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Cots

Are we mad... lol

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We’ve  got until August on our RRV and we’ve just this weekend decided it’s now or never. I never wanted to leave but long story, we did. It’s always been there on my mind to go back but didn’t want to break my parents hearts again however we have to live for ourselves. Kids (3) are very keen remembering the times when we lived there. This time round we’re older, I’ll be 46, OH will be 42 and chances of us affording a mortgage are slim since house prices have increased so much and this time around I don’t want to have to worry that we can’t. Renting is a pain but I know it can be expensive with all the maintenance, insurance etc so maybe we just accept that we can’t own again. Is that the worst? Are we mad! The timeframe is killing me due the deadline of August with Covid limiting flights and therefore cost! 

 


176 Visa lodged Oct 09, CO request meds Jan 11. Meds arrived in Oz 14 Feb 11, status changed to processing further 16 Feb 11, PCC sent 23 Feb, VISA GRANTED 25 FEB 11.

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Go for it!   As they say better to regret things you have done than things you haven't! 

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PR (100) Planning to move to Perth September 2021

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That's a tough one.  I definitely agree with what @Jon the Hat says about it being better to try than regret not trying.  But I am the same age as you, was raised to be financially conservative and have spent a lot of year worrying about money.   In the situation you describe, do you have a plan for retirement?  I know that in many countries it's the norm to rent rather than buy and to keep renting when retired.  But with Australia being so expensive, I'd imagine rent can take up a lot of your retirement income.

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British  | Lived in Australia 2001-02 on 457   | Married Aussie wife & moved back to UK | Plan to return to Sydney 2026 when all kids have finished school

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If your RRV runs out in August and you really want to be in Aus, i would be making steps to move now. Getting a flight can be the trickiest bit and quite a lot of people seem to have had their flights cancelled on them - numerous times. Those most successful appear to have booked business class.

 Good luck with everything , which State are you heading too?

  Cal x

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If you don't go after what you want, you'll never have it. If you don't ask, the answer is always no. If you don't step forward, you're always in the same place...

If you get a chance,take it, If it changes your life,let it. Nobody said it would be easy they just said it would be worth it...

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We spent 2 years on the Gold Coast so would be returning there. We live in the Channel Island’s, a very small (minded)  place with limited opportunities and extremely high house prices. husband rrv runs out mid-August and the rest of the family is end September. We’ve got an estate agent coming Wednesday to value the house and ultimately it all falls on the house sale. 
 

I’ve checked flight and could book for June, July and August but need to see where we go with the house first. Perhaps by then the policy may be different for quarantine if we are considered a Green zone.

 

 

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176 Visa lodged Oct 09, CO request meds Jan 11. Meds arrived in Oz 14 Feb 11, status changed to processing further 16 Feb 11, PCC sent 23 Feb, VISA GRANTED 25 FEB 11.

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11 minutes ago, Cots said:

We spent 2 years on the Gold Coast so would be returning there. We live in the Channel Island’s, a very small (minded)  place with limited opportunities and extremely high house prices. husband rrv runs out mid-August and the rest of the family is end September. We’ve got an estate agent coming Wednesday to value the house and ultimately it all falls on the house sale. 

I hope you have taken some time to think back on your time on the Gold Coast and write down everything you liked and disliked about it.  Also write down why you left.  Don't just think about it, write it all down - that's very important, especially if one of you is keen to go and the other isn't so sure.  You need to be absolutely positive you're not wearing rose-coloured glasses to please the other party, so you need to confront the reasons why it didn't work the first time.

If, after that exercise, you still feel it's the right thing, you can go for it with more confidence.

Consider, though, there are many places on the British mainland you could move to, at a mere fraction of the cost.  At your ages, that would be less disruptive to your pensions and the children's education too.  And you'd still be within reach of your folks.  

Edited by Marisawright
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Scot by birth, emigrated 1985 | Aussie husband applied UK spouse visa Jan 2015, granted March 2015, moved to UK May 2015 | Returned to Oz June 2016

"The stranger who comes home does not make himself at home but makes home itself strange." -- Rainer Maria Rilke

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19 hours ago, Cots said:
We’ve  got until August on our RRV and we’ve just this weekend decided it’s now or never. I never wanted to leave but long story, we did. It’s always been there on my mind to go back but didn’t want to break my parents hearts again however we have to live for ourselves. Kids (3) are very keen remembering the times when we lived there. This time round we’re older, I’ll be 46, OH will be 42 and chances of us affording a mortgage are slim since house prices have increased so much and this time around I don’t want to have to worry that we can’t. Renting is a pain but I know it can be expensive with all the maintenance, insurance etc so maybe we just accept that we can’t own again. Is that the worst? Are we mad! The timeframe is killing me due the deadline of August with Covid limiting flights and therefore cost! 

 

We sold all three houses when we divorced back in 2012 and both ex-wife and I have rented ever since. We are both perfectly happy living in other people's houses, we both move regularly when the mood takes us, me because I change towns/cities and her because she just likes trying new parts of Perth! Being free to roam or putting down roots is a very personal thing.

On top of that, none of my three adult offspring have bought a house because they simply refuse to live miles from the action (new housing estates seem to be the only option for first time buyers) and they would rather spend their money enjoying themselves than locking it all away in a house deposit.

It's not all doom and gloom being a renter!

 

Edited by Graham Fletcher

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33 minutes ago, Graham Fletcher said:

It's not all doom and gloom being a renter!

 

Maybe. But i could think of nothing worse than renting in retirement. I think a paid off home you live in in retirement is very important

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I want it all, and I want it now.

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46 minutes ago, Graham Fletcher said:

We sold all three houses when we divorced back in 2012 and both ex-wife and I have rented ever since. We are both perfectly happy...

It's not all doom and gloom being a renter!

 

100% agree, there are lots of positives to renting, provided you're financially secure in other ways.   There's a growing army of "rentvestors" who take exactly that attitude. 

However, the point is that rentvestors DO make sure their money is invested wisely elsewhere, as I'm sure you do - they don't just spend it.  And they haven't been forced into renting because they can't afford anything else.  For a family with children, to deliberately put yourself in a situation where you 're going to struggle financially is a big risk.

Edited by Marisawright
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Scot by birth, emigrated 1985 | Aussie husband applied UK spouse visa Jan 2015, granted March 2015, moved to UK May 2015 | Returned to Oz June 2016

"The stranger who comes home does not make himself at home but makes home itself strange." -- Rainer Maria Rilke

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5 hours ago, Graham Fletcher said:

We sold all three houses when we divorced back in 2012 and both ex-wife and I have rented ever since. We are both perfectly happy living in other people's houses, we both move regularly when the mood takes us, me because I change towns/cities and her because she just likes trying new parts of Perth! Being free to roam or putting down roots is a very personal thing.

On top of that, none of my three adult offspring have bought a house because they simply refuse to live miles from the action (new housing estates seem to be the only option for first time buyers) and they would rather spend their money enjoying themselves than locking it all away in a house deposit.

It's not all doom and gloom being a renter!

 

The big positive about owning a house is one day it’s paid for.  I took my first mortgage in the mid 1980’s and never even gave a thought to it being paid off as that was so far in the future.  Fast forward and I now have no mortgage.  For the rest of my life the income I get is mine to spend and no one could ever force me out of my home.  I have friends that never got on the housing ladder and they’ve been happy enough with that choice.  There’s been a few times they’ve had to move out of a loved home though as the landlord wanted it back. The reality has also dawned on them that they will be paying rent for the rest of their lives.  Even a small 2 bedroom place in my area would be about £900pm to rent. That’s a big chunk of your pension to find every month and a lot of holidays in retirement you could have.  If you’ve got a massive pension pot it doesn’t matter but not many have so much they don’t wish they could spend nearly a grand a month on something else.  Personally I see a huge positive in buying because that day comes when it’s yours and you become richer having a big outlay gone. You’ve also something to one day pass onto your children.  To me, when you rent you are simply paying someone else’s mortgage for them, might as well be your own. Everyone’s different though, nothing wrong with doing what suits you best. 

Edited by Tulip1
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36 minutes ago, Tulip1 said:

The big positive about owning a house is one day it’s paid for.  I took my first mortgage in the mid 1980’s and never even gave a thought to it being paid off as that was so far in the future.  Fast forward and I now have no mortgage. 

That's true, and that's the big advantage - enforced saving.  In theory, if people saved the money and put it in other investments, they should be just as well off as you in their sixties.  However in practice, when you are renting are more likely to spend the money rather than invest it, because it's so available.  It's just human nature. 


Scot by birth, emigrated 1985 | Aussie husband applied UK spouse visa Jan 2015, granted March 2015, moved to UK May 2015 | Returned to Oz June 2016

"The stranger who comes home does not make himself at home but makes home itself strange." -- Rainer Maria Rilke

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9 minutes ago, Marisawright said:

That's true, and that's the big advantage - enforced saving.  In theory, if people saved the money and put it in other investments, they should be just as well off as you in their sixties.  However in practice, when you are renting are more likely to spend the money rather than invest it, because it's so available.  It's just human nature. 

Yes and any savings or investments are more liquid hence easier to be assessed when it comes to claiming a pension or needing benefits. The system here benefits homeowners at pension time.

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I hated renting.  When we first arrived in Australia we had a couple of nice rentals but each time the owners wanted to move back in so that was a pain.  Things like not being able to hang pictures where we wanted to was also a pain and just the whole thing of paying another person's mortgage for them got on my pip too.  Nothing like living in your own home.  Different strokes for different folks though.

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The lack of security in renting and possibly having to move everything into yet another rental when older and retired would make renting a complete no go for me..

I know that there have been studies showing that investing over many years can give better profits than the increase in the value of a house, but realistically if you are renting how much spare cash would you have left to invest in the stock market, to be able to take advantage of that option.

Another vote for owning your own house is that when older you can downsize to release some much welcome capital. 
 

Having said the above as owners of investment properties we are happy people do rent and pay off the mortgages.

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3 hours ago, Marisawright said:

That's true, and that's the big advantage - enforced saving.  In theory, if people saved the money and put it in other investments, they should be just as well off as you in their sixties.  However in practice, when you are renting are more likely to spend the money rather than invest it, because it's so available.  It's just human nature. 

Most couldn’t save the money instead as it would be used on paying rent rather than the mortgage.  Often rent is higher than a mortgage payment would be so both housing options would give someone the ability to save if they wanted to and had the disposable income. A mortgage is enforced saving but by paying the money to a landlord instead you’re helping them save rather than yourself.  It suits some and that’s fine but I struggle to see an advantage.  My friend is renting and pays far more than my mortgage payments were.  She will have to find that money for the rest of her life.  Neither of us are retired yet but she has a reasonable pension when she does. The difference is I will have a lot more every month than her to enjoy. A life changing amount more. I can also release equity from my home if I ever needed to. Not everyone is able to get on the housing ladder so I’m not in anyway putting anyone down, I’d never do that. Just saying if you have the option I’d personally take home ownership always.  

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On 01/02/2021 at 07:20, Cots said:
We’ve  got until August on our RRV and we’ve just this weekend decided it’s now or never. I never wanted to leave but long story, we did. It’s always been there on my mind to go back but didn’t want to break my parents hearts again however we have to live for ourselves. Kids (3) are very keen remembering the times when we lived there. This time round we’re older, I’ll be 46, OH will be 42 and chances of us affording a mortgage are slim since house prices have increased so much and this time around I don’t want to have to worry that we can’t. Renting is a pain but I know it can be expensive with all the maintenance, insurance etc so maybe we just accept that we can’t own again. Is that the worst? Are we mad! The timeframe is killing me due the deadline of August with Covid limiting flights and therefore cost! 

 

Hmmm...it sounds like you are taking a huge huge risk moving to Australia now 

1. Are you even eligible to renew the RRV? Have you met the conditions of the visa to renew it?

2. What job opportunities are there for you in Australia? It sounds like you are moving out there with no jobs lined up....you could be out of work for months with rent eating up your savings 

3. What have you actually got to gain at this stage from moving to Australia? From what you describe I literally see no positives to moving. At. All. 

Sorry to be negative, but the way you are positioning this move sounds like you're acting on a whim and giving up financial security and employment for not a lot in return, especially during a pandemic. 

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11 hours ago, Tulip1 said:

Most couldn’t save the money instead as it would be used on paying rent rather than the mortgage.  Often rent is higher than a mortgage payment

Actually this is not true, and it's the whole point.  For people who don't have much deposit, or people just starting out with their first property, the mortgage payment is considerably more than a rental payment would be.   I vividly recall buying my first property.   Getting the deposit wasn't a big deal for me, but the thought of suddenly having to find a much bigger payment each month was daunting. 

As well as the rental payment being less than the mortgage, the renter has no rates or maintenance to worry about, so they have a lot more spare cash every month.   The problem is that the average renter uses that to enjoy themselves rather than investing, and it takes real discipline to resist that temptation.  Which is why buying a property is safer for most people, because the mortgage and rates and maintenance gobble up all their spare cash,  removing the temptationj to spend it.  And that pays off down the line, as you point out. But it's only because it removes that temptation, not because it's more financially beneficial per se.   Ten or twenty years down the track, it may appear that the renter is worse off because the rent has got higher but the mortgage has stayed the same - but IF the renter has been disciplined, they will have a substantial investment fund, so it balances out.  There are plenty of studies to demonstrate that. 

So, the benefits of home ownership are (1) that intangible feeling of having your own nest, which matters to some people more than others, and (2) forcing people to save, because otherwise, most of us waste our money.    A financially-disciplined person who prefers flexibility can be just as well-off as a renter as a homeowner.  And what suits may change over a person's lifetime.

But I'm conscious we're straying a long way from the OP's post.  The OP isn't talking about renting in order to invest:  she's talking about renting because they'll be too poor to buy.  Not a good prospect, especially in your mid-forties with kids to raise.

Edited by Marisawright
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Scot by birth, emigrated 1985 | Aussie husband applied UK spouse visa Jan 2015, granted March 2015, moved to UK May 2015 | Returned to Oz June 2016

"The stranger who comes home does not make himself at home but makes home itself strange." -- Rainer Maria Rilke

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2 hours ago, Marisawright said:

Actually this is not true, and it's the whole point. 

Tulip is quite correct but it depends on the suburb.

In many places it is cheaper to buy than rent. https://www.finder.com.au/143-suburbs-cheaper-to-buy-than-rent

You also need to recognise that after a period of time, say 10 years you are likely to have seriously reduced your mortgage so you could reduce your mortgage repayment if you wanted to.

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I want it all, and I want it now.

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On 01/02/2021 at 19:09, Cots said:

We spent 2 years on the Gold Coast so would be returning there. We live in the Channel Island’s, a very small (minded)  place with limited opportunities and extremely high house prices. husband rrv runs out mid-August and the rest of the family is end September. We’ve got an estate agent coming Wednesday to value the house and ultimately it all falls on the house sale. 
 

I’ve checked flight and could book for June, July and August but need to see where we go with the house first. Perhaps by then the policy may be different for quarantine if we are considered a Green zone.

 

 

The quarantine rules will not change until the population is vaccinated in Australia, and even then it is unclear if it will change immediately. Current goal is for vaccination to be completed by October ish time, but wouldnt be surprised if it took longer, so plan for quarantine. Also if you intend to travel, I would book now. The media is full of stories of people struggling to get a flight 3-6 months after their original booking due to cancellations. If you wait until August to try and fly, it is likely flight delays will push you past the RRV date


:evilface_frowning_s

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On 01/02/2021 at 21:09, Cots said:

We spent 2 years on the Gold Coast so would be returning there. We live in the Channel Island’s, a very small (minded)  place with limited opportunities and extremely high house prices. husband rrv runs out mid-August and the rest of the family is end September. We’ve got an estate agent coming Wednesday to value the house and ultimately it all falls on the house sale. 
 

I’ve checked flight and could book for June, July and August but need to see where we go with the house first. Perhaps by then the policy may be different for quarantine if we are considered a Green zone.

 

 

I always wanted to go to the Channel Islands, and living in Southampton it was close enough. I met a bloke from St Peter Port on my way to Australia in 1978, stayed friends with him for a while before losing touch. Id love to know what he's up to. 

I assume from what you say the house you own there would not cover the price of a new home on the Gold Coast?  I suppose it depends upon which part of the Gold Coast you had in mind?  I have been in Surfers Paradise for six months now (from Sydney), thinking of staying forever. I don't want to live in the "Hinterland" though. I've got a real estate guide next to my computer. 7A Haileah Crescent, Helensvale. No Body Corparate so I guess it is a villa/duplex/townhouse - 3 bedroom, $349,000. Oh, no Body Corporate but shared insurance. I've been to Helensvale a couple  of times on the tram - good shopping centre but not sure what it's like to live there.

I lived with my two brothers and parents for a year or so in a two bedroom townhouse in Narrabeen (Sydney) so I suppose it's "doable" to live in a smaller place. I've got a Ray White property guide for "The Event", a huge auction sale they had the other week, $38M I heard sold in total. There's an ad for house and land packages from $349,000 in Flinders View (The Plateau, 125 Boylands Way). I've no idea where that is. That's not the Gold Coast - nearer to Ipswich. Good price compared to Sydney 'burbs though.

http://www.capgrowth.com.au/properties/the-plateau-estate-125-boyland-way-flinders-view-qld-4305/

I imagine you want to live near to the coast/beach to enjoy the Gold Coast lifestyle?

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If it is first time buying in Australia then things like First Home Buyer discounts and other incentives might be available also when buying.

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I want it all, and I want it now.

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5 hours ago, Red Rose said:

Hmmm...it sounds like you are taking a huge huge risk moving to Australia now 

1. Are you even eligible to renew the RRV? Have you met the conditions of the visa to renew it?

2. What job opportunities are there for you in Australia? It sounds like you are moving out there with no jobs lined up....you could be out of work for months with rent eating up your savings 

3. What have you actually got to gain at this stage from moving to Australia? From what you describe I literally see no positives to moving. At. All. 

Sorry to be negative, but the way you are positioning this move sounds like you're acting on a whim and giving up financial security and employment for not a lot in return, especially during a pandemic. 

Would you want to be stuck in Blighty?

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8 hours ago, Red Rose said:

Hmmm...it sounds like you are taking a huge huge risk moving to Australia now 

1. Are you even eligible to renew the RRV? Have you met the conditions of the visa to renew it?

2. What job opportunities are there for you in Australia? It sounds like you are moving out there with no jobs lined up....you could be out of work for months with rent eating up your savings 

3. What have you actually got to gain at this stage from moving to Australia? From what you describe I literally see no positives to moving. At. All. 

Sorry to be negative, but the way you are positioning this move sounds like you're acting on a whim and giving up financial security and employment for not a lot in return, especially during a pandemic. 

We already have our RRV so need to to apply, they just happen to run out later this year. I could apply for at least 50 jobs today with my skills and experience so I’m not worried about that at all. my husband is a plumber and a grafter and we’ve both never been out of work here nor in Australia so I am not concerned. He will dig roads and plant trees if he had to.

We have friends In Oz who would put us up after quarantine and friends are all you need.

it’s interesting that people like you can make statements like - you see no positives for us - based on my single statement - you have no idea and thank goodness I’ll take no notice of you LOL
 

 

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176 Visa lodged Oct 09, CO request meds Jan 11. Meds arrived in Oz 14 Feb 11, status changed to processing further 16 Feb 11, PCC sent 23 Feb, VISA GRANTED 25 FEB 11.

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56 minutes ago, Cots said:

We already have our RRV so need to to apply, they just happen to run out later this year. I could apply for at least 50 jobs today with my skills and experience so I’m not worried about that at all. my husband is a plumber and a grafter and we’ve both never been out of work here nor in Australia so I am not concerned. He will dig roads and plant trees if he had to.

We have friends In Oz who would put us up after quarantine and friends are all you need.

it’s interesting that people like you can make statements like - you see no positives for us - based on my single statement - you have no idea and thank goodness I’ll take no notice of you LOL
 

 

When you ask for advice on a forum you may get someone say something you don’t really like.  That often happens but when you reply with a negative response like you have it will put people off trying to help.  You said in your post that you wouldn’t be able to get a mortgage yet you’ve just said you are two very employable people. Maybe the person who made the comment took what you said at first as it may be a big struggle for you and was wanting to warm you off taking the reap. Their response was quite to the point  I agree but not rude. Your response was rude. If you want help from strangers then it’s best to be pleasant.  

 

Edited by Tulip1
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Why was it rude? I said I find it strange that people think they know other people from a couple of paragraphs. The person said we were acting on a whim?? Is that not a little presumptuous? I feel it was a little rude to say such a thing, I sure was asking for advice but it’s really interesting what people are prepared to offer.

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176 Visa lodged Oct 09, CO request meds Jan 11. Meds arrived in Oz 14 Feb 11, status changed to processing further 16 Feb 11, PCC sent 23 Feb, VISA GRANTED 25 FEB 11.

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