Bringing an Oldie to Aus ?

[OwenJohn]

I probably should have posted this in PIO Parents Visa thread, but took a chance to post it here.  I'm interested to know the best way to bring my Mama out to live here.  She's 88, and would love to move out here. She visited at Christmas 2018 and stayed for about 8 weeks. Loved it here.  So she retuned back to UK and  then Covid struck and of course we all know what that did to many peoples plans, hopes and dreams.   Do you think it's possible?  She's financially sound,  got very good health. Is there any age limit on when they wouldn't grant a visa?   Is 88 too old I wonder?  I'm interested to read any advice.  I hear and read stories of people being on a very long waiting period due to processing times, which I completely respect.   So that's kind of put me off bringing her here as I wouldn't want to build her hopes up only to have them dashed by a long wait.  (What I mean is, at 88 year old she don't even buy a green tomato if you see my point.  )   She's hoping to visit in July but of course that's just on a Visitor Visa just like last time.  Just for the record, she's a widow, no family except my oldest son still lives in UK but about 200 miles from her.  Any thoughts?   

[Tulip1]

3 hours ago, OwenJohn said:

I probably should have posted this in PIO Parents Visa thread, but took a chance to post it here.  I'm interested to know the best way to bring my Mama out to live here.  She's 88, and would love to move out here. She visited at Christmas 2018 and stayed for about 8 weeks. Loved it here.  So she retuned back to UK and  then Covid struck and of course we all know what that did to many peoples plans, hopes and dreams.   Do you think it's possible?  She's financially sound,  got very good health. Is there any age limit on when they wouldn't grant a visa?   Is 88 too old I wonder?  I'm interested to read any advice.  I hear and read stories of people being on a very long waiting period due to processing times, which I completely respect.   So that's kind of put me off bringing her here as I wouldn't want to build her hopes up only to have them dashed by a long wait.  (What I mean is, at 88 year old she don't even buy a green tomato if you see my point.  )   She's hoping to visit in July but of course that's just on a Visitor Visa just like last time.  Just for the record, she's a widow, no family except my oldest son still lives in UK but about 200 miles from her.  Any thoughts?   

So you’re her only child? Look at aged parent visa.  She’ll never get it though as the wait time is 30 years but she’ll get a bridging visa to stay in Australia while waiting.  She’ll have no access to any public funding though so she does need to be self funding for all her needs. 

[Marisawright]

What Tulip said.  There's no hope of her ever getting a permanent parent visa, because the waiting time is at least 12 years (if you're willing to pay tens of thousands of pounds for the expensive visa) or 30 years (if you go for the non-contributory).

One option is for her to come to Oz on a tourist visa, then apply for a parent visa while she's here.  She'll then be given a bridging visa, allowing her to stay until they consider her application -- even though that's going to be 30 years!   Amazing, but true. 

There are downsides:  she'll be in limbo, not a permanent resident of Australia, and therefore not entitled to benefits, pensioner concessions etc.  If she wants to buy property, she'll need special permission from FIRB and will pay a hefty surcharge on the purchase price.  If she wants to leave Australia, even for a holiday, she'll have to ask for permission (a BVB) and justify her reasons for the trip. 

If she's currently living in the UK, she'll be entitled to Medicare under the reciprocal agreement.  The rules of the reciprocal agreement say it covers essential care only, and if something can wait until she flies home to the UK, then it's not covered.  However, in practice it doesn't seem to work that way, and we've seen people having hip replacements and all sorts under the reciprocal scheme.  The risk would be that Medicare gets their act together while she's here, and starts applying the rules properly.  The NHS did the same a few years ago and are now strict about checking residency before they treat you, so it's quite possible Australia will follow suit at some point.  If they do, then you'll need to have deep pockets to pay for all her medical costs, which will only increase as she ages.  

The other option is a temporary parent visa, or go for the 600 visa which will let her visit for longer holidays but keep her own home in the UK.

[Quoll]

Have you thought about moving back to help care for her, should she need it? We did that.  Mine were 87 when we did it, mum had the beginnings of dementia and all of a sudden dad needed heart stents then had a stroke. They had the chance to live in Australia as they came every year for 6 months and had a good social network here but they really valued their independence and own connections, so they stayed in UK and it worked out well for them.  Had they decided that they would go into supported accommodation we would probably not have done it but, as it was, we took such good care of them we were there for 9 years during which time mum died and then dad decided off his own bat to go into a care home.  Being old in Australia is not a picnic - nor is it anywhere I suppose but even just medically, I would be hesitant about relying on reciprocal medicare.  Around here, elective surgeries are hard enough to get on Medicare if you are a long standing citizen so to run the risk of being a reciprocal would be very uncomfortable.  Remember that everyone loves a holiday, however actually resettling in a foreign country far away from your established social network can be challenging and you may find that you dont establish those casual social links that you maybe took for granted.  Some people get lucky, others get isolated - it's a coin toss.  If she is extremely wealthy then she probably wouldnt have much to lose.

[OwenJohn]

Marisawright you are a legend,  thank you so much for the time and effort to reply to me. Yea 30 years would make the Mother 118, so I think we'll swerve that option. 

But the other option you say sounds very encouraging indeed.  (for her to come to Oz on a tourist visa, then apply for a parent visa while she's here.  She'll then be given a bridging visa, allowing her to stay until they consider her application -- even though that's going to be 30 years!)    So this Bridging visa,  would that apply for the whole term she would be here?  She would be legally living here awaiting their decision through her bridging visa, even though it's a 30 year wait?   Wow, that's incredible. 

So if we took this route, am I right in thinking I would have to sponsor her?  I am not an Australian citizen, only a PR.   Do I need to have been settled here for 5 years or more?  I own my own house here and have savings and investment in Australia.  I understand your words on the downside of this option. Without going into detail here, the financial side of it thankfully and indeed luckily doesn't come into it, as none of this would be an issue.  I can guarantee no need for any benefits from the Australian state or burden and a full comprehensive Health cover policy in place. As I say we are in a very fortunate position, thanks be to God.  The only thing that would be nice, would be to have the opportunity to travel, say to New Zealand or Singapore for example so if a Bridging Visa that allowed that could be achieved it would be a bonus, though not essential. 

On the 600 Visitor Visa, I think that could be granted for 12 months, and she could stay for 12 months maximum per visit.  My concern would be what happens when that visa comes to an end. I don't fancy the option of sending her back to Blighty and reapplying if we can avoid that.  

Thank you once again for your great advice which is very much appreciated, you have given us a lot of food for thought this weekend.   

[OwenJohn]

8 hours ago, Quoll said:

Have you thought about moving back to help care for her, should she need it? We did that.  Mine were 87 when we did it, mum had the beginnings of dementia and all of a sudden dad needed heart stents then had a stroke. They had the chance to live in Australia as they came every year for 6 months and had a good social network here but they really valued their independence and own connections, so they stayed in UK and it worked out well for them.  Had they decided that they would go into supported accommodation we would probably not have done it but, as it was, we took such good care of them we were there for 9 years during which time mum died and then dad decided off his own bat to go into a care home.  Being old in Australia is not a picnic - nor is it anywhere I suppose but even just medically, I would be hesitant about relying on reciprocal medicare.  Around here, elective surgeries are hard enough to get on Medicare if you are a long standing citizen so to run the risk of being a reciprocal would be very uncomfortable.  Remember that everyone loves a holiday, however actually resettling in a foreign country far away from your established social network can be challenging and you may find that you dont establish those casual social links that you maybe took for granted.  Some people get lucky, others get isolated - it's a coin toss.  If she is extremely wealthy then she probably wouldnt have much to lose.

Thanks for the reply, you raise some good points.  To be honest, She is now very keen to come here as she has changed her attitude completely to past times.  In the past the word Australia was a swear word to her as she saw it as the place that broke her family up.  We actually went back in 2009 when my Dad became ill, and stayed there.  When he died, the Mother was totally anti Australia to the point of embarrassment.   (I'll never set foot in that wretched place!!)    But time heals and slowly things changed, absence makes the heart grow fonder as they say, I'd like to take the credit for that,  but I think it was more to do with Neighbours and Home and Away!! .  Back in UK, she has 4 friends, but no family close bye. These friends have their own life's and family so she's not close to them to the point of going on holidays with them or staying over at their houses or anything like that. Infact out of the 4, she's closer to just one, who is possibly moving about 25 miles away soon to be with her son.  There is no doubt that moving to Australia at such an advanced age would be a challenge.  However I have tried to sell it to her as an adventure to embrace and experience, and She also agrees with that.  I think now to be around family and children would be like a real uplift for her.  I visit her every year and stay with her, and I see how the Winter and the Dark nights really cause her limitations in her life, as she doesn't even want to go out to Church on certain days in Winter. There is no doubt that loneliness is a factor in her life now there in her life.   So I think it would be very stimulating mentally for her to come here.  She has no social network 

Luckily the cost side of things especially relating to health and treatment etc., is not a factor. She is very fortunate there. So hopefully your right,  she wouldn't have much to lose.  Thank you so much for your reply and best wishes.  .     

 

[Marisawright]

8 hours ago, OwenJohn said:

But the other option you say sounds very encouraging indeed.  (for her to come to Oz on a tourist visa, then apply for a parent visa while she's here.  She'll then be given a bridging visa, allowing her to stay until they consider her application -- even though that's going to be 30 years!)    So this Bridging visa,  would that apply for the whole term she would be here?  She would be legally living here awaiting their decision through her bridging visa, even though it's a 30 year wait?   Wow, that's incredible. 

Yes, it's true.  As an Australian taxpayer, I have to disapprove of its existence, because thousands are taking advantage of it and coming to Australia, to become a burden on Medicare and therefore on me!  However it's a blessing for people like yourself. 

I would double-check that you can get comprehensive health insurance cover at her age.  She won't be able to get the usual Australian health insurance as she's on a bridging visa.  She'll have to stay on Overseas Visitor cover (I don't mean travel insurance, there is a special Overseas Visitor cover that most health funds offer within Australia).  If you can't get insurance cover, then don't underestimate the cost of her medical care.  A hip replacement in Australia will easily cost $35,000. 

Yes, you would have to sponsor her. You don't need to be a citizen and you just need to have been resident for 2 years. 

[Marisawright]

8 hours ago, OwenJohn said:

  Back in UK, she has 4 friends, but no family close bye. These friends have their own life's and family so she's not close to them to the point of going on holidays with them or staying over at their houses or anything like that..... I think now to be around family and children would be like a real uplift for her. 

At your mum's age, she doesn't need friends to go on holidays with or stay over with.  She needs friends to have a cuppa with, go for a walk with, meet and chat with at church, and all those other little interactions that break up her days. 

You and the kids are a very poor substitute for friends, because you're all at work or at school most of the week.  How many workday evenings will you spend with her, once the novelty has worn off? Are you all going to give up your normal weekend activities to spend them with your mum?  

I know one woman, also in her 80s, who moved to be with her daughter after her husband died.   Unfortunately she's not very mobile, so her life now consists of sitting at home alone all week, waiting for the few happy hours when her daughter and family come to visit on Sunday.   Of course, she was stuck at home in her old home, too -- but she had all her treasured possessions around her, and her garden to potter in, the health visitor to chat with, and good public transport at her door, to get her to John Lewis or tea with her friend. 

Where do you live?  How is the public transport?  Will your mum be able to get out and about easily on her own?  Are there plenty of seniors/pensioners activities in your area?  If not, how is she going to make new friends?  All these are practical questions you need to think about.  

 

[OwenJohn]

13 hours ago, Marisawright said:

At your mum's age, she doesn't need friends to go on holidays with or stay over with.  She needs friends to have a cuppa with, go for a walk with, meet and chat with at church, and all those other little interactions that break up her days. 

You and the kids are a very poor substitute for friends, because you're all at work or at school most of the week.  How many workday evenings will you spend with her, once the novelty has worn off? Are you all going to give up your normal weekend activities to spend them with your mum?  

I know one woman, also in her 80s, who moved to be with her daughter after her husband died.   Unfortunately she's not very mobile, so her life now consists of sitting at home alone all week, waiting for the few happy hours when her daughter and family come to visit on Sunday.   Of course, she was stuck at home in her old home, too -- but she had all her treasured possessions around her, and her garden to potter in, the health visitor to chat with, and good public transport at her door, to get her to John Lewis or tea with her friend. 

Where do you live?  How is the public transport?  Will your mum be able to get out and about easily on her own?  Are there plenty of seniors/pensioners activities in your area?  If not, how is she going to make new friends?  All these are practical questions you need to think about.  

 

Yes indeed your right, all practical questions needing thought.   All people differ of course in attitude and needs and demands.  My Mother isn't a great mixer in terms of fellow seniors/pensioners, I wish she was, but that's not something she does.   Funnily enough one of the things she misses most is not having someone to go on holiday with now as the friend she used to do that with moved to the U.S 2 or 3  years ago to her join her daughter.   

What I can say is both my wife and I have given this an enormous amount of thought.  If I bring her to Australia, she will live in our home and luckily she will have her own privacy in an Annex we have added to the house, yet still be part of the home.   She asked for that by the way, when she visited previously.   In addition, when I sold my business in the UK, I was able to retire, so I am home now apart from the Charity work I am involved in.  My wife is a part time nurse, and her and my Mother get along great and this is a big advantage and she is well versed in elderly care.   No, we have no intention of leaving her alone in the evening or at weekends, absolutely not, that would be a terrible thing to do.   We want to give her maximum involvement as per her wishes, yet allow her, her own privacy and freedom to have time to herself.  In all seriousness, lets be realistic,   at 88 years old,  we want to cherish the time we have left with her and share the beauty of Australia with her whenever we can.  

I laughed at some of the points you mention, (laugh in a nice way I mean),  her garden back home,  quote "it's too bloody big and costs me a small fortune every year"   treasured possessions,  "It's all Junk Owen, I sold all the good stuff when your father died"  I have asked if she wants to bring things with her and apart from a couple of things like items of jewellry, she's only asking to bring her new bed with her!!     No health visitor, and no public transport used, but a nice taxi guy who helps her when she calls him.  And she's no fan of John Lewis either, she's more of a Tesco girl.  So I think Coles or Woolies will work out OK,  but a trip now and then to Meyer or David Jones will be fine.  There are 4 of us here who drive so we should be capable of organising a lift for her when she needs it.  Also the public transport near us is good but on her own, I wouldn't feel happy about her using it until she had been here a while and I had observed her mobility, as she had a fall on a bus once back home when the driver pulled off early before she had taken her seat.  But that's no big deal.    Another thing she always liked was swimming, she was a really good swimmer in her younger days,  but she doesn't even get to do that now back in Blighty.   So she would easily be able to swim again here, which is something she really enjoyed when she visited us. She's mentioned that with great enthusiasm. 

I thank you sincerely for raising these points because this is a serious matter and a big step for all, and it's good to get feedback and asked questions.   

 

[Quoll]

Lol, the one thing she doesn't need to bring is her bed! Beds are different sizes here so sheets are different sizes. 

[ramot]

5 hours ago, Quoll said:

Lol, the one thing she doesn't need to bring is her bed! Beds are different sizes here so sheets are different sizes. 

Easy to replace UK size on line