Child Maintenance from a mans point of view

[Guest manc123]

Hi all,

 

Before you read this i would ask you not to make the typical judgements that i have seen on other forums before that all men who pay child maintenance but arnt happy about it are b***tards. im going to keep details of myself to a minimum so i can remain as anonymous as possible and thanks in advance for any advice.

 

I am planning to move to Australia in the near future to begin a new life there and i cant wait!! the only thing which i have a big question mark about and i've found it difficult to find information about is maintenance payments and where i legally stand.

 

to cut a long story short, my ex used getting pregnant as a way for me not to dump her after the "suicide attempts" stopped working. since then the child is used as bribery tool. after many "discussions" she decided to keep it fully knowing i didnt want anything to do with her or the child, she though that the decision was entirely her choice and up untill i told her even afterwards i wanted her out of my life she was booked into get an abortion...i am having to pay maintenance now because the CSA dont care what the circumstances are surrounding how the child came to be, i know it takes 2 to make it happen but it should also take 2 to make an adult decision weather it is right to bring a child into the world and in my opinion, she knew what the implications were before she decided to keep it and she knew she would be doing it as a single mum (this is the point i ask not to make a judgement, if it was a loving relationship i wouldnt have walked away...it has turned out i have been granted a restraining order to stop her contacting me so thats the extent of the problems i have had).

 

Anyway, the English system is that i have to pay which i have been doing. what i want to know is what happens when i move to Aus? i've read mixed things where the UK CSA have no jurisdiction but others who say she can still get money out of me?

 

Sorry for rambling on but any advice is much appreciated.

 

Thanks.

[Guest Noodle]

Firstly, thank you for sharing your basic information. It must have been hard putting enough but not too much info. down.

 

You really need to contact Gollywobbler (on this forum - v. helpful), and does not judge.

 

This is a very specific question and you are right, sometimes things that are typed seem a little conflicted. Your alternative is to take up a free consultation (most do this service) at a solicitors near to you.

 

I can promise you that not all people judge and jump down your throat on this issue but, some may be in the throws of this issue themselves and emotionally find it very hard. I have two children from my previous marriage and he does not pay a penny, my personal view is he should even if it is minimal as they are his responsibility not just mine. We were both consenting adults before our children came along. You could set up a bank account for your child and make minimal monthly payments to be released on his/her 25 birthday so that the money goes to your child and your child will later on realise that you do care but for what ever reason are unable to be there.

 

Needless to say, what I, or anyone else, thinks - sod em. Best wishes Ley x

[tonyman 6,279]

Hi all,

 

Before you read this i would ask you not to make the typical judgements that i have seen on other forums before that all men who pay child maintenance but arnt happy about it are b***tards. im going to keep details of myself to a minimum so i can remain as anonymous as possible and thanks in advance for any advice.

 

I am planning to move to Australia in the near future to begin a new life there and i cant wait!! the only thing which i have a big question mark about and i've found it difficult to find information about is maintenance payments and where i legally stand.

 

to cut a long story short, my ex used getting pregnant as a way for me not to dump her after the "suicide attempts" stopped working. since then the child is used as bribery tool. after many "discussions" she decided to keep it fully knowing i didnt want anything to do with her or the child, she though that the decision was entirely her choice and up untill i told her even afterwards i wanted her out of my life she was booked into get an abortion...i am having to pay maintenance now because the CSA dont care what the circumstances are surrounding how the child came to be, i know it takes 2 to make it happen but it should also take 2 to make an adult decision weather it is right to bring a child into the world and in my opinion, she knew what the implications were before she decided to keep it and she knew she would be doing it as a single mum (this is the point i ask not to make a judgement, if it was a loving relationship i wouldnt have walked away...it has turned out i have been granted a restraining order to stop her contacting me so thats the extent of the problems i have had).

 

Anyway, the English system is that i have to pay which i have been doing. what i want to know is what happens when i move to Aus? i've read mixed things where the UK CSA have no jurisdiction but others who say she can still get money out of me?

 

Sorry for rambling on but any advice is much appreciated.

 

Thanks.

 

i find this a little sickening that you keep refering to your Daughter as "the child" thats not right and its not normal pal ...sounds to me you just want out and want to pull a fast one .........if you do get here please think about how your Daughter will feel in yrs to come if she ever see`s this thread .......what a horrible bastard my so called dad must have been ..........sort something out before you leave your Daughter ......

[basil 529]

How sad. I sort of agree with Tonyman. You've already painted a picture that she has a rotten Mother and whilst you might not have wanted to 'keep' the baby you did have a choice in intercourse and in the method of contraception that could have prevented any potential 'trickery'.

 

I feel really sorry that you got manipulated like that, but now the child is here I hope you'll make sure she has one decent parent and role model. I 'get' that you might not want to pay child support in case it goes to the wrong things, but if you don't *have* to pay from Aus I hope that you will still do the right thing by your daughter and find ways to support her emotionally and financially.

[Guest]

Very hard not to make a judgement of you, what about your child. How can you say you dont want anything to do with your own flesh and blood. Didnt you have any part in contraception with your partner? And thank God its the woman who has the ultimate decision wether to terminate or not. Life is very precious. I ask that you think long and hard into the future because none of us know whats round the corner. I think that you still have to pay even in Australia and I think it can be taken straight from your wages if need be.

[Guest manc123]

thanks for your advice noodle...i really appreciate you can look at my situation with an open mind without putting me into a stereotypical box.

 

everyone else, i appreciate you taking your time to add your feelings but i anticipated responses like that and i am not going to get into a debate to defend myself because i know i am a good person and dont have to prove it to you guys.

[tonyman 6,279]

thanks for your advice noodle...i really appreciate you can look at my situation with an open mind without putting me into a stereotypical box.

 

everyone else, i appreciate you taking your time to add your feelings but i anticipated responses like that and i am not going to get into a debate to defend myself because i know i am a good person and dont have to prove it to you guys.

 

if your a good person then you stop calling YOUR Daughter that child and it.............thats just not nice at all and a good person would not use those terms for their own child ..........

[Peach 3,285]

thanks for your advice noodle...i really appreciate you can look at my situation with an open mind without putting me into a stereotypical box.

 

everyone else, i appreciate you taking your time to add your feelings but i anticipated responses like that and i am not going to get into a debate to defend myself because i know i am a good person and dont have to prove it to you guys.

 

if you're such a good person, think about your daughter who is one day going to wonder who her father is...

[pablo 14,048]

Not judging you,i had an extremely traumatic marriage myself ,BUT dont take your exes faults(if true)out on YOUR flesh and blood mate,she has done no harm.

So wether you can avoid CSA payments from oz or not,my opinion is you should try and have some contact even if only when your daughter can speak on the phone,AND make a saving each month for when she's older.

NOT the advice you wanted i know,but cant help having an opinion.

[ellasdaddy 283]

awwww i find this post really sad

Fair one you dont get on with your ex and you want to have nothing to do with her but what about your little girl, she should be your tiny princess forever, imnot judgeing you but that poor little girl, i think you should spend a bit more time with her and bond with her,

But above all else whatever happend then i honestly think you should pay for her whatever the situation when it come down to it if you didnt want a child then you should not have been having unproteced sex with her mother or sex at all if you really disliked her that much

I think it only somthing you can decide yourself could you really walk away with a clear consience (sorry cant spell) knowing that your baby girl could be going without because you dont want her?

[Petals 4,259]

Difficult but the deed is done and responsibility is the name of the game.

[Guest Noodle]

Come on all (I know I'm asking for it), you can voice your opinions but attack when you do not know the full extent - something tells me there is a little more than normal going on here. My ex has no excuse what so ever and when ranting at me the last time he said QUOTE "why should I pay for something I do not see, I mean you would not walk into a shop and pay for something you can't have now would you". Basically I feel he referred to his son as something to be bought!

 

My point is (and the ONLY reason I have shared) - my ex-husband is an alcoholic, abusive and violent. He attacked my son the way he used to attack me (foolishly something I thought he would not do), my son told school (not me), school told social services and social services told me that if he ever went near our children again they would be taken off me. It was out of my control (to some extent) and he was not even approached. Guess who had to deal with it... (and no, I would not have let him see them unless supervised visits after that).

 

My ex lives in Torquay and tells everyone he is not allowed to see his children because I won't let him, I have something wrong with me, he has tried everything but to no avail yarda, yarda, yarda! It gave him the perfect excuse not to pay a penny (not that he did often anyway). So who, why, what and when depends on the real truth of why...

 

That is why I did not judge and neither should anyone else. Maybe manc123 will set something up for his child's future, who knows - only him.

 

Ley x

[ali 16,507]

Whilst I know you've asked about CSA payments I don't know enough to give you an answer. However, one of your considerations about moving to Aus is that you have a child of dependent age and they will also have to be named on your application as a non-migrating child and you will need to try to get your ex to let them have a medical. If you have shown that you have made reasonable attempts to do this and it has not happened then you can do a statutory declaration (witnessed by a solicitor).

 

At some point over the coming years - your child when old enough may want to find you and try to have a relationship with you. Certainly, not judging but I have to be honest and say that I'm stuggling to comprehend why you do not want to pay something for your child - it reads like you're getting back at the ex by punishing the child - you've commented that the child is being used against you .... are you not doing the same? If you think the money is being used inappropriatley, I am sure that there are things you can put in place to ensure it is only spent for the benefit of the child

[tisme 410]

There is a lot of info on the CSA Australia website.

 

International parents - Child Support Agency (CSA)

 

My understanding is your ex can get a court order for payments and this order can be inforced in Australia.

[whopperdaisy 1,067]

I think a part of the problem (generically, not specific to OP) is that child support payments are seen as being for the mother, not for the child.

 

I believe Tisme is correct that an order can be sought and enforced here for a child remaining in the UK. The other thing you should consider is that should you return to the UK in the future, even for a holiday, not paying what is ordered there could catch up with you. Not sure about the UK but I think here in Aus it can go so far as international travel being denied.

 

I will admit bias in that I have not ever received child support for my little one, who was planned with the consent of both parents. I have some sympathy for the OP in that these situations are very messy. No doubt in hindsight there are things he wouldn't do (like having sex with someone he feels manipulated by). He's not the only one to have poor judgement on some occasions. That said, it would not be right to make someone have an abortion and the resulting child did not ask to be put in this situation either, whereas OP did play some willing part in his child's creation. The needs of children have to be put first. There is no perfect answer to this situation and it sounds like he is learning a lesson the hard way in that regard.

[Guest carlj3108]

Whilst I know you've asked about CSA payments I don't know enough to give you an answer. However, one of your considerations about moving to Aus is that you have a child of dependent age and they will also have to be named on your application as a non-migrating child and you will need to try to get your ex to let them have a medical. If you have shown that you have made reasonable attempts to do this and it has not happened then you can do a statutory declaration (witnessed by a solicitor).

 

At some point over the coming years - your child when old enough may want to find you and try to have a relationship with you. Certainly, not judging but I have to be honest and say that I'm stuggling to comprehend why you do not want to pay something for your child - it reads like you're getting back at the ex by punishing the child - you've commented that the child is being used against you .... are you not doing the same? If you think the money is being used inappropriatley, I am sure that there are things you can put in place to ensure it is only spent for the benefit of the child

 

 

Hi .....

 

Is that right - you have to put down non-migrating children on your application? Why would they be required to have a medical?

 

Carl

[Peach 3,285]

Hi .....

 

Is that right - you have to put down non-migrating children on your application? Why would they be required to have a medical?

 

Carl

 

Hi Carl, the reason is that child visas have a health waiver. The intention is to prevent parents who are aware of a medical condition - that would prevent their child from passing a visa medical - from removing the child from their application, waiting for their own visa to be approved and then applying for a child visa with a health waiver. In this way they're forced to play their hand...

 

If the parent of the non-migrating child won't co-operate, you have to show that you have tried to make them comply (through solicitor's letters etc).

[Guest carlj3108]

Hi Carl, the reason is that child visas have a health waiver. The intention is to prevent parents who are aware of a medical condition - that would prevent their child from passing a visa medical - from removing the child from their application, waiting for their own visa to be approved and then applying for a child visa with a health waiver. In this way they're forced to play their hand...

 

If the parent of the non-migrating child won't co-operate, you have to show that you have tried to make them comply (through solicitor's letters etc).

 

 

Thanks for the respons Peach,

 

So even if you have no contact / no intention of the non-migrating child going to oz etc you still have to do this?

What happens if you had no contact or way of knowing the where-abouts etc?

 

Carl

[Phoenix16 763]

Sorry OP, one more comment you proberbly won't want to hear but your post just made me really sad then really annoyed.

 

Sounds like your ex was very very manipulative and you have most proberbly made the right decision to remove her permanently from your life. But what happened? One last time for old times sake? And while we are at it...lets not bother with any contraception? Dosn't sound like a highly manipulated man at the end of his tether to me...

 

The real victim in all of this sorry state of affairs is not YOU yet you seem determined to portray yourself as such...

 

The real victim is your poor daughter who didn't ask for this but is having this bitterness inflicted on her and will ultimately be the one who really suffers as she grows up and realises that whilst her father couldn't be bothered to prevent her birth, he certainly now resents it and blames her....

 

You have brought a child into this world, it may not be under the circumstances that you wished, and with the partner that you hoped, but nevertheless you did, so be a man and respect yourself enough to do the right thing by this poor little girl be the dad she deserves and give her the chances in life she deserves, you will find the rewards you get back mindblowing.

 

By the way, your question was around financial support which obviously is important but my comments refer to emotional support and love and these are FREE.

 

Sorry to lecture but as the mother of a wonderful, amazing 3 year old little girl, you really don't know what joys you are missing out on.

[Peach 3,285]

Thanks for the respons Peach,

 

So even if you have no contact / no intention of the non-migrating child going to oz etc you still have to do this?

What happens if you had no contact or way of knowing the where-abouts etc?

 

Carl

 

Yes. You have to make a statement documenting the facts and have it witnessed via a solicitor.

[Phoenix16 763]

thanks for your advice noodle...i really appreciate you can look at my situation with an open mind without putting me into a stereotypical box.

 

everyone else, i appreciate you taking your time to add your feelings but i anticipated responses like that and i am not going to get into a debate to defend myself because i know i am a good person and dont have to prove it to you guys.

PS; you really only need to prove to your daughter that you are a 'good person' .....

[Guest claire146]

Sorry, I find it really hard not to judge. Actually, impossible not to judge. I'm glad you think of yourself as a good person and you can live with yourself trying to get out of paying a few pounds to your daughter, but I really hope someday you won't be able to look at yourself in the mirror. What about contraception??

[BritChickx 10,882]

Hi all,

 

Before you read this i would ask you not to make the typical judgements that i have seen on other forums before that all men who pay child maintenance but arnt happy about it are b***tards. im going to keep details of myself to a minimum so i can remain as anonymous as possible and thanks in advance for any advice.

 

I am planning to move to Australia in the near future to begin a new life there and i cant wait!! the only thing which i have a big question mark about and i've found it difficult to find information about is maintenance payments and where i legally stand.

 

to cut a long story short, my ex used getting pregnant as a way for me not to dump her after the "suicide attempts" stopped working. since then the child is used as bribery tool. after many "discussions" she decided to keep it fully knowing i didnt want anything to do with her or the child, she though that the decision was entirely her choice and up untill i told her even afterwards i wanted her out of my life she was booked into get an abortion...i am having to pay maintenance now because the CSA dont care what the circumstances are surrounding how the child came to be, i know it takes 2 to make it happen but it should also take 2 to make an adult decision weather it is right to bring a child into the world and in my opinion, she knew what the implications were before she decided to keep it and she knew she would be doing it as a single mum (this is the point i ask not to make a judgement, if it was a loving relationship i wouldnt have walked away...it has turned out i have been granted a restraining order to stop her contacting me so thats the extent of the problems i have had).

 

Anyway, the English system is that i have to pay which i have been doing. what i want to know is what happens when i move to Aus? i've read mixed things where the UK CSA have no jurisdiction but others who say she can still get money out of me?

 

Sorry for rambling on but any advice is much appreciated.

 

Thanks.

 

Just googled for you...

 

Parents living abroad - Setting up child maintenance - Child Support Agency

 

'If the non-resident parent lives in Australia and the parent with care lives in the UK then the Australian Child Support Agency may be able to accept an application to assess maintenance.'

 

So you may still have to pay or of it's not compulsory then you may have the option to anyway, but if your ex partner goes to court with it and wins then you'll probably have to pay anyway? The number is on the webpage.

 

You're probably tired of this but I hope you re-consider keeping in touch with your daughter and maintaining a relationship with her. I don't have a great relationship with my dad and that's down to him not making much effort in the past. As others have said your ex's actions isn't your daughters fault. Good luck with the move.

[Guest Gollywobbler]

Hi all,

 

Before you read this i would ask you not to make the typical judgements that i have seen on other forums before that all men who pay child maintenance but arnt happy about it are b***tards. im going to keep details of myself to a minimum so i can remain as anonymous as possible and thanks in advance for any advice.

 

I am planning to move to Australia in the near future to begin a new life there and i cant wait!! the only thing which i have a big question mark about and i've found it difficult to find information about is maintenance payments and where i legally stand.

 

to cut a long story short, my ex used getting pregnant as a way for me not to dump her after the "suicide attempts" stopped working. since then the child is used as bribery tool. after many "discussions" she decided to keep it fully knowing i didnt want anything to do with her or the child, she though that the decision was entirely her choice and up untill i told her even afterwards i wanted her out of my life she was booked into get an abortion...i am having to pay maintenance now because the CSA dont care what the circumstances are surrounding how the child came to be, i know it takes 2 to make it happen but it should also take 2 to make an adult decision weather it is right to bring a child into the world and in my opinion, she knew what the implications were before she decided to keep it and she knew she would be doing it as a single mum (this is the point i ask not to make a judgement, if it was a loving relationship i wouldnt have walked away...it has turned out i have been granted a restraining order to stop her contacting me so thats the extent of the problems i have had).

 

Anyway, the English system is that i have to pay which i have been doing. what i want to know is what happens when i move to Aus? i've read mixed things where the UK CSA have no jurisdiction but others who say she can still get money out of me?

 

Sorry for rambling on but any advice is much appreciated.

 

Thanks.

 

Hi Manc

 

The CSA in the UK can't organise a p*ss up in a brewery so how would they know how and where to find you in Oz unless you give them the information?

 

One way to discourage irresponsible pregnancies would be to tell the mothers that they would not get flats and they would not get any Benefits either, and there would be no CSA to try to pursue the fathers for anything, it seems to me.

 

About 2 years ago there was a fairly strong rumour that the then Government intended to close the CSA down. Apparently they had worked out that the CSA was a waste of money because mostly they do not recover anything from the fathers and even when they succeed, it costs 60p in salaries and other overheads to run the CSA for every £1 that they do manage to collect.

 

The talk at the time was that the CSA staff would be re-deployed to the passport office and the CSA offices would be used for processing the complicated sounding plans for British passports.

 

Then the passport scheme seems to have bitten the dust as well so the talk of the CSA seemed to have died at the same time.

 

Cheers

 

Gill

[tracy123 5,093]

Hi Manc123

 

If the UK CSA pass the case onto the Aust CSA, they will track you down and force you to pay, by taking it out of your wages and tax return......

 

I think us men are set up differently to woman (I can only speak for myself) but watching something grow in your partners stomach feeling it kick etc isn't the same as feeling it grow inside you, so when my wife had our little boy, I was really disappointed to find that 1st off I thought he was an ugly looking thing (all new borns are I think, it's once they fill out they look cute IMHO) and I had no bond with him. I was told that when my son came out I would be awash with love and love him even if he was a monkey!!!! Well I can tell you I didn't......

 

 

As for contraception!!!!! I'm sorry I don't see where Manc said how long he had been with his ex for....... Seems what ever contraception they had was working, I wonder how many woman have been on the pill etc and gone off it forgetting to tell their partner as they knew the other half didn't want a child? So is that the mans fault?

 

 

Everyone is different and people don't have the right to judge anyone if they don't know the full story.

 

Cheers

 

Geoffrey