"Cap & Cease" Terminations Are To Start Soon

[Guest Gollywobbler]

Hi Guys

 

As I understand this whole thing, it is roughly as follows:

 

To start with, somebody assumed that the reason why so many of the pre-Sept 2007 applications had not been processed was because the applications were dodgy in some way. Where the applicant has studied for a trade skill in Oz, bogus documents might be involved. Where the applicant has been outside Oz all along, bogus Pathway D claims might be involved.

 

DIAC would not actually know whether either of the suspicions above is correct unless they actually process the visa application instead of leaving it lying about somewhere.

 

Then DIAC realised that not all of the visa applicants are outside Australia. They might have applied for offshore visas but many of them, like Dacalcedo, are physically in Australia with their partners and children. The family's lifestyle in Australia is contented, the children are happy in their new schools etc. The visa applicants are ploughing their money into Australia like good 'uns. Some of them have sc 457 visas, via which they are paying Tax in Australia. Others are ploughing yet more money into remaining within the International Education system in Oz. Try to uproot any of them and the Human Rights lobby will hit the Minister where it hurts, apart from all of the other groups of interested parties who would hit him for other reasons.

 

 

 

More recently DIAC have realised that not all of the languishing applicants are languishing because they are tradies whose applications are dodgy. Some of them are well-qualified applicants who are professionals in their own fields, who have never been involved with Pathway D or with a dodgy, "Visa factory" type of college. Applicants such as Virtual Bajwa are probably being held up because of one or both of the following factors:

 

• According to Peter Speldewinde, DIAC can't tell how many people are included in VB's application unless somebody reads the file. Right, so if Mr Speldewinde can't work that out without somebody reading the file, what else can't he work out without reading the file? He can't even eliminate the possiblility that VB might be in Australia unless VB lets him know about this, it would seem. Does Mr Speldewinde actually know that VB is not a Cook with allegedly dodgy claims of one sort or another?
  
• The boss of ASIO has been whingeing that it is no use expecting him to do anything about processing the security checks for VB when the Minister seems to be enjoying his own flirtations with unauthorised boat arrivals instead - which apparently has caused a lot of skilled visa applicants to complain to ASIO about the delays with their own security checks.
  

Then there is the added complication that some of the Cooks with allegedly dodgy claims might have applied for sc 496 visas which cannot be capped & ceased unless the Regulations are changed first.

 

Then there is another complication which says that the Minister cannot cap some of the visa applications in a subclass but not others. He must either grant all the visa applications that he wants to grant and then get rid of all the remaining outstanding applications or he must touch none of them.

 

It is all very easy for the staff who are not lawyers to waffle self-importantly about "Collateral Damage" without a care in the world. DIAC's Chief Solicitor will be telling the Minister, "Minister, dear, the Plaintiff called "Collateral Damage" tends to make his or her way to the Courts in this country, and your track record of losing claims must be getting on towards a record by now, chum! Never mind the monetary claims for out of pocket expenses - what about the lawyers' costs that you will incur if you lose too much litigation?"

 

I can see a stack of legal problems looming with the whole idea. Those legal problems will be expensive to sort out, for sure.

 

No matter how carefully the Minister might look for Dasalcedo via inviting Dasalcedo to contact the Minister, there will be 100 other Dasalcedos who don't hang on the Minister's every muttering and therefore don't know that the Minister is suddenly looking for them for some reason. DIAC gave them the distinct impression that the Minister would contact them by letter if the Minister has anything to tell them. So it would be a good idea for the Minister to write to ALL of the applicants, wouldn't it?

 

The Minister's in-house lawyer, Ms Robyn Bicket, has no choice except to advise the Minister that every single outstanding file should be scrutinised by a qualified lawyer, in order to minimise the risk of potentially embarrassing, damaging and expensive litigation. Sure, lawyers make mistakes as well - and trawling through all the files is a monumentally boring job - so Sod's Law says that Collateral Damage will rear his/her ugly head somewhere unless either:

A. The Minister abandons the whole idea; or

B. The Minister at least permits Ms Bicket's team to do their best to try to minimise the number of potential Plaintiffs called Collateral Damage.

 

In the meantime, where DIAC know that the visa applicant is onshore, there is nothing dodgy about his visa application but ASIO are holding matters up, the Minister for Immi had better have an earnest and urgent chat with whichever other Minister is in charge of ASIO, I would suggest.

 

Cheers

 

Gill

[rahulpatel1969]

Gill

 

I like this. The path ahead looks murkier and murkier for the sinister and DIAC. Hope this new population minister gets some sense into the immigration minister. Another problem they are going to face in capping 496 and 138 (i think those are relative sponsored ) is that people who have applied have relatives in Australia who have votes. Also a lot of them are from Asian countries who have tight communities in Australia. This is going to create quite a buzz and bad press among them. Probably the govt will be thinking about the votes they stand to lose. I have yet to see any politician anywhere in the world not thinking of votes especially in an election year.

 

Rahul

 

Hi Guys

 

As I understand this whole thing, it is roughly as follows:

 

To start with, somebody assumed that the reason why so many of the pre-Sept 2007 applications had not been processed was because the applications were dodgy in some way. Where the applicant has studied for a trade skill in Oz, bogus documents might be involved. Where the applicant has been outside Oz all along, bogus Pathway D claims might be involved.

 

DIAC would not actually know whether either of the suspicions above is correct unless they actually process the visa application instead of leaving it lying about somewhere.

 

Then DIAC realised that not all of the visa applicants are outside Australia. They might have applied for offshore visas but many of them, like Dacalcedo, are physically in Australia with their partners and children. The family's lifestyle in Australia is contented, the children are happy in their new schools etc. The visa applicants are ploughing their money into Australia like good 'uns. Some of them have sc 457 visas, via which they are paying Tax in Australia. Others are ploughing yet more money into remaining within the International Education system in Oz. Try to uproot any of them and the Human Rights lobby will hit the Minister where it hurts, apart from all of the other groups of interested parties who would hit him for other reasons.

 

 

 

 

More recently DIAC have realised that not all of the languishing applicants are languishing because they are tradies whose applications are dodgy. Some of them are well-qualified applicants who are professionals in their own fields, who have never been involved with Pathway D or with a dodgy, "Visa factory" type of college. Applicants such as Virtual Bajwa are probably being held up because of one or both of the following factors:

 

• According to Peter Speldewinde, DIAC can't tell how many people are included in VB's application unless somebody reads the file. Right, so if Mr Speldewinde can't work that out without somebody reading the file, what else can't he work out without reading the file? He can't even eliminate the possiblility that VB might be in Australia unless VB lets him know about this, it would seem. Does Mr Speldewinde actually know that VB is not a Cook with allegedly dodgy claims of one sort or another?
  
• The boss of ASIO has been whingeing that it is no use expecting him to do anything about processing the security checks for VB when the Minister seems to be enjoying his own flirtations with unauthorised boat arrivals instead - which apparently has caused a lot of skilled visa applicants to complain to ASIO about the delays with their own security checks.
  

Then there is the added complication that some of the Cooks with allegedly dodgy claims might have applied for sc 496 visas which cannot be capped & ceased unless the Regulations are changed first.

 

Then there is another complication which says that the Minister cannot cap some of the visa applications in a subclass but not others. He must either grant all the visa applications that he wants to grant and then get rid of all the remaining outstanding applications or he must touch none of them.

 

It is all very easy for the staff who are not lawyers to waffle self-importantly about "Collateral Damage" without a care in the world. DIAC's Chief Solicitor will be telling the Minister, "Minister, dear, the Plaintiff called "Collateral Damage" tends to make his or her way to the Courts in this country, and your track record of losing claims must be getting on towards a record by now, chum! Never mind the monetary claims for out of pocket expenses - what about the lawyers' costs that you will incur if you lose too much litigation?"

 

I can see a stack of legal problems looming with the whole idea. Those legal problems will be expensive to sort out, for sure.

 

No matter how carefully the Minister might look for Dasalcedo via inviting Dasalcedo to contact the Minister, there will be 100 other Dasalcedos who don't hang on the Minister's every muttering and therefore don't know that the Minister is suddenly looking for them for some reason. DIAC gave them the distinct impression that the Minister would contact them by letter if the Minister has anything to tell them. So it would be a good idea for the Minister to write to ALL of the applicants, wouldn't it?

 

The Minister's in-house lawyer, Ms Robyn Bicket, has no choice except to advise the Minister that every single outstanding file should be scrutinised by a qualified lawyer, in order to minimise the risk of potentially embarrassing, damaging and expensive litigation. Sure, lawyers make mistakes as well - and trawling through all the files is a monumentally boring job - so Sod's Law says that Collateral Damage will rear his/her ugly head somewhere unless either:

A. The Minister abandons the whole idea; or

B. The Minister at least permits Ms Bicket's team to do their best to try to minimise the number of potential Plaintiffs called Collateral Damage.

 

In the meantime, where DIAC know that the visa applicant is onshore, there is nothing dodgy about his visa application but ASIO are holding matters up, the Minister for Immi had better have an earnest and urgent chat with whichever other Minister is in charge of ASIO, I would suggest.

 

Cheers

 

Gill

[rahulpatel1969]

Friends

 

One more thing comes to my mind. How abou they start cap and cease and then some of our relatives and applicants already living in Australia holding a small rally outside parliament house. I think Chris Evans would like that.

 

Rahul

[John Gilfillan]

Friends

 

One more thing comes to my mind. How abou they start cap and cease and then some of our relatives and applicants already living in Australia holding a small rally outside parliament house. I think Chris Evans would like that.

 

Rahul

 

 

I like your way of thinking Rahul.:wink:

[Guest babboo]

Dear Rahul n VB, I am still here with u all... Procession and legal options are there.... with u.. I think Chris Evans is just contemplating the options... And believe me he will not find one... If he does ... we will try our best to @%*!+-/^* him ......

Cheers

[virtual_bajwa]

Hello to all(Babboo, Rahul, Gilly and John),

Rahul , I like your way of Presenting your way. But it should be in democratic and peaceful way.Well in my words this will not put put our case in right direction. It would be better if we wait for the time when they implement cap and cease. If ever one of us effected by this rule , then go ahead with legal action , then try to come on roads and make aware the people from Australia that how immigrants are effected by this govt.

One thing is very true that Minister Chris Evens does not care about the votes and media cry ....

At last there is one suggestion take the Australian public with us . Australia common people are very nice and helpful( in spite of very few).

[rahulpatel1969]

Still no news yet about cap and cease. Hmm, seems the minister and DIAC are taking their own sweet time. Probably working out how to avoid a mess. Just cant think what they will come up with.

[virtual_bajwa]

Still no news yet about cap and cease. Hmm, seems the minister and DIAC are taking their own sweet time. Probably working out how to avoid a mess. Just cant think what they will come up with.

Hey Rahul,

I want to tell u that sooner or later there will be elections. So now I can understand the thinking behind these 8th February changes. DIAC is waiting for the elections . So I think there will not be any more changes implemented before the elections.It's an old tricks of politicians to put the policies in the bag and let the public wait for lolly pop.So that's wat the plan is.......

[virtual_bajwa]

Guys,

Now frustration is on the peak now for me. Can somebody tell me what wrong I did? May be, I should have not applied before September 2007.

After getting daily in the morning, first thing I do is to check this website Department of Immigration & Citizenship then browse through PomsInOz Australia Migration & Expat Forum. It has been ages since I am doing this. This has been totally unprofessional way of handling backlog of files.And the files are still increasing in numbers. Is there any website or forum where I can meet some senior DIAC or Minister's official.

[dasalcedo]

Guys,

Now frustration is on the peak now for me. Can somebody tell me what wrong I did? May be, I should have not applied before September 2007.

After getting daily in the morning, first thing I do is to check this website Department of Immigration & Citizenship then browse through PomsInOz Australia Migration & Expat Forum. It has been ages since I am doing this. This has been totally unprofessional way of handling backlog of files.And the files are still increasing in numbers. Is there any website or forum where I can meet some senior DIAC or Minister's official.

 

Last week I sent an email to a Senior DIAC and he just replied to me saying that I should contact DIAC and gave me the link to check DIAC phone numbers.... :arghh:

 

cheers

[virtual_bajwa]

Last week I sent an email to a Senior DIAC and he just replied to me saying that I should contact DIAC and gave me the link to check DIAC phone numbers.... :arghh:

 

cheers

 

As U already know nothing is going to come out of this numbers. There numbers are just the dumping pre recorded speeches. So real thing will come on DIAC website....I think some of the DIAC officials do not know wat to do with CAP and CEASE buggg.

[Guest celalit]

Hi friends,

 

I am pre-september 2007 applicant, waiting for my refund . Any idea when will they give us our refund?? So that I can re-apply..

[Welshtone]

There has been no final decision on the cap and cease yet - so no refund until that is done. Make sure you are still eligible for a visa under the new system, even if it means re-applying for a visa prior to getting your refund. If you re-apply and DIAC decide not to Cap and Cease, you would be likely to get a refund on the second application.

 

Regards

 

 

Tony

[Guest celalit]

As you said that cap and cease are not yet finalized, so does that means that is there any change of visa being granted (I got 7 bands in IELTS and is computer engineer by profession) ? Also, i have appplied my september 2007 file through migration agent, so how will I come to know if my application is capped ? Any idea, Sir !!

[Welshtone]

Until the Minister signs the Instrument to Cap and Cease a particular class of visa, there is some hope - especially for the 496 applicants where a change in law is required to use the Cap and Cease power.

 

Regards

 

 

Tony

[Guest celalit]

I have applied for OffShore 136 subclass. so is there hope for me tooo !!!!

 

Even, can I start new application without waiting for the refund. I already had my skill Assessment done in CSL and waiting for IELTS and state sponsorship results.

 

Also, DIAC had requested and I have submitted medical and PCC in september 2008..

 

Thanks very much

[Welshtone]

If your IELTS result is due soon and you get at least 6 in each, I would look at applying ahead of getting the State Sponsorship, depending on how long that is likely to take.

 

If any class is going to get capped and ceased, it will be the Idependent 136/137, in my opinion.

 

Regards

 

 

Tony

[Guest andres96]

If your IELTS result is due soon and you get at least 6 in each, I would look at applying ahead of getting the State Sponsorship, depending on how long that is likely to take.

 

If any class is going to get capped and ceased, it will be the Idependent 136/137, in my opinion.

 

Regards

 

 

Tony

 

Hello, why do you think 136/137 would be most likely to be capped and ceased?, if you need more points to apply isn't supposed you have more chances than other classes. I wonder because I'm 136 and I always thought and independent visa was "better" than a regional one.

[Guest celalit]

If I got 6 bands each in IELTS, then can I put my application before State Sponsorship? as DIAC website shows that one cannot lodge application before SS, if applying for 176.

 

Also, can I convert 176 (family sponsor) to 176(State sponsorship) to gain priority processing ?

[Welshtone]

The 496 cannot currently be capped and ceased and has Australian voting sponsors.

The 138 has Australian voting sponsors.

The 495 are State sponsored and there are not so many of them left

The 136/137 is the biggest group and do not have any sponsors to cause a fuss or vote against the government.

 

Regards

 

 

Tony

[Welshtone]

If I got 6 bands each in IELTS, then can I put my application before State Sponsorship? as DIAC website shows that one cannot lodge application before SS, if applying for 176.

 

Also, can I convert 176 (family sponsor) to 176(State sponsorship) to gain priority processing ?

 

When you apply for the visa, you apply for a 175 and 176 subclass of visa. If you apply without State or family sponsorship, and there is no sign of such when DIAC assess your application, they assess under 175 and, if you do not meet the pass-mark, as long as you meet the Pool mark of 100, they will Pool your application for 2 years. If at any time during that 2 year period, a state or family sponsorship comes in, they will then process your application and re-assess your points for a 176 subclass visa.

 

If you are family sponsored, you can withdraw the family sponsorship and provide State Sponsorship if you prefer. You can swap back and fore if priorities change and there is an advantage in going back to a family sponsored visa e.g. an exercisable review right.

 

Regards

 

 

Tony

[Guest mostafizur rahman]

Is there any hope for pre Sep'2007 Applicant? I want to know the end. Any one with any news ? Plese share.

[virtual_bajwa]

Is there any hope for pre Sep'2007 Applicant? I want to know the end. Any one with any news ? Plese share.

Well mostafizur,

No news is a good news as if there will be news that will be a bad news. Let us hope for the best matey.