Flights, times and stopovers. Any advice?

[LKC 2,986]

We are hoping to make the move to Oz (Sydney) now at the end of December and we have been talking about flights. There are four of us, hubby, two children (aged 2 1/2 and 9 months when we fly) and myself. We will be forking out for a seat for our youngest.

 

When we went there at the end of August we took a 12.15pm (midday) direct flight with Qantas. We found the air crew to be more than helpful, and just had a very quick stop (I think it was about 2 hours) in Singapore which gave us time to change the girls, wear them out again running up and down the travelator things, and to get a (very strong!) coffee. Once we actually got to Oz, at about 7pm, we went to an airport hotel and went to bed at about 10.30, got up as normal at 6.30 and didn't really suffer any jet lag, except our youngest wanting her dinner at 3am, but that was easy to deal with by fobbing her off with milk for a couple of days.

 

However, we did find the flight a bit too long. The two legs in themselves weren't that bad, but the fact that we did the two together, whilst great to get there quickly, was way too much with the children. So, this time we are thinking of doing a stopover, but we wondered if anyone had any advice on the following:

 

1. Anyone who has done a stopover with a baby and a toddler, how did you find it worked? If you have done a direct flight aswell, did you think that that worked better, or was breaking the flight up an easier thing to do? How did the children react to having two flights with a stop in between?

 

2. Where is nice to stopover with small children? Although Qantas were good with us, we don't really mind who we fly with, so any recommendations re which airline and where to stop would be helpful.

 

3. In the places to stopover, what hotels etc are nice to stay in? As this is likely to be our last holiday (not counting going to the UK) for two or three years, we would like it to he a nice hotel that is family friendly with things to do nearby. Hopefully not too much to ask!

 

4. How long is the right length of time for a stopover? One, two, three nights or more?

 

5. For you, what was the best time of day to fly? We found that arriving at 7pm in Sydney was great becasue we could just go to bed, but leaving at midday from Heathrow was awful because the children were tired from getting up early to drive there, but not tired enough to go to sleep. They only cat napped the whole way and were awful! I was tearing my hair out by the time we got to Singapore and felt a bit like this --> :goofy:!

 

Thank you! I can't wait until we are in Oz and giving out advice rather than asking for it all of the time :biglaugh:!

[Guest The Hoys hoping.........]

Great questions LCK!

 

I cannot answer any of them for you........but I too would like the advice from the 'PIO experts' out there.

 

Thanks

 

Donna xx

[Guest guest17301]

Hi huns! Well we are going for a 12 hour stopover in Singapore, booked into the transit hotel for the 12 hours, costing about £120 for 2 interconnecting rooms. We fly at 9.15 am and land in Singapore about 12 hours later so the kids should want to sleep. Hoping they will then when we get the connecting flight to Perth (5 hours) they may well stay awake and we land in Perth at 01.40 local time so hopefully we will all crash when we get to the house and wake up refreshed with no jet lag! Yeah right..

[Guest curlysue]

Hi there,

 

I cannot answer your questions about stop overs as I have never done it!....however,

I have just returned back to Sydney after a 3 week visit to the UK and would fly Singapore airlines every time. ...especially if you can bet yourself on the A380 from Singapore to Sydney....that makes the journey far less painful!!!....and they are the cheapest and still being voted airline of the year!!

 

Kel.:yes:

[Quoll 6,357]

I'm a fly-right-through-and-get-it-over-and-done-with kind of girl. I have done stop overs (not with the kids except one slightly aborted attempt in Japan with JAL) in the past but it still comes down to the fact that you have 20+ hours of flying time and breaking it up just prolongs the agony. If you hadnt been to places like Singapore, Bangkok or wherever and your kids were older then maybe a week to see the sights would be good but I dont think I would be taking a 9 monther to places like that because they wont remember it anyway and unless you are a real take it in your stride type of traveller, it can be a worry with little kids.

 

Personally I always take the late evening flights - that way I can get utterly knackered at work during the day and then get on the flight after work. Most times I am asleep before wheels up (I always seem to miss that first meal) and usually wake up somewhere around lights on for breakfast. My kids are now adult but I flew with them many times when they were little - from 12 weeks onwards - and usually on my own as well:arghh: and the flights were longer in those days too. I always go Qantas because I have never yet had bad service and their Frequent Flyer program works well for me. They were great with the kids back in the day as well.

 

So a vote for straight through from me!

[Guest Dionne and Rickie]

Right what we intend to do is completly out of the norm, we are going the other way round to America thats right America, we are going to LA Disney land for 4 days we hav'nt looked into the cost yet it will all come out of our house money anyway so not worrying about that yet. We were soposed to be going to Florida in sept just gone but we councilled it because of Oz it made sence, so anyway going LA will be the next best thing and a great way to seperate the flights what do you all think oh we will be staying there for 4 days.

Dionne

xxxx

[LKC 2,986]

Thank you for the advice!

 

We looked at going via LA, but as the second leg is longer, discounted that. Had the girls been a bit older, Disneyland would have been good though!

 

We are still umming and ahhing between going straight through like last time, and staying over in Singapore. When we flew to Sydney last time, it was a total nightmare. We flew at 12.15pm and arrived at Sydney at 7pm, so by the time we got the suitcases, got the car and drove to the airport hotel, had baths and a room service dinner, it was 10.30 and we were all ready for bed and had a good nights sleep with no jet-lag. However, on the actual flight, the girls were awful. By the time we got to Singapore, I was ready to come back to the UK. They cried and tantrumed and didn't sleep, so you can imagine how awful we both felt! The second leg was awful too. However, on the way back they slept pretty much the whole way except for the meal times. The flight on the way back was at about 5pm, so the actual flight was fab, but the jet-lag went on for days and days! I don't suppose you can have it all!

 

In actual fact, it was a bit like labour - I remember it was painful at the time, but can't remember what the pain was like!

[Guest brooksey]

We always try to fly at 10pm ish as by the time you have eaten and had a drink you fall to sleep for 5 or 6 hours and it makes the journey seam a lot shorter. If you go to Singapore senatosa island has a nice beach and some hotels(linked by a bridge from mainland) but has a lot of work happening at the moment. And english is the national language so that makes things easier.

[Guest John Sydney]

I don't travel with Kids - but if you not frequent traveller - what I would do is Fly to Singapore break the trip here for 3 days (arrive day one leave day 3) I would catch the same flight out of Singapore to Arrive in Sydney at 7pm this breaks the trip into one 12 hour flight and one 6 -8 hours flight -depending on wind I would fly Singapore airlines and buy one of their stopover packages. the flight out of Singapore to Sydney leaves at 9 am in the morning and arrives at about 7pm but the best thing about this flight is it one of the last arrivals into Sydney so its quick thro customs and immigration morning arrival can be a real mess in Sydney

I use to fly Syd - instanbul - Syd every month and by the time I was on the last sector home Sing Syd I was wiped

Hoped this helps - for hotels in Singapore pick one downtown near Orchard rd

[Guest Kev, Kaz & Ellie]

My advice would definately book with Singapore airways on the A380 Airbus. There is more room and you will be more comfortable. I've always done the nightflights but must admit found landing in Sydney in the morning very difficult. You either have to force yourself to stay awake or only have a short nap before bed (which is really, really hard).

 

I'd be tempted to stay with the daytime flight times so you can arrive in Sydney and go straight to bed. As for a stop over that's the tricky question..... to stop over or not to stop over!!!

 

If you do go for Singapore, it's affordable, clean and easy to get around. However you will have to lump aload of baby related stuff with you that you can easily just buy when you land in Sydney. My husband and I are in the same situation and we have weighed up the pros and cons and decided not to stopover.

 

Try bribing the kids to be good by wrapping up a load of small, cheap presents from pound saver type stores and giving them one each hour or two. Otherwise (it may be controversial but) you could try a sedative or strong antihistame. You may want to try it out at home first. And above all remember that your childs screams and tantrums always sound louder to you than ayone else......

 

Good luck with whatever you decide.

[LKC 2,986]

We gave our toddler Medised on the way over to Sydney but, despite having given her it before for a cold with no ill effects, it made her hyper! It was awful, and I ended up holding her down because she was lashing out with her arms and legs. I was saying to hubby earlier though, that she hasn't had a tantrum since that flight. She started at pre-school when we got back from Oz, so maybe that has had a calming effect on her.

 

In a way I would rather get it over with (a bit like ripping a sticking plaster off, it hurts, but is over and dome with), but I know how it was last time. If I could drive there over a few weeks I would feel happier.

 

We were thinking of going on the A380 - hubby wants to see what it is like.

[Guest nareyclan]

We gave our toddler Medised on the way over to Sydney but, despite having given her it before for a cold with no ill effects, it made her hyper! It was awful, and I ended up holding her down because she was lashing out with her arms and legs. I was saying to hubby earlier though, that she hasn't had a tantrum since that flight. She started at pre-school when we got back from Oz, so maybe that has had a calming effect on her.

 

In a way I would rather get it over with (a bit like ripping a sticking plaster off, it hurts, but is over and dome with), but I know how it was last time. If I could drive there over a few weeks I would feel happier.

 

We were thinking of going on the A380 - hubby wants to see what it is like.

 

Great thread!

We are flying to Sydney in Jan. We are doing the all in one thing, not sure how it will be with a very active 3 year old!! The medised thing made me giggle as it has the same effect on ours, so we will give that a miss!! We have debated other drugs tho!

Hayley

[Guest Richard and carole]

I think you should stop over in singapore, even if the kids don't enjoy it much you will!! Takes that long haul out of it and gives you a break!! You get to see another city, which i must admit is beautiful, go to the butterfly sanctuary and unerwaterworld on Santosa island the children will love it, they fly all about so many species and so beautiful. Then if you can, go to the dancing fountains in the evening as this is so magical.

They have bus tours, or taxi very cheaply to and from the hotels if you fancy just being free to come and go as you please. I know this suited us when we flew over and our little one was 5, bit older than yours but such a nice place for families. Oh forgot to mention, if your not scared of heights, there is a cable car that goes across the river, that is brilliant, although a bit scary too!! If it's still there?

 

Great cheap shopping on the main rd too!! Just enjoy it while your coming this way. Carole

[samozsoon 27]

Right what we intend to do is completly out of the norm, we are going the other way round to America thats right America, we are going to LA Disney land for 4 days we hav'nt looked into the cost yet it will all come out of our house money anyway so not worrying about that yet. We were soposed to be going to Florida in sept just gone but we councilled it because of Oz it made sence, so anyway going LA will be the next best thing and a great way to seperate the flights what do you all think oh we will be staying there for 4 days.

Dionne

xxxx

 

 

Hi Dionne

We went via LA with Air NZ last Dec and stopped over in America for 4 weeks! It was great, we did a day in LA, saw Hollywood sign, 4 days in Disneyland and a day at San Diego Zoo to see the Panda Bears. We then went to Las Vegas for 3 days before flying to Michigan to spent Christmas with friends (and real snow).

 

The flights were longer than we were used to as we normally go with Emirates (3 x 7hr flights) and I think I prefer the shorter flights where we can get out for a walk about and use a proper loo! But visiting America was certainly worth it.

 

Going back to the UK for a hol in 2 weeks, this time going with Korean Air as they were the cheapest, two 10hr flights with a night in Korea on the way there. Hope they're ok!

 

Sam x

[Herbster 259]

Nice Try! You haven't heard my 2+yr old Great Nephew scream then!- it's deafening, blood curdling & horrible! Maybe checking your kids diets - no funny e#'s (160b esp) that kind of thing can adversely affect temperament... Apparently when my poor niece took him & his 5-yr old bro to Spain this summer he yelled all the way there & ALL the way back - When we went to her house for our Leaving Party, he screamed for an hour straight, & then another hr, for the shear hell of it! But at least she could take him round the front & annoy the neighbors on the other side of the street, she couldn't do that on the plane!

I really feel for anyone taking kids on such a long journey - I think M&D really have their work cut out ahead of time planning a min by min strategy to keep their kids engaged & happy, avoiding insurrection by the rest of the cabin!COLOR] Probably having a bag full of books, paper, crayons, finger puppets... tricks, treats & distractions will help - I always think wearing the kids out before hand helps - just don't get them over-tired!! Maybe some real-life Preparation could be in order:- sitting in the back seat of the car for a day - with the kids - OMG! I don't know about sedatives for the kids, I'm sure the parents will need some Major HELP... to preserve their sanity!

Just all the best, safe & quiet travels... It'll soon be a dim & distant memory...

 

[Herbster 259]

Hi Dionne

We went via LA with Air NZ last Dec and stopped over in America for 4 weeks! It was great, we did a day in LA, saw Hollywood sign, 4 days in Disneyland and a day at San Diego Zoo to see the Panda Bears. We then went to Las Vegas for 3 days before flying to Michigan to spent Christmas with friends (and real snow).

 

The flights were longer than we were used to as we normally go with Emirates (3 x 7hr flights) and I think I prefer the shorter flights where we can get out for a walk about and use a proper loo! But visiting America was certainly worth it.

 

Going back to the UK for a hol in 2 weeks, this time going with Korean Air as they were the cheapest, two 10hr flights with a night in Korea on the way there. Hope they're ok!

 

Sam x

Where abouts in MI, can I ask? It's such an under-rated state. Herbster Agrees:- he's from just over the border of the UP - where they have VERY REAL WEATHER, being from Herbster, on Lake Superior, Wisconsin - not so far from Ironwood, Michigan! But have you been there & seen the Big Lake - we love it, it's one of our fav places in all the World... (As it should be! - Herbster)

When we flew Emirates via Singapore, as the flight was a bit delayed, the stop-over was a 'mare, I barely had time for the real loo as the que was so long & the facilities minimal w/everyone washing everything in the 2 basins AHHHH! And don't take off large (50mm+) liquids as you won't be able to take them back on!!! As adults, we preferred the non-stop from Dubai to Melbourne, (however, beware the removal of the Foot Rests)! It is a KILLER - going straight to an hotel then would have been ideal - instead of loitering round the airport for 6-hrs before our Hobart flight... I've heard VERY good things about Korean Air, also that a stop-over there is very civilized!

All the best & Bon Voyage Travelers! X

[samozsoon 27]

Where abouts in MI, can I ask? It's such an under-rated state. Herbster Agrees:- he's from just over the border of the UP - where they have VERY REAL WEATHER, being from Herbster, on Lake Superior, Wisconsin - not so far from Ironwood, Michigan! But have you been there & seen the Big Lake - we love it, it's one of our fav places in all the World... (As it should be! - Herbster)

When we flew Emirates via Singapore, as the flight was a bit delayed, the stop-over was a 'mare, I barely had time for the real loo as the que was so long & the facilities minimal w/everyone washing everything in the 2 basins AHHHH! And don't take off large (50mm+) liquids as you won't be able to take them back on!!! As adults, we preferred the non-stop from Dubai to Melbourne, (however, beware the removal of the Foot Rests)! It is a KILLER - going straight to an hotel then would have been ideal - instead of loitering round the airport for 6-hrs before our Hobart flight... I've heard VERY good things about Korean Air, also that a stop-over there is very civilized!

All the best & Bon Voyage Travelers! X

 

 

 

We stayed with friends in Northville, nr Detroit (I think). Very nice area and they seem to have an ideal life, lots of snow and skiing in the winter and in the summer they have a caravan not far away and a great big boat in the garage. We didnt get to go to the lakes but I wish we had though. We did go to Niagara Falls though, something we had to do as we were so close. Would love to go back and I think had we gone there beforehand I could have been very tempted to try and move there instead of to Oz but our friends would love to move to Oz but are stuck in negative equity so cant afford to sell up now.

 

Hopefully Korean Air will be ok, have heard mixed reports, one even saying they dont have tv's in the back of the seats which I'm hoping is wrong otherwise kids, although not little, will drive me nuts!

 

 

Sorry to hear your flight with Emirates wasnt so good, ours have always been great, I can understand how you felt about hanging around Mel waiting for you onward flight though, when we landed in NZ from LA and had to wait for our flight to Sydney it was a pain, so close, although we only had a couple of hours.

 

Hope you're enjoying your new life in Tassie.

Sam x

[Herbster 259]

We stayed with friends in Northville, nr Detroit (I think). Very nice area and they seem to have an ideal life, lots of snow and skiing in the winter and in the summer they have a caravan not far away and a great big boat in the garage. We didnt get to go to the lakes but I wish we had though. We did go to Niagara Falls - Would love to go back and I think had we gone there beforehand I could have been very tempted to try and move there instead of to Oz but our friends would love to move to Oz but are stuck in negative equity so cant afford to sell up now....Hopefully Korean Air will be ok, - don't have tv's in the back of the seats which I'm hoping is wrong otherwise kids, although not little, will drive me nuts!...Sorry to hear your flight with Emirates wasn't so good,... Hope you're enjoying your new life in Tassie....Sam x

 

 

Hi Sam;

 

Thanks, Tas is a great Experience & we're moving to our own home in -3wks! Oh! the flight w/Emirates was fine - just late, & they are lousy at disseminating info - it was just that debacle in Singapore which put us off that route again - or at least to warn peeps of the Hassle-potential of a Singapore break - rather than sling! The loo/Que situation was ghastly & the 2nd time we flew they'd removed the foot rests which is tiresome on such a long journey...

 

Oh yes! No, Question, I'd be back in USA now, if the option was there, unfortunately the likelihood of an English passport holder getting PR is minimal at present (even thu' I was a pr 13+yrs!) but I'm ever optimistic, although my chances of return now are reducing by degrees... I often find it ironic how peeps say they would LOVE to live in OZ, but HATE the US (having never visited either!) & then come here & complain OZ doesn't have all mod cons, dble glazing, insulation, character, charm, whatever - & of course what they were really hoping to find, was (more than likely) Middle America... and believe me, Sam, there are many EVEN greater bits beyond the charms of Northville, as lovely as that looks! Detroit is not usually on peeps Most Likely to Move-To list, but see how impressed you were with that area, just outside the city? I think the wonderful thing with the States, is that it is so huge, it is so diverse, just crossing Michigan from Detroit to St Joe, or going northwards a bit to the lovely Traverse City/Petosky area, on Lake Michigan, etc., is another world of beauty, & as here, many folks do have holiday homes (NOT 2nd homes - there IS a difference!) & of course with the lakes, many thousand in MI, 11K in Wisconsin, the potential for water-based activity is huge! So, yes, many people have boats, jet skis, dingys, water skis, snow skis, X-country skis, toboggans, snow mobiles... :cry: Sorry - I was lost in the moment... cabins, a cabana in the woods w/private mooring, pontoon boats, bass boats, Jon boats, camper-vans, rv's, Florida Rooms w/a view of the lake.....! :cry:

 

I'm sure you'll be very happy in OZ - as you say, getting here is a bit of a challenge, especially w/a family in tow... Double check w/Korean about the entertainment, I'm sure someone else on here had raved about how fab they were... And it probably is, as someone else described it, a bit akin to childbirth... horrendous at the time, memories quickly usurped by the challenge of emerging into a new country & LIFE! I've heard Air NZ are very good... my 70's parents are trying to come out after Xmas - they've done the Singapore/Hawaii/NZ/USA/Hong Kong variations, so, I'm just wondering if there are any new reasonable options - as Mom can't be sitting around too long w/her bp problems...? They loved Hawaii & USA, but then where??!

 

All the best with your move, bon voyage & Happy Landings!

 

X

 

[Guest Silol]

We came to Oz a month ago, and wanted a stopover in Dubai where some rellies have moved to, but were told we could not have the double baggage allowance (40kg each instead of 20kg per person) if we had a stopover!!! We needed the extra space but were too squeezed financially to afford to pay for it. It may be worth asking about with whomever you fly as apparently Oz have an agreement with UK for the double baggage allowance if you're activating your PR visas for the first time (which may not apply in your situation depending if your reckie was on a visitors or your residency visas).

 

However we had 7 hrs in Singapore and as we and children were exahusted when we got there, we booked into the transit hotel for a sleep. (Glad we did as this helped lots). However, flying in, the city looked so beautiful, and if not for exhaustion, we could have hopped onto the free bus tour of the city, where some things like the famous Singapore zoo are complimentary when you're flying Singapore Airlines... very tempting. Singapore Airlines were fantastic and the children (aged 5 to 13) were very happy. So, if you do opt for Singapore stopover, I am sure you will love it. Just check the baggage allowance thing if this is of concern, especially flying with littlies who need more baggage than the big ones!!!

[samozsoon 27]

Hi Sam;

 

Thanks, Tas is a great Experience & we're moving to our own home in -3wks! Oh! the flight w/Emirates was fine - just late, & they are lousy at disseminating info - it was just that debacle in Singapore which put us off that route again - or at least to warn peeps of the Hassle-potential of a Singapore break - rather than sling! The loo/Que situation was ghastly & the 2nd time we flew they'd removed the foot rests which is tiresome on such a long journey...

 

Oh yes! No, Question, I'd be back in USA now, if the option was there, unfortunately the likelihood of an English passport holder getting PR is minimal at present (even thu' I was a pr 13+yrs!) but I'm ever optimistic, although my chances of return now are reducing by degrees... I often find it ironic how peeps say they would LOVE to live in OZ, but HATE the US (having never visited either!) & then come here & complain OZ doesn't have all mod cons, dble glazing, insulation, character, charm, whatever - & of course what they were really hoping to find, was (more than likely) Middle America... and believe me, Sam, there are many EVEN greater bits beyond the charms of Northville, as lovely as that looks! Detroit is not usually on peeps Most Likely to Move-To list, but see how impressed you were with that area, just outside the city? I think the wonderful thing with the States, is that it is so huge, it is so diverse, just crossing Michigan from Detroit to St Joe, or going northwards a bit to the lovely Traverse City/Petosky area, on Lake Michigan, etc., is another world of beauty, & as here, many folks do have holiday homes (NOT 2nd homes - there IS a difference!) & of course with the lakes, many thousand in MI, 11K in Wisconsin, the potential for water-based activity is huge! So, yes, many people have boats, jet skis, dingys, water skis, snow skis, X-country skis, toboggans, snow mobiles... :cry: Sorry - I was lost in the moment... cabins, a cabana in the woods w/private mooring, pontoon boats, bass boats, Jon boats, camper-vans, rv's, Florida Rooms w/a view of the lake.....! :cry:

 

I'm sure you'll be very happy in OZ - as you say, getting here is a bit of a challenge, especially w/a family in tow... Double check w/Korean about the entertainment, I'm sure someone else on here had raved about how fab they were... And it probably is, as someone else described it, a bit akin to childbirth... horrendous at the time, memories quickly usurped by the challenge of emerging into a new country & LIFE! I've heard Air NZ are very good... my 70's parents are trying to come out after Xmas - they've done the Singapore/Hawaii/NZ/USA/Hong Kong variations, so, I'm just wondering if there are any new reasonable options - as Mom can't be sitting around too long w/her bp problems...? They loved Hawaii & USA, but then where??!

 

All the best with your move, bon voyage & Happy Landings!

 

X

 

 

 

 

Hi Herbster,

Talking of late flights, it took us 9 hrs to get out of Detroit airport because of the snow!

I had allowed 5 hrs in LA to catch AirNZ flight which we missed then consequently missed flight from NZ to Syd. Eventually arriving in Syd to start our new life with just hand luggage as our bags were still somewhere in LA having failed to make the flight (or perhaps making the original flight but being off-loaded as we weren't aboard). Turned up 11 days later!

Cant say I'm looking forward to the flights again but its a means to an end I suppose.

 

Yes, Michigan certainly left us wanting to see more, more than LA or Las Vegas did. We'd never been to the US before and just never expected it to be so good really.

Would like to go in the summer next time, although seeing all the little kids stomping off to school in their snow suits and boots was great, how long must it take them to get out off them once they get there and putting them all back on again to come home I couldnt guess. Bless em!

Detroit was a strange place, the city centre I mean, we went there on a Sat afternoon between Christmas and New Year and it was like a ghost town. Where were all the January sales shoppers? We managed to see about 6 people and two of them were cops (with big guns!). Had a lovely lunch in the Mexican part of town though.

Would really like to go further south next time we visit (I'm sure there will be a next time) too.

 

Oh well, back to Korean Air, I'm going to ring them I think, although cant do much about it now, its booked and paid for so we'll be on it whether it has tv's in the seats or not.

We are going back to the UK for a hol 11 months after leaving, bit soon really but daughter (16) was going through a bad time some months ago and had saved her own fare and was determined to go back and, well, I couldnt let her go by herself could I? lol.

Hopefully the 'getting on the plane' to come back here wont be quite so traumatic for any of us as it was 12 months before hand.

 

Good Luck in your new home, we bought 4 months ago and its so much better than renting which we all hated.

 

Sam x

[Herbster 259]

Hi Sam:

 

Yes - never had my OWN home & I'm almost past my sell-by date! Had to come all the way to Tassie to afford one! So it's quite an Adventure!

Honestly folks:- don't under estimate Michigan, if you get asked back - as you say Summer's good, but Sept/Oct is better (cooler not many bugs, delightful - kids in school!)- the Fall Colors are usually MUCH better than New England & there aren't the crowds, just get away from Detroit! (Yes, it tends to be fairly quiet after Christmas peeps are spent out!Remember, they don't have Boxing Day - Thanksgiving in November tends to be a much bigger Holiday than Xmas,- no religious connotations! - & The Sales! happen Dec 26 & not for much longer!) Actually just following the lake shore north, all round MI, is a fabulous trip & for anyone with the time, going right up into the UP to Lake Superior is wonderful - if you like trees, P&Q & just to see the Big Lake (Superior) from, say, Porcupine Mt or Grand Marais, is worth it (well I think so!) I love Wisconsin EVEN more - so if you were coming into Chicago it's well worth a stop-over - one of my old friends was only saying this week that I would barely recognize parts of The City, so much rehab has continued since the 90's, I can't wait to get back...People never think of Chicago as a break in the journey, but it's an amazing city to visit & then hire a car for a week & go up North into Wisconsin (you might never want to get back on the plane!) & you'd have an amazing holiday... Then of course there are the 33 other States I've visited, I could tell you about too,... (Yea, never done LA - why? - & Las Vegas seems to be an acquired taste on the way to MANY Better Places!)

 

Fingers X'd for your return journey/s - Good on your daughter for saving all that DOSH - shows what they CAN do when they put their minds to it & true motivation is there!?? How soon before your departure? & to where are you all headed?

All the Best X

[Guest snoo]

However, on the actual flight, the girls were awful. By the time we got to Singapore, I was ready to come back to the UK. They cried and tantrumed and didn't sleep, so you can imagine how awful we both felt! The second leg was awful too.

 

In actual fact, it was a bit like labour - I remember it was painful at the time, but can't remember what the pain was like!

 

The first time we took our Daughter on hol she was about one-ish (now 15...but the memory is still RAW!! Haha!).....she was such a pain in the jacksy...particularly on the flight...that my Husband said he'd never take her on another hol until she was 16!! Ha!

 

I've got to say....we do keep our fingers crossed that we don't have children sat near us (especially on a long haul)...but we obviously do have some sympathy for their parents...well those parents who don't let them cause havock and at least TRY to keep control!! I'm sure we've all had the kid who sits behind holding onto our head-rest and plays 'lets shake this head-rest as hard as poss...back and forth...quicker and quicker..harder and harder....til our head explodes'

Right that's it....who wants to go instead of me??:yes:

 

Lisa,xxx

[Herbster 259]

The first time we took our Daughter on hol she was about one-ish (now 15...but the memory is still RAW!! Haha!).....she was such a pain in the jacksy...particularly on the flight...that my Husband said he'd never take her on another hol until she was 16!! Ha!

 

I've got to say....we do keep our fingers crossed that we don't have children sat near us (especially on a long haul)...but we obviously do have some sympathy for their parents...well those parents who don't let them cause havock and at least TRY to keep control!! I'm sure we've all had the kid who sits behind holding onto our head-rest and plays 'lets shake this head-rest as hard as poss...back and forth...quicker and quicker..harder and harder....til our head explodes'

Right that's it....who wants to go instead of me??:yes:

 

Lisa,xxx

And the one looking for who-knows-what in your hair after they've eaten the main course with their fingers - I like children - just not behind me!! Or the ones who, as soon as M&D try to sleep, ignore them, deal with their other kids, or talk to the flight attendants immediately begin to scream, shriek, kick the seat back or throw themselves in the aisle lashing out wildly... keep the kids off the E#'s, hi sugar treats - & pleasssse don't sit near us!!! Some parents do just let their kids run riot, & to be honest the grown-ups wouldn't be allowed to act that way, & just being a kid isn't a valid excuse it's a cop-out... I do appreciate parents trying their best & will offer help if I can, a stranger's intervention can often help distract a fractious child! But some parents really are oblivious to the misery their Little Darlings are causing a captive plane-load of innocent travellers... I can never understand why the Crew let them get away with it!

All the best to those flying soon...

[LKC 2,986]

Thank you for the useful and constructive advice. Perhaps it would do to remember that children are just that, children. At 2 1/2 and 6 months (as ours were when we flew to Sydney), they were not seasoned travellers. Our youngest was okay - she was breastfed so I spent pretty much the whole flight with my nipple in her mouth. That kept her lovely and quiet for everyone around us. However, at 2 1/2 our normally happy, polite and incredibly well behaved daughter had some tantrums. To be expected perhaps when she had been awake for more than 24 hours, and the adults sat around us kept her awake with their incessant coughing, talking and putting the overhead lights on and off. Oh, and on the way back there was the women who spent the whole flight hacking her guts up and gave us all flu (which I am still not completely recovered from seven weeks later) and the chap who seemed not to have any control of his bottom and farted his way back home - it isn't just children who are badly behaved.

[Herbster 259]

Thank you for the useful and constructive advice. Perhaps it would do to remember that children are just that, children. At 2 1/2 and 6 months (as ours were when we flew to Sydney), they were not seasoned travellers. Our youngest was okay - she was breastfed so I spent pretty much the whole flight with my nipple in her mouth. That kept her lovely and quiet for everyone around us. However, at 2 1/2 our normally happy, polite and incredibly well behaved daughter had some tantrums. To be expected perhaps when she had been awake for more than 24 hours, and the adults sat around us kept her awake with their incessant coughing, talking and putting the overhead lights on and off. Oh, and on the way back there was the women who spent the whole flight hacking her guts up and gave us all flu (which I am still not completely recovered from seven weeks later) and the chap who seemed not to have any control of his bottom and farted his way back home - it isn't just children who are badly behaved.

Thanks LKC: Bless! You poor things really sounds like you had the Flight from Hell. No one blames parents when their kids are like yours, we all understand - we all were kids once, had little bros & sisters, kids of our own - so our sympathies are completely with you. I think where ours & your patience ends is with peeps who are flat-out rude!

And, unfortunately, adults can be just as annoying as any whining 6-yr old! Which is why we took the Airbus the 2nd time round, so we could have a pair of seats together & not have a third seat occupied by a drugged-out zombie asleep next to us, trapping us in our seats for 8+ hours - desperate for the loo, desperate to move, desperate to stretch our leg, defrost my toes, prevent DVT, or at least get a drink of water - & then there was the woman in front of me, like a horse (& I like horses, but not old nags!) constantly adjusting her seat so it whacked me in the knees, nearly sent my hot meal flying over me & generally snorting & hacking the entire flight! I always say - look on the Bright Side - at least YOU don't have to go home with these people!

I suspect what this hi-lights more than whether kids are good, bad, polite, quiet, restless or out of control, is a decline in general, of overall respect for each other? That flu doing the rounds would be a dreadful thing to take on a plane, infecting most of the innocent passengers & crew thru' the ventilation system. Many airlines won't & shouldn't let you fly if you're not fit - whether due to inebriation or illness... I sometimes think when they are delivering the arm-waving safety messages @ the start of flights, they should add a postscript to be PLEASE respectful of your fellow traveling companions - whether you know them or not - we're all here for the duration, locked in this tin can & a little consideration & politeness would go a long way to making this a safe & pleasant flight for EVERYONE - How anyone can be cabin crew, beats me - & just where is the glamor part!???

ps - I certainly wasn't casting aspersions at your children, after all it's very stressful for you guys when your kids start acting out of character - over-tiredness & being stuck in that horrid little box is no ones idea of fun... well, it's not mine - for more than 3-hrs,. anyway! All the best