Malaysia Airlines

[Ken]

5 hours ago, Marisawright said:

Neither of those sound like sensible reasons to avoid an airline.    The Russians who shot down the plane weren't waiting specially for a Malaysian plane to fly over, were they?  They could just as easily have shot down a Qantas flight or any other plane flying that route.   

We still don't know if it was a suicide pilot.  As JetBlast says, that has happened on other airlines too.  The difference is that there was no mystery about those so they weren't featured in the press as much.  

In a way, both are one of those "lightning doesn't strike twice" scenarios, IMO.

The issue with the plane shot down by the Ukrainian rebels is that the Rebel government had announced to the world that they acquired a BUK missile system before the incident and had told airlines to stay clear. Many airlines were avoiding that airspace as a result. Malaysian did not - probably because that would have used a little more fuel (could possibly be because they listened to the Ukrainian government's denial that the rebels had any BUK missiles though). I'm happier with airlines that take the cautious approach.

As to the missing plane - perhaps any airline would have had the same problem, but it seems wrong to me that an airline doesn't know where its aircraft are at all times when even your average trucking company knows the exact location of all its trucks (and the drivers can't just switch it off).

It's a long time since I last flew with Malaysian (23 years ago to be precise) which is far too long ago to judge what they are like now (and in any case they were a muchness with any other airline back then) but I'd hesitate to fly with them today. I might put them ahead of the Chinese airlines - my concern there being if they had a safety issue, they'd keep it as a state secret so the Chinese regulator saying they're safe becomes meaningless.

Edited January 16, 2023 by Ken

[Jon the Hat]

56 minutes ago, Ken said:

The issue with the plane shot down by the Ukrainian rebels is that the Rebel government had announced to the world that they acquired a BUK missile system before the incident and had told airlines to stay clear. Many airlines were avoiding that airspace as a result. Malaysian did not - probably because that would have used a little more fuel (could possibly be because they listened to the Ukrainian government's denial that the rebels had any BUK missiles though). I'm happier with airlines that take the cautious approach.

As to the missing plane - perhaps any airline would have had the same problem, but it seems wrong to me that an airline doesn't know where its aircraft are at all times when even your average trucking company knows the exact location of all its trucks (and the drivers can't just switch it off).

It's a long time since I last flew with Malaysian (23 years ago to be precise) which is far too long ago to judge what they are like now (and in any case they were a muchness with any other airline back then) but I'd hesitate to fly with them today. I might put them ahead of the Chinese airlines - my concern there being if they had a safety issue, they'd keep it as a state secret so the Chinese regulator saying they're safe becomes meaningless.

I agree if it was between Malaysian or China Southern / Eastern I would probably pick Malaysian.  I still have a great photo of me holding a cocktail shaker behind the bar on a Malaysian A380 about 12 years ago.

[JetBlast]

PSA: It's Malaysia Airlines not Malaysian

[InnerVoice]

On 12/01/2023 at 20:50, benj1980 said:

They are the cheapest around. Is it time to get over the missing and shot down planes in terms of travel? I guess I'm interested in people's experiences as well!

Surely only you can answer this question by asking yourself, what level of risk am I comfortable with? I've flown domestically in India, Nepal and Indonesia in the past, whereas some of my friends would only ever fly Qantas and partners. My parents would never fly anywhere.

I've flown with Malaysia a few times and I've always they were 'okay' (nothing special). More recently I've chosen AirAsia, Malindo, and Scoot when travelling to and from Asia, as there's no beating them on price - although clearly you get what you pay for.

[Marisawright]

On 16/01/2023 at 14:40, Ken said:

The issue with the plane shot down by the Ukrainian rebels is that the Rebel government had announced to the world that they acquired a BUK missile system before the incident and had told airlines to stay clear. Many airlines were avoiding that airspace as a result. Malaysian did not..... I'm happier with airlines that take the cautious approach.

When you say "many airlines", which ones do you mean exactly?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/10974823/Air-operators-belatedly-avoid-Ukraine-war-zone.html

https://www.spiegel.de/panorama/malaysia-airlines-mh17-lufthansa-ueberflog-ost-ukraine-56-mal-a-981813.html

American airlines weren't advised to avoid that airspace until AFTER Malaysia Flight 17 was shot down. 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-ukraine-crisis-airplane-warnings-idUSKBN0FM2BV20140717

There were warnings before that, but they didn't include the area where M17 was shot down, where the low-level airspace was closed but there were no restrictions at high level.

In a nutshell, if you're going to avoid Malaysia airlines because of M17, then you need to avoid Lufthansa, Singapore, Thai and most US airlines because they were all flying similar routes so it could just as easily have been one of them.  There may be more, those are just the names I found in reports. 

Edited January 18, 2023 by Marisawright

[Loopylu]

On 12/01/2023 at 20:50, benj1980 said:

They are the cheapest around. Is it time to get over the missing and shot down planes in terms of travel? I guess I'm interested in people's experiences as well!

We flew with this airline a year after the two incidents and it was fine.  The crew and food were lovely.  The only perturbing feature was the Islamic prayer before take off for a safe flight....

[benj1980]

I do remember Singapore who I have flown with previously being on the same flight path. I think I was quite surprised at the time. Why? In hindsight I have no idea! 

[Marisawright]

2 hours ago, benj1980 said:

I do remember Singapore who I have flown with previously being on the same flight path. I think I was quite surprised at the time. Why? In hindsight I have no idea! 

I saw one report which said about 37 other flights were using that flight path at the time. So it really was just bad luck.   

[Ken]

6 hours ago, Marisawright said:

When you say "many airlines", which ones do you mean exactly?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/10974823/Air-operators-belatedly-avoid-Ukraine-war-zone.html

https://www.spiegel.de/panorama/malaysia-airlines-mh17-lufthansa-ueberflog-ost-ukraine-56-mal-a-981813.html

American airlines weren't advised to avoid that airspace until AFTER Malaysia Flight 17 was shot down. 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-ukraine-crisis-airplane-warnings-idUSKBN0FM2BV20140717

There were warnings before that, but they didn't include the area where M17 was shot down, where the low-level airspace was closed but there were no restrictions at high level.

In a nutshell, if you're going to avoid Malaysia airlines because of M17, then you need to avoid Lufthansa, Singapore, Thai and most US airlines because they were all flying similar routes so it could just as easily have been one of them.  There may be more, those are just the names I found in reports. 

British Airways, Qantas, Cathay Pacific, Korean Airlines, Air Berlin, Asiana Airlines and Tawan's China Airlines had all been detouring to avoid the east Ukraine route before the incident. There may have been other airlines that were doing so but that's from a very quick google search.

[CaptainR]

If its a safety concern; if you are rational person with a scientific mind then consider that the statistical risk of an incident remains very low regardless of the airline. To decide between large airlines like Qantas, Emirates, Malaysia etc based on safety concerns would be an emotional decision rather than a rational one. 

Service wise, Malaysian is fine. Honestly, if you are flying economy, airlines are much of a muchness. 

Edited January 18, 2023 by CaptainR

[Blue Flu]

1 hour ago, CaptainR said:

If its a safety concern; if you are rational person with a scientific mind then consider that the statistical risk of an incident remains very low regardless of the airline. To decide between large airlines like Qantas, Emirates, Malaysia etc based on safety concerns would be an emotional decision rather than a rational one. 

Service wise, Malaysian is fine. Honestly, if you are flying economy, airlines are much of a muchness. 

Exactly this. The few stand out desperado's ,few  folk will ever travel on. I think I am correct in saying Garuda had a reputation among the flag carriers as being under par on safety levels. No idea if redeemed themselves or not. At the end of the day, simply a metal tube attempting to remain in the sky, usually quite successfully, pumping out recycled oxygen of dubious quality , presenting the same sort of preheated meals , where cattle class is virtually non differing .regardless of insignia on the tail and wings of plane.  

[Blue Flu]

16 hours ago, Marisawright said:

I saw one report which said about 37 other flights were using that flight path at the time. So it really was just bad luck.   

Nothing but bad luck. Malaysian Airlines was not targeted. It could have been any airline .

[Blue Flu]

19 hours ago, benj1980 said:

I do remember Singapore who I have flown with previously being on the same flight path. I think I was quite surprised at the time. Why? In hindsight I have no idea! 

Because that was the flight path airlines took based on procedure at that time. But gosh. Thought your attention would have been all consumed by flying with Singapore girl. (A great way to fly.) Probably too young to recall that jingle. 

[Blue Flu]

20 hours ago, Loopylu said:

We flew with this airline a year after the two incidents and it was fine.  The crew and food were lovely.  The only perturbing feature was the Islamic prayer before take off for a safe flight....

Surely welcome having the airline ask for divine intervention in keeping the metal tube in the sky?  Preferable than issuing parachutes, I'd have thought? Royal Brunei does the same thing. I find it rather endearing and comforting. 

[DrDougster]

On 16/01/2023 at 09:44, benj1980 said:

Well that's where my head is that. It seems unreasonable to condemn an airline on that basis, however there's still that lingering worry! I have read great reviews recently concerning service and quality of the flights, adding to the people I have spoken to who have flown recently with them.

As we are looking for a few days stopover I'll have a look at KL. We are considering Dubai and Singapore as well...

I think if you're going through KL you can actually get a free flight up to Penang Island with your long haul flight. Given the choice, I'd go there for a few days rather than KL - it's a beautiful place.

[Toots]

2 hours ago, DrDougster said:

I think if you're going through KL you can actually get a free flight up to Penang Island with your long haul flight. Given the choice, I'd go there for a few days rather than KL - it's a beautiful place.

I really liked Penang and especially Georgetown.  Far more interesting than KL.

[Tychen]

I used to fly with them between Aus and UK occasionally but stopped (this was even before the missing/downed planes) because: (1) after sale customer service was atrocious;  and (2) I had my phone stolen in KL airport in transit. 

[emanyalpsid]

22 hours ago, Tychen said:

I used to fly with them between Aus and UK occasionally but stopped (this was even before the missing/downed planes) because: (1) after sale customer service was atrocious;  and (2) I had my phone stolen in KL airport in transit. 

I flew with them after the plane incidents. Think i got sub 800 quid return tickets around xmas times

[benj1980]

Prices have skyrocketed for all airlines at the moment so we are waiting to see if things settle down. Nothing discounted yet. Still great to read these posts and so many aren't linked to the major incidents!

[Phil1712]

Has anyone recently flown with Malaysia airlines and taken those Sports Direct holdalls for their luggage?

[rammygirl]

6 hours ago, Phil1712 said:

Has anyone recently flown with Malaysia airlines and taken those Sports Direct holdalls for their luggage?

If you are worried about damage then it is usually the baggage handling at the airport not the airline to blame. Loose straps are a problem as they can get ripped off. I wouldn’t put anything breakable in. We used light holdalls in addition to hard luggage when migrating but just put clothes in them. 

[rtritudr]

On 16/01/2023 at 11:40, Ken said:

The issue with the plane shot down by the Ukrainian rebels is that the Rebel government had announced to the world that they acquired a BUK missile system before the incident and had told airlines to stay clear. Many airlines were avoiding that airspace as a result. Malaysian did not - probably because that would have used a little more fuel (could possibly be because they listened to the Ukrainian government's denial that the rebels had any BUK missiles though). I'm happier with airlines that take the cautious approach.

I'm pretty sure that Singapore Airlines was still using that airspace up until the shoot-down.  In fact there was a Singapore Airlines plane in the vicinity of the shoot-down at the time.  Would you avoid flying SIA as well?

[Ken]

On 14/03/2023 at 18:42, rtritudr said:

I'm pretty sure that Singapore Airlines was still using that airspace up until the shoot-down.  In fact there was a Singapore Airlines plane in the vicinity of the shoot-down at the time.  Would you avoid flying SIA as well?

The last time I flew Singapore was in 2012, so yes, I must have avoided them.

[JetBlast]

On 14/03/2023 at 09:58, rammygirl said:

 baggage handling at the airport not the airline to blame.

Baggage handlers are usually employed / contracted by the airline. Very few staff actually work directly for the Airport.

[benj1980]

Thanks all, I've ended up with a combination of Emirates and Singapore with a stopover in Singapore. Malaysia became more expensive and it took away the decision really!