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Corona Virus

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1 hour ago, Toots said:

That is true Stu but TB and measles are preventable with a quick jab and should be available through all sorts of charities in poor countries.

If only it were possible to protect the elderly and folk with a dodgy immune system and let Covid do it's best (or worst) to the rest of us.  If a vaccine isn't found soon maybe that will have to be the way to go.

I think that will be the way it will go soon. No country can survive this for years. I’d even go so far as to say I think that U.K. has almost adopted the herd mentality and get on with it stance without it being public that’s what’s happening.  The government can’t openly say we’ve got to get on with things and some will die but so be it but I honestly think it’s along those lines, just swept under the carpet.  We have approx 17 thousand a day testing positive.  A least 80% of people have no symptoms and therefore only know they have it when tested. These people are being tested because of their job or they’ve been in contact with someone who’s had it/displayed symptoms. Therefore it’s reasonable to assume that 17 thousand a day figure is far higher, multiplied several times over but they aren’t getting tested because they feel fine. Yet still we have most things open. You can wonder around every shop all day everyday and pop into many pubs, restaurants, gyms etc. On my drive to work there are posters advertising the annual 3 day circus. You can even go to the circus. You can holiday anywhere, stop overnight in any hotel and hang out with five other people non stop. Not the same five. If you fancied a busy day you could get through dozens and dozens of friends who in turn have done the same.  It’s certainly not back to normal and some places, particularly in the north have a stricter lockdown but it’s hard to say the country are trying everything to keep the numbers down when people pretty much can do what they want.  I think many believe it’s beyond repair now and it will take its course.  

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5 minutes ago, Tulip1 said:

I think that will be the way it will go soon. No country can survive this for years. I’d even go so far as to say I think that U.K. has almost adopted the herd mentality and get on with it stance without it being public that’s what’s happening.  The government can’t openly say we’ve got to get on with things and some will die but so be it but I honestly think it’s along those lines, just swept under the carpet.  We have approx 17 thousand a day testing positive.  A least 80% of people have no symptoms and therefore only know they have it when tested. These people are being tested because of their job or they’ve been in contact with someone who’s had it/displayed symptoms. Therefore it’s reasonable to assume that 17 thousand a day figure is far higher, multiplied several times over but they aren’t getting tested because they feel fine. Yet still we have most things open. You can wonder around every shop all day everyday and pop into many pubs, restaurants, gyms etc. On my drive to work there are posters advertising the annual 3 day circus. You can even go to the circus. You can holiday anywhere, stop overnight in any hotel and hang out with five other people non stop. Not the same five. If you fancied a busy day you could get through dozens and dozens of friends who in turn have done the same.  It’s certainly not back to normal and some places, particularly in the north have a stricter lockdown but it’s hard to say the country are trying everything to keep the numbers down when people pretty much can do what they want.  I think many believe it’s beyond repair now and it will take its course.  

Agree it's beyond repair in the UK. Exactly what Bojo planned. Shocking really. 

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5 hours ago, Paul1Perth said:

I'm retired, in the worst possible situation for handouts. My missus works so I don't get any pension so  zero handouts for me.

Call it Dullsville if you like but there's certainly more here to keep me the wife and kids amused than there ever was in the UK. My eldest is 31 and used to moan a bit when he was younger, believed that Dullsville label if you like. Then he started work got FIFO jobs and went travelling for 6 months of the next 10 years. Europe, America, tomorrowland a couple of times, music festivals galore, then lived in Whistler, Canada for a couple of years. Loves his snowboarding. Went to Coachella a couple of times, week or 2 in Mexico, travelled the stares for a bit. Met his girlfriend in Canada, she's from Newcastle near Sydney, so they lived there for about 8 months. Now they've moved back here and they love it. When he'd been travelling a few years he came back near Christmas, went to raftup at rottnest on his mates boat for the day. I went to pick him up from Hillary's as he was flying out to Bali that night and I knew he would be worse for wear after rotto. In the car on the way home he said what a great day they'd had (again) and now realised what a great place Perth is. I suppose you have to travel and be able to compare.

I'm not at all worried about catching the virus here, there is none and it's likely to stay that way. I don't know one person who thinks McGowan did the wrong thing and everyone knows we are extremely lucky. Don't know how you can criticise really.

Walking is not really my bag. Triathlon, running, swimming,  adventure racing, biking. Take today, meet a load of mates at7:00 am at the surf club, ski paddle for 10k or so, run, swim after, cup of coffee by the beach, sort the worlds problems out😄. Home for a fry up.

Do you reckon older people lose interest in pubs? Maybe clubs, but pubs are still popular with me love a drink and a socialise.

Oh well mate, no nice little Island off the coast for you to visit. I'll have a few pints at Pinkies beach and the Rotto hotel next week and ponder what you said.😎

 

 

 

 

They mostly come back to WA to settle down. (The youngsters) Best place to make a fantastic life. 

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13 hours ago, kungfustu said:

.you do seem to have a strange fascination with the UK though....odd I think that someone so happy with life on the otherside of the world takes such an interest in our mundane life over here.....

Oh the irony!   😂😂   From one (among several) posting for years on an Australian website despite having left the place for a (claimed) much better life on the other side of the world.  Paul in Perth is posting on an Australian website:  AFAIK he doesn't go stalking UK websites to criticise how things are managed there.

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11 hours ago, Tulip1 said:

I think that will be the way it will go soon. No country can survive this for years. I’d even go so far as to say I think that U.K. has almost adopted the herd mentality and get on with it stance without it being public that’s what’s happening.  The government can’t openly say we’ve got to get on with things and some will die but so be it but I honestly think it’s along those lines, just swept under the carpet.  We have approx 17 thousand a day testing positive.  A least 80% of people have no symptoms and therefore only know they have it when tested. These people are being tested because of their job or they’ve been in contact with someone who’s had it/displayed symptoms. Therefore it’s reasonable to assume that 17 thousand a day figure is far higher, multiplied several times over but they aren’t getting tested because they feel fine. Yet still we have most things open. You can wonder around every shop all day everyday and pop into many pubs, restaurants, gyms etc. On my drive to work there are posters advertising the annual 3 day circus. You can even go to the circus. You can holiday anywhere, stop overnight in any hotel and hang out with five other people non stop. Not the same five. If you fancied a busy day you could get through dozens and dozens of friends who in turn have done the same.  It’s certainly not back to normal and some places, particularly in the north have a stricter lockdown but it’s hard to say the country are trying everything to keep the numbers down when people pretty much can do what they want.  I think many believe it’s beyond repair now and it will take its course.  

That's interesting.  So no sign of fever etc etc?  As long as hospitals particularly the ICU can cope all should be good   .................... or is it?  Maybe herd immunity is the way to go.  

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12 hours ago, Tulip1 said:

I think that will be the way it will go soon. No country can survive this for years. I’d even go so far as to say I think that U.K. has almost adopted the herd mentality and get on with it stance without it being public that’s what’s happening.  The government can’t openly say we’ve got to get on with things and some will die but so be it but I honestly think it’s along those lines, just swept under the carpet.  We have approx 17 thousand a day testing positive.  A least 80% of people have no symptoms and therefore only know they have it when tested. These people are being tested because of their job or they’ve been in contact with someone who’s had it/displayed symptoms. Therefore it’s reasonable to assume that 17 thousand a day figure is far higher, multiplied several times over but they aren’t getting tested because they feel fine. Yet still we have most things open. You can wonder around every shop all day everyday and pop into many pubs, restaurants, gyms etc. On my drive to work there are posters advertising the annual 3 day circus. You can even go to the circus. You can holiday anywhere, stop overnight in any hotel and hang out with five other people non stop. Not the same five. If you fancied a busy day you could get through dozens and dozens of friends who in turn have done the same.  It’s certainly not back to normal and some places, particularly in the north have a stricter lockdown but it’s hard to say the country are trying everything to keep the numbers down when people pretty much can do what they want.  I think many believe it’s beyond repair now and it will take its course.  

New rules being announced on Monday in the UK Parliament.


I want it all, and I want it now.

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13 hours ago, kungfustu said:

.its a virus similar to Flu.....

It is NOT a virus similar to flu.  That is not my lay person's opinion:  this is the opinion of medicos and researchers who have seen it produce inflammation of the circulatory system and complications in brain, liver and kidney functions which they do not see in flu. 

You may not, but I happen to respect the knowledge of people who are experts in their field.

Quote

.I was in the pub then an indian restaurant from 2pm to 10pm a couple of weeks ago with someone that tested positive 48 hours later.....infact there were 8 of us....all sitting together on 2 tables all evening.....inside....laughing and joking.....none of us caught it from the bloke.....my son even sat next too him in the cinema for 2 hours the next evening and was talking to him all night.....we have all tested and no one caught the virus..

Good for you.  You were OK on this occasion. But many people contract it from exposure to only one infected person. Next time you might not be OK     And it may not matter at all if you contract it:  but it may have serious consequences for someone else you infect.     Like the nearly 43,000  who have died in the UK.  Not all of them are "dispensible" oldies who have passed their "use by" date. (Not my opinion, but that is obviously the opinion of some).     More than 600 of them in the UK have been frontline medical/social care staff.  (More than 620 estimated in early August.....likely to be even higher now).  Even if one doesn't have any human compassion for them or their families, the economic and morale cost to the health system is enormous.   It may even affect  the care you or your family receive from the health system for something entirely unrelated in the future. 

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.lots of viruses have long term effects on their recipients.....fatigue etc....its nothing new....do some research.

I don't need to do any research, mate.  In my thirties I contracted a mysterious infection which affected me for the next 12 years and seriously affected my employment, career and finances.   In another place I could now be homeless because of it.  The difference was that I didn't infect any one else and no one died from it.   So I have personal experience  of the long term impact.

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..whats unique is that you are so hyper sensitive to this virus like no other.....you are sh@t scared of it..

I'm not scared of it at all.  I live in a state which has had zero community transmission since April and only 13 deaths - and all those infections related to returning passengers from a cruise ship in March.

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20 hours ago, Dusty Plains said:

WA was never an attraction for me. It was always too far away. I had pictures in my mind that it was an empty desert with the odd town thrown in and also there was a mining industry there as well. 

My daughter and son in law, plus two of our little grandchildren took off on the around-Australia loop heading off from Newcastle NSW several years ago while the kids were still pre-schoolers. Back then the SIL had been a visiting medical officer and registrar in relation to mental health in-patients and outpatients in the Newcastle Region.

 Long story short. WA health contacted NSW health as they had an urgent vacancy for exactly that particular medical officer and so the SIL who was in WA at the time, was eventually tracked down, enlisted and provided with accommodation just off the beach at Busselton WA for 3 months. We flew over there to visit the family and could not believe how beautiful Busselton and the south west were. 

We returned to NSW, The family returned to NSW, Three years later another grandchild arrives, our daughter had graduated as an environmental scientist and had a high paying job with an environmental company in Newcastle, and our SIL had passed his exams for entry into the Royal AUST/NZ College of Psychiatrists,  Then the phone rang.  WA Health offered a full time position to the SIL. So it was back to WA, Daughter and SIL bought a beautiful property up in the hinterland behind Dunsborough and there they have settled,

WE have been back a number of times touring the South West, the wheat belt region and the goldfields,

We love WA. What a lifestyle. 

Perth is a really nice City too. I think we have the best of both worlds, 30km North, close to a fantastic beach, good shopping centres close by, heaps of beachside restaurants up and down the coast but still an easy bus/train ride into the City in half an hour.

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18 hours ago, kungfustu said:

you sound a busy man Paul.....I don't know where you find the time to keep tracks on whats going on here.....you do seem to have a strange fascination with the UK though....odd I think that someone so happy with life on the otherside of the world takes such an interest in our mundane life over here.....when I lived in Perth I took no interest at all in what was happening in the UK.....my life was Perth and I did my best to live it.....sadly for me I found the place to be dull....isolated....almost lonely.....ideal if you are thinking of retiring.....yeh there are lovely beaches etc etc etc and lots of free parking spaces......it was just boring.....the lack of other people didn't help but I come from a very busy part of the UK so that probably has had an affect on my time in Perth......enjoy Rotto....it was beautiful when I visited....problem was you needed a 2nd mortgage to be able to stay on the island......accommodation was so expensive we only ever did the day trip

We got a good deal on scoopon. Ferry included, couple of nights in the lodge for $250. Going again in December for 4 nights. Share a 2 bed apartment, doesn't cost that much.

All our families are still in the UK so we get a lot of news from them, usually how bad things are so I do have an interest still.

Don't know what you mean about lack of other people? Perth and where we live is like anywhere else, better when you have a friendship group to enjoy it with. We've found ours mostly through sport and the kids. Squash club, surf club mostly. Not hard to find some people with the same interests.

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5 hours ago, Toots said:

As long as hospitals particularly the ICU can cope all should be good   .................... or is it?  Maybe herd immunity is the way to go.  

But that's the issue. The problem with Covid-19 is not that it kills large numbers of people. 

The problem is that it can infect very large numbers of people in a very short space of time.   Unchecked, the number infected can more than double every day.

Most of those people will have mild or no symptoms, but when there are thousands getting sick every day, there are hundreds who need treatment - and then the hospitals get overwhelmed.  Then the death rate soars because:

  • doctors and nurses die because they get such a heavy viral load from constant exposure;
  • there aren't enough ventilators etc for everyone, so some patients must be left to die who might otherwise have survived;
  • Emergency rooms are full, so heart attack and stroke patients aren't treated in a timely fashion, and are therefore more likely to die or have poor outcomes

We know all this, because we saw it in Italy, Spain and New York.   Why do people think that wouldn't happen again if everything went back to normal?  

We also know that it's impossible to achieve true herd immunity without a vaccine, because we know the history of smallpox, diphtheria, polio etc etc.  The facts are there for everyone to see.  Those diseases were not brought under control until a vaccine was found.

Edited by Marisawright
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Scot by birth, emigrated 1985 | Aussie husband applied UK spouse visa Jan 2015, granted March 2015, moved to UK May 2015 | Returned to Oz June 2016

"The stranger who comes home does not make himself at home but makes home itself strange." -- Rainer Maria Rilke

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18 hours ago, kungfustu said:

I think you will find most of the 1.5 million dying from TB are from poor countries.....just like the 150k or so kids under the age of 5 that die from Measles each year are from poorer countries.....that argument does not stack up I am afraid.....we are not poor countries.....we have treatments and we have health care systems......what we have in science and medicine we sadly lack in common sense.

That's the whole problem. No one has a treatment for covid yet.

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17 hours ago, HappyHeart said:

Agree it's beyond repair in the UK. Exactly what Bojo planned. Shocking really. 

Come on ,its nothing to do with bojo - hes doing his best with information received by the scientists - but if you want to make political capital out of it , carry on .

Is Andrews doing any better in victoria ?

Its the British public that are saying enough is enough .

The govt is tring to lock down parts of the North and Midlands- and I feel the public will either largely ignore it or there will be social unrest .

Absolutely nothing to do with bojo - like all of the leaders in the western world - they are doing their best .

No mention of blame for the virus origins , I see .

Let's just blame trump or bojo 

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BUT I DONT FEEL AFRAID

AS LONG AS I GAZE AT

WATERLOO SUNSET

IAM IN PARADISE

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8 hours ago, Parley said:

New rules being announced on Monday in the UK Parliament.

I know @Parley. The problem is that from the start the government/police have been too soft over enforcing the rules so they are ignored by many.  If that’s the case it doesn’t matter what new rules are announced. People know they can get fined for not following the rules but very few actually do get fined. In the last few weeks I’ve seen several things in the news where the rules have clearly been breached. The university students were told they can return to student accommodation but no parties and keep to the rule of six. They haven’t done that and we now have thousands of students who are positive and now isolating (or should be)  Many have been interviewed away from the cameras and they’ve said they have been careless. Some would have caught it even by obeying the rules but not in the numbers that have it.  Police turned up at a wedding reception in Manchester after a tip off and it was filmed. There was about 70 guests in this pub and the police walked around asking them all to leave and go home. The big headline was the pub owner was fined. Too right but what about the selfish newly weds who sent out 70 invitations and all the guests who turned up and stayed knowing they shouldn’t.  Exactly the same thing happened in Luton. A hotel had a wedding going on with about 100 guests. Police went in and asked them all to leave. The hotel owner was fined.  I saw a police film of an illegal rave of many and the police again walked about asking for them to leave. In these three things alone I’ve mentioned just two people we’re fined even though there was no dispute whatsoever hundreds had broke the rules. I’m pretty sure not one student has received a fine either. The message that sends is do what you want as the chances of actually getting in trouble is negligible. The worst that will happen is a police officer will nicely ask you to go home.  Those who return from abroad are supposed to isolate at home (subject to certain countries) They get a phone call asking if they are at home and sticking to the rules. No one ever turns up at their houses and checks and many have not answered the calls that have been made to them. I have not heard of anyone getting fined for breach of the isolation rule. Therefore again, no point in making rules that can be ignored without punishment.  Of course rules are better than none as a reasonable amount of people will adhere to them but unless they crack down and make people afraid of getting caught then sadly many will continue to behave in a selfish way and worsen the already terrible situation.  

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3 hours ago, Paul1Perth said:

That's the whole problem. No one has a treatment for covid yet.

yes they do.....what do you think Trump has just been taking.....we have several different drugs/treatments that we now use here.....

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14 minutes ago, kungfustu said:

yes they do.....what do you think Trump has just been taking.....we have several different drugs/treatments that we now use here.....

And still many are dying. 81 died yesterday.  Sure we are in a better place than early in the year and have some things that help but we still have a lot of very sick people being admitted to hospital with Covid and we still have a lot dying from it with the numbers increasing daily. 

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8 hours ago, Skani said:

It is NOT a virus similar to flu.  That is not my lay person's opinion:  this is the opinion of medicos and researchers who have seen it produce inflammation of the circulatory system and complications in brain, liver and kidney functions which they do not see in flu. 

You may not, but I happen to respect the knowledge of people who are experts in their field.

It IS 😂similar to flu/influenza......it kills the exact same people that covid kills.....most covid deaths are due to the immune response of the individual.....symptoms are similar....Flu affect a persons respiratory tract and system.....its long term effects are obviously not going to be the same as covid.....I never said they were because it is a different virus....this is what I said ......"its a virus similar to Flu.....lots of viruses have long term effects on their recipients.....fatigue etc....its nothing new.".....so you taking one small snippet and spinning it to suit is pointless.....answer the whole point not just one small bit.

https://www.health.com/condition/cold-flu-sinus/flu-long-term-effects

Highlighted part is interesting....do you respect these experts as well?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54442386

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2 minutes ago, Tulip1 said:

And still many are dying. 81 died yesterday.  Sure we are in a better place than early in the year and have some things that help but we still have a lot of very sick people being admitted to hospital with Covid and we still have a lot dying from it with the numbers increasing daily. 

when are you going to realise this constant over reporting of figures is brainwashing you......have you any idea how many people die in this country everyday from cancer,,,,,from respiratory illnesses.....I heard the other day on the radio during this time of year we have about 1000 hospital admissions every day for respiratory illnesses during a normal year.....we have about 1400 die everyday in England and Wales.....everyday.....heart disease.....cancers.....respiratory illnesses....death is sadly a part of life and people die.....what we are voluntarily doing in this country and people like you are advocating is also adding to this list of people dying.....sadly the government does not give us a daily figure.....regular updates several times a day so you are not constantly being reminded and don't realise its taking place......c'mon....where is your common sense?

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There are quite a few differences between Covid and flu.  Personally I 'd sooner have the flu

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/symptoms/flu-vs-covid19.htm

Just watched a program about cruise ships,Covid and other viruses and I am never, ever, going on a cruise again. We have been on quite a few round different parts of the world and had a great time but that time has now gone for the forseeable future.

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4 hours ago, bunbury61 said:

Come on ,its nothing to do with bojo - hes doing his best with information received by the scientists - but if you want to make political capital out of it , carry on .

Is Andrews doing any better in victoria ?

Its the British public that are saying enough is enough .

The govt is tring to lock down parts of the North and Midlands- and I feel the public will either largely ignore it or there will be social unrest .

Absolutely nothing to do with bojo - like all of the leaders in the western world - they are doing their best .

No mention of blame for the virus origins , I see .

Let's just blame trump or bojo 

Give me a break man. Are you SERIOUSLY comparing the Victorian situation and management to the murderous shitshow unfolding in the UK under that most disingenuous of 'leaders' Boris Johnson? The man couldn't run a chippy let alone a country. He effed it up BIG TIME from day 1 and is now reaping what was sowed from his poorly imagined idea of herd immunity and dismissal of the consequences. Shit himself when he realised what MIGHT happen if he carried through. Much like Trump. 

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5 hours ago, Marisawright said:

But that's the issue. The problem with Covid-19 is not that it kills large numbers of people. 

The problem is that it can infect very large numbers of people in a very short space of time.   Unchecked, the number infected can more than double every day.

Most of those people will have mild or no symptoms, but when there are thousands getting sick every day, there are hundreds who need treatment - and then the hospitals get overwhelmed.  Then the death rate soars because:

  • doctors and nurses die because they get such a heavy viral load from constant exposure;
  • there aren't enough ventilators etc for everyone, so some patients must be left to die who might otherwise have survived;
  • Emergency rooms are full, so heart attack and stroke patients aren't treated in a timely fashion, and are therefore more likely to die or have poor outcomes

We know all this, because we saw it in Italy, Spain and New York.   Why do people think that wouldn't happen again if everything went back to normal?  

We also know that it's impossible to achieve true herd immunity without a vaccine, because we know the history of smallpox, diphtheria, polio etc etc.  The facts are there for everyone to see.  Those diseases were not brought under control until a vaccine was found.

Spot on, it amazes me when people say lockdown is a waste of time, because it hasn't been too bad,  it has been bad, but it would have been a hell of a lot worse without intervention, and it drives me mad when people bang on about the economy, well I'd lake to ask them exactly the monetary value they place on  human life, because that is what they are doing.   

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Jeremy Corbyn on the EU  " A European bureaucracy totally unaccountable to anybody"

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1 hour ago, kungfustu said:

when are you going to realise this constant over reporting of figures is brainwashing you......have you any idea how many people die in this country everyday from cancer,,,,,from respiratory illnesses.....I heard the other day on the radio during this time of year we have about 1000 hospital admissions every day for respiratory illnesses during a normal year.....we have about 1400 die everyday in England and Wales.....everyday.....heart disease.....cancers.....respiratory illnesses....death is sadly a part of life and people die.....what we are voluntarily doing in this country and people like you are advocating is also adding to this list of people dying.....sadly the government does not give us a daily figure.....regular updates several times a day so you are not constantly being reminded and don't realise its taking place......c'mon....where is your common sense?

I used my common sense when I replied to your comment about Covid following someone saying we don’t have a cure. You responded with... 

yes they do.....what do you think Trump has just been taking.....we have several different drugs/treatments that we now use here.....
 

If you want to start up a post about how many people go to hospital/die with cancer and other medical issues then please do.  I may respond to that one too. Different to the subject matter being discussed here though.  As for being brainwashed, please be assured I’m not. I do however listen to the facts given by some of the finest minds out there.  

 

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13 hours ago, kungfustu said:

yes they do.....what do you think Trump has just been taking.....

Trump was given an experimental drug cocktail which is not available to anyone else.  Not approved for use by the FDA in the US and one of the drugs alone costs over $3000 for a 5 day treatment.  And the ultimate health outcome is still unknown.  One of the drugs ( Remdesivir) can speed up recovery in the short term.   But it can also have serious long term side effects -  liver and kidney toxicity and anaemia.   The steroid he was given reduces inflammation short term but also suppresses the immune system so if it's not out of his system completely - and they refuse to say that he's tested negative - it could come back to bite him harder.  In trials of that steroid they've found that a quarter of patients who appeared to benefit  initially still died within a month.   It's only 10 days since he tested positive and the second week is the most dangerous so it's too early to say he's definitely cured.

Quote

we have several different drugs/treatments that we now use here.....

They can reduce symptoms and speed up recovery but they are not a cure and aren't effective for every patient.

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The only person I know of personally who has had Covid is @simmo.  He was in hospital and by all accounts made a good recovery.   👍   I wonder what medication he received whilst being treated in hospital.

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14 hours ago, kungfustu said:

Highlighted part is interesting....do you respect these experts as well?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54442386

You do realise these "experts" include:  Professor Cominic Dummings, Dr. Johnny Bananas,  Professor Boris Isacompuliveliar,   someone whose name is the first verse of the Macarena song,  Dominic Cummings "PhD of Durham Univercity",  Dr. Person Fakename, Dr. Harold Shipman, a Mongolian Khoomii singer, massage therapists, hypnotherapists, psychotherapists, homeopaths  - with all due respect, hardly experts on herd immunity or this particular disease.

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Fallowfield a suburb of Manchester - home to thousands of students - remains the Covid-19 hotspot of England.  A number of students who have contracted Covid-19 are being treated for the virus in hospital - and some have needed intensive care.  The arrival of some 80,000 students appears to have caused Manchester’s – and Fallowfield’s – sudden Covid surge.

.............  and before anyone starts querying why I really care about that given that I live on the other side of the world, I have friends with grandchildren who are students at Manchester uni.

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