Environmental Engineer Confusions

[Guest Richer]

hello,

 

I am confused with my EA assessment outcome. This April I was assessed as Environmental Engineer,the code is 2129-79 according to ANSO. However, ANZSCO came into effect since July 1, 2129-79 corresponding to 233999 is not included in SOL Schedule 3 but Environmental Engineer as a new seperate occupation 233915 is on the SOL.So what should I do to get my application in Priority Group 3?

 

thanks in advance.

[cazhoney]

Hi Richer,

 

I am in the same situation as you.

 

I have called DIAC yesterday, and after 15 minutes of waiting and spending almost my entire Skype credits, a lady talked to me.

 

I explained to her my concern about my situation. I have applied in 2009, under a ASCO code (2129-79 - Building Engineers nec - Environmental engineers). Building engineers nec are not ont the new SOL, so that puts me under Priority 4. But, Environmental Engineer is on the new SOL, so I checked the transitional arrangements from ASCO to ANZSCO, and I am not converted automatically to the new code. So I asked the lady if I should get a new skills assessment with the correct code, and if it´s possible to send it to DIAC, or if I would have to reapply for a visa.

 

The lady said she didn´t know. Said that they were doing police checkings at this time, and looking through all the files from everyone who has already applied, to see in which category they fall and to advise them if they should do anything, in cases like mine....She said it´s not fair to be in a situation like mine, so that´s why they were going through all files. She told me she was sending my file to this "special section" to be checked, and I would be contacted in 4 weeks to receive instructions.

 

I can´t answer your question right now, because even DIAC doesn´t know what to do with us....PLease let me know if you have any news, ok? Perhaps you could call DIAC also? To explain your situation and see what they tell you? PLase share with me later....

 

Carolina

[cazhoney]

One more thing. Have you seen the transitional arrangements? Why aren´t we converted automatically? I don´t understand.....reallly....Why can a Chemical Engineer be a Environmental engineer, and we (who were classified as Environmental Engineers) can´t be?

[Guest Richer]

Hi Cazhoney, it is great to meet you.

I have sent an E-mail about my concern to Skill Australia who is the SOL developing institution and got a reply below, you may obtain some information from it.

 

"Thank you for your enquiry about the coding of Environmental Engineer on the Australian and New Zealand Standard Classification of Occupations (ANZSCO), and the Australian Standard Classification of Occupations (ASCO). In 2006 ANZSCO replaced the 1996 ASCO Second Edition. Please see the link to the 2006 ANZSCO publication on the Australian Bureau of Statistics website.

 

http://www.ausstats.abs.gov.au/Ausstats/subscriber.nsf/0/69651C2DD21FE15BCA2575DF001CB1CC/$File/12200_2006.pdf

 

According the correspondence table on page 785 of the ANZSCO publication 233915 Environmental Engineer corresponds with ASCO (Edition 2) 2129-17 Chemical Engineer, which includes Environmental Engineers.

 

The ASCO (Edition 2) code 2129-79 referred to Building and Engineering Professionals nec which in turn corresponds to ANZSCO code 233999 Engineering Professionals nec. Assuming that EA refers to Engineers Australia I cannot say why that organisation would have recommended the code 2129-79.

I am assuming you sought assessment by Engineers Australia in order to determine if the occupation of Environmental Engineer is on the Skilled Occupation List (SOL), which is used by the Department of Immigration and Citizenship in their General Skilled Migration program. The SOL was developed by Skills Australia, an independent statutory body that provides advice to the Minister for Education,

Employment and Workplace Relations (DEEWR) on Australia’s current, emerging and future workforce skills needs and workforce development needs.

 

By way of background, prior to advising the government on the occupations to be included on the new SOL, Skills Australia had developed a Specialised Occupation List (SpOL), and this was used as the basis for developing the SOL. The SpOL was based on all occupation unit groups in the ie at the four digit code level. Environmental Engineer does not appear as a separate occupation at this level of aggregation, but is included under the four digit unit group of 2339 Other Engineering Professionals.

 

In developing its advice to the Government on the SpOL, Skills Australia initially assessed all occupation unit groups in ANZSCO against four criteria:

1. Long lead time. These are skills which are highly specialised and require extended learning and preparation time over several years.

2. High use. These are skills which are deployed for the uses intended (ie there is a good occupational ‘fit’).

3. High risk. This is where the disruption caused by the skills being in short supply imposes a significant risk to the Australian economy and/or community.

4. High information. This is where the quality of information about the occupation is adequate to the task of assessing future demand and evaluating the first three criteria.

 

An occupation is considered ‘specialised’ if it meets at least two of the first three criteria, as well as the fourth criterion.

 

As a result of additional analysis of occupations undertaken to determine the SOL it was decided that some occupations that were not included on the SpOL should be included on the SOL, and that some occupations on the SpOL should not be included on the SOL. The SOL is at the 6 digit code occupation level. In the case of Environmental Engineer it is on both lists.

 

I have included a link to the summary sheet for Other Engineering Professionals which is available on the Skills Australia website. It explains the reasoning behind why Environmental Engineer was included on the SOL.

http://www.skillsaustralia.gov.au/PDFs_RTFs/SOL/2339OtherEngineeringProfessionals.pdf "

 

keep contact.

[cazhoney]

Hi Richer,

 

 

well, they didn´t say too much, right? My only concern is whether DIAC will allow us to send a new skills assessment or not.

 

Carolina

[cazhoney]

And you know what is worse? If we were considered as Chemical engineers, I would already have received a visa, because Chemical Engineers were on the CSL!!!

[Guest Richer]

Yes, they really said nothing except some inessential explanation about how they develop the SOL; I guess that may because they just encounter this situation for the first time.

I have compared the occupation descriptions of Chemical engineer and Environmental engineer both in ASCO and ANZSCO and found that the occupation contents of Chemical engineer are totally identical but is quite different from that of Environmental engineer. I also noted that Chemical engineer has been transferred to another group 2331 Chemical and Materials Engineers in ANZSCO from 2129 OTHER BUILDING AND ENGINEERING PROFESSIONALS in ASCO, which means Environmental engineer should be a separate occupation under group 2339 OTHER ENGINEERING PROFESSIONALS in ANZSCO.

I believe we are Environmental engineer (233915) in ANZSCO.

[cazhoney]

Do you think we should antecipate and get ourselves reassessed?

 

What are you planning to do?

 

Could you please share youtr timeline? Would be great to share infos with you.....Where are you planning to go to? Do you have State Sponsorship?

[Guest Richer]

I don't think we should reassess as I can anticipate the outcome is definitely Environmental Engineer just with a new code 233915, why should we waste the money ? Actually I applied for assessment as CIvil Engineer but the result turned to be Environmental Engineer .

 

I am 175,no state sponsorship ,and Elodged application on Apri. 28 in 2010.

[Guest Richer]

As you metioned you have called DIAC and got uncertain reply, maybe what we should do now is to wait for their more detailed answer and continue to E-mail or call DIAC or other relevant insitutions to express our concerns and struggle for beening included in Priority 3.

 

You are not alone, there are another four besides me in the same situation as I have known. Let we do together for a fair treatment.

[cazhoney]

Hi Richer,

 

thanks. PLease keep in touch, I would be glad to this together....

 

Carolina

[Guest Richer]

hey Cazhoney,

 

I just got a reply again from Skill Australia, which means we may need a re-assessment. The main conclusion is below:

 

DIAC informed me that a skills assessment issued for ASCO 2129-79 Building and Engineering Professionals nec cannot be used as evidence of a skills assessment for ANZSCO 233915 Environmental Engineer. You may need to contact Engineers Australia to request a new assessment because DIAC began using the ANZSCO standard on 1 July 2010. You will need to nominate your occupation in ANZSCO from 1 July 2010 for future visa applications.

 

 

But I do not want to do so,and send a new letter to explain the ASCO 2129-79 Environmental Engineer .

[Guest Gollywobbler]

Hi Carolina, Hi Richer

 

I may be talking complete rubbish, so please just ignore me if I am. I am wondering whether there would be any mileage in asking Engineers Australia about this confusion?

 

Cheers

 

Gill

[cazhoney]

HI Gill,

 

actually, I have contacted them about 2 months ago, but they don´t have any answers either....

 

The guy told me that I could be reassessed under the new ANZSCO code, but I am not sure yet if DIAC will accept this....

 

The funny (tragic) thing is that it seeems Skills Australia has not contacted EA when they were doing the correlations between the old and the new codes.

 

 

"According the correspondence table on page 785 of the ANZSCO publication 233915 Environmental Engineer corresponds with ASCO (Edition 2) 2129-17 Chemical Engineer, which includes Environmental Engineers.

 

The ASCO (Edition 2) code 2129-79 referred to Building and Engineering Professionals nec which in turn corresponds to ANZSCO code 233999 Engineering Professionals nec. Assuming that EA refers to Engineers Australia I cannot say why that organisation would have recommended the code 2129-79. "

So, they just blame EA for not recognizing us as Chemical Engineers....It doesn´t make any sense. Of course Chemical engineers could be considered Environmental Engineers, but no all of them. On the other hand, an Environmental engineer isalways an Environmental Engineer. I know it sounds stupid, but Skills Australia wasn´t able to see this!

 

Argh! :arghh:

 

Carolina

[Guest Richer]

" actually, I have contacted them about 2 months ago, but they don´t have any answers either...."

A person‘s agent has contacted EA and got a positive reply saying “……our assessment outcome letter has no expiry date from our perspective ... but to our best knowledge, we understand that DIAC does not accept such letters that are more than 12 months old at the date of migration application. To this end we can issue updated assessment outcome letters - this does not require your client to be reassessed，unless they require a different outcome. Subject to the above, the likely outcome for your client in his updated duplicate letter will be as 'ANZSCO 233915 Environmental Engineer' "

So some are planning to sent materials to EA for reissue. I will tell you the detailed materials needed later since I am not in preparation at the moment.

 

Richer

[cazhoney]

Richer,

 

this applies only to the ones who haven´t applied for a visa yet. This is the reply I got:

 

"Thank you for your further advice.

 

Please understand that our authority to use the ANZSCO codes for

migration skills assessment purposes was NOT granted until 1 July 2010

(per DIAC introduction of the new SOL/ENSOL).

 

Up to that time, we could ONLY assess in ASCO codes, and you were

assessed in all good faith using the rules in existence at the time ...

simply, Environmental Engineering did not have its own ASCO code, and we

had no alternative but to use the miscellaneous 'nec' code for you.

 

Clearly, since 1 July 2010, if an applicant is successfully assessable

as a (professional) Environmental Engineer then we can use the ANZSCO

code 233915.

 

 

Once again, I believe you are worrying unnecessarily if you have

already applied for Migration. It is neither your fault or ours if

adherence was made to the DIAC requirements prevailing at the time. If

you had NOT already applied for migration to DIAC, then we would have no

hesitation in reissuing an updated letter but please understand we are

not inclined to confuse the situation with DIAC at this stage by issuing

a revised assessment outcome letter which will now necessarily bear a

post-1 July 2010 date - and thus different to what you have already

applied with."

 

They clearly stated they will not reissue letters using the new code, unless DIAC tells them to.

[Guest Richer]

I am totally confused. It seems the EA is contradictive. Whatever,two people have sent their reissue application to EA yesterday, let us wait for the outcome.

[Guest Richer]

Dear Carolina,

 

We are busy in cotacting with DIAC,EA and SA(Skills Australia), and need more information to persuade them, would you sent all your replys from them to me, my E-mail address is horicher@hotmail.com. thanks.

[cazhoney]

Hi Richer,

 

these 2 engineers who have asked to be reassessed, have they applied for a visa yet?

 

Carolina

[Guest Richer]

yes, they have been waiting for one year and two years respectively since their application, they are requesting a reissue letter with new code not a re-assessment. Yesterday my agent got a reply from EA that means the new code can be directly allocated without any re-assessment or update. So I am waiting for news from the two meanwhile forwarding the reply from EA to Skill Australia for advice or help.

[cazhoney]

Richer,

 

I forwarded you the email response I received from EA. The guy told me that they will not reissue letters if people have already applied using an ASCO code.

 

Please stay in touch, I am totally lost here....

 

Carolina

[Guest Richer]

Carolina,

 

Thank you,I have received your email. There were really many contacts with EA though there had been no obviously possitive conclusion until now. Yesterday some got letter from DIAC saying another 3~4 weeks will be needed . So we could image the DIAC's efficiency, very dissatisfactory and disappointed!

 

Richer

[Guest ombadei]

Hi,

 

I am intending to lodge a GSM application. Just completed my degree in Bachelor Engineering (Computer).

 

Apparently, EA has classified my occupation as ANZSCO 233999. This has created a bit of a problem for me since it does not fall within schedule 3.

 

I am hoping to gain experience in the electronics industry which is why i took many electronic/hardware subjects in my coursework. Naturally, i hope to be classified as an electronics engineer.

 

It doesnt make sense to me at all. This process is pretty confusing for me right now. Any insights for any computer engineers who are facing the same problem? Does anyone know what "nec" stands for?