457 visa granting ever more harder (look at all the conditions attached to it!) to the point where potential immigrants (cheap migrants taking Australian jobs to their eyes) give up and leave.

[ovel]

But you can get more points if you get 8 for IELTS.

 

i GOT ALL 8's, but i can see how it will affect a lot of students.

 

It's almost impossible to pass ielts 8, if you live in non-english country. Just imagine a place, where none of any english person with whom you can speak to.

[Guest mpogr]

It's almost impossible to pass ielts 8, if you live in non-english country. Just imagine a place, where none of any english person with whom you can speak to.

It is possible, but would require some major effort, and, most definitely, investing some money into a good course/tutor. I lived in a non-English-speaking country and was able to do IELTS with 8.5/9/7/7.5 marks without any preparation. I could have definitely done much better in writing if I had prepared more thoroughly. Speaking is the only part that requires a real human counterpart for practicing, everything else can be done using computer software and/or online.

Терпение и труд всё перетрут:wink:

[The Flinns]

Wow. I got over on a State Sponsored 475 (Temporary Visa). Under the new system, I would have qualified for the 175!

 

Still only 8 more months to go until I can apply for PR.

[Guest MOTO]

It's almost impossible to pass ielts 8, if you live in non-english country. Just imagine a place, where none of any english person with whom you can speak to.

I hear what you are saying. Spain is a very good example of such country, but I have the following to say to you. It’s the matter of how badly you want something. Take your dream job for example, wouldn’t you go above and beyond of what it is required to get it?

I think about it this way. I am currently working on my French in my own time when I have a spare minute , simply because I don’t want to feel like an idiot every time I visit France.

 

[taniaholmes]

Guys,

 

I am sure @ this moment they are saying the existing applications will not be impacted.....just to make sure that more and more eligible people apply urgently and keep their cash boxes filling..

 

Come may 2011 - State Migration & DIAC will get together and say the new points system will have priority 2 as per the ministerial rights on 1900 century(ex1948) the minister has rights to whip all CAT 3's arses and put the people applying on new points system a higher priority (i.e max 2)

 

The other CAT3 and CAT 4 can patiently wait for their allocation of CO's or you know what 2 ways of PR.

 

1. Employee Sponsored Visas (PR)

2. New Points Test(PR) - 8-14months something like that to lure new applications.

3. Or recall your old applications and you will not get your money back.

 

Australia destination has become a joke now... !!!!

 

I will tell you the IELTS 7 is already discriminatory saying people with competant english which were able to work in Australia for last 10+ years the new ones are not welcome...

 

Regards, JSHAN.

 

Thats what i thought till i read this statement from Go Matilda

 

 

 

Importantly for those whose applications are already submitted, the Department of Immigration confirms that visa applications lodged before the 1st of July 2011 will be assessed against the current points test.

 

 

Regards Tania