Paid For Skilled Migration - Can we get money back and go down a different route?

[Guest BobbyFowler]

In the last few weeks we (me, wife & 2 kids) put through a Skilled Migration application & our credit card has been taken for $2500. We put it all through in my wifes name - she's a senior doctor here in Victoria. In the meantime I've got myself sorted in an IT Recruitment role. I've got all the relevant degree qualifications. While I haven't pushed it with the new company I'm with, I think the possibility would be there to go down the Permanent Application route through them. My idea would be that I'd offer to pay whatever it costs - $7k to $8K from what I've heard. Main motivation behind this PR application is because it's costing us close to $40K a year for childcare for the 2 kids. My understanding is that we'll get half that back if we become permanent. My questions are as follows - can I get that $2500 back and start the application again - if so how? Is there any risk that the company takes in letting me put the application through them (would be good to be armed with any important facts before approaching them)? Do things progress a lot faster when it goes through the company rather than off our own stream? I heard that once the application is submitted, we're entitled to the childcare rebate - is that true? If there's any feedback on our situation, it would be great to hear. Cheers.

[pommekate]

you will get the childcare tax rebate if you are pr, but it won't be half of 40k, it is capped at (i think) $7000 per child, still that is $14,000 in your pocket. Would it not be cheaper for you to have a live in nanny if you have the space

[Guest Manj]

In the last few weeks we (me, wife & 2 kids) put through a Skilled Migration application & our credit card has been taken for $2500. We put it all through in my wifes name - she's a senior doctor here in Victoria. In the meantime I've got myself sorted in an IT Recruitment role. I've got all the relevant degree qualifications. While I haven't pushed it with the new company I'm with, I think the possibility would be there to go down the Permanent Application route through them. My idea would be that I'd offer to pay whatever it costs - $7k to $8K from what I've heard. Main motivation behind this PR application is because it's costing us close to $40K a year for childcare for the 2 kids. My understanding is that we'll get half that back if we become permanent. My questions are as follows - can I get that $2500 back and start the application again - if so how? Is there any risk that the company takes in letting me put the application through them (would be good to be armed with any important facts before approaching them)? Do things progress a lot faster when it goes through the company rather than off our own stream? I heard that once the application is submitted, we're entitled to the childcare rebate - is that true? If there's any feedback on our situation, it would be great to hear. Cheers.

 

 

I do understand the cost as you mention... I have 2 kids of my own. BTW how are old are the kids? what is your visa type?

 

If you are on a bridging visa, and your kids are of schooling age, like 4 year kinder onwards I think you might be better off to send them to school and booking them for after hours school care.

 

eg: my daughter goes to 4 year kinder and we have her in after school care ($6 er hour) for 4 hours a day for 3 days!!

 

hope this link helps you

List of Visa Subclasses for Validation of ESL-NA Claims

 

 

depending on your visa your kids will be eligible for gov. funding, that means even if you put them to Gov. school you don't have to pay the full fee.

 

I'm just publishing all these ...if it makes any help for you!!

[Ozmaniac]

My questions are as follows - can I get that $2500 back and start the application again - if so how?

 

VACs are non-refundable, however, if the primary applicant (i.e. in your case, your wife) for a GSM visa finds ENS visa sponsorship, they are usually eligible to lodge a fee free application for the ENS visa. The original visa fee wouldn't be refunded, but the net financial effect would be the same. I very much doubt though that the above would apply if the primary applicant for the ENS visa was different from the original primary applicant.

Employer Nomination Scheme (Subclass 121/856)

 

Main motivation behind this PR application is because it's costing us close to $40K a year for childcare for the 2 kids. My understanding is that we'll get half that back if we become permanent... I heard that once the application is submitted, we're entitled to the childcare rebate - is that true?

 

According to the Centrelink website, you must be eligible for Childcare Benefit before you can apply for Childcare Rebate, and you must already have PR before being eligible for CCB - simply having applied is not enough. Also, there is a limit of $7500 per child for CCR. I think the current limit is lower, but it will rise to $7500 if the enabling legislation is passed (and it should be).

Child Care Benefit

Child Care Rebate

[Guest BobbyFowler]

Cheers, yep was thinking of a live in nanny but we'd need more space. Next year maybe.

[Guest BobbyFowler]

Sorry, thought I was replying to individual contributors there - kids are just turned 3 years and 7 months. We're here on a 457. Interesting to hear there's a limit on what you get back - $7K per child is worth the effort though. Doesn't sound good re: getting the $2.5K back so won't jump into my next step till I know where I stand and stop throwing money around hoping something sticks.

[melbournegirlinny]

In the last few weeks we (me, wife & 2 kids) put through a Skilled Migration application & our credit card has been taken for $2500. We put it all through in my wifes name - she's a senior doctor here in Victoria. In the meantime I've got myself sorted in an IT Recruitment role. I've got all the relevant degree qualifications. While I haven't pushed it with the new company I'm with, I think the possibility would be there to go down the Permanent Application route through them. My idea would be that I'd offer to pay whatever it costs - $7k to $8K from what I've heard. Main motivation behind this PR application is because it's costing us close to $40K a year for childcare for the 2 kids. My understanding is that we'll get half that back if we become permanent. My questions are as follows - can I get that $2500 back and start the application again - if so how? Is there any risk that the company takes in letting me put the application through them (would be good to be armed with any important facts before approaching them)? Do things progress a lot faster when it goes through the company rather than off our own stream? I heard that once the application is submitted, we're entitled to the childcare rebate - is that true? If there's any feedback on our situation, it would be great to hear. Cheers.

 

You've asked a number of questions here and some have been answered.

 

You do not mention what visa your wife applied for-whether it was a 175 or a 176 visa. These have different processing times. 18-24mths versus 12 mths at present according to DIAC.

 

You ask about whether it matters with processing times if you go by yourself or via a company and I presume what you mean in asking this is whether an employer sponsored visa is quicker than a GSM visa? If so, the answer is yes. You would not want a 457 temporary visa of course -you will want an ENS 121/856 PR visa. You should read up on what is required for such a visa on the DIAC website. Just put '121 visa' in the search box.

 

You mention you are an IT recruiter so I do not know whether you would be on a fixed base salary.As you know, recruiters are often only paid by commission. There is a minimum salary you must meet for the ENS visa and this must be paid to you as the base salary and as a full-time employee.

 

You would need to make a new, separate visa application and pay for it -no money back on your wife's application as the other poster has said.

[Guest BobbyFowler]

Some great advice here - My wife's applied for the Skilled - Independent (VE 175). I'm on a $70K Base + Super. I see her category is down under the Priority Processing scheme. Is this still 18 to 24 months?

[Guest Global Girl]

Some great advice here - My wife's applied for the Skilled - Independent (VE 175). I'm on a $70K Base + Super. I see her category is down under the Priority Processing scheme. Is this still 18 to 24 months?

 

 

Yes all 175 are being quoted as 18-24 months timeline irrespective of occupation code.

Our local MP asked on our behalf and were given the same answer.

Is your OH employer unwilling to sponsor her or do they think they are unable?

[Guest BobbyFowler]

I heard something along the lines that if you're being sponsored, that the employer has to guarantee 3 years worth of work? That was my reason for asking if there's risk associated with the employer doing the sponsoring. I don't think it's totally true but would be interested in hearing what element of truth there is.

[Guest Alejandro]

The Australian Economy actively benefits from tourists, overseas students and offshore/ onshore visa applications.

Can you imagine the amount of interest accrued if I take $3000 out of my credit card and don't pay it off for 3 years?

($3000 plus interest accrued) times the number of applicantions since 2008= God knows:err:

As far as the ENS:skeptical: is concerned, I'd rather flip burgers at burger king than scar my soul with bureaucratical slavery.

 

"Movement means growth". The decision to move to Australia for me was based on that moto. When unexpectedly forced to find and stick with an employer not because of a decent wage or company profile or career aspirations but simply for Australian immigration requirement I was quite shocked. I invested a considerable amount of time and money to satisfy independent immigration requirements for the sole purpose of this freedom.

[Joebloggs]

:

As far as the ENS:skeptical: is concerned, I'd rather flip burgers at burger king than scar my soul with bureaucratical slavery.

 

 

Bureaucratic Slavery!! Why would you think that?

 

Who says you have to stick with the same employer on ENS? You can leave the next day if you wish and immigration cant do anything about it.

 

ENS 856 Restrictions .... NIL

 

just same as GSM 175.

[melbournegirlinny]

I agree with the prior poster. What do you mean by slavery? Perhaps you are thinking of the temporary 457 visa?

 

With the Employer Nomination Scheme (ENS) 121/856 visa there are no restrictions whatsoever.

 

Although the job offer letter must state the job is there for 3 years there are no conditions on the visa and if the boss doesn't like you or you don't like the boss then you can be fired or quit. This could happen within days or weeks of starting the job! No obligation on either party to stick out 3 years.

[melbournegirlinny]

Some great advice here - My wife's applied for the Skilled - Independent (VE 175). I'm on a $70K Base + Super. I see her category is down under the Priority Processing scheme. Is this still 18 to 24 months?

 

If you are onshore, as you are, DIAC is saying it will take 18 months if you lodged your visa application after July 1, 2010. If you lodged prior to July 1, 2010 then they are saying it will be processed by July 1, 2011. See:

 

Client Service Charter

 

State sponsorship onshore applications are only taking 6 months to process. If you wanted to go that route once the SMPs come out you would however, need to lodge a new 176/886 visa application and pay a new visa charge.

 

You also do not need to stay in the job for 3 years although the job offer letter must say the job is open for 3 years. This is just another of those rumours that are totally wrong! See my other post in this thread on this point.

[Guest Alejandro]

I agree with the prior poster. What do you mean by slavery? Perhaps you are thinking of the temporary 457 visa?

 

With the Employer Nomination Scheme (ENS) 121/856 visa there are no restrictions whatsoever.

 

Although the job offer letter must state the job is there for 3 years there are no conditions on the visa and if the boss doesn't like you or you don't like the boss then you can be fired or quit. This could happen within days or weeks of starting the job! No obligation on either party to stick out 3 years.

 

ENS--> Subclass 121/ 856

Form used--> 47ES

Referred section--> 85

 

85 DECLARATION

This declaration must be signed by the main applicant.

• I understand that if I apply under the RSMS, my visa may be cancelled

if I do not commence employment with my nominated employer within

6 months of arriving in Australia, or 6 months after my visa is granted

in Australia, or if I leave my position within 2 years of commencement

of my employment with my nominated employer.

• I understand that if I am applying under ENS then I am agreeing to

take up the position for at least 3 years.

Signature

of main

applicant

 

I actually read what I sign. Thank you. Please refrain from misleading others.

[Joebloggs]

ENS--> Subclass 121/ 856

Form used--> 47ES

Referred section--> 85

 

85 DECLARATION

This declaration must be signed by the main applicant.

• I understand that if I apply under the RSMS, my visa may be cancelled

if I do not commence employment with my nominated employer within

6 months of arriving in Australia, or 6 months after my visa is granted

in Australia, or if I leave my position within 2 years of commencement

of my employment with my nominated employer.

• I understand that if I am applying under ENS then I am agreeing to

take up the position for at least 3 years.

Signature

of main

applicant

 

I actually read what I sign. Thank you. Please refrain from misleading others.

 

 

 

You are the one misleading others!! If you haven't a clue don't post rumor and mis-information. Obviously you didn't read it properly. :biglaugh::biglaugh:

 

RSMS (Regional Sponsored Migration Scheme) subclass 119/857 is different than ENS Employer Nomination Scheme) 121/856. The RSMS is a Regional Sponsored visa and can be revoked if you leave the specified Regional area within 2 years.

 

ENS has 121/856 has NIL conditions just the same as GSM 175 they are both equally flexible, the 3 years with an employer is just a moral obligation and you visa most certainly wont be revoked.

 

I should know I have one in my passport.

 

Also have a few friends who left their ENS job after a year of so, one who recently went back to the UK and is still a PR

 

Once you are in... you are in.

 

2nd opinion from another MARA agent, and a very respected one as well. http://www.pomsinoz.com/forum/652385-post4.html

[Guest Alejandro]

It says you agree to take up employment for three years over and over.

 

Where does it say your employer can't sue you or report you to the centre of excellence for fraud if you leave within 3 years.

 

No employer would be happy if they spent so much time and resources on you and saw you leave within the first year.

 

If I was the employer personally I'd make sure the individual pays for the time and resources the company spent on them.

 

Once they leave I'd have to find a replacement which again means more expenses. You'd know this if you ever had a senior management position.

 

You may think it's all an assumption. In a court this could turn very real.

[Joebloggs]

It says you agree to take up employment for three years over and over.

 

Where does it say your employer can't sue you or report you to the centre of excellence for fraud if you leave within 3 years.

 

No employer would be happy if they spent so much time and resources on you and saw you leave within the first year.

 

If I was the employer personally I'd make sure the individual pays for the time and resources the company spent on them.

 

Once they leave I'd have to find a replacement which again means more expenses. You'd know this if you ever had a senior management position.

 

You may think it's all an assumption. In a court this could turn very real.

 

Best they could do is claim back any money spent on agent fees, Nomination or even VAC. Visa itself wont be revoked. Like Les Mighalls says its a gamble for employer.

 

End of story.

[melbournegirlinny]

ENS--> Subclass 121/ 856

Form used--> 47ES

Referred section--> 85

 

85 DECLARATION

This declaration must be signed by the main applicant.

• I understand that if I apply under the RSMS, my visa may be cancelled

if I do not commence employment with my nominated employer within

6 months of arriving in Australia, or 6 months after my visa is granted

in Australia, or if I leave my position within 2 years of commencement

of my employment with my nominated employer.

• I understand that if I am applying under ENS then I am agreeing to

take up the position for at least 3 years.

Signature

of main

applicant

 

I actually read what I sign. Thank you. Please refrain from misleading others.

 

I was not misleading others. I wrote about the ENS 121 visa.

 

With the RSMS 119 regional visa you are supposed to stay working for 2 years for the regional employer who sponsored you. However, this is not a legal condition on your visa. DIAC have the power to cancel your visa if you leave before the 2 years is finished. Although the policy in the DIAC manual states that if you have stayed in the job for more than 12 months they will take it that you have made a genuine effort and not cancel the visa.

 

As for the 121 ENS visa, what I said is legally correct. There is no legal condition whatsoever on your 121 ENS visa that requires you to stay in that job for 3 years. Just because you state that you understand the job is for at least 3 years this does not equate to a condition to stay in that job for 3 years. That is the correct legal position-it is not misleading at all.

 

Sandra

[melbournegirlinny]

It says you agree to take up employment for three years over and over.

 

Where does it say your employer can't sue you or report you to the centre of excellence for fraud if you leave within 3 years.

 

No employer would be happy if they spent so much time and resources on you and saw you leave within the first year.

 

If I was the employer personally I'd make sure the individual pays for the time and resources the company spent on them.

 

Once they leave I'd have to find a replacement which again means more expenses. You'd know this if you ever had a senior management position.

 

You may think it's all an assumption. In a court this could turn very real.

 

An employer could only sue you, under employment law (not immigration law) if they had included a provision in the employment contract that you had a fixed term of 3 years of employment etc...There is no fraud being mentioned here and fraud is always a very hard thing to prove in court-there is a high burden of proof.

 

I'm sure you're right that an employer might be annoyed if an employee quit before the employer felt they'd got their money's worth. However, the employer is also free to terminate the employment of the employee. This is the typical situation for most employees -an employee 'at will' situation.

[Joebloggs]

Cant see where it says 3 years over and over, booklet 5 just mentions that employer must offer employment for 3 years.

 

I guess some people hate to be proven wrong.

[Guest BobbyFowler]

Mentioned this in work to see if it could be a runner. They seem okay about it. At the same time they questioned whether a 2nd family member could apply when the other person has already applied. Wouldn't have thought it would be a problem? Good news is that they appear happy to pay for my application as well! I've said that I'd pay for it if not. I'm guessing that we're as well to go down both routes seen as we've already paid for my wifes application. I heard from a friend yesterday that if you leave the company through whom your PR has been registered, during the 3 year period, that you either lose your PR status unless another organisation takes it on.

[Joebloggs]

I heard from a friend yesterday that if you leave the company through whom your PR has been registered, during the 3 year period, that you either lose your PR status unless another organisation takes it on.

 

:biglaugh::biglaugh:

 

Well your friend is telling you lies or just simply misinformed.

 

Where does it say in booklet 5 that your ENS visa is going be cancelled if you leave your sponsoring employer? It doesn't.

 

For 121 ENS you still meet all the requirements as you do for a 175/176.. ie you need a Skills assessment, Health & Character requirements etc... only you jump the queue because a job is available for you. For the ENS 856 2 years on a 457 can be used in lieu of a skills assessment. If you meet all the requirements for GSM PR why would your visa be cancelled? Just because you have a headstart on a job.

 

 

A 475 Skilled Regional (Provisional) and RSMS 119/857 Sponsored Regional can be cancelled because you are required to reside in the Regional area/Employer.

[Guest Susan Wareham McGrath]

I heard something along the lines that if you're being sponsored, that the employer has to guarantee 3 years worth of work? That was my reason for asking if there's risk associated with the employer doing the sponsoring. I don't think it's totally true but would be interested in hearing what element of truth there is.

 

Hi Bobby

 

DIAC's requirement for ENS applications is that the nominated position is full-time, ongoing and available for at least 3 years. The employer is required to provide a written offer to that effect.

 

Having said that, companies do close down, and contracts can be terminated for many reasons, so there's always a risk associated with accepting an ENS sponsorshp, just as there is with any employment.

 

Best regards

Susan

[Guest Susan Wareham McGrath]

Bureaucratic Slavery!! Why would you think that?

 

Who says you have to stick with the same employer on ENS? You can leave the next day if you wish and immigration cant do anything about it.

 

ENS 856 Restrictions .... NIL

 

just same as GSM 175.

 

Hi Joe

 

DIAC has the power to cancel an ENS sponsored worker's visa if it feels their intent was not to honour their employment contract.

 

Under such circumstances, it would consider the reason they left and take that into account in making the decision. For example - if the employer breached Australian workplace laws, it would be looked at differently to a situation where the employee left because they decided they didn't like the work.

 

Best regards

Susan