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Guest Torrestheman

Silver trowel - good, bad, worth the money?????

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Guest Torrestheman

Is there anyone out there that is currently or has used Silver Trowel in Perth to study. My son was initialling thinking of using ST for a two year bricklaying course as their web site is very convincing. However, having read various formus on other Expat sites now he is not so sure.

 

Some people are very disappointed with ST and said they dont offer anything like they suggest. Also it appears bricklaying is the main choice of a lof of people and many brickies, builders are on the forums saying there is no work available once you have completed the course anyway.

 

I would like to hear from anyone who has used ST or is on a course at the moment in Perth as any advice would be invaluable as their courses are very expensive. Also, which course is the best to take, is carpentry less saturated with applicants and is there is a better chance of finding work once the course is completed.

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Guest Torrestheman
The state ETI TAFE WA also do, similar prices .... courses pretty much the same...

 

Is your son permanent resident, or offshore?

 

Think I would wait till news on new occupation lists etc. etc.

 

 

Cant find any courses at local TAFE in Perth that does construction, ie: bricklaying, carpentry etc - which is nearest? What are the entry requirements for both local TAFE and ST? Which construction trade is most likely to stay on occupation list?

 

We are still here in UK. I am hoping to do Landscaping for 2 years at Murdoch - advice suggests this is a good course to take.

 

Cheers

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Guest Gollywobbler
Cant find any courses at local TAFE in Perth that does construction, ie: bricklaying, carpentry etc - which is nearest? What are the entry requirements for both local TAFE and ST? Which construction trade is most likely to stay on occupation list?

 

We are still here in UK. I am hoping to do Landscaping for 2 years at Murdoch - advice suggests this is a good course to take.

 

Cheers

 

Hi Torrestheman

 

I'd suggest doing nothing at all for the next couple of weeks.

 

There is a strong rumour that DIAC are likely to make an announcement early in December to the effect that they intend to change everything for Student visa holders studying VET courses. (Vocational Education Training - nothing to do with animals.)

 

Please see this thread:

 

http://www.pomsinoz.com/forum/migration-issues/70255-studying-oz-view-future.html

 

Cheers

 

Gill

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Guest wanderer

If you're looking Ttm towards courses as a pathway to a future PR visa application, whilst there have been possibilities for that to occur, it is by no means a guaranteed right and a PR application carries with it a set of eligibility requirements.

 

As Gill indicates, there has been a recent review underway for several months now and an announce,ment was due last months but could be anytime either side of Xmas as to when it does come and anybody's guess as to what it may include.

 

Whatever happens, a new priority of processing structure will likely take account of several factors, being:

. Employer Sponsership, temporary that could lead to permanent and permanent by itself as focused on now to address market flucuations in demand and it is known that an applicant is coming to a job in the workforce.

There are eligibility criteria and you may want to look at the ES area on www.immi.gov.au

 

. Highly skilled occupations, usually of University degree level training that are known to generally always in demand, medical, engineering and IT professions to the fore.

 

. And then you get the rest you could say for which wait lists will be lengthy and what has componded that to some extent in recent years is the extent of onshore training, particularly in what may be construed by some potential PR applicant hopefuls as easier courses, not that building trades nor landscapiong is amongst them.

 

. But the like of building trades and landscaping do have their issues and with

Also it appears bricklaying is the main choice of a lof of people and many brickies, builders are on the forums saying there is no work available once you have completed the course anyway.

 

that could be getting said for a few reasons:

1. Brickies not taking on new starters if work projections are not there and all builders/tradies are very familiar with the boom/bust cycle of the Australian building industry.

2. Brickies may actually prefer apprentice trained brickies, fellas that have done their time with an older brickie and learnt how their team does it and then the Brickies know the skills they have.

This is going to be a factor in a lot of trade courses that DEEWR people sitting in ivory towers somewhere do overlook if they feel short training courses are the answer to less apprentices being trained.

 

Landscaping may not be so affected by the latter but existing lanscapers taking on personnel is not likely to happen in great numbers either if a market downturn is considered to be a possibility.

. Lanscaping in some ways is also like the jam and cream and money is not there you might just make do with bread and butter.

 

So certainly wait on any new announcements, be it weeks or months and hopefully somewhere in between but really think twice on what training will offer.

Education in Australia offers only that as a guarantee.

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Guest Torrestheman

Thanks to all for your replies and I will take everthing mentioned on board.

 

However, no-one has commented on whether Silver Trowel are any good and worth the outlay financially.

 

Also, is the following feasible:

 

Can you go out on a tourist visa and if when you are on holiday you go for interviews and you get offered employee sponsorship (I have years and years of catering management experience) can you then transfer your visa while still in Australia or do you have to be offshore?

 

Similarly, can you go out on a tourist visa and then transfer to a student visa while in Australia. The idea of this giving time to go and actually see the likes of Silver Trowel and TAFE colleges, their facilities and courses they have to offer and seeing locally in papers etc what kind of trade jobs are more widely available before committing to a particular college?

 

 

TTM

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Guest wanderer

DIAC do have a policy of people using the right visas and they get awfully suspicious if someone with a heap of work related stuff, ie. even support documents turned up on a tourist visa.

 

That said, people do also do their recce trips and so if you are using a tourist visa to have a look around, that's OK, it's the done tourist thing.

So once here, you extend your looking around because you think Australia would not be too bad a place to live, and there's nothing illegal in doing that.

 

Perhaps any documentation you may want to have access to could be obtained online [if you have scanned and attached it to an email to yourself].

And if something comes up and you get an employer sponsorship offer that you're eligible for along with the employer/position, then yes you can apply for a 457 visa in Australia and can also apply for a student visa here too.

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Guest Torrestheman
DIAC do have a policy of people using the right visas and they get awfully suspicious if someone with a heap of work related stuff, ie. even support documents turned up on a tourist visa.

 

That said, people do also do their recce trips and so if you are using a tourist visa to have a look around, that's OK, it's the done tourist thing.

So once here, you extend your looking around because you think Australia would not be too bad a place to live, and there's nothing illegal in doing that.

 

Perhaps any documentation you may want to have access to could be obtained online [if you have scanned and attached it to an email to yourself].

And if something comes up and you get an employer sponsorship offer that you're eligible for along with the employer/position, then yes you can apply for a 457 visa in Australia and can also apply for a student visa here too.

 

 

Hi again

 

Many thanks for response. Excuse my ignorance but can I just verify then:-

 

If I, my wife and my son all went out on tourist visas, once in Oz if I am fortunate enough to find an employer to sponsor me I can then transfer to a 457 visa which will also include my wife. My son on a tourist visa could use the time to vet various colleges, ST etc and decide which course he feels would be best for him and then he could enrol and transfer to a Student Visa.

 

How long are you allowed to stay on a tourist visa and when transferring from tourist visa to whatever can this all be done on line or would it be through an office in Perth?

If the tourist visa expires while in the process of waiting for the student visa are you still allowed to stay or should we make sure we have the student visa well boxed off before the tourist visa is due to expire?

 

Again, if I were not able to find employer sponsorship I could also go down the student visa route, is that correct?

 

Can we send any documents over in a parcel to our relatives who we would be living with in Perth so we dont actually have them with us when we travel?

 

Sorry to bombard you with so many questions but I spend hours and hours on this extremely useful site and get a bit saturated with it all and end up digressing!

 

Many thanks again.

 

TTM

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Alright torres

Cant help re your queeries,but PLEASE advise him to do something other than bricklaying!!

A lot of the big commercial buildings in the uk are just concrete,glass,marble panels,brick "veneer" now,McDonalds were one of the first to start it all,most of the McDonalds you see come overnight in 3 or 4 modules on the back of artics,they even have all the tiling ready done,mirrors the lot,then they just drop them onto a footing(which is brick),and the "brickwork" you see is tiles,theres more and more innovations like this coming in here:mad:,i know oz might not be the same?but im just saying that he should look to do a trade that has a good future in both countries(just in case).

Besides that its just too hard on your back,discs,and body in general,how many 55 to 60 year old brickies do you see still working??? ive just told my 15 y.o nephew the same btw.

Look for something else,honest!! good luck with your plans btw.:wink:


"The problem with neo conservative capitalism and it's insatiable greed for more wealth and disparity amongst the populace,is that it ended up being the catalyst for the great depression and modern recession"

 

Me,tonight:wubclub:

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Guest Torrestheman
Alright torres

Cant help re your queeries,but PLEASE advise him to do something other than bricklaying!!

A lot of the big commercial buildings in the uk are just concrete,glass,marble panels,brick "veneer" now,McDonalds were one of the first to start it all,most of the McDonalds you see come overnight in 3 or 4 modules on the back of artics,they even have all the tiling ready done,mirrors the lot,then they just drop them onto a footing(which is brick),and the "brickwork" you see is tiles,theres more and more innovations like this coming in here:mad:,i know oz might not be the same?but im just saying that he should look to do a trade that has a good future in both countries(just in case).

Besides that its just too hard on your back,discs,and body in general,how many 55 to 60 year old brickies do you see still working??? ive just told my 15 y.o nephew the same btw.

Look for something else,honest!! good luck with your plans btw.:wink:

 

Thanks for your reply and I am totally on board with what you sare saying which is why we would prefer to get over there and check it all out first and see which trade is the best to go for. He is leaning towards carpentry now, what are your thoughts on that? Any other suggestions?

 

Are you in Oz already?

 

Still had no-one come back to me on just how good, bad or ugly ST is - from posts it appears there are loads of people go on their courses so someone out there must have some kind of feedback. One guy on another expat forum had changed from bricklaying to roofing to plastering - not sure how that worked if the courses had already started how he will manage to complete the course he finally chooses within the 2 year time frame!!

 

Thanks again.

 

TTM

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Guest siamsusie

Torrestheman, I have a feeling Gollywobbler one of the Moderators, knows the gentleman running ST, I think Gill GW is out right now, but maybe when she is back she can enlighten you further. Very best wishes susie x

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Thanks for your reply and I am totally on board with what you sare saying which is why we would prefer to get over there and check it all out first and see which trade is the best to go for. He is leaning towards carpentry now, what are your thoughts on that? Any other suggestions?

 

Are you in Oz already?

 

Still had no-one come back to me on just how good, bad or ugly ST is - from posts it appears there are loads of people go on their courses so someone out there must have some kind of feedback. One guy on another expat forum had changed from bricklaying to roofing to plastering - not sure how that worked if the courses had already started how he will manage to complete the course he finally chooses within the 2 year time frame!!

 

Thanks again.

 

TTM

No probs,im a bricky myself,and earned a good living but it IS dying out with all these innovations.

Yes i would do joinery before bricklaying,maybe drylining,because a lot of internal walls(guts) here are plasterboard now instead of block,and i know an awfull lot of the newbuild houses in oz are steelframe and plasterboard.

No im not there yet,only been on a reccie for a month roughly to validate the visa,so not qualified to say how much work there is or isnt tbh,but i did check out the work situation while we were in adelaide and there "was" more work there than lpool/the north west in april/may when we went.

Another idea might be tiling? i spoke to a few tilers over there and they were all busy,which i suppose is down to the amount of tile they have in their houses compared to ours.

re the work situation in various states i will leave that to the people who are over there to advise.


"The problem with neo conservative capitalism and it's insatiable greed for more wealth and disparity amongst the populace,is that it ended up being the catalyst for the great depression and modern recession"

 

Me,tonight:wubclub:

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Theres a lot of brickies here in Perth , as well as you say you are lookin for sponsorship in landscaping , there are loads of landscapers most are subbies to land developers , a mate of mines a bricky but works for a landcape firm doin groundwork and blocks


Here at last:jiggy:

SUFC life not a pastime

I limit myself to 2 drinks a day, I`m now 10 years in front make that 15

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Guest Torrestheman
No probs,im a bricky myself,and earned a good living but it IS dying out with all these innovations.

Yes i would do joinery before bricklaying,maybe drylining,because a lot of internal walls(guts) here are plasterboard now instead of block,and i know an awfull lot of the newbuild houses in oz are steelframe and plasterboard.

No im not there yet,only been on a reccie for a month roughly to validate the visa,so not qualified to say how much work there is or isnt tbh,but i did check out the work situation while we were in adelaide and there "was" more work there than lpool/the north west in april/may when we went.

Another idea might be tiling? i spoke to a few tilers over there and they were all busy,which i suppose is down to the amount of tile they have in their houses compared to ours.

re the work situation in various states i will leave that to the people who are over there to advise.

 

Thanks again Pablo. Will take your advice, ST also do tiling and I know from our trip over earlier this year there is a lot of tiling in an Ozzy house!

We are not too far from you here in the UK, over on the Wirral, what a small world!

We want to settled in Perth to be with family.

 

Cheers

 

TTM

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Guest Torrestheman
Theres a lot of brickies here in Perth , as well as you say you are lookin for sponsorship in landscaping , there are loads of landscapers most are subbies to land developers , a mate of mines a bricky but works for a landcape firm doin groundwork and blocks

 

Hi there

 

Sorry I think I've confused you, my fault as I tend to waffle. I am not looking for sponsorship for landscaping that is my option if I go down the student visa route - so do you think there is plenty of work for landscapers once I've completed the course?

 

I have worked in catering management for many years and if I can manage to get sponsorship in that line of work once over in Oz then brilliant, if not then my plan B is to go down the student visa route. I am happy to re-train in whatever it takes, I quite fancy the challenge of something completely different even if I am an old git!!!

 

Thanks again.

 

TTM

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Thanks again Pablo. Will take your advice, ST also do tiling and I know from our trip over earlier this year there is a lot of tiling in an Ozzy house!

We are not too far from you here in the UK, over on the Wirral, what a small world!

We want to settled in Perth to be with family.

 

Cheers

 

TTM

Lol, i allways assume if its a scouser/merseysider that they are going to perth tbh el nino!and i guessed you were by your username,yeah all my mates are in perth,all brickies and all doing ok,but as i said,get him to do something else,even just for the "rain offs " alone,besides the other things ive mentioned,good luck in your venture anyway:wink:


"The problem with neo conservative capitalism and it's insatiable greed for more wealth and disparity amongst the populace,is that it ended up being the catalyst for the great depression and modern recession"

 

Me,tonight:wubclub:

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Guest wanderer

Ttm,

If I, my wife and my son all went out on tourist visas, once in Oz if I am fortunate enough to find an employer to sponsor me I can then transfer to a 457 visa which will also include my wife. My son on a tourist visa could use the time to vet various colleges, ST etc and decide which course he feels would be best for him and then he could enrol and transfer to a Student Visa.

 

How long are you allowed to stay on a tourist visa and when transferring from tourist visa to whatever can this all be done on line or would it be through an office in Perth?

If the tourist visa expires while in the process of waiting for the student visa are you still allowed to stay or should we make sure we have the student visa well boxed off before the tourist visa is due to expire?

 

Again, if I were not able to find employer sponsorship I could also go down the student visa route, is that correct?

 

Can we send any documents over in a parcel to our relatives who we would be living with in Perth so we dont actually have them with us when we travel?

 

Should have mentioned earlier too that at random there can be "no further stay" conditions put on tourist visas and if you get that on the eVisa, that'll can you getting on to either a 457 or student visa and to safeguard against that I've seen inference that you may be less likely it'd seem to have the nfs applied to an ETA - Electronic Travel Authority (ETA) - Online Applications

 

The eVisa is good for 3 months and likewise an ETA though valid for 12 months allows a stay of only 3 months at a time.

You can apply for a tourist visa separate to those of for 6 months or 12 months, the longer you apply for the more support funds you may be required to show.

 

If you have a student visa application in and do not leave it until the last few days of a tourist visa, you may get a bridging visa until the student visa is granted though student visas are usually granted to start a maximum of a month before a course starts, perhaps something an IA may comment on for you.

There is also a bit of work you need to do first in preparing for the student visa, making sure a course is available and getting a letter of offer which is one of the requirements - a lot of info @ Students - Visas & Immigration

 

Sending docyments to a relative in Perth is a possibility though it is not unknown for parcels to be checked on occasion and if a whole heap of working documentation was received with your name on it and someone was nosey, they could enter your name in the DIAC computer and it could create problems.

 

Tiling btw is still a trade on the CSL but hardy type work too, though not of the heavy lifting that brickies do but tough on knees and backs.

And how old a git are you for if the master plan is to move on to PR, there could be issues if you're getting on towards 45.

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Guest Torrestheman
The state ETI TAFE WA also do, similar prices .... courses pretty much the same...

 

Is your son permanent resident, or offshore?

 

Think I would wait till news on new occupation lists etc. etc.

 

 

Hi Andrew

 

Can you tell me which TAFE nearest to Perth would do either carpentry, joinery, plumbing/gas fitting courses. Son is based in UK. Also, what school qualifications would he require for entry to TAFE on these type of courses.

 

Many thanks.

 

TTM

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Guest craigmin

torrestheman, i am currently at silver trowel doing a bricklaying course. THere is quite a few people on the bricklaying course at various stages and the first lot of international students are just coming to the end of their courses so it will be interesting to see if they get PR or if DIAC changes the rules early in Dec regarding student visas.Silver Trowel is a professional set up and have good quality lecturers in bricklaying and there is also plenty work for brickies and brickies labourers at the moment.my advice to you would be to wait and see what DIAC do in Dec as rumoured and then decide what to do. If a student visa is your only option then its a way to get to australia but also a very expensive one. if you would like anymore advice or info on ST then feel free to PM me.

 

cheers

 

Craig

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Regarding carpentry, joinery, plumbing/gas fitting courses will need to go through documents ETI WA have sent, they have not updated their website yet....nor has CRICOS, but their International Manager told us last week they had been registered under CRICOS....

 

Will get back to you (need to speak to ETI WA), but off top of my head only Gordon TAFE Geelong Victoria has plumbing course.....

 

carpentry does not commence till Julky, I know that much :)


Andrew Smith, B. Bus., M. Ed. Web http://www.aiec.hu Blog http://aiecquest.wordpress.com

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ETI TAFE WA has Bricklaying plus Wall & Floor Tiling mid year, Swan TAFE Midland.

 

Carpentry is Silver Trowel, which is fine, have domestic track record of construction training as does ETI WA.

 

ETI WA are probably planning others for CRICOS....


Andrew Smith, B. Bus., M. Ed. Web http://www.aiec.hu Blog http://aiecquest.wordpress.com

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Guest Torrestheman
torrestheman, i am currently at silver trowel doing a bricklaying course. THere is quite a few people on the bricklaying course at various stages and the first lot of international students are just coming to the end of their courses so it will be interesting to see if they get PR or if DIAC changes the rules early in Dec regarding student visas.Silver Trowel is a professional set up and have good quality lecturers in bricklaying and there is also plenty work for brickies and brickies labourers at the moment.my advice to you would be to wait and see what DIAC do in Dec as rumoured and then decide what to do. If a student visa is your only option then its a way to get to australia but also a very expensive one. if you would like anymore advice or info on ST then feel free to PM me.

 

cheers

 

Craig

 

Hi Craig

 

This is a really interesting post as I have read so much negative stuff of ST lately. I understand the carpentry course is a new one to them - any idea how this one is going and whether there is likely to be a demand for carpenters at the end of the course? Also, if you are currently on the student visa, how do you find only working 20 hours a week. Where are you based? Also, did you have any prior experience when applying for the course and what school qualifications did it require?

 

Cheers

 

TTM

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Guest craigmin

alright TTM, ST do carpentry, plastering. wall & floor tiling and bricklaying which on its own is currently in a different place from the other courses so unfortunetly i dont know how the other courses are going or am able to speak to anyone doing these courses. You also have to find your own work towards your 900 hours work experience but they do say they will try to help if you are finding it difficult to get these hours. As for only working 20hours a week you really need some money behind you especially if you have school age kids as school fees are expensive along with everything else because when on a student visa you have to pay for absolutely everything & 20 hours a week aint enough to pay for it. No previous qualifications or school results matter mate its only aslong as you can look after your family for 2 years. Hope this helps a bit mate , any more Q`s just fire away mate and if i can help i will.

 

cheers

 

Craig

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Guest Torrestheman
alright TTM, ST do carpentry, plastering. wall & floor tiling and bricklaying which on its own is currently in a different place from the other courses so unfortunetly i dont know how the other courses are going or am able to speak to anyone doing these courses. You also have to find your own work towards your 900 hours work experience but they do say they will try to help if you are finding it difficult to get these hours. As for only working 20hours a week you really need some money behind you especially if you have school age kids as school fees are expensive along with everything else because when on a student visa you have to pay for absolutely everything & 20 hours a week aint enough to pay for it. No previous qualifications or school results matter mate its only aslong as you can look after your family for 2 years. Hope this helps a bit mate , any more Q`s just fire away mate and if i can help i will.

 

cheers

 

Craig

 

Thanks Craig. Are you in Perth or somewhere else? No kids of school age so no worries there. Have you managed to find 20 hours a week of work OK? Have you any idea if the TAFE colleges around Perth need any kind of school qualifications to get onto courses as opposed to ST who you say dont matter? I have been told no TAFE's in Perth have any trade courses for international students - do you know any different?

Thanks for all your help - much appreciated.

 

TTM

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Guest Torrestheman
ETI TAFE WA has Bricklaying plus Wall & Floor Tiling mid year, Swan TAFE Midland.

 

Carpentry is Silver Trowel, which is fine, have domestic track record of construction training as does ETI WA.

 

ETI WA are probably planning others for CRICOS....

 

 

Hi Andrew

Thanks for reply. An enquiry I made direct to TAFE in Perth has replied saying no trade courses are available to international students. Can you confirm or otherwise?

 

Cheers

 

TTM

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