Why are you going ?

[Guest TLC1]

Well Jim as a Canadian who moved to Australia, I have to disagree with your post. I have found Australia very expensive. I also am friends with lots of Australians at work, and everyone I speak to has said how expensive Australia has gotten in the past 4 years.

 

My OH and I had a combined income of approx $145k a year prior to him losing his job, and we still found it expensive. On a income like that back in Canada we would have lived like kings and queens !!. We are now on an income of $50k and that is why we are going back, there is no way we can survive on that amount.

 

Also Jim I take personal offence to you saying that people accept low income jobs... you make it sound like the majority of people on PIO will be accepting high paying jobs... sorry to burst your buble mate.. but the reality of living here, is that not everyone in Australia is making $65 to $100k and if you are then consider yourself damn lucky!!

 

Jim I know that you LOVE Australia, and I don't hate Australia (it just hasn't worked out for us), however, sometimes the way you rabbit on to prospective immigrants, you would think that this country has a bloody red carpet waiting for new migrants and the streets are paved with gold, and that everyone who gets a visa will get a high paying job.

 

Sorry mate, but the dream and the reality are often two different things.... yes lots of people make a good go of it, but please stop shooting us down for those that didn't land that $100k a year job, and have struggled.

 

I really hope that when you move over to Australia it is your Utopia, as you have built it up so much, but at the end of the day, please give some respect to us moving back, the majority of us have had some hard decisions to come to !!

 

Cheers

 

Karen

Well said Karen! I couldn't agree with you more I have met a good few that were so full of excitement & hope before they got here & were so happy to have gained a visa only to face the harsh reality when they got here. Every case is different but where we live on the Sunshine Coast it's expensive & we earn less money. After not even getting a reply to many jobs my Husband applied for despite being highly qualified with many years experience we were told by an employment agent it's because he is English, although I think she panicked after saying this and said it probably best to keep that just between us! LOL!

[mrsindecision]

Well said Karen! I couldn't agree with you more I have met a good few that were so full of excitement & hope before they got here & were so happy to have gained a visa only to face the harsh reality when they got here. Every case is different but where we live on the Sunshine Coast it's expensive & we earn less money. After not even getting a reply to many jobs my Husband applied for despite being highly qualified with many years experience we were told by an employment agent it's because he is English, although I think she panicked after saying this and said it probably best to keep that just between us! LOL!

 

I agree with you - we have just moved back form the Sunshine Coast where the wages are pretty bad - I earned 70K last year self employed (so some tax breaks) and had to travel the country for that. Lawyers on the coast earn about 80-90K. Most of my friends there earn about $35 - $70k. Housing however is still very pricey our 4 bed home with pool on a suburban block was $650,000. Groceries are astronomical. Petrol is cheap as is train travel compared to here. But our cars are more economical and cheap to buy ( two good german run arounds for £6500 we paid $53k for our two cars in Oz). My husband is now earning the same here (UK) with no overtime as he did there (Oz) with lots of overtime. I am earning £350 per day here (not working everyday yet but likely to be within the year). We live in a very expensive part of the UK (30 miles from London) and feel better off than we were in Oz - that's including supporting kids at uni. Free healthcare and education are blessings. We paid for top quality schools in Oz and educationally they don't come near to the good state comp that my daughter is attending where she is already being predicted As and Bs at GCSE - in Oz she regularly got Cs and Ds because the laid back attitude meant if she didn't want to work she didn't have to. Here the teachers role is to stimulate learning as much as teach - and there are rewards and punishments for those who do and don't.

 

Don't get me wrong I really think Australia is a wonderful country and I do miss certain aspects of it and always will I think. But for a whole rounded life there is more here than there.

[Skani]

 

I grew up in Australia in the 50s and 60s surrounded by $10 poms and I can assure you the streets were never paved with gold - for them or for the Australian born. They battled b***y hard to establish a life here. The difference is that people expect so much more today - we all do.

The $10 poms knew that home was 6 weeks away by ship and, if they ever wanted to return, it would take years of saving to do so.

[Guest siamsusie]

Chris in light of your signature, I came across this wee cartoon which brought a smile to my face

 

 

 

:tongue:

[christopher]

Well Jim as a Canadian who moved to Australia, I have to disagree with your post. I have found Australia very expensive. I also am friends with lots of Australians at work, and everyone I speak to has said how expensive Australia has gotten in the past 4 years.

 

My OH and I had a combined income of approx $145k a year prior to him losing his job, and we still found it expensive. On a income like that back in Canada we would have lived like kings and queens !!. We are now on an income of $50k and that is why we are going back, there is no way we can survive on that amount.

 

Also Jim I take personal offence to you saying that people accept low income jobs... you make it sound like the majority of people on PIO will be accepting high paying jobs... sorry to burst your buble mate.. but the reality of living here, is that not everyone in Australia is making $65 to $100k and if you are then consider yourself damn lucky!!

 

Jim I know that you LOVE Australia, and I don't hate Australia (it just hasn't worked out for us), however, sometimes the way you rabbit on to prospective immigrants, you would think that this country has a bloody red carpet waiting for new migrants and the streets are paved with gold, and that everyone who gets a visa will get a high paying job.

 

Sorry mate, but the dream and the reality are often two different things.... yes lots of people make a good go of it, but please stop shooting us down for those that didn't land that $100k a year job, and have struggled.

 

I really hope that when you move over to Australia it is your Utopia, as you have built it up so much, but at the end of the day, please give some respect to us moving back, the majority of us have had some hard decisions to come to !!

 

Cheers

 

Karen

 

Karen

 

this site is a really god resource for people who are going both ways, some posters don't add anything to the debate/discussion IMO,

[Guest guest22466]

I agree with you - we have just moved back form the Sunshine Coast where the wages are pretty bad - I earned 70K last year self employed (so some tax breaks) and had to travel the country for that. Lawyers on the coast earn about 80-90K. Most of my friends there earn about $35 - $70k. Housing however is still very pricey our 4 bed home with pool on a suburban block was $650,000. Groceries are astronomical. Petrol is cheap as is train travel compared to here. But our cars are more economical and cheap to buy ( two good german run arounds for £6500 we paid $53k for our two cars in Oz). My husband is now earning the same here (UK) with no overtime as he did there (Oz) with lots of overtime. I am earning £350 per day here (not working everyday yet but likely to be within the year). We live in a very expensive part of the UK (30 miles from London) and feel better off than we were in Oz - that's including supporting kids at uni. Free healthcare and education are blessings. We paid for top quality schools in Oz and educationally they don't come near to the good state comp that my daughter is attending where she is already being predicted As and Bs at GCSE - in Oz she regularly got Cs and Ds because the laid back attitude meant if she didn't want to work she didn't have to. Here the teachers role is to stimulate learning as much as teach - and there are rewards and punishments for those who do and don't.

 

Don't get me wrong I really think Australia is a wonderful country and I do miss certain aspects of it and always will I think. But for a whole rounded life there is more here than there.

 

 

Finding the same as the above, jobs hard to come by, rents high and the education system not that good but as we say...... everyone has a different situation so experiences will be different for everyone.

[Guest chris955]

Thank you everyone for your thoughts and views. It seems clear that this country doesn't hit the spot with everyone and of course that is true of anywhere.

For us the reasons are many and varied, we are moving back because of our business but also because of friends, the places we love, the feeling of being involved in the world rather than on the periphery, the ease of travelling and probably a few others.

There does seem to be a fairly common theme amongst those moving back, many can't get used to the lack of 'buzz' which we can definitely relate to.

[Guest guest36187]

OK, lets not get personal otherwise we will end up with another closed thread

 

Edited to add:

 

Pomsinoz is for people going both ways. Those coming here, those staying here and those going back. Nowadays there are lots more going back as the financial crisis is effecting the world.

 

Respect needs to be shown to everyone.

[ali]

Jim, there isn't a 'dark side' there are two groups who have opposing views. The majority of people who set off on the visa journey and invested a lot of money had the same hopes, aspirations and excitement that we all did ... for some the reality was for whatever reason not what they'd hoped for.

 

There isn't a 'good' and 'bad' side of PIO, no-one member is better than anyone else. As we always say it's two sides of the same coin - people will take from all posts what they want to and that includes threads like this which can highlight the things that potentially make people want to return.

[Guest guest33730]

 

Pomsinoz is for people going both ways.

 

Well Jim and sh7tman should be ok then LOL

 

Daniel

[Guest The Ropey HOFF]

Jim, there isn't a 'dark side' there are two groups who have opposing views. The majority of people who set off on the visa journey and invested a lot of money had the same hopes, aspirations and excitement that we all did ... for some the reality was for whatever reason not what they'd hoped for.

 

There isn't a 'good' and 'bad' side of PIO, no-one member is better than anyone else. As we always say it's two sides of the same coin - people will take from all posts what they want to and that includes threads like this which can highlight the things that potentially make people want to return.

 

 

Hi Ali

 

Theres no need for them to be sarcastic, personal and rude, just because it hasn't worked out for them, because it then descends into arguments and ruins threads, i try to help people and the same people take offence and cause trouble. There will be new people looking on these threads and thinking, if its like that, then forget it, i'm not going. ALL i hear ALL the time is, we ALL have different views, well i like to post positive points of views without getting personal, but i then get attacked, which is par for the course. I can take it, i'm a big guy, but i will always try to help people, its the way i am.

[Guest siamsusie]

Hi Ali

 

Theres no need for them to be sarcastic, personal and rude, just because it hasn't worked out for them, because it then descends into arguments and ruins threads, i try to help people and the same people take offence and cause trouble. There will be new people looking on these threads and thinking, if its like that, then forget it, i'm not going. ALL i hear ALL the time is, we ALL have different views, well i like to post positive points of views without getting personal, but i then get attacked, which is par for the course. I can take it, i'm a big guy, but i will always try to help people, its the way i am.

 

 

Your enthusiasm is infectious Jimbo, your friendliness beyond repute, and Handsome Mans thread appears to be suffering and we witches really do need your input you know:jiggy:.. so nice and easy tiger love Susie xxx

[ali]

Hi Ali

 

Theres no need for them to be sarcastic, personal and rude, just because it hasn't worked out for them, because it then descends into arguments and ruins threads, i try to help people and the same people take offence and cause trouble. There will be new people looking on these threads and thinking, if its like that, then forget it, i'm not going. ALL i hear ALL the time is, we ALL have different views, well i like to post positive points of views without getting personal, but i then get attacked, which is par for the course. I can take it, i'm a big guy, but i will always try to help people, its the way i am.

 

 

I think you give as good as you get Jim and the war of words is becoming a little tiresome for the average member if you go by the number of complaints we've been receiving recently.

 

In respect of the OP - this thread is about why people choose to go back to the UK lets all try to keep it on track (me included)

[Guest chris955]

Something I have noticed is that some people on here have this view that the UK isn't for kids anymore and it is 'done with'. What makes some feel this way ? I agree that there are places I wouldn't like to bring up kids but that applies equally here but having recently done a LOT of miles through the West Country there was nothing to make me think it wasn't a great place to bring up kids. Is it just because these people have had their view tainted by where they live ?

I also read that the only people who smile are those who have jumped off the sinking ship, it seems a bizarre way of thinking and totally different to the way I found things and many others reading these posts and threads. I find it a little sad that people see things like that and maybe coming here is the best thing for them ?

[SKW]

I don't post much but felt I wanted to reply to this thread.

 

We are going back home for Xmas, I'm hoping that we will be able to get a feel of the job market so that we can start applying for work. I am in the process of getting an ex-pat mortgage arranged so that we can possibly buy a house over there when we are back at xmas.

 

We want to go home because it's home. It's where we belong. We have been here a year now and I knew from the early days that it didn't feel right but tried really hard to make a life here. We both have good jobs, son is settled in day care, we have friends and a house that we probably couldn't afford in the UK, but something is missing. We agonised about our decision, we had spent a lot of money to get here, we have been through a lot as a couple emotionally and on some level there is a sense of failure that it hasn't worked out. However, neither of us want to spend the rest of our lives with this sadness and emptiness around us.

 

We miss family and friends immensley, but I also miss US. Being in Oz has challenged us a couple and it has been really difficult, also without any family support it has been hard to have time as a couple. I feel part of our need to go back is also so that we can be happy as a couple again as we will be fulfilled as individuals.

 

Wishing you all happiness where ever you decide to live.

[fleabo]

Nice post SKW.

[Guest chris955]

I agree, a very good post indeed and it sums it up for many people I think.

[Guest spenny]

too many reasons ... UK here we come

[Steve99]

In response the ranking you used from the 'International Living' Magazine. I quote from their website.....

 

How the numbers are crunched

To rate and rank the 194 countries considered in this year’s Quality of Life Index, we took into account:

 

Cost of Living (15% of the final ranking). This is a guide to how much it will cost you to live in a style comparable to—or better than—the standard of living you’re likely enjoying in the U.S. Our primary source in this category is the U.S. State Department’s Index of Overseas Living Costs, used to compute cost-of-living allowances for a Western-style of living in various countries. We also consider each country’s income tax rates.

 

Culture and Leisure (10%). To calculate this score, we look at literacy rate, newspaper circulation per 1,000 people, primary and secondary school enrollment ratios, number of people per museum, and a subjective rating of the variety of cultural and recreational offerings.

 

Economy (15%). We consider interest rates, GDP, GDP growth rate, GDP per capita, the inflation rate, and GNP per capita to determine each country’s Economy score.

 

Environment (10%). To figure a country’s score in this category, we look at population density per square kilometer, population growth rate, greenhouse emissions per capita, and the percentage of total land that is protected.

 

Freedom (10%). Freedom House’s 2009 survey is the main source for these scores, with an emphasis on a citizen’s political rights and civil liberties.

 

Health (10%). In this category, we look at calorie consumption as a percentage of daily requirements, the number of people per doctor, the number of hospital beds per 1,000 people, the percentage of the population with access to safe water, the infant mortality rate, life expectancy, and public health expenditure as a percentage of a country’s GDP.

 

Infrastructure (10%). To calculate a country’s Infrastructure score, we look at the length of railways, paved highways, and navigable waterways in each country, and equated these things to each country’s population and size. We also consider the number of airports, motor vehicles , telephones, Internet service providers, and cell phones per capita.

 

Safety and Risk (10%). For this category, we use the U.S. Department of State’s hardship Differentials and danger allowances, which are based on extraordinarily difficult, notably unhealthy, or dangerous living conditions.

 

Climate (10%). When deciding on a score for each country’s climate, we look at its average annual rainfall and average temperature…and consider its risk for natural disaster

 

 

This report means nothing if you ANALYZE how they came up with figures.

 

Apart from anything, numbers do not demonstrate the major factor the UK holds over Australia.

 

Ambience.

 

I will be the first to admit that Australia can hold in some favour due to the weather, unfortunately Weather is not a big enough factor to persuade a winning vote from me.

I prefer a little more substance than that. And I would say the 'Buzz' that is missing from Australian life is exactly that- Substance.

 

I am not wanting to offend anyone on this thread,i am not saying your experiences aren't right, but it isn't everyones experience

 

My cousin, a teacher from England came over for a holiday, her description of life in Australia was that it is 'one dimensional'. and 'one size fits all' in terms of the nature of what lifestyle is avaliable.

[Peach]

My cousin, a teacher from England came over for a holiday, her description of life in Australia was that it is 'one dimensional'. and 'one size fits all' in terms of the nature of what lifestyle is avaliable.

 

Cool.. I'm looking forward to my huge house, swimming pool, unlimited holidays and big cars! Bring it on.:biggrin:

[mrsindecision]

Haha - good luck - hope you have an equally big wallet to match.:wink:

[Skani]

My cousin, a teacher from England came over for a holiday, her description of life in Australia was that it is 'one dimensional'. and 'one size fits all' in terms of the nature of what lifestyle is avaliable.

 

The "size" and "dimension" of my life in Australia is completely different to those of many other lifestyles in Australia, and any comment like that is either superficial or arrogant or both.

[Steve99]

Cool.. I'm looking forward to my huge house, swimming pool, unlimited holidays and big cars! Bring it on.:biggrin:

Now thats a worthwhile one dimension to step into. If your cashed up enough to buy that lifestyle then you can get the whole package in Florida for 1/10th the price, and the rest is your early retirement money.

[Peach]

Sadly, I'm not. But I can dream! )

[Steve99]

The "size" and "dimension" of my life in Australia is completely different to those of many other lifestyles in Australia, and any comment like that is either superficial or arrogant or both.

Was none of the above, its what she saw, lifestyle in the outburbs of Melbourne, nothing much other than roads, never ending housing estates, shopping centres and lots of rain, yes a day or two here and there out in the hills and the city, etc was appreciated but looking at it as a long term prospect, she was right, she couldn't have an acceptable lifestyle in comparison to what she had back home. She was fully entitled to say that, and she isn't in the slightest bit rude or arrogant, spends much of her time caring for people and asks for little from people. There are far more people in Australia willing to aggressively tell you how stupid you are to like anything about your 'old' country and how could you possibly ever want to go back there, never mind have a life anywhere else, and they have never left Australia. That is arrogance personified.