INDIAN students are shunning Australia

[Guest Jane1991]

This commonly held bogus assumption that "Indians do the job that Aussies never do" is utter rubbish.

 

By Australian I am guessing you are referring to anglo-saxons Australians. Many of them work as garbage collector, plumbing (yes, when your toilet breaks down the one that most likely come and fix will be Aussie), car mechanics, electricians. Many Caucasian British migrants (if you follow this site more often) come here on these roles which in India is "poor people's job".

 

Taxi driving is not a odd looked down upon job in Australia that people avoid. Reason why many Indians chose to do it is because they can:

 

1) Drive

2) Work hours to suit them day or late nights

3) Good money

 

Its not because Aussies cant drive or they have issues with taxi driving career. Its not just India, Lot of cabbies in New York are from subcontinent.

 

FYI, Indians started to migrate here in bulk in last 20 years or so, who do you think did these tradie jobs before that?

 

Also by constantly bringing up this myth, you are emphasizing that this country looks down on people "doing jobs Aussies wouldn't do".

 

Do you think its any different in India? Can you imagine a IT pro or someone well established marrying a hairdresser or plumber in India? FYI, current PM Julia Gillard's partner was a hairdresser. Cant imagine an Indian politician having a partner/spouse doing one of the "jobs Aussies wouldn't do"? Answer to all of the above is NO.

 

Some people needs to look in the mirror before complaining about people from other backgrounds.

 

While I agree whole heartedly that no job is good or bad ... including prostitution ... but the idea that migrants do jobs that aussies won't do ... is widely held by many people including the Treasury Secretary of Australia ...

 

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/national/dont-push-out-migrants-out-of-cities-warns-treasury-secretary-ken-henry/story-e6freuzr-1225891889840

 

And while we are talking about stereotypes ... Have you ever seen how many daddies hit on Asian chicks( their daughter's age) in a club ... we all know what stereotype I am talking about.

 

Sadly stereotypes are here to stay ... just like the "Fried chick ... watermelon ... afro-american thing"

[User Name]

While I agree whole heartedly that no job is good or bad ... including prostitution ... but the idea that migrants do jobs that aussies won't do ... is widely held by many people including the Treasury Secretary of Australia ...

 

 

Yep hence there GSM for that very purpose to fill in skill shortages. When is there skill shortages? When enough Aussies dont go into a certain profession.

 

When some people say "Indians or whatever migrant does jobs Aussies wont do" they refer to jobs like taxi driving, cleaning while presuming Aussies are nose-high when it comes to doing "get your hands dirty" work. That is rubbish.

 

 

And while we are talking about stereotypes ... Have you ever seen how many daddies hit on Asian chicks( their daughter's age) in a club ... we all know what stereotype I am talking about.

 

Yeah I have seen many go to Thailand and Phillippines and get a bride half the age on the way back but how does it remotely relate to to my post of Aussies being stereotyped in India as picky with jobs?

[Guest perry]

this commonly held bogus assumption that "indians do the job that aussies never do" is utter rubbish.

 

by australian i am guessing you are referring to anglo-saxons australians. Many of them work as garbage collector, plumbing (yes, when your toilet breaks down the one that most likely come and fix will be aussie), car mechanics, electricians. Many caucasian british migrants (if you follow this site more often) come here on these roles which in india is "poor people's job".

 

taxi driving is not a odd looked down upon job in australia that people avoid. Reason why many indians chose to do it is because they can:

 

1) drive

2) work hours to suit them day or late nights

3) good money

 

its not because aussies cant drive or they have issues with taxi driving career. Its not just india, lot of cabbies in new york are from subcontinent.

 

fyi, indians started to migrate here in bulk in last 20 years or so, who do you think did these tradie jobs before that?

 

also by constantly bringing up this myth, you are emphasizing that this country looks down on people "doing jobs aussies wouldn't do".

 

do you think its any different in india? Can you imagine a it pro or someone well established marrying a hairdresser or plumber in india? Fyi, current pm julia gillard's partner was a hairdresser. Cant imagine an indian politician having a partner/spouse doing one of the "jobs aussies wouldn't do"? Answer to all of the above is no.

 

some people needs to look in the mirror before complaining about people from other backgrounds.

 

bull ****

[Guest jigish]

And while we are talking about stereotypes ... Have you ever seen how many daddies hit on Asian chicks( their daughter's age) in a club ... we all know what stereotype I am talking about.

 

Sadly stereotypes are here to stay ... just like the "Fried chick ... watermelon ... afro-american thing"

I don't think this discussion, especially the latter part was about stereotypes. My posts about those tweets and that face-to-face experience were very much real, and certaintly they are not made up, if that's what you mean by, "they're just stereotypes, get over it."

[Guest perry]

Jigish,

Thanks for replying,I can understand why you are upset with that sort of treatment,it really is disgusting

but believe me it is not the sort of attitude held by the majority of Australians,most aussies that I know would,like me,be appalled at such shocking attitudes but unfortunately Australia is no different to any other country in that there will always be a very small minority of ignorant,bad mannered people with racist views,it's a shame that this sort of experience has put you off Australia but to be honest with you I really don't think you will find any country in the world that doesn't have a racist

element,it's sad of course but I think it's the reality of the world we live in,I have travelled widely during my career in the travel industry and I've encountered racist attitudes almost everywhere,even in India itself but I take the view that the majority of people in the world are decent,caring folk who couldn't care less about the color of a persons skin or their nationality,sadly however there will always be some people who don't fit that description and equally sadly Australia is not immune to that.

I hope you change your mind and stay here,and please don't think that all Australians are as rude and bad mannered as those people who posted those tweets.

Regards

Nigel

__________________

 

i do agree with PROUDAUSSIE that australia is not an racist country and anyone who says that does not know the australians.......

[Guest perry]

If u see the amount of racism that exist in INDIA its nothing compared as in here...

[Guest nitsy]

Hi Paul

 

I noticed that you have not asked Indaussie how much money he has spent in Australia whilst he has been studying there. Why have you not asked about this, please?

 

The foreign income from people like Indaussie has been worth $17 billion a year to Australia at the last count. The International Students pay enormous tuition fees - far higher than a domestic student has to pay for the same thing. It has been the second or third largest source of export income for Australia, apparently.

 

It is well known that encouraging International Students means that Governments are able to spend less money on educating their own students at home. Consequently, the UK (where I live) Canada and the USA are all licking their lips. Since Australia has kissed goodbye to the foreign income, the three other countries are perfectly willing to share it between us instead.

 

Similarly, when the Aussie Unis and colleges of further education either close down or decrease in size - which they will be forced to do - Aussie Citizens and Permanent Residents who work for these colleges/unis will be made redundant. The predictions are that several thousands of these workers will be made redundant in Melbourne alone.

 

These "reforms" by the Minister for Immi - who is not responsible for the economic effects that his "reforms" will undoubtedly cause elsewhere in 'Australia's balance sheet' - seems to be determined to put the Aussie economy at risk, especially in VIC, it seems to me.

 

If I were the average Aussie, I'd be looking at the balance sheet rather than at the International Students, since there won't be many (if any) International Students to look at in years to come, but the gaping hole in the balance sheet will be more than readily apparent.

 

Australia's economic loss is the UK's gain, frankly. We need the up-front, easy money that more or less earns itself for us, without the UK having to do anything much in return. We also need to create additional jobs. Attracting the prospective International Students whom the Aussie Minister has decided that Australia doesn't want is very good news for the UK and for our two competitors on the other side of the Atlantic.

 

I strongly suspect that John Howard and Co were never interested in whether or not Australia provided genuine value for money in return for grabbing the shekels of foreign income and creating jobs for Australians. I don't think Birrell understands the economic risks that the Labor Government is determined to take, period. Birrell is a demographer, not an economist, after all.

 

Cheers

 

Gill

Hi Gill,

 

I totally agree with you. And they say Australia is reeling under recession without realising that they are the biggest contributors to it today!!

 

Regards,

Nitsy

[User Name]

bull ****

 

Funny how you refer to my post as bull**** then proceed to ramble along the same line in you other post

[Guest true blue sue]

Hi Gill,

 

I totally agree with you. And they say Australia is reeling under recession without realising that they are the biggest contributors to it today!!

 

Regards,

Nitsy

 

I think from economic data to date it suggests that Australia is one of the few countries NOT reeling under a recession. In fact the treasury is trying to take the heat out of the Australian economy by raising interest rates.It's a long bow to link any downturn in international student numbers to a supposed recession in Oz.

 

Sue

[Guest archetype]

Hi All, this is my first post in the forum

I registered to share my views as a student who did his Masters here and now pursuing a doctorate.

I do not know about other fields or subject areas, my views are limited to education in computer science and IT. I don't think the problem lies at a single location.. many are at fault.

 

I. University Education

1. majority of the bright students never looked at Australia at first preference and the same is reflected in the class structures here. Most of the students studying are without work experience. Some of these I would consider as above average..

2. The course content and curriculum are diluted so as the pass percentage of students remains 'decent'.

3. Specialized courses are often made to run as 'seminar based' (because total students are less than a required minimum) i.e. the lecturer is not paid by the uni to run it.. the profs run them for their own interest.. or rather to get potential phd students. On top of that even these are not detailed enough because of the fear of loosing students further.

4. Majority of the students pick courses which are easy and would fetch them high marks..

5. On average each subject costs $2000-$3000 depending on uni. If a student fails a few subjects, he changes his uni to a more lenient one.

6. Many students start tutoring to earn money. University tutoring pays more than most of part time jobs.. as a result the competition is pretty high. Sadly, ACS does not recognize tutoring as part of work experience. Few of the tutors I would say are not fit for tutoring.. (most come from the same population of students).. But then the university needs tutors..

 

Having said all that, I don't think universities are to be blamed either, they have to be economically profitable. The professors hate diluting courses or making easy assessments. If they don't, they have the fear of loosing students. Plus, there are lot of 'other' universities where you can just go and pass.. After spending this much amount of money, students have passing the course as first priority and getting good education as secondary.

 

II. Permanent Residency

1. For a bright student.

Most of the bigger companies require TR/PR for a full time job (for experienced positions), unless you are in a highly specialized area. Now, even if you had experience before coming here, in fields like IT out of industry for more than year makes you kinda outdated. Finding good part time work is not easy either. After hearing a person was chosen because he had PR .. it does not go easily if you believe in yourself and have worked hard. And getting PR.. 2+ years away and TR takes 1 year.. Few of whom I knew, they did not want to work on petty jobs just to earn a living unless the savings finished (where they had no choice).. at this stage i guess the self-confidence tends to go down.

Further, I expect the TR processing time to go beyond 1 year.. as now almost all students would be 'forced' to apply for TR before PR. Reason being, you need skills assessment before applying PR, most take 2-4 months. On average the student visa expires about 1.5 months after finishing education... unless you are finishing in semester 2 (nov-dec) then most visas expire mid March. Now mid-dec to early jan being low productivity times.. these students are only at a slight advantage..

 

2. Some of my classmates who had experience got work as a contractor, all of them got it because they knew someone in the industry or had worked in Australia before. For a person new here, making contacts in the industry is not easy.

 

3. For students without experience but willing to work in same field, they look for graduate positions. Most graduate positions require PR. Off late some of them have relaxed this and rather required a IELTS score of more than 7 to be considered. The companies spend money,time and effort to train graduates. A graduate is considered 'under training' for at least 6-12 months. They do not want to risk with someone on a bridging visa..I hope it gets better.

 

4. For students who have just come here for PR.. I think they are prepared for it mentally.. less frustrated of the rest.. few of whom i met seemed to have a 'gambler' like attitude..

 

Now, i am not taking out 'my' frustration.. I was able to fetch a part time job in my field as soon as i started my Masters, after finishing i got a full scholarship to do my PhD. I have had good experiences here.. These are based on what i have observed and issues I could quickly sketch here.. may not be totally correct.. Sorry if it offends someone.

[Guest proud2beaussie]

Congratulations on your first post archetype,I think it is very well written,you raise sensible points and present your views in a concise manner and I don't think you have posted anything that could be considered offensive at all.

Thanks for your post and welcome to the forum,I hope you find it interesting and valuable.

Cheers

Nigel

[Paul1Perth]

I really do hope that my degree will not be worthless, after spending 3 years of my life and in excess of $300K......

 

Will Aussie employers feel the same about a degree from one of their own Uni's?

 

Steph

xxxx

 

I don't think you need to worry about a degree from an Australian University. Working for a large multinational employer, which regularly employes new graduates, an Australian Degree is regarded very highly, here and abroad. Despite the comments above.

[Paul1Perth]

What about a Brit?? I'm a fully qualified Financial Investment Adviser with over 21 years experience, now doing a Bachelor of Commerce at an Australian Uni.

 

Do you think I will be employable??

 

Steph

xxxx

 

I don't think you will have a problem, unless there isn't a demand for Financial Advisers, or whatever you are planning, when you finish your degree.

Being a mature student has its advantages but you may have to start with a low salary as a new graduate.

 

It's hard to predict what type of people will be in demand and having a degree isn't a guarantee of getting a job. Your experience will count for a lot though.

[Guest TheStig]

If u see the amount of racism that exist in INDIA its nothing compared as in here...

 

How do you know? Are you from India?

[Guest proud2beaussie]

This article isn't really about Indian students but it does show that the universities are worried.

Plan to lift cap on local students | The Australian

UNIVERSITIES Australia may lobby the government to raise the cap on government-funded over-enrolments next year. They believe this will help the sector weather a downturn in international students.

While government funding rates for domestic students are well below the fees universities charge international students, advocates say it would cushion parts of the sector from falling international revenues by providing extra cash flow and students. But there are concerns it could be ineffective in compensating for a downturn, since it wouldn't help vulnerable universities that don't have strong domestic demand.

It is one of several proposals UA is considering putting to government to offset the downturn. UA is due to meet Immigration Minister Chris Evans on July 26.

 

[mlsdq]

 

Yeah I have seen many go to Thailand and Phillippines and get a bride half the age on the way back but how does it remotely relate to to my post of Aussies being stereotyped in India as picky with jobs?

 

I am a filipina and i can attest that one. But not all are the same. I am not offended since I have an Aussie bf, same age as mine. With regards to your line there, i am somewhat agree to that... just so you know..

[Paul1Perth]

I understand there are hoops to jump through to get into Australia, just as there are for any country. I had to jump through hoops to move to the USA a couple of years ago to be with my husband. The big difference between the Australian process and the US process was the clarity and transparency of the information. Maybe it should be hard to get into Australia, as you say, although I don't know why it has to be "hard", there should be rules but it should also be fair. Information should be public and up front so that, even if it is hard, people know exactly what they are getting themselves into at the outset. Decisions should be transparent, not cloaked in secrecy and legal mumbo jumbo, and rules should not be changed halfway through the application process. Information should be absolutely clear - not confusing and all over the place.

 

I don't really sense a racial undertone at all in this thread - I can very easily see how anyone would become angry and resentful after having jumped through hoop after hoop and forked out your family's life savings, to then be told it was all for nothing. I think you would see things very differently if you'd been refused your visa - it's very easy to say "that's life" while sitting pretty.

 

I can understand people's anger - I myself am angry at Australia for the treatment both my husband and I have received. Why should I be forced to choose between my country of birth and my husband? The UK would not treat us like that, the US would not, nor Canada - why is it OK for Australia? All along we were led to believe there would be a waiver available to us but I had to do a lot of research to discover that the waiver is only exercised around 10% of the time. And that is the problem - the information provided by DIAC is very misleading and evasive. Needlessly so. We're in a much better position than a lot of people in other visa categories, too - at least we have a right of appeal. So I really think, at the very least, people have a right to be angry!

 

Honestly, I no longer see Australia the same way as I used to, as the country of a "fair go" - it seems like many other countries give people a much fairer go.

 

(Also I think the Australian media and government carry on a bit - having lived in the USA, with 11,000,000 illegal immigrants, it's laughable what Australia thinks of as an illegal immigration crisis.)

 

I would have been very dissappointed if we hadn't been accepted for emigration and refused a visa, to say the least. But we would have had to accept it and make the best of where we were, like my sisters family had to do. If DIAC took the time to explain every decision they made and inform applicants they wouldn't have time to process the millions of applications they have sat on their desks, the queue would get longer and people even more frustrated.

 

Having said that your predicament seems totally unfair.

[Guest nitsy]

Guys,

 

Can we stop the slanging please. Its helping no one!! Thought this would be a discussion on effects of the governments policies.

 

Nitsy

[Guest archetype]

well.. there is no ideal place.. every country has its goods and bads.. depends what works for you.. till the time you are happy with your place of being at present :-)

Australia also serves as a good 'transit' for highly skilled people.. The US market is way bigger and better than the AUS at least in some sectors. Having an Australian passport makes those markets more accessible !

[Guest proud2beaussie]

Ok guys I have deleted 38 posts on this thread which had nothing to do with the subject matter and were purely members sniping at each other and back biting.

I have reopened this thread but this is the last warning,stay on the topic of reduced enrolements of students because of the cap and cease bill,no more discussions about race,which country is better etc,

stick to the topic and respect each others views or the thread will be closed permanently which would be very unfair to the OP who started the thread.

[Guest jigish]

This thread from the beginning was a bit misleading, even the journalist who wrote that piece had it wrong, because its not only Indian, but Chinese and other nationalities also, who're thinking twice before choosing Australia as a place to study.

[Guest fat]

What are you saying? I am planning to leave this hellhole ASAP, once I get my application fees from capping. And you are saying I can't get job back home with Australian degree?!? I was dreaming about, applying in infosys, BTW. LOL. Are you saying this from your personal experience or this is just an assumption?

 

Just because you requested a reply .. I don't quite understand why your planning to leave the hellole once you GET your VA fee... I don't quite understand why your planning to wait in the hellhole till you get your refund? lets be realistic here is $2k really enough money to stop u from following your dreams?

 

u'll get your refund ..even if your on the north pole when it's processed

 

how about leaving today ? and realizing your dreams in infosys or wherever? why exactly..or WHAT exactly are you waiting for? a change in government? perhaps a change in rules? or maybe even the PR visa you applied for?

[User Name]

Just because you requested a reply .. I don't quite understand why your planning to leave the hellole once you GET your VA fee... I don't quite understand why your planning to wait in the hellhole till you get your refund? lets be realistic here is $2k really enough money to stop u from following your dreams?

 

u'll get your refund ..even if your on the north pole when it's processed

 

how about leaving today ? and realizing your dreams in infosys or wherever? why exactly..or WHAT exactly are you waiting for? a change in government? perhaps a change in rules? or maybe even the PR visa you applied for?

 

If you are onshore applicant you cant leave the country while the visa is being processed. I think they can reject you (with no refund) if you leave as you broke bridging visa condition.

 

Why they have that condition OR why they didn't remove it since it started to take eternity to process graduates, I don't know.

[Guest jigish]

If you are onshore applicant you cant leave the country while the visa is being processed. I think they can reject you (with no refund) if you leave as you broke bridging visa condition.

 

Why they have that condition OR why they didn't remove it since it started to take eternity to process graduates, I don't know.

 

That's exactly what I was gonna say.

 

@fat: Please research it, before you blurt out nonsense.

[Guest Alucard]

Anyone else getting a headache from the posts in here?