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Australian and UK Covid Responses

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1 hour ago, Robert Dyson said:

ahem...you said you were "not aware of any city in the world with populations of that size which has managed to contain Delta", so i was just pointing out you are wrong by forgetting the world's biggest population.  

Now you're saying not to compare with China, you don't believe anything they say, and they "welded apartment doors shut", which is highly dubious and probably localised.  I certainly know of nobody who was locked in an apartment with welded doors, standard practice before the existence of testing was one visit outside each day with temperature test on re-entry.   

Even if i accept this absurd simplistic characterisation of a country with 1.4 billion people, do you think what the Chinese did was worse than sending thousands of infected old people away from hospital to spread the disease and kill to the tune of 20,000 in the first wave, and more in subsequent waves even after they knew what they'd done the first time?  Which is actually worse in your eyes? 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It was all over social media and a quick search

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/02/06/warning-chinese-authoritarianism-is-hazardous-your-health/

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/mar/08/china-ill-not-only-coronavirus-communist-party-control
 

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2020/05/how-not-to-handle-a-pandemic/

 

you do seem to have a blinkered view in regard to China's handling of the pandemic. 

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On 12/10/2021 at 14:56, DIG85 said:

I don't know the % of COVID cases who go to hospital in Queensland is, and given there's so few cases in that case, it's probably a weak sample. But in NSW, Victoria etc. I would have thought that no more than 10% of COVID cases end up in hospital.

It has never been the policy in Victoria/NSW to send positive cases to hospital unless meically required.  On the other hand, Queensland/SA have done exactly that from the very beginning (even Tom Hanks was admitted).  Of course if their case numbers ever explode like Victoria/NSW I would expect them to change the policy as they simply won't be able to cope.

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10 hours ago, DIG85 said:

Comparisons with China, a country that welded apartment doors shut to contain COVID, are absurd. And do you actually believe anything that comes out of that country? Do you actually believe the statistics which suggest that China has done relatively well? Do you seriously think its response would have been acceptable in the west?

I still can't believe people are holding up the Chinese model of fighting COVID.

It's not just China though, democratic Taiwan has also managed to keep Zero-Covid despite Delta.  And then there is Hong Kong and Macau, despite being part of China they have not been able to weld any doors shut, yet.

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14 minutes ago, rtritudr said:

It has never been the policy in Victoria/NSW to send positive cases to hospital unless meically required.  On the other hand, Queensland/SA have done exactly that from the very beginning (even Tom Hanks was admitted).  Of course if their case numbers ever explode like Victoria/NSW I would expect them to change the policy as they simply won't be able to cope.

It isn't, and never has been, the policy of Queensland or SA to send every COVID positive patient to hospital.

In any case, it would be a silly policy. There is no reason to send a person with mild symptoms to hospital where they risk spreading it to staff and non-COVID patients who may be very ill with other illnesses.

Edited by DIG85

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1 hour ago, DIG85 said:

Do you have any confidence in the mortality rates that come out of China? Given that they got us into this mess, that they lied to the WHO at the start of the pandemic and have been lying to the world pretty much ever since.

I think you are extremely naive if you trust any info that comes out of China.

Do you trust the US CDC?

https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/travel/notices/covid-1/novel-coronavirus-china

 

COVID-19 in China

Level 1: Low Level of COVID-19 in China

 

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1 hour ago, DIG85 said:

And can you please cite evidence that Nanjing did actually contain Delta back in August. Not "evidence" from the Chinese authorities; proper, independent, third party evidence please.

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-08-23/china-crushed-covid-again-with-containment-on-steroids

China Hits Zero Covid Cases With a Month of Draconian Curbs

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2 minutes ago, rtritudr said:

That's a Bloomberg article. I'm sure a Daily Tel or Guardian article would say the same. But on what authority is it based? Who's providing the information?

Edited by DIG85
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32 minutes ago, DIG85 said:

That's a Bloomberg article. I'm sure a Daily Tel or Guardian article would say the same. But on what authority is it based? Who's providing the information?

810 A Real Way with Words ideas in 2021 | words, bones funny, figure it out

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5 hours ago, Parley said:

I did my own a few weeks ago in front of the mirror. I have clippers so all i can do is basically give myself a number 2 all over.

But hard to see the back so don't know how patchy it is back there. Out of sight out of mind. Eyebrows are easy enough just use a razor.

You need a hand mirror to examine the back. Once, in Qld I missed a large tuft on the back  I use my beard trimmer without the beard grader attachment.

Razor for eyebrows? I don't want to shave them off! Decades ago I stabbed my nose trying to trim hair with scissors and my Dad bought me an electric nose trimmer. I may still have it.

Mostly I'm wearing a beanie to keep my head warm so nobody can see my cut or lack of it.

Where are you? Melbourne? Geelong? How are you coping with the lockdown? Do you "Stand with Dan" or are you relishing his appearance on this investigation?

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5 hours ago, Parley said:

Elections are forward looking things, a contest between the incumbent's ideas for the future and the opposition's ideas for the future. Bill Shorten learned this hard lesson at his last election.

Any election in mid to late 2022 or beyond probably won't have much to do with covid at all. Why would a 1 in 100 year event that has just happened and been navigated be an issue for the next 3 year electoral cycle?

Like a tennis match, you don't have to be the best player in the country, all you have to do is beat your opponent on the day you play him.

In some quarters, ie Sky, they say Qld and WA want to keep their borders closed till the next election so the Libs can't campaign there. 

I don't know if Covid-19 will no longer be a  issue. I don't even believe it's gone away yet.

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1 hour ago, MARYROSE02 said:

. Once, in Qld I missed a large tuft on the back  I use my beard trimmer without the beard grader attachment.

Well, if you're going to use a beard trimmer to cut hair...

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Scot by birth, emigrated 1985 | Aussie husband applied UK spouse visa Jan 2015, granted March 2015, moved to UK May 2015 | Returned to Oz June 2016

"The stranger who comes home does not make himself at home but makes home itself strange." -- Rainer Maria Rilke

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2 hours ago, MARYROSE02 said:

Razor for eyebrows? I don't want to shave them off!

Obviously you don't shave them totally off. But if you run it over the top lightly you can thin them out a bit.

Needs a light touch but not too hard.


Buy a man eat fish. The Day, Teach Man, to lifetime.      - Joe Biden.

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3 hours ago, MARYROSE02 said:

Razor for eyebrows? I don't want to shave them off! Decades ago I stabbed my nose trying to trim hair with scissors and my Dad bought me an electric nose trimmer. I may still have it.

Not a razor.   You can use a hair clipper with a big comb.

 


Scot by birth, emigrated 1985 | Aussie husband applied UK spouse visa Jan 2015, granted March 2015, moved to UK May 2015 | Returned to Oz June 2016

"The stranger who comes home does not make himself at home but makes home itself strange." -- Rainer Maria Rilke

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RIP AstraZeneca.

AZ will no longer be produced in Australia. The production facilities will close as the public is now demanding the superior Pfizer and Moderna vaccines.

The AstraZeneca vaccine will no longer be produced in Australia by Christmas, according to biotech firm CSL, which says the UK jab could not survive the “disproportionate” amount of hesitancy and criticism levelled at it throughout the national rollout.

“Obviously we don’t want to manufacture something that’s not going to be utilised, and we will have a number of options moving into the future,” said University of Queensland’s Paul Griffin, who sits on AstraZeneca’s advisory board.

Edited by Parley
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Buy a man eat fish. The Day, Teach Man, to lifetime.      - Joe Biden.

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5 hours ago, Parley said:

RIP AstraZeneca.

AZ will no longer be produced in Australia. The production facilities will close as the public is now demanding the superior Pfizer and Moderna vaccines.

The AstraZeneca vaccine will no longer be produced in Australia by Christmas, according to biotech firm CSL, which says the UK jab could not survive the “disproportionate” amount of hesitancy and criticism levelled at it throughout the national rollout.

“Obviously we don’t want to manufacture something that’s not going to be utilised, and we will have a number of options moving into the future,” said University of Queensland’s Paul Griffin, who sits on AstraZeneca’s advisory board.

What would be great for Australia would be for it to develop its own vaccine. Maybe we could send some people over to assist.

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6 hours ago, Parley said:

RIP AstraZeneca.

AZ will no longer be produced in Australia. The production facilities will close as the public is now demanding the superior Pfizer and Moderna vaccines.

The AstraZeneca vaccine will no longer be produced in Australia by Christmas, according to biotech firm CSL, which says the UK jab could not survive the “disproportionate” amount of hesitancy and criticism levelled at it throughout the national rollout.

“Obviously we don’t want to manufacture something that’s not going to be utilised, and we will have a number of options moving into the future,” said University of Queensland’s Paul Griffin, who sits on AstraZeneca’s advisory board.

Bad news for competition, Moderna and Pfizer are going to clean up.  Pfizer are already putting the price up  11.5 Euro per jab in the EU contract, £22 per jab in their latest UK contract.

AZ...about $2.50 per jab over here and $20 for Pfizer?

 

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18 minutes ago, Robert Dyson said:

Bad news for competition, Moderna and Pfizer are going to clean up.  Pfizer are already putting the price up  11.5 Euro per jab in the EU contract, £22 per jab in their latest UK contract.

AZ...about $2.50 per jab over here and $20 for Pfizer?

 

Why such a difference in costs? 

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4 minutes ago, Rallyman said:

Why such a difference in costs? 

AZ worked as a non-profit, a remarkable gesture for a pharmaceutical.  They would have charged more eventually.....but i doubt they will ever take this route again after the way they've been used as a political tool.   This means no more research and development into improving protections for variants and mutations.

Whether or not the efficacy is as good as Pfizer or Moderna,  AZ offers nearly 100% protection against serious covid and hospitalisation.  Compare that to an annual flu jab where sometimes we get 40% protection and see that as successful, it's a blow to the overall vaccine market.

 

 

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https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/oct/13/canberra-set-to-become-the-most-covid-vaccinated-city-in-the-world

Quote

Canberra set to become the most Covid vaccinated city in the world

“We expect to be at around 99% of the eligible population fully vaccinated by the end of November. It’s a testament to ACT residents and their willingness to protect themselves, their family and their community.”

Overseas city-states, such as Monaco are tipping 70% fully vaccinated, and Singapore is approaching 80%. London has just passed 70%, despite the head start it received in its vaccination program, compared with Australia.

But Canberrans, or “Ken Behrens” as they dubbed themselves, after a media transcription mistake was adopted as a unifying mascot of the latest lockdown, embraced the need for vaccination with almost no fuss – with no more incentive than a lollipop.

“What has been hugely beneficial to the ACT is the efficient vaccination rollout,” Barr said.

“Our mass vaccination hubs have provided the majority of Canberrans with a very easy and simply way to get the vaccine. The nurses and staff at our vaccination centres are running the most efficient vaccination programs in the country, with close to 100% utilisation rates.”

Primary health networks – GPs – and pharmacies also formed part of the response, as they did across Australia. The ACT government also worked on its own in-reach vaccination programs for vulnerable and disadvantaged populations, which Barr said helped “bridged the gap for many residents who would have faced challenges accessing the vaccine without extra support, and has contributed to our very high vaccination levels”.

 

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13 hours ago, DIG85 said:

You can draw any conclusion you want from the evidence.

I'd still like to understand the logical contortions that allow the MPs to argue that the UK government should have challenged its scientific advisers when the latter did not push for lockdown in March 2020; but then criticise the government for failing to follow its scientific advisers when the latter argued for lockdown in September 2020. Until that logical contortion is explained, I will regard the report as highly dubious.

 

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1 hour ago, Rallyman said:

Why such a difference in costs? 

Because AZ decided to work on a non-profit basis given Covid was a crisis for humanity.  

If I were a conspiracy theorist, I'd wonder if the other companies made sure the whole blood clot thing was blown up out of proportion, just to get rid of the cheap competition....

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Scot by birth, emigrated 1985 | Aussie husband applied UK spouse visa Jan 2015, granted March 2015, moved to UK May 2015 | Returned to Oz June 2016

"The stranger who comes home does not make himself at home but makes home itself strange." -- Rainer Maria Rilke

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Yes, the UK was of course the only country to suffer terribly during COVID. 

Still waiting for an explanation of the logical contortion in the report which I have highlighted above.

Edited by DIG85

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