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Guest goldencoil

Visa 176 Obligation - To live and work in another state

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Guest goldencoil

Hi there. I am a newbie here. I found this forum to be very helpful.

 

Reading through this tread...

http://www.pomsinoz.com/forum/migration-issues/78714-176-visa-obligations-unemployment.html

 

I was able to understand that not being able to fulfill the obligation to live in the sponsoring state for 2 years does not have any legal implications.

 

Here is my dilemma...

 

My family and I have been an Australian PR since Nov 2009. However, I have been working in the Middle East and have not relocated to Australia yet. My visa category is Visa 176 with South Australia State Sponsorship. I thought that it'll be a better idea to secure a job offer prior our arrival. But when we learned that my wife is pregnant for our 2nd child, we had to plan much faster because we want to be there months before she gives birth.

 

After months of searching for a job, finally, I was able to get 2 job offers. One is in Adelaide and one is in Melbourne. The job offer in Adelaide I would say is attractive and acceptable. On the other hand, the offer in Melbourne offers a better salary package that also comes with a relocation package. The company in Melbourne is also a global organization so this is something that is difficult to say NO to.

 

I am now considering choosing the job offer in Melbourne over Adelaide. Aside from the better job offer, we've got friends in Melbourne who has offered their assistance to look after my first child by the time my wife gives birth. Their assistance would be very helpful because we've got no relatives in Australia.

 

Here are my questions.

1. I know that I am not legally required to live in Adelaide. My migration agent said that I still have a choice and since I don't intend to live there anyway, I might as well not contact the South Australia government. What can you say about this approach? What implication will this approach make in the near future?

 

2. Will I encounter any issues with Victoria when we apply for Centrelink, Medicare etc..?

 

3. Will this be an issue if we apply for citizenship?

 

4. Will this be an issue if we apply for visas for our relatives if they would have to come visit us for short period of time?

 

I am also considering consulting another migration agent regarding this matter but I thought that maybe some of you guys here can provide some answers too.

 

TIA

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Guest Gollywobbler
Hi there. I am a newbie here. I found this forum to be very helpful.

 

Reading through this tread...

http://www.pomsinoz.com/forum/migration-issues/78714-176-visa-obligations-unemployment.html

 

I was able to understand that not being able to fulfill the obligation to live in the sponsoring state for 2 years does not have any legal implications.

 

Here is my dilemma...

 

My family and I have been an Australian PR since Nov 2009. However, I have been working in the Middle East and have not relocated to Australia yet. My visa category is Visa 176 with South Australia State Sponsorship. I thought that it'll be a better idea to secure a job offer prior our arrival. But when we learned that my wife is pregnant for our 2nd child, we had to plan much faster because we want to be there months before she gives birth.

 

After months of searching for a job, finally, I was able to get 2 job offers. One is in Adelaide and one is in Melbourne. The job offer in Adelaide I would say is attractive and acceptable. On the other hand, the offer in Melbourne offers a better salary package that also comes with a relocation package. The company in Melbourne is also a global organization so this is something that is difficult to say NO to.

 

I am now considering choosing the job offer in Melbourne over Adelaide. Aside from the better job offer, we've got friends in Melbourne who has offered their assistance to look after my first child by the time my wife gives birth. Their assistance would be very helpful because we've got no relatives in Australia.

 

Here are my questions.

1. I know that I am not legally required to live in Adelaide. My migration agent said that I still have a choice and since I don't intend to live there anyway, I might as well not contact the South Australia government. What can you say about this approach? What implication will this approach make in the near future?

 

2. Will I encounter any issues with Victoria when we apply for Centrelink, Medicare etc..?

 

3. Will this be an issue if we apply for citizenship?

 

4. Will this be an issue if we apply for visas for our relatives if they would have to come visit us for short period of time?

 

I am also considering consulting another migration agent regarding this matter but I thought that maybe some of you guys here can provide some answers too.

 

TIA

 

Hi Goldencoil

 

Welcome to Poms in Oz.

 

The answers to your questions are:

 

1. Following your migration agent's advice will have zero implications for you.

 

2. No.

 

3. No.

 

4. No.

 

Cheers

 

Gill

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Gill is totally correct.

 

I just wanted to add that in relation to your 2nd question, the state of Victoria has nothing at all to do with Centrelink or Medicare-they are Federal government authorities (although they obviously have offices in each state, not state government authorities.


Sandra Maxfield LLB (Hons), BA

www.eurekamigration.com; Lawyer admitted in Victoria, Australia & New York, USA. MARN 1066311

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Guest Gollywobbler
Gill is totally correct.

 

I just wanted to add that in relation to your 2nd question, the state of Victoria has nothing at all to do with Centrelink or Medicare-they are Federal government authorities (although they obviously have offices in each state, not state government authorities.

 

Hi Sandra

 

Thanks for clarifying the Centrelink and Medicare points.

 

I think something might be wrong with your auto-signature. It does not say "Color" at both ends of the hyperlink to your website. I am not sure whether a hyperlink works in this situation?

 

Cheers

 

Gill

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Guest Gollywobbler
Hi Sandra

 

Thanks for clarifying the Centrelink and Medicare points.

 

I think something might be wrong with your auto-signature. It does not say "Color" at both ends of the hyperlink to your website. I am not sure whether a hyperlink works in this situation?

 

Cheers

 

Gill

 

Hi Sandra

 

Please forget my drivel about your hyperlink. It works fine, regardless of the colour. That is obviously only an "optional extra" in case you want the link to stand out.

 

Cheers

 

Gill

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Actually, you're right. My link used to be in blue to match my website theme and seems to have disappeared all of a sudden! Shall investigate why. Thanks.


Sandra Maxfield LLB (Hons), BA

www.eurekamigration.com; Lawyer admitted in Victoria, Australia & New York, USA. MARN 1066311

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Hi all,

 

I was thinking the same as goldencoil, if in a situation where you got a employment offer in a different state from the one you are state sponsored by...where would you stand....

 

So what would one do, if they decided to down that route (move to a different state) with regards to contacting the original state they got SS from. Don't you have to contact them with an arrival date and do six monthly assessments on how everyhting is going?

Do you:

1) just not contact the original SS state and move to wherever you get a job, or

2) contact them and let them know what you're up to?

 

BTW, thanks for the info Gollywobbler & Melbournegirlinny

 

Harry

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Guest goldencoil

Thank you Gill and MellbourneGirlInNY for the wonderful responses.

 

Aside from the Harry's question, if you don't mind, I have some follow up questions.

 

1. Will this scenario affect us if we apply for RRV? Im anxious to know if DIAC will ask if we have fulfilled our "obligations" on our existing visa. If we didn't, they may use it as a ground not to grant us the RRV.

 

2. Suppose I live in Melbourne for the first year and relocate to South Australia on the subsequent years (and inform them about this), will the SA govt consider this as fulfilling the obligations too?

 

3. If relocating in another state has no impact at all, then what can they actually do (even in the most little kind of way) in such cases? Are there any?

 

Again, I really appreciate your very informative answers. These will really help me come to a decision without any anxieties.

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Why not drop the SA migration office an email explaining that you've been offered an excellent opportunity in Melbourne and see what they say.

 

If they reply that it's no problem then you don't have anything to worry about.

 

But if they insist on you living in Adelaide, then... :cry:

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Guest Gollywobbler
Thank you Gill and MellbourneGirlInNY for the wonderful responses.

 

Aside from the Harry's question, if you don't mind, I have some follow up questions.

 

1. Will this scenario affect us if we apply for RRV? Im anxious to know if DIAC will ask if we have fulfilled our "obligations" on our existing visa. If we didn't, they may use it as a ground not to grant us the RRV.

 

2. Suppose I live in Melbourne for the first year and relocate to South Australia on the subsequent years (and inform them about this), will the SA govt consider this as fulfilling the obligations too?

 

3. If relocating in another state has no impact at all, then what can they actually do (even in the most little kind of way) in such cases? Are there any?

 

Again, I really appreciate your very informative answers. These will really help me come to a decision without any anxieties.

 

Hi Goldencoil

 

The answers to your supplementary questions are:

 

1. It will have no impact on your applications for RRVs. There is no condition that can be imposed on a sc 176 visa that requires you to live in a particular State, so there are no visa conditions to breach if you decide to move to a different State instead of the sponsoring State.

 

2. There is no problem if you decide to live in VIC for the first year and move to SA later. SA know perfectly well - at the time when they offer you their sponsorship - that circumstances might change and so you might decide to move to another State instead of SA when you first move to Oz. They also know full well that you might never even visit SA for a holiday for as long as you live.

 

The State Governments do not waste any time worrying about it. Loads of people get sponsorship from VIC and they have every intention of moving to VIC and living there forever. However their circumstances change and either they get a better job offer from an employer in SA or they simply decide that they prefer SA to VIC, so they move to SA. The flow of immigrants going in each direction is probably about equal in those two States. For instance, if a VIC sponsored immigrant wants to buy a house in Oz, he will get considerably more house for his money if he buys a house in Adelaide instead of in Melbourne.

 

"3. If relocating in another state has no impact at all, then what can they actually do (even in the most little kind of way) in such cases? Are there any?"

They cannot do anything. Nor would they want to. Please don't worry about it.

 

Cheers

 

Gill

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Guest Gollywobbler
Hi all,

 

I was thinking the same as goldencoil, if in a situation where you got a employment offer in a different state from the one you are state sponsored by...where would you stand....

 

So what would one do, if they decided to down that route (move to a different state) with regards to contacting the original state they got SS from. Don't you have to contact them with an arrival date and do six monthly assessments on how everyhting is going?

Do you:

1) just not contact the original SS state and move to wherever you get a job, or

2) contact them and let them know what you're up to?

 

BTW, thanks for the info Gollywobbler & Melbournegirlinny

 

Harry

 

Hi Harry

 

It is not essential to contact the sponsoring State although, personally, I feel that it is good manners to do so.

 

If it were me, I would contact the sponsoring State with a brief explanation about why I have decided to move to a different State at least to begin with. I think that is the well mannered approach. However from the State's point of view, someone whom they are paying then has to be equally polite and reply to my e-mail, so it probably saves the sponsoring State money if the migrant simply leaves them out of the information/communications "loop" altogether, which thousands of migrants do every year.

 

Cheers

 

Gill

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Again, I totally agree with Gill. It doesn't matter what question you come up with the answer on this is the same. There is also no point in 'asking' permission from SA to live somewhere else-they have no legal power over you at all.

 

If I could just add the Australian constitutional law explanation to this so perhaps it is clearer.

 

Australia is a federation with a Federal (also called Commonwealth) government. And then each state has its own government too. There is a written constitution unlike what you have in the UK. This written constitution sets out certain powers that are exclusive to the Federal government. These exclusive powers include things such as taxation, defence and migration and citizenship. Therefore, the states are not allowed to make any laws on migration matters.

 

It is the Federal government, via DIAC, which issues migration visas and which has the power to revoke them etc....

 

The state governments are allowed to be involved just because in a sense a country is still only made up by its states and it is useful to know who the states need to move there. The state governments are allowed to produce these lists of skills they need and grant sponsorship but as you know the state sponsorship form is then sent to the Federal government.

 

There are NO LEGAL CONDITIONS regarding living in a state that has given you sponsorship attached to a 176 visa when it is issued by the Federal government.

 

Hence, it is irrelevant to DIAC where you live. Concepts like can I get a RRV again raise a Federal government power question. Because that is a migration visa issue what you did in the state or not and where you lived is irrelevant to DIAC. Same for citizenship.

 

Governments can only consider things that are set out in Acts of parliament or regulations and there is nothing set out in the Federal acts or regulations that says they should consider whether you went and lived in a particular state or not.

 

Hope this helps to understand the legal basis behind Gill's and my answers.

  • Like 1

Sandra Maxfield LLB (Hons), BA

www.eurekamigration.com; Lawyer admitted in Victoria, Australia & New York, USA. MARN 1066311

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My god, i am in shock! Am i being a dill, or does this mean I could apply for Queensland state sponsorship but eneter australia through Perth and stay and work there? I'm sorry for repeating the question , but hadnt realised this!

Gill x


Gill (40!), nurse, and Mal (43), ROV pilot tech.

IELTS 8.5 01/10, ANMC 05/10, SA SS 10/10, 176 application 11/10, 01/11 on SA SMP!!!, CO 14/2/11, visa granted 17/03/11 :yes:, living in SA since aug 2011.

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Guest Gollywobbler
My god, i am in shock! Am i being a dill, or does this mean I could apply for Queensland state sponsorship but eneter australia through Perth and stay and work there? I'm sorry for repeating the question , but hadnt realised this!

Gill x

 

Hi Gill

 

It is not "policy" to encourage somebody to seek sponsorship from State A if the person actually wants to move to State B, so the DIAC website is silent about the idea, as are the websites for the various States.

 

State and Territory Migration Sites - australia.gov.au

 

Also, I discourage Poms in Oz members from seeking sponsorship from State A if they actually want to move to State B, because State A has a choice about whether to grant State sponsorship or not. If somebody is not serious about moving to State A then there is a high chance that s/he will not bother to research life in State A in sufficient detail to secure sponsorship from State A.

 

I spend a lot of time advising people to perish Bright Ideas because their application will be read by somebody who lives in the State (and usually the same city) that the applicant says s/he wants to move to. An application which obviously suffers from a dearth of genuine research will stick out like a sore thumb to the decision maker who actually lives in the place! If the decision maker in State A suspects that the applicant has no serious intention of moving to State A then the application for State sponsorship will be refused. There is no formal system of appeal against the State Government's refusal, so it becomes a bended knee job to try to convince State A that the applicant really, really does want to move to the place. It is then a bated breath job whilst we all wait to see whether State A will change its mind and grant the State sponsorship after all.

 

However to answer your specific question, yes. It can work as you suggest and it often does so. For example you might have set your heart on QLD but you have a cousin or a friend in WA so you decide to go and visit your cousin/friend for a while on your way to QLD. You then find a job in WA so you decide to stay in WA, at least to begin with. There is no problem with that.

 

Also, some of the Aussies think that driving across the whole continent is a piece of cake, whereas I would regard it as a major expedition! Many years ago a British girl whom I knew at school went to Oz for a year on a Working Holiday visa. She flew to Perth initially and her return ticket to the UK was from Perth.

 

This grl found herself in QLD eventually, where she met an Aussie chap who later became her husband. They spent some time together and then the girl said that she had to make tracks to get back to Perth in time for the flight home. The Aussie man said calmly, "Perth airport? No problem. I'll drive you to Perth airport."

 

So he did!!!! The upshot was that they fell in love, got married later and she now lives near Cairns somewhere, with the Aussie hubby, somewhere near the area where she met him in the first place and from where the drive to Perth airport had begun!

 

Cheers

 

Gill

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Thanks for the answer, Gill. Rest assured its not something We thought of doing, and we are awaiting an employer sponsored visa, but I just couldn't believe that this could happen! Don't think I could ever live with the worry? The convulutions of visa applications are amazing!

Gill x:eek:


Gill (40!), nurse, and Mal (43), ROV pilot tech.

IELTS 8.5 01/10, ANMC 05/10, SA SS 10/10, 176 application 11/10, 01/11 on SA SMP!!!, CO 14/2/11, visa granted 17/03/11 :yes:, living in SA since aug 2011.

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and P.S

loved the romantic story!:swoon:


Gill (40!), nurse, and Mal (43), ROV pilot tech.

IELTS 8.5 01/10, ANMC 05/10, SA SS 10/10, 176 application 11/10, 01/11 on SA SMP!!!, CO 14/2/11, visa granted 17/03/11 :yes:, living in SA since aug 2011.

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Again, I totally agree with Gill. It doesn't matter what question you come up with the answer on this is the same. There is also no point in 'asking' permission from SA to live somewhere else-they have no legal power over you at all.

 

If I could just add the Australian constitutional law explanation to this so perhaps it is clearer.

 

Australia is a federation with a Federal (also called Commonwealth) government. And then each state has its own government too. There is a written constitution unlike what you have in the UK. This written constitution sets out certain powers that are exclusive to the Federal government. These exclusive powers include things such as taxation, defence and migration and citizenship. Therefore, the states are not allowed to make any laws on migration matters.

 

It is the Federal government, via DIAC, which issues migration visas and which has the power to revoke them etc....

 

The state governments are allowed to be involved just because in a sense a country is still only made up by its states and it is useful to know who the states need to move there. The state governments are allowed to produce these lists of skills they need and grant sponsorship but as you know the state sponsorship form is then sent to the Federal government.

 

There are NO LEGAL CONDITIONS regarding living in a state that has given you sponsorship attached to a 176 visa when it is issued by the Federal government.

 

Hence, it is irrelevant to DIAC where you live. Concepts like can I get a RRV again raise a Federal government power question. Because that is a migration visa issue what you did in the state or not and where you lived is irrelevant to DIAC. Same for citizenship.

 

Governments can only consider things that are set out in Acts of parliament or regulations and there is nothing set out in the Federal acts or regulations that says they should consider whether you went and lived in a particular state or not.

 

Hope this helps to understand the legal basis behind Gill's and my answers.

 

Thanks a lot mate...A great piece of information...I have been sponsored by SA and planning to move to SA in near future (once visa is granted) although I have no intentions of moving to another state but in case I have problems finding a good job in SA I will have to move. So its better to know the limitations and my rights.


Ezy & wifoo -- IELTS 08.05.10 -- SA SS submitted 13.10.10 - Granted 02.11.10 -- 176 Visa submitted 10.11.10 -- CO allocated: 01.02.11 -- Form 80 + Work exp submitted: 25.02.11 -- Meds finalized: 10.06.11 -- VISA granted 20.12.11

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Again, I totally agree with Gill. It doesn't matter what question you come up with the answer on this is the same. There is also no point in 'asking' permission from SA to live somewhere else-they have no legal power over you at all.

If I could just add the Australian constitutional law explanation to this so perhaps it is clearer.

Australia is a federation with a Federal (also called Commonwealth) government. And then each state has its own government too. There is a written constitution unlike what you have in the UK. This written constitution sets out certain powers that are exclusive to the Federal government. These exclusive powers include things such as taxation, defence and migration and citizenship. Therefore, the states are not allowed to make any laws on migration matters.

It is the Federal government, via DIAC, which issues migration visas and which has the power to revoke them etc....

The state governments are allowed to be involved just because in a sense a country is still only made up by its states and it is useful to know who the states need to move there. The state governments are allowed to produce these lists of skills they need and grant sponsorship but as you know the state sponsorship form is then sent to the Federal government.

There are NO LEGAL CONDITIONS regarding living in a state that has given you sponsorship attached to a 176 visa when it is issued by the Federal government.

Hence, it is irrelevant to DIAC where you live. Concepts like can I get a RRV again raise a Federal government power question. Because that is a migration visa issue what you did in the state or not and where you lived is irrelevant to DIAC. Same for citizenship.

Governments can only consider things that are set out in Acts of parliament or regulations and there is nothing set out in the Federal acts or regulations that says they should consider whether you went and lived in a particular state or not.

Hope this helps to understand the legal basis behind Gill's and my answers.

Hi melbournegirlinny

That explanation was incredible..:notworthy: but I have a different question for you...I applied for ACT state sponsorship in May 2011.. They have sponsored me this month after three months ...While I was waiting for ACT application outcome I got my new skill assessment from ACS and luckily that code was in SA SMP list... So just as a backup option (whatever) I applied for SA state sponsorship and am expecting an outcome of it this week...I did all this just to make sure I have sponsorship from at least 1 state before quotas get filled up as my past experience with SS was bad (I got rejected from Victoria after 6 months of waiting- no demand;sure waste of time).

 

I am waiting for SA SS outcome as personally I prefer to go to Adelaide over Canberra as Canberra has job complications( security clearance issues).

 

I am not sure what do I do with ACT sponsorship if I get approved from SA?

 

Is there any need to tell ACT CM Department that I wanna withdraw or something?

 

I am scared to tell them as they asked in application form "Have ya applied for SS in any other state which at that time I answered "no" but later on i did and never updated them.

 

Is their any need to update ACT or they gonna update DIAC or something?I am not sure what to do at this point. I am kinda worried for all this help.

 

thanks in advance

regards

Bob


ICT Security Specialist|176 Filed State Sponsored:1 Sep 2011|Meds/PCC Finalised:12 Sep 2011|CO Allocated :13 Sep 2011| Visa Grant :21 Sep 2011|Arrived Australia:9 Nov 2011|Living OZ Dream!4226zc7

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Guest Bagpuss1974

Hi all,

 

I see this thread is quite old now and was just wondering if the same information was applicable now?? If yes what's the point of SS visa???

 

Thanks

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Guest Bagpuss1974

Hi all,

 

I see this thread is quite old now and was just wondering if the same information was applicable now?? If yes what's the point of SS visa???

 

Thanks

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Guest TAMMYT

I just curious to know; If the person does not live in the Sponsored state and lives in other states, how the sponsored state will know?

Does the sponsoring state officials conduct house checks or conduct online surveys?

Suppose the person can provide a local address in the sponsored state and visits the state often; however does not live there, is it a breach of visa conditions? Will the176 state sponsored visa be cancelled?

 

 

 

 

Hi Goldencoil

 

Welcome to Poms in Oz.

 

The answers to your questions are:

 

1. Following your migration agent's advice will have zero implications for you.

 

2. No.

 

3. No.

 

4. No.

 

Cheers

 

Gill

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Guest Alibajwa
Hi Goldencoil

 

The answers to your supplementary questions are:

 

1. It will have no impact on your applications for RRVs. There is no condition that can be imposed on a sc 176 visa that requires you to live in a particular State, so there are no visa conditions to breach if you decide to move to a different State instead of the sponsoring State.

 

2. There is no problem if you decide to live in VIC for the first year and move to SA later. SA know perfectly well - at the time when they offer you their sponsorship - that circumstances might change and so you might decide to move to another State instead of SA when you first move to Oz. They also know full well that you might never even visit SA for a holiday for as long as you live.

 

The State Governments do not waste any time worrying about it. Loads of people get sponsorship from VIC and they have every intention of moving to VIC and living there forever. However their circumstances change and either they get a better job offer from an employer in SA or they simply decide that they prefer SA to VIC, so they move to SA. The flow of immigrants going in each direction is probably about equal in those two States. For instance, if a VIC sponsored immigrant wants to buy a house in Oz, he will get considerably more house for his money if he buys a house in Adelaide instead of in Melbourne.

 

"3. If relocating in another state has no impact at all, then what can they actually do (even in the most little kind of way) in such cases? Are there any?"

They cannot do anything. Nor would they want to. Please don't worry about it.

 

Cheers

 

Gill

 

 

On different forums, I always read that there is no legal obligation to live in that particular state who has sponsored u. People says that this is only moral obligation.

 

I don't belive on this.

 

Are Aussies are insane or stupid that they had left such a major loophole in migration process. For 176 visa, u need much less marks as compared to 175 (before 2011 july). Also thete are additional marks for state sponsorship. So there must b a point behind this less scoring criteria and additional marks for sponsorship.

 

If that opinion is true that there is no legal obligation in staying in that particular state, this means that states r themselves giving oppurtunities to less qualified people to apply and then they can move anywhere else in oz.

 

Moreover, I hvn't heard from any who got sponsorship from state A, lived in state B, anf then applied for citizenship. The point is whn u go for applying for citizenship, DiAC will definitely have all the record of u. May b while applying for citizenship, Diac asks the question that hv u filled the obligation to live in that particular state and u answe it with no, then there might b problem in getting sponsorship.

 

Also, if there is such a big loop hole in system, then people who had 475 regional visa can also work in cities and other states which is difinitely not the case.

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Guest TAMMYT

If you can avoid that phrase "may be when you apply for citizenship" your posting may be of some use. Why may be? If you are not sure,please avoid posting here. It is not helping anyone-even yourself.

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I'm starting to think no one actually knows on here- plenty of fiction but no fact!

 

If someone has actually done it would they raise there ugly head and admit to it- probably not due to backlash they would probably receive in here!

 

Come on some one must of done it- man up and tell us your story!

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Guest Alibajwa
If you can avoid that phrase "may be when you apply for citizenship" your posting may be of some use. Why may be? If you are not sure,please avoid posting here. It is not helping anyone-even yourself.

"May be" becaue yes I have reasons to belive that moving to other states is not that much simpler as people in this and other forums are suggesting. It will definitely create complications. But no solid proof.

 

And please you avoid suggesting me to stop posting here. Its a public forum and anyone can post its thought.

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