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Guest janinecooksey

Repeat use of 12 months' visitor's visa

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Guest janinecooksey

How many times can you use a 12 months' visitor's visa whilst waiting for a standard aged parents residence visa to go through? Has anyone experience of multiple repeats of their visa?

 

Also, is it possible for the aged parent to invest in property (jointly with relatives who are Australian citizens) without actually being permanent residents?

 

(Reluctant to use funds for contributory visa application, as funds needed to invest in a property to live in.)

 

Thanks, Janet (Janine's Mum)

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Guest Gollywobbler

Hello Janet

 

Welcome to Poms in Oz.

 

If you apply for the onshore Aged Parent subclass 804 visa, you would not normally use tourist visas as well. Instead you would be in Oz on a Bridging Visa because you made an onshore application for an onshore visa:

 

Aged Parent (Residence) Visa (Subclass 804)

 

The Bridging Visa would allow you to remain in Oz until such time as your application for the Aged Parent visa has been decided.

 

http://www.immi.gov.au/allforms/pdf/1024i.pdf

 

Although Form 1024i says that you would not be entitled to Medicare whilst on the Bridging Visa I have asked both DIAC and Medicare about this. Both of them confirmed that where the Aged Parent applicant is from a country which has a reciprocal health care agreement with Oz then s/he will be entitled to the Visitor level of Medicare in the same way as if s/he were in Oz on a tourist visa instead:

 

Visitors to Australia - Medicare Australia

 

Where are you at the moment, please? Inside Oz or outside it? If you are in Oz, which visa do you have at the moment? If you currently have a subclass 676 visa, has Condition 8503 - No Further Stay - been imposed on it? If Condition 8503 has been imposed, is the visa valid for multiple entry to Oz or for single entry only?

 

Australian Immigration Fact Sheet 52b. Waiving Visa Condition 8503 - "No Further Stay"

 

What sometimes happens is that Parent is old enough to qualify for an Aged Parent or Contributory Aged Parent visa. Parent applies for a long stay tourist visa in order to travel to Oz. DIAC not infrequently impose Condition 8503 on the tourist visa in order to block the possibility of an onshore application for an APV or CAPV.

 

And, of course, are you old enough to qualify for an APV or a CAPV? You would need to be at least 64.5 years of age before you would become eligible for either of the onshore visas.

 

Your question about repeated long stay tourist visas is consistent with a plan to apply for an offshore Parent subclass 103 visa instead:

 

Parent (Migrant) Visa (Subclass 103)

 

If you apply for a PV103 (and bear in mind that you may be too young to be able to apply for one of the onshore visas) then the chances are that you would use repeated long stay tourist visas to enable you to spend as much time as you can in Oz whilst you wait for your Parent visa application to be processed:

 

Tourist Visa (Subclass 676)

 

If you are 70 or over and you are British, you would be required to get your own GP to complete a simple form of Medical Certificate every time you apply for a new tourist visa:

 

http://www.uk.embassy.gov.au/lhlh/files/0024A%5fMedical%5fCertificate%5fPro%5fForma%20%5f%20Over%2070%2epdf

 

DIAC prefer Parent and Contributory Parent visa applicants to use the paper & post method of applying for long-stay tourist visas. They process the application in London and usually return the passport - complete with paper visa - within a fortnight.

 

There are no hard & fast rules about how often a Parent or CPV applicant can apply for repeated tourist visas. DIAC tend to be more generous towards Parents than to any other group. However you have to play it by ear. One Case Officer might take a lenient view. The next one might take the view that if you want to move to Oz permanently and soon then you should consider switching into the Contributory Parent process instead, which a PV 103 applicant can do without having to pay the initial fee (currently about $1,420) again. Basically diplomacy is needed in order to avoid treading on DIAC's corns & bunions!.

 

There would be nothing to prevent you from buying a house in your own sole name. The rules about this have been considerably relaxed recently:

 

Go Matilda - Your Gateway to Australia - News

 

However I believe that a tourist counts as a "non-resident" so you would need to study the FIRB website carefully to see what the new rules actually are. I don't know whether a non-resident could "tag along with" a Citizen in order to bypass the FIRB altogether. You would need to ask the FIRB about this if the answer is not clear from the FIRB website.

 

I hear you on the idea of saving money by avoiding the CPV route if you can. Currently, processing of the offshore Parent 103 visa is taking about 8 to 9 years. The factors to bear in mind are as follows:

 

1. There are two lots of health & character checks with this visa. The first set are done prior to the application being approved in principle and placed in the Queue. The second set are required several years later as part of the final processing prior to granting the visa. If your health collapses during the wait, the Parent visa could eventually be refused.

 

2. You would be required to leave Oz for a while every time a tourist visa expires. Where would you go, what would it cost to get there and be there for a while, and how do you feel about some years of (probably) long-haul travel at least once a year? If you add the likely costs together, it could well be that your idea is not significantly cheaper than a CPV in the end in terms of capital outlay.

 

3. Whether you apply for the Contributory or non-contributory Parent visa, you will not become eligible for the Australian Age Pension until 10 years after you obtain PR in Oz.

 

Age Pension

 

Meanwhile you would not receive any State Pension increments or things like the winter heating allowance unless you are actually in the UK:

 

Go Matilda - Your Gateway to Australia - News

 

The British Government is determined not to budge on this one. So you are potentially looking at many years before the Aussie Age Pension could be claimed in order to top up your income if need be.

 

4. However the non-contributory Parent and Aged Parent visas do have one massive strength, which is that the Assurance of Support only lasts for two years and not 10. Therefore if you should get a Parent 103 or APV 804 visa and then you fall on hard times during Years 3 to 10 once you have PR (ie before you qualify for the Age Pension) you would be able to seek Special Benefit without any come-back on your Assurer(s.)

 

Assurance of Support

 

Special Benefit

 

5. Then again, my mother has a Contributory Parent 143 visa. It was granted a little over 2 years ago so she is now potentially eligible to apply for a Commonwealth Seniors Health Card:

 

Commonwealth Seniors Health Card

 

This is important to us because Mum is now 88. Although she does not have any serious medical problems, she does have a whole raft of routine ailments which are mainly due to her great age. $31.30 per drug every time she gets a prescription filled is naffing expensive because she needs about 15 different pills for different things every day. If she is able to get a CSH Card then her drugs bill will fall very substantially.

 

6. Another factor to bear in mind is that the level of Medicare cover provided to tourists and bridging visa holders is limited to "necessary" treatment only. Therefore if you are going to be in Oz for a long time without PR, you would need to consider whether to buy private medical insurance as well. If so, the costs should be factored into your planning, I would suggest.

 

Best wishes

 

Gill

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Guest janinecooksey

Hi Gill,

 

Thanks for the info so far.

 

My husband and myself are only 62 years young at the moment. According to DIAC I should be able to apply for the AP Visa from Jan 2010, Because I will be 64 then, but what would be the stipulation for my Husband? Could I be the main Applicant and he comes as a spouse or do we have to wait until he is 65 as well?

 

Is there a different waiting list for the Parent Visa and the Aged Parent Visa? Are there any benefits of using one over the other? Also do you get any of the Contribution back if we chose to use one of the Contributory visas?

 

We are only on holiday at the moment visiting our daughter and her family in Perth. We did live here for 6 years in the seventies, during which our daughter was born, but foolishly failed to naturalise at the time (in hind sight!!!). Does having a child born here take any priority over someone who has just emigrated and then taken up Citizenship?

 

We return to The UK in 3 weeks. We would realistically be looking at not returning to Australia for at least another year, but would like to make a start on the entry process now. Are we better to apply for the visas from Oz (bearing in mind that we must go back to the UK) or from the UK. And if we apply from OZ or the UK are we allowed to travel back and forth between them?

 

Lots of questions I know but we appreciate your knowledge and the time you take to answer them.

 

Janet and Janine and Janines Dad (Roy)

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Guest Gollywobbler

Hi Janet

 

You are asking very intelligent questions, so good for you.

 

My husband and myself are only 62 years young at the moment. According to DIAC I should be able to apply for the AP Visa from Jan 2010, Because I will be 64 then, but what would be the stipulation for my Husband? Could I be the main Applicant and he comes as a spouse or do we have to wait until he is 65 as well?

 

 

Only one of you needs to meet the qualifying age for the Aged Parent or Contributory Aged Parent visa. If you are older than Roy then you need to do battle with the wretched Age Table for women:

 

Aged Parent (Residence) Visa (Subclass 804)

 

I was wrong about the current Age requirement for a woman. I thought it was 64.5 if applying now but plainly not.

 

At the moment there is a loophole in the legislation. One of you could apply for a Contributory Parent subclass 143 visa, get that and then the remaining Parent could apply for a Spouse visa almost immediately afterwards. That would save you around $30,000. DIAC have said that closing the loophole is on their agenda but probably won't happen for a year or two because they would need to alter the legislation and this is not a priority issue right now.

 

The same idea probably works with the ordinary Parent visa at present but because they take so long to be processed I think the chances are that the loophole will close long before the plan could be brought to fruition. Also with the non-contributory visa the cost saving would be so small (or non existent) that it would not be worth the bother of the split visa strategy.

 

I also think that if trying to cut the costs of the visas to the absolute bone is essential, Parents should think hard about whether they can afford to live in Australia at all, to be honest. Australia is not as generous to the elderly as the UK is and even on the £124 per week which the British Government deems to be adequate for a Pensioner, the official UK Poverty Line is £217 per week per person at present. It is nice to know that the British Government thinks it is OK to force British Citizens to live below the Poverty Line in what we claim is a civilised country.

 

The idea of the Contributory Parent visa is that the second visa application charge - currently $32,725 per Parent - is a Contribution towards the Parent's likely future health care costs in Australia. The Government at the time (in 2001/2002) decided that it is reasonable to expect the family to pay 12.5% of this predicted likely cost and that the Aussie tax-payer should bear the other 87.5% of the bill. The Australian Government Actuary does the sums once a year in order to work out what the 2nd VAC should be set at:

 

Publications — Australian Government Actuary

 

According to the AGA's original Report in 2002, a non contributory Parent contributes only 0.5% of his her likely future health care costs in Oz.

 

In return for the larger Contribution towards his/her future health care costs, the Parent gets PR in Oz sooner rather than later is the idea behind the Contributory Parent scheme. Personally I consider it to be a reasonable idea. My mother has not lived in Oz all her life, therefore she has not been contributing to the Australian health care cost fund all her life either. Why should she stroll into someone else's country and expect that country's long-term contributors to health care to foot her medical/Aged Care bills for her without making any realistic contributions to those costs herself?

 

The main financial risk with a Parent is always going to be the potential need for residential care in an Aged Care Home because of the colossal cost of providing the Care. In the UK the deal is that if the family cannot afford the cost then the State will bear it instead but the State will claw the money back if possible by forcing the sale of the Parent's house after his/her death, with the net sale proceeds being used to reimburse the State. I do not know whether Oz deals with this cost issue in the same way and I don't know how to find out. The Department of Health & Ageing might know, otherwise I would ask Australia House in London to obtain the answer for me - from Canberra, presumably.

 

National Insurance contributions paid in the UK - towards the cost of the NHS - are not transferable to Australia. Gordon Brown's hands have super glue on them when it comes to sticking to a British tax-payer's money, as we all know!

 

Therefore I think that a prospective applicant for a Parent or Contributory Parent visa needs to consider what sort of deal s/he really wants to make with the Aussie Government. Although there are LOADS of flaws in the original parameters that the AGA was instructed to use back in 2002, the Rudd Goverment has made no attempt to alter the philosopy of how the Aussie Government views the Parent of a skilled migrant to Oz is what it comes down to since the majority of the relevant children are/were skilled migrants to start with.

 

Most of the staff on the coal face at DIAC have no idea that the Australian Government Actuary even exists, I strongly suspect, so I suspect that they do not present the Parent & Contributory Parent schemes fairly and accurately to those who enquire about the options. My approach is to explain the reasoning, produce the AGA's material and then leave it to the people concerned to decide what they want to do.

 

Yes there are separate "queues within queues" for each of the Parent & CP visas but the "mini-queues" reflect actual demand:

 

Parent Visa Processing Priorities - Family - Visas & Immigration

 

Australian Immigration Fact Sheet 31. Parents

 

DIAC Newsroom – Media_releases – Capping of Contributory Parent category visas

 

The fact that your daughter is presumably an Australian Citizen by birth does not seem to provide priority over a Citizen by conferral. Also you and Roy still have each other and are relatively young. The oldest Contributory Parent whom I know about was 97 when her CPV was granted in 2005, she was a widow and her only child had been living in Oz for 40 years - and paying tax in Oz for 40 years - by the time they all decided that Granny should join them in Oz. The youngest CPV Sponsor whom I know about is an Australian child who is currently only 7 years old. His Aussie mother is Sponsoring her ex-husband for a CPV on the little boy's behalf so that the child can continue to enjoy regular access to his father. That poor child gets no priority at all in terms of re-uniting him with his father, unfortunately. I know the Registered Migration Agent who fought Canberra tooth & nail about it because they can, will and do rush a Child visa through within about a fortnight. An oversight seems to me to be responsible for the idea that they cannot or will not do the same in reverse. The RMA tried everything but got nowhere with Canberra unfortunately. I think the range of factual possibilities is so great that they simply use blunt instruments and hope for the best, frankly.

 

Are we better to apply for the visas from Oz (bearing in mind that we must go back to the UK) or from the UK. And if we apply from OZ or the UK are we allowed to travel back and forth between them?

 

 

I think this question will answer itself to be honest. There is no way to prepare a Parent or CPV application in 3 weeks flat. The checklist is lengthy and it takes time to work your way through it, assemble the bundle of documents and then get them to the POPC:

 

http://www.immi.gov.au/migrants/_pdf/103-checklist.pdf

 

I think the important issue for you is not "when" but "which visa" because given your current ages, the onshore options are not possible. If you apply for an offshore non-contributory Parent 103 visa soon but change your mind about that later, you would be able to switch into the offshore Contributory Parent scheme without paying a further $1,420. However if you later want to switch to one of the onshore visas instead you would have to start the entire process again, in which case there is little point in spending $1,420 now, it seems to me.

 

Travelling back & forth between Oz and the UK also depends on which visa you apply for. If you wait until 2010 and make an onshore application for an onshore Aged Parent or Contributory Aged Parent visa, you would be talking about obtaining a Bridging Visa B if you then want to leave Oz for some reason. In that event you would be permitted to return to Oz after no more than 90 days outside Oz in each year. Go above the 90 days and the right to return to Oz would almost certainly be lost.

 

If you choose an offshore visa instead then you would need tourist visas to enable you to travel back and forth, realistically. The rules described in my earlier reply would apply. If you can afford it and want a fast solution with minimal travelling, a CPV application coupled with becoming a Student in Australia (on a Student visa) is sometimes used as a way round the travelling. I would not suggest a Student Visa except as a short term solution and if cost is an issue then I would say forget the idea of a Student Visa altogether.

 

There are loads and loads of factors to consider, unfortunately. My instinct in your case is that you should chew the cud with Alan Collett of Go Matilda. Alan is in Melbourne:

 

Go Matilda - Your Gateway to Australia - Contact and Feedback

 

The reason why I would suggest Alan particularly is because he is a Chartered Accountant in both jurisdictions as well as being a competent and highly reputable Registered Migration Agent.

 

You have asked about the possibility of joint ownership of a house in Oz. We have not had to consider this question with my mother because she is very old, is physically disabled and so lives with my sister. As far as I can gather it seems to be a Clever Tax Wheeze for the child to buy the house that the Parents will live in, and the Parents then pay rent to the child. My (vague) understanding is that this is a tax-efficient wheeze for the child according to Australian tax laws.

 

However you and Roy are domiciled and usually resident in the UK for tax-purposes. UK Inheritance Tax is no longer the big issue that it was when the thresholds were unrealistically low because of land values mainly. If you sell your house in the UK and transfer the money to your child in Oz, it may well be an exempt transfer in the UK but I do not know what happens when that money enters Oz, potentially as a Capital Gain in the hands of your Aussie daughter.

 

There does seem to be a way to make the whole thing work tax-efficiently and to make it do so cross-border but I avoid Tax questions like the plague because I haven't a clue how it all works. Alan Collett of Go Matilda is the only man I know who definitely does know how it all works and could advise you about it properly.

 

Best wishes

 

Gill

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Guest janinecooksey

Thanks Gill. You certainly have given us food for thought. We will chew things over, and most likely contact Alan as you suggest.

 

Particularly like your reference to the money saving loophole!

 

Will be in touch if we think of any other questions.

 

Regards,

 

Janet & Janine

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Guest Lyndhurst

Hi

 

we too are looking at the CPV for my parents. my dad is 60 in feb 09 and mum 60 in Jan the year after.

 

we have applied for our visas and are looking to move out Oct 2009. my parents will be comming out with us for 6 months and then back to the UKfor 6 months then again in Oct 2010 out to Oz.

 

at the end of this time it will have been 18 months we will then be lookng to submit the CPV when they return after the 2nd 6 months I.e. March 2011 from the uk as we feel this will have given us enough time to see if we all like it.

 

would the then beable to sel the house on the 2nd 6 month back i the UK and return to Oz and stay until CPV grant or would they be able to apply on shore?

 

i know the kids will miss the so much as will we and i know they want to be out with us asap.

 

dont know if it will make a difference but OH a carpenterand i am a midwife so on application we would put the need for help with child care.

 

thanks

 

cheryl xx

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Guest Gollywobbler

Hi Cheryl

 

Welcome to Poms in Oz.

 

Will your Parents be OK on the Balance of Family Test, which is crucial to Parent migration?

 

Contributory Parent (Migrant) Visa (Subclass 143)

 

The balance of family test requires that:

 

  • half your children must be permanently resident in Australia
    or
  • you have more children permanently resident in Australia than any other single country.

 

 

Assuming that this bit is OK, will you and your OH be Permanent Residents in Oz from Day One?

 

I'm just trying to check whether or not your plans are technically feasible.

 

The POPC (Perth Offshore Parents Centre) now deal with all applications for all Parent visas. They said recently that demand for the CPV is outstripping the available supply, so they expect that CPV processing will take two years from now on, simply owing to insufficient visas to go round.

 

The way they are alleviating the problem of this delay for British families is as follows:

 

1. Parents submit their CPV application.

2. Parents then apply for a long-stay tourist visa, requesting a stay of 12 months in Australia.

3. Currently, DIAC are not imposing Condition 8503 on the tourist visas.

4. Consequently when the first tourist visa expires, Parents will be able to make an onshore application for a new one, so as to hold the fort until such time as they must leave Oz for a few days to enable the CPV to be granted.

 

I would therefore suggest as follows:

 

Don't wait 18 months or more before submittting the CPV application. For the sake of a mere $1,420, which is the only up-front cost, I would submit the application as soon as you can fairly be said to have become "settled" in Oz:

 

Go Matilda - Your Gateway to Australia - News

 

In the worst case, you would decide that you do not want to live in Oz after all, so your parents would just ditch their CPV application and their $1,420 AUD. I would, personally, risk the $1,420 because of the slow processing times.

 

To answer your remaining questions:

 

What Parents do about their homes in the UK is of no concern to DIAC. What the family need to be aware of is that the meds for the CPV will not be requested until about 18 months after the CPV application has been submitted. If one of the Parents has become ill during the wait and therefore cannot meet the Health requirement for PR in Oz, both visas must be refused. What would your Parents do in that scenario?

 

Whether they can be in Oz at the time when they apply for their CPVs depends on whether or not DIAC impose Condition 8503 on the relevant tourist visas:

 

Australian Immigration Fact Sheet 52b. Waiving Visa Condition 8503 - "No Further Stay"

 

They are unlikely to impose it on your parents, partly because they only want to stay for six months and partly because they will be too young to apply for the onshore Aged Parent or Contributory Aged Parent visas in any case, but it only needs a careless CO and Condition 8503 cannot be undone, so its absence can never be guaranteed.

 

dont know if it will make a difference but OH a carpenterand i am a midwife so on application we would put the need for help with child care

 

 

Read the Sampson case:

 

Sampson, Lynne Jones [2004] MRTA 7298 (4 August 2004)

 

The daughter more or less told the Tribunal that she needed to get her Parents to Oz quickly so that they could act as unpaid skivvies for the daughter by the sounds of it! I'd have thought there is a more diplomatic way of making that point!

 

Best wishes

 

Gill

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Guest Lyndhurst

Hi Gill

 

thank you so much for taking the time to reply. your information has really helped.

 

yes my parents do pass the balance of family test (i am an only child)

and we will be going on a 175 pr visa and remain in Oz from entry.

 

i see where you are comming from with applying asap. i was looking at 18 month as i assumed this is when we would be classed as settled.

 

my mum had bowel cancer Nov 2007 this was operated on and removed therefore no remission as it was curable, would this be a problem for medicals do you know but i assume it will be at least 3 years from the operation when they are requested to do medicals.

 

my parents are very close to us and the children and are looking forward to comming to Oz with us and if they could get over sooner that would be brill. (like you say we could go on the route of childcare with 2 professions in demand im sure we could have a case even though we do not relay on them for childcare)

 

so from the information you have given me do you think this could work

 

Oct 2009 go to Oz with us

Aprl 2010 back to UK( parents only)

Sept 2010 apply for CPV(while in UK) after we have been in Oz 9 months

Oct 2010 back to Oz

April 2011 back to Uk to sell house.

asap back to Oz and ask for a 12 months visa.. if CPV not issued in that 12 months ask for another 12 months visa while on shore (i didnt know you could do this i thought you would have to leave Oz to get the new 12 months visa)

and when the visa is issued a nice relaxing holiday for a few weeks in NZ.(away from th grandkids hehe )

 

does this look like it may work.

 

thank you so much for all the information, its great that you will spend time helping others.

 

i hope you had a great xmas and wish you all the best for the new year.

 

cheryl xx

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Guest Gollywobbler

Hi Cheryl

 

Thanks for your response.

 

my mum had bowel cancer Nov 2007 this was operated on and removed therefore no remission as it was curable, would this be a problem for medicals do you know but i assume it will be at least 3 years from the operation when they are requested to do medicals.

 

 

There are no hard & fast rules. All that anyone can say for sure is that Mum will need to get copies of all the consultant-to-GP letters, reports etc and take those with her to whichever doctor does her visa meds. If there have been no further problems by the time of her meds then there would be no reason to think she would not be OK. (Visa meds can be done in Oz by the way. Health Services Australia do them and they have surgeries in all the main cities in Oz.)

 

my parents are very close to us and the children and are looking forward to comming to Oz with us and if they could get over sooner that would be brill. (like you say we could go on the route of childcare with 2 professions in demand im sure we could have a case even though we do not relay on them for childcare)

 

 

Not quite. The application must be sponsored by the child and the child must be a "settled.... Permanent Resident" at/by the time when the visa application is launched. The reason for this is because the Sponsor undertakes that if the Parents fall on hard times during their own first two years as PRs, the Sponsor will ensure that the Parents are supplied with adequate food, clothing, shelter and enough cash to get by on. In other words, the financial & practical support provided by the Sponsor will prevent any need for the Parents to have to seek financial help from Centrelink (social security) instead.

 

Plainly one cannot give a realistic Undertaking of this sort a week after arriving in Oz. It takes time to find a house to rent long term or to buy, open bank accounts, buy cars, get settled into the child's job, settle the child's own kids into their new schools and so forth.

 

So there is no "rule" saying, "8 months after my arrival in Oz, I'll be able to Sponsor Mum & Dad." Booklet 3 actually says that if the Sponsor has been living in Oz for 2 years or more before the Parent or CPV application is launched then DIAC will not quibble about whether or not the Sponsor's lifestyle is "settled."

 

If the application is to be made within two years of the Sponsor's arrival in Oz then it is up to the family to offer DIAC a shedload of additional information that the application forms do not require. All the sorts of evidence that was produced to the MRT in the two Appeals should be provided voluntarily, up front, with the visa application.

 

Plus I reckon it is prudent to include a covering letter from the Sponsor, saying politely, "I realise that Booklet 3 says "usually two years of residence in Oz." However I believe that my own lifestyle has become nice & settled well within that time. I am confident that I would be able to meet my Sponsorship Undertaking if I should have to. My children have been in school in Oz for the last 6 months - here's a report from their teacher saying how well they are doing. Here's a letter from my boss saying how well and how quickly I have settled into my job, what a good relationship I have with my colleagues and my patients. Here's the proof that Hubby & I each have our own cars so that we can get around easily. Here's the proof that we transferred all our capital to Oz when we moved - we have nothing in the UK to return to back there because we have committed ourselves to Australia instead, as you can see. Here's the proof that we bought our house jointly 3 months ago [whatever.] Our bank statements demonstrate that we can afford our lifestyle and could afford to support Mum & Dad as well if we needed to."

 

Providing all the evidence up front on Day One demonstrates that you have thought about the Sponsor's Undertaking, have a responsible attitude towards it and that you are indeed a "settled.... PR" as you claim to be.

 

DIAC have a rule which they have never broken with us (we have been dealing with them for years because Mum couldn't meet the BoF Test until 2004, so she spent 13 years travelling back & forth every year.) DIAC say that if you want to send them any additional information, they will consider what you say and provide. If you choose to tell them nothing beyond completing the forms, they will base their decisions on what the forms say and on nothing else. Explain how and why you think your ideas are feasible and they will listen. I've always found them to be brilliant about this.

 

Oct 2009 go to Oz with us

Aprl 2010 back to UK( parents only)

Sept 2010 apply for CPV(while in UK) after we have been in Oz 9 months

Oct 2010 back to Oz

April 2011 back to Uk to sell house.

asap back to Oz and ask for a 12 months visa.. if CPV not issued in that 12 months ask for another 12 months visa while on shore (i didnt know you could do this i thought you would have to leave Oz to get the new 12 months visa)

and when the visa is issued a nice relaxing holiday for a few weeks in NZ.(away from th grandkids hehe )

 

 

 

Yep. Loads of other families have followed roughly the same pattern with no problems at all.

 

5 to 7 days in NZ would be enough and 3 days might suffice. When the visa is granted, the CO sends a load of data to the DIAC office in Auckland if the Parents say that they want the CPVs to be evidenced in Auckland. (Evidencing the visa is putting the visa label into the person's passport for him/her.) It takes 48 hours for the data to get from Perth to Auckland because of the way the DIAC computer works. Sometimes the data-transfer goes wrong and in that event it has to be sent again, starting in Perth again. So they say to allow 5 working days just in case the staff have to defeat the computer in order to get the job done. A 7 or 10 night package deal is often cheaper than independently-arranged travel for a shorter period, though.

 

Happy New Year

 

Gill

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Guest Lyndhurst

Hi Gill

 

thankyou again for the detailed information you have provided. when it is time to apply for the CPV we will make sure we have all the information needed as you suggest.

 

my parents have taken early retirement to travel and spend time with the grandchildren so putting the visa in asap when we can be classed as settled would make sence.

 

can i just ask, if say we apply after we have been in Oz for 11 months and they look at the infomation when will this be done, as they get a case officer ie. 3-6 months or near to the end of the process, as this may give us some indication of when it may be rejected.

 

my only concen would be if the CPV is declined after say a year in the que would thay need to reapply and would they go to the back of the que again,

 

would this then have any effect on them getting a CPV in future if one had been declined.

 

thankyou Gill, i hope you dont mind all the questions

 

cheryl xx

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Guest Gollywobbler

Hi Cheryl

 

Please relax. Your instincts will tell you when you can safely launch the CPV application. Might be sooner than 11 months, might be longer but you will know in your own heart whether or not you are sure that you want to stay in Oz for the rest of your life. You would not encourage your Parents to rip their own lives apart until you are sure that it is the right move for the whole family. You have plenty of common sense, therefore it will not go wrong. Trust yourself, hon.

 

If there is something horrendously wrong with the application it would be spotted and dealt with quickly. DIAC are not out to trap people. Applications are either refused via the "early decision" process - which happens promptly - or they are refused at the time when a decision has to be made. However because you will be sensible about what you do in the first place, you will find that the POPC will bend over backwards to help you as well.

 

No - refusal of a visa does not prevent a new application. Not at all, so have no fear whatsoever about that. However it won't go wrong in the first place. Look at how thoroughly you are doing all the research. That is what prevents mistakes and will ensure that you do not make any mistakes yourself.

 

Cheers

 

Gill

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Guest Lyndhurst

thanks Gill again

 

like you say i just want to have all the information, mum and dad are excited to go with us for the first 6 months but i know they are dreading coming home, like wise my 5 year old son has declared he does not want to go as nana has to come home and he will miss her.

 

i will, im sure, speak to you more times on PIO and i will keep you informed although it will be some time yet, of when we put in our CP visas.

 

i am sorry as i know little of your situation other than your parents have got a CPV. are you waiting for a visa yourself.

 

i wish you well for the new year and hope it brings you everything you wish for.

 

cheryl xxx

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Guest geethani

Dear Gill,

 

It is so imporatant the points related to contributory visas.

I am the only child of my family. Migrated to australia in May 2008.

I have to wait till May 2010 (2 years) to sponser my parents as adivised me.

 

My parents (Sri lanka) are goiing to apply for 676 category and to arrive Australia in August 2009.

 

I contacted WA parent visa application processing centre, and they said that my parents can apply under contributory aged parent category eventhough they will be in " No further condition". But I asked them wether they can get bridging visa. They said "no". even I confused with this answer. They said parents has to go back to the their country and applly for tourist visa and come back once their visa validity period is finished.

 

I need to contact them again and confirm about the "bridging visa".

 

Each year 350 visa are allocated for contributory aged parent visa category. Do you have any idea of the waiting time period for "Contributory Aged Parent (Temporary)" category?

 

Thanks a lot.

 

Geethani

 

 

 

 

 

Hello Janet

 

Welcome to Poms in Oz.

 

If you apply for the onshore Aged Parent subclass 804 visa, you would not normally use tourist visas as well. Instead you would be in Oz on a Bridging Visa because you made an onshore application for an onshore visa:

 

Aged Parent (Residence) Visa (Subclass 804)

 

The Bridging Visa would allow you to remain in Oz until such time as your application for the Aged Parent visa has been decided.

 

http://www.immi.gov.au/allforms/pdf/1024i.pdf

 

Although Form 1024i says that you would not be entitled to Medicare whilst on the Bridging Visa I have asked both DIAC and Medicare about this. Both of them confirmed that where the Aged Parent applicant is from a country which has a reciprocal health care agreement with Oz then s/he will be entitled to the Visitor level of Medicare in the same way as if s/he were in Oz on a tourist visa instead:

 

Visitors to Australia - Medicare Australia

 

Where are you at the moment, please? Inside Oz or outside it? If you are in Oz, which visa do you have at the moment? If you currently have a subclass 676 visa, has Condition 8503 - No Further Stay - been imposed on it? If Condition 8503 has been imposed, is the visa valid for multiple entry to Oz or for single entry only?

 

Australian Immigration Fact Sheet 52b. Waiving Visa Condition 8503 - "No Further Stay"

 

What sometimes happens is that Parent is old enough to qualify for an Aged Parent or Contributory Aged Parent visa. Parent applies for a long stay tourist visa in order to travel to Oz. DIAC not infrequently impose Condition 8503 on the tourist visa in order to block the possibility of an onshore application for an APV or CAPV.

 

And, of course, are you old enough to qualify for an APV or a CAPV? You would need to be at least 64.5 years of age before you would become eligible for either of the onshore visas.

 

Your question about repeated long stay tourist visas is consistent with a plan to apply for an offshore Parent subclass 103 visa instead:

 

Parent (Migrant) Visa (Subclass 103)

 

If you apply for a PV103 (and bear in mind that you may be too young to be able to apply for one of the onshore visas) then the chances are that you would use repeated long stay tourist visas to enable you to spend as much time as you can in Oz whilst you wait for your Parent visa application to be processed:

 

Tourist Visa (Subclass 676)

 

If you are 70 or over and you are British, you would be required to get your own GP to complete a simple form of Medical Certificate every time you apply for a new tourist visa:

 

http://www.uk.embassy.gov.au/lhlh/files/0024A%5fMedical%5fCertificate%5fPro%5fForma%20%5f%20Over%2070%2epdf

 

DIAC prefer Parent and Contributory Parent visa applicants to use the paper & post method of applying for long-stay tourist visas. They process the application in London and usually return the passport - complete with paper visa - within a fortnight.

 

There are no hard & fast rules about how often a Parent or CPV applicant can apply for repeated tourist visas. DIAC tend to be more generous towards Parents than to any other group. However you have to play it by ear. One Case Officer might take a lenient view. The next one might take the view that if you want to move to Oz permanently and soon then you should consider switching into the Contributory Parent process instead, which a PV 103 applicant can do without having to pay the initial fee (currently about $1,420) again. Basically diplomacy is needed in order to avoid treading on DIAC's corns & bunions!.

 

There would be nothing to prevent you from buying a house in your own sole name. The rules about this have been considerably relaxed recently:

 

Go Matilda - Your Gateway to Australia - News

 

However I believe that a tourist counts as a "non-resident" so you would need to study the FIRB website carefully to see what the new rules actually are. I don't know whether a non-resident could "tag along with" a Citizen in order to bypass the FIRB altogether. You would need to ask the FIRB about this if the answer is not clear from the FIRB website.

 

I hear you on the idea of saving money by avoiding the CPV route if you can. Currently, processing of the offshore Parent 103 visa is taking about 8 to 9 years. The factors to bear in mind are as follows:

 

1. There are two lots of health & character checks with this visa. The first set are done prior to the application being approved in principle and placed in the Queue. The second set are required several years later as part of the final processing prior to granting the visa. If your health collapses during the wait, the Parent visa could eventually be refused.

 

2. You would be required to leave Oz for a while every time a tourist visa expires. Where would you go, what would it cost to get there and be there for a while, and how do you feel about some years of (probably) long-haul travel at least once a year? If you add the likely costs together, it could well be that your idea is not significantly cheaper than a CPV in the end in terms of capital outlay.

 

3. Whether you apply for the Contributory or non-contributory Parent visa, you will not become eligible for the Australian Age Pension until 10 years after you obtain PR in Oz.

 

Age Pension

 

Meanwhile you would not receive any State Pension increments or things like the winter heating allowance unless you are actually in the UK:

 

Go Matilda - Your Gateway to Australia - News

 

The British Government is determined not to budge on this one. So you are potentially looking at many years before the Aussie Age Pension could be claimed in order to top up your income if need be.

 

4. However the non-contributory Parent and Aged Parent visas do have one massive strength, which is that the Assurance of Support only lasts for two years and not 10. Therefore if you should get a Parent 103 or APV 804 visa and then you fall on hard times during Years 3 to 10 once you have PR (ie before you qualify for the Age Pension) you would be able to seek Special Benefit without any come-back on your Assurer(s.)

 

Assurance of Support

 

Special Benefit

 

5. Then again, my mother has a Contributory Parent 143 visa. It was granted a little over 2 years ago so she is now potentially eligible to apply for a Commonwealth Seniors Health Card:

 

Commonwealth Seniors Health Card

 

This is important to us because Mum is now 88. Although she does not have any serious medical problems, she does have a whole raft of routine ailments which are mainly due to her great age. $31.30 per drug every time she gets a prescription filled is naffing expensive because she needs about 15 different pills for different things every day. If she is able to get a CSH Card then her drugs bill will fall very substantially.

 

6. Another factor to bear in mind is that the level of Medicare cover provided to tourists and bridging visa holders is limited to "necessary" treatment only. Therefore if you are going to be in Oz for a long time without PR, you would need to consider whether to buy private medical insurance as well. If so, the costs should be factored into your planning, I would suggest.

 

Best wishes

 

Gill

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Guest AshinOz

Hi,

 

I am a permanent resident of Australia and want my parents to come and settle with me. They pass the Balance of Family test and satisfy the age criteria and are eligible to apply for the Aged Parent Visa. I have been reading the threads in this forum and have some questions.

 

My parents will be applying for short term visitors visa and then if they like Australia, they will apply for onshore Aged Parent Visa.

 

I understand there is a waiting time of may be 10 years or more till the time the visa in granted. And they are eligible to apply for bridging visa B which will allow them to stay out of Australia for a maximum of 90 days in a year.

 

My question is - what if my parents want to stay out of Australia for more than 3 months. I understand bridging visa B will no longer be valid in that case. Can they apply for tourist visa and then come to Australia and stay for the period the visa is granted and then go back. Is it possible to continue to do that till the time the visa is granted.

 

Contributory Aged Parent visa costs are a bit high so I am not currently thinking of that option.

 

Aged Parent visa process looks so complicated to me.

 

Thank you for your help

Ash

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