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Nothing wrong with making potential migrants think hard about the opportunity - might save them £50k or so 🙂

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PR (100) planning to move to Perth by then end of 2019!

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On 22/01/2020 at 13:00, Marisawright said:

Absolutely. Personally, I like life in Australia but when I see someone saying "we want to move to Australia because everything is better and we'll be happier and healthier", I think it's irresponsible not to point out that there are minuses as well as pluses.  If they get their visa and arrive expecting a paradise, they'll be disappointed and those first disappointments can poison their whole experience.  Whereas if they've thought through the pros and cons first, they've got a much better chance of success.

When someone says, "go for it, it's an adventure" to someone with a wife and kids, they're saying, "Yeah, why not, it will only cost you about . If you don't like it, you can always move back, what's another £30k?"   For some people, that would be their life savings.

How do you know that? When I first arrived in Cairns I knew immediately that it was the place for me,  I absolutely loved it. Yet, I had seen so many posts from people saying don’t go there it’s too hot, too humid, no work, too expensive, too many aboriginal people, too touristy. All their comments usually based on a 2 week holiday made 10 years ago in the height of wet season and staying in the cheapest accommodation which was in the roughest area and not close to the outer suburbs.  If it wasn’t for my health I would still be there, it is a tropical paradise. 
 

When I ran the relocation business we had a number of people return home in the first week, one couple were back on UK soil in 48 hours.
‘On the forum, we have had a family who earned over $250k a year but hated Australia because they could only afford beans on toast,  the ones who returned because they couldn’t buy Robinson’s cordial, a family who touched down at Melbourne airport but because it was raining caught the next flight home.  There have been many more. Now I am sorry but people like that can’t blame Australia obviously they had cold feet. 

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If you are depressed you are living in the past. If you are anxious you are living in the future. If you are at peace you are living in the present.

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28 minutes ago, The Pom Queen said:

How do you know that?

Because the whole of Australia isn't a paradise.  There are some  lovely places to live, but nowhere in the world is a perfect paradise.  

Recently, someone joined these forums asking about migration.  They said they KNEW that moving to Australia would automatically make them happier and healthier and less stressed, because Australian life is so laid back. Someone arriving in Sydney and finding all they can afford is a flat in Mount Druitt is going to be sadly disappointed, don't you think? 

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Scot by birth, emigrated 1985 | Aussie husband applied UK spouse visa Jan 2015, granted March 2015, moved to UK May 2015 | Returned to Oz June 2016

"The stranger who comes home does not make himself at home but makes home itself strange." -- Rainer Maria Rilke

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11 minutes ago, Marisawright said:

Because the whole of Australia isn't a paradise.  There are some  lovely places to live, but nowhere in the world is a perfect paradise.  

Recently, someone joined these forums asking about migration.  They said they KNEW that moving to Australia would automatically make them happier and healthier and less stressed, because Australian life is so laid back. Someone arriving in Sydney and finding all they can afford is a flat in Mount Druitt is going to be sadly disappointed, don't you think? 

Well they didnt quite word it like that... They said they would be happier and healthier and when you called them out as to why they thought that ,this was their response - 

''The outdoor lifestyle will be much better as a family, walks, sports eating fresher and healthier foods... The laid back atmosphere will be amazing, were im from everyone loves drama and to just leave behind the bad and start afresh. ''

I see nothing at all unachievable with what they wrote and im sure everyone agrees and knows the world isnt paradise, IMO that doesnt mean we have to disect their comments to point out every negative that ''could'' happen should they move. Not many migrants move without doing research first, for most of them thats how they found this forum. 

Cal x

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If you don't go after what you want, you'll never have it. If you don't ask, the answer is always no. If you don't step forward, you're always in the same place...

If you get a chance,take it, If it changes your life,let it. Nobody said it would be easy they just said it would be worth it...

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1 hour ago, The Pom Queen said:

On the forum, we have had a family who earned over $250k a year but hated Australia because they could only afford beans on toast,  

What?! 😂

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46 minutes ago, Jelly said:

What?! 😂

HaHa , you see it all when doing relocation's, i had one family decide they didn't like Aus during their trip from the airport to the accommodation when they first arrived (night flight so all dark). Next day they booked flights back to the UK without seeing anything Aus had to offer,lol.. Each to their own i guess and shows how very different one person is to the next.

 Cal x

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If you don't go after what you want, you'll never have it. If you don't ask, the answer is always no. If you don't step forward, you're always in the same place...

If you get a chance,take it, If it changes your life,let it. Nobody said it would be easy they just said it would be worth it...

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13 minutes ago, calNgary said:

HaHa , you see it all when doing relocation's, i had one family decide they didn't like Aus during their trip from the airport to the accommodation when they first arrived (night flight so all dark). Next day they booked flights back to the UK without seeing anything Aus had to offer,lol.. Each to their own i guess and shows how very different one person is to the next.

 Cal x

Some folk should just never leave home.  

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On 17/01/2020 at 05:34, Aussiewannabie said:

Hi, 

Me and my partner are looking to move to Australia. We have 2 children also. Any information and help would be much appreciated. 

Thanks 

Hey mate,

That's a pretty broad query.

It's like saying we're thinking of moving to Europe.

Australia is a big place and the cities are all very different.

If you put a map of Australia over Europe, Perth is about where Lisbon is, Darwin would be in Scandanavia and Sydney probably close to Istanbul.

As a few others have said, 1st thing is to see if you are eligible for visas.

With a family, there are additional costs (school fees etc) if you are on temporary (sponsorship) visas and you can be pretty vulnerable.  If you can, look at PR visas.

After that maybe start doing some research on where in Australia will match what you are looking for, where you'll get work and fits within your budget.

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We knew a couple who moved to Sydney from Huddersfield, they found it too expensive in Sydney but got as much of their weekly shopping as possible from the British Shop because their kids wouldn’t eat smiths instead of walkers crisps etc.
Then there’s another couple who live in Birkdale who moved out to be near family and nothing is ever as good as ‘back home’.
I try to avoid these kinds of people, they do put a dampener on life!!

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Collie made some very good comments. 
‘He is definitely correct when he says “Australia is a big place and the cities are all very different” I would take this further and say every suburb (town) is different as well. You can live in a very affluent suburb in Melbourne yet two suburbs down can be an absolute dump. 
We came from the UK straight to Melbourne, lived 10 years there,  then up to Cairns, down to Townsville for a year and then we are now 1 1/2 hours outside of Brisbane. The only place I hated was Townsville and I will be totally honest in saying that was probably my own head space, I had to leave Cairns to be closer to a larger hospital. 
‘What I will say to you is if you do come and don’t like the suburb where you land don’t give up on Australia.  I learnt through relocating families was that most came here with a list of suburbs that they were going to live in because they had read it on a forum and not one of our families actually settled in those suburbs. I admit we did exactly the same. When we were making the move, the Mornington Peninsula was all the rage, everyone was moving to Mornington, Mount Martha, Mt Eliza. I told my husband that was where we were moving. It didn’t happen like that we ended up in Lynbrook and Beaumaris. We started off in a short term rental, it was actually a house sitting and they gave us the use of their car. During this time we drove around many suburbs and narrowed it down. Honestly though, even then it’s so easy to make a mistake. You have no idea who your neighbours will be. This is why I never recommend anyone buys without seeing.  If you rent for 6 months it gives you chance to look around properly and if you do find a nicer suburb you can move on. 
 
‘I say Melbourne is very much like the UK, easy to acclimatise and plenty of jobs

Sydney is very expensive, commuting is a nightmare

Cairns and FNQ is Hot and humid but as long as you don’t work outdoors it’s fine everywhere you go as aircon.

Darwin is the same as Cairns although more remote.

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If you are depressed you are living in the past. If you are anxious you are living in the future. If you are at peace you are living in the present.

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1 minute ago, The Pom Queen said:

Collie made some very good comments. 
‘He is definitely correct when he says “Australia is a big place and the cities are all very different” I would take this further and say every suburb (town) is different as well. You can live in a very affluent suburb in Melbourne yet two suburbs down can be an absolute dump. 
We came from the UK straight to Melbourne, lived 10 years there,  then up to Cairns, down to Townsville for a year and then we are now 1 1/2 hours outside of Brisbane. The only place I hated was Townsville and I will be totally honest in saying that was probably my own head space, I had to leave Cairns to be closer to a larger hospital. 
‘What I will say to you is if you do come and don’t like the suburb where you land don’t give up on Australia.  I learnt through relocating families was that most came here with a list of suburbs that they were going to live in because they had read it on a forum and not one of our families actually settled in those suburbs. I admit we did exactly the same. When we were making the move, the Mornington Peninsula was all the rage, everyone was moving to Mornington, Mount Martha, Mt Eliza. I told my husband that was where we were moving. It didn’t happen like that we ended up in Lynbrook and Beaumaris. We started off in a short term rental, it was actually a house sitting and they gave us the use of their car. During this time we drove around many suburbs and narrowed it down. Honestly though, even then it’s so easy to make a mistake. You have no idea who your neighbours will be. This is why I never recommend anyone buys without seeing.  If you rent for 6 months it gives you chance to look around properly and if you do find a nicer suburb you can move on. 
 
‘I say Melbourne is very much like the UK, easy to acclimatise and plenty of jobs

Sydney is very expensive, commuting is a nightmare

Cairns and FNQ is Hot and humid but as long as you don’t work outdoors it’s fine everywhere you go as aircon.

Darwin is the same as Cairns although more remote.

Don’t forget Brisbane 

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Australia isn’t a country, it’s a franchise.  Once you understand that, it’s easy!

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On 22/01/2020 at 06:21, Bobj said:

Mate! Love that attitude. Been in Australia for over 55 years and still having an outdoors lifestyle at age 79...Do what you and your partner feel you should do. Be positive in your outlook. And to hell with the negative comments. 😉 I can honestly say that I’ve had a fabulous life here.

And, enjoy your lives together

Cheers, Bobj.

PS. In all my time in Australia, I have only lived in cities for about 2 years, My time has been spent in The Kimberlies, northern New England and now in the Whitsunday/ Mackay Region.

 

 

I didn't know you lived here.

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1 hour ago, Canada2Australia said:

I didn't know you lived here.

Retired here 21 years ago. Downtown Ball Bay.👍

Cheers, Bobj.

 

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8 minutes ago, Bobj said:

Retired here 21 years ago. Downtown Ball Bay.👍

Cheers, Bobj.

 

Nice. I'm in scenic East Mackay lol

Seriously though, it is pretty nice here.

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Agree with Bob- to hell with the negativism, go for it if you want to ! 

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To the OP:  I think it's good to know the potential pitfalls - we used to look for the reasons people went home and disregarded the ones were they couldn't find their favourite brand of juice or didn't like the journey to the airport - but did discuss what if one or both of us didn't like it and talked about that (the decision was that Aus was a big place and we'd try somewhere else).  I think the tone of some posts suggesting those pitfalls can be misunderstood and it's better to try not to read between imaginary lines when offering an opinion.  For me, I try to remember how excited and hopeful I was at the start of the journey and certainly responded better to considered post which gave a balanced view/ideas to consider. 

As a family, I'd like to think that had we stayed in the UK we'd have maintained the ok life we had there -  We lived in a nice area in the north west (don't buy into the 'if you live up north living in Aus is a step up just because where you're living must be a dump) - for us the move was a comparable one although our house/block is slightly bigger.  We've still managed to travel as a family and as a couple, we've saved money (some things are cheaper and some more expensive), we cut our cloth accordingly and have a good life.  Our children have thrived (as we hoped they would have done in the UK), the (public) education system hasn't let them down and perhaps aided my daughter more as her HS here had an academic extension programme which she got into which met her academic needs and by 23 she had her masters (and a hefty student loan - just like the UK).  Our son had the opportunity to do sailing and also obtained his skippers ticket (to drive a boat)  as part of the school curriculum (opportunities he wouldn't have had).

Is our life better here?  it's certainly different and we feel more content.  We have accessed a lot of different sporting activities and concerts than we did when we lived in the UK as the stadium/venues in the city are less than 30 mins away for us.  We do spend more time outside , even relaxing at home we eat outside often and spend time in the garden.  Last weekend, we had a impromptu picnic with friends by the river, there was a large group of teens having a get together without anyone wondering what they were up to or if there would be anti-social behaviour lol.  For me, these have been the little things that have been very different that what we did in the UK and lifestyle changes don't have to be major ones.

My advice for the OP - it's a long time to live with regrets - you won't know if it's for you unless you try.  As a family, you and your partner need to both be invested in it 100% - years on the forum have shown that if you're both not up for it, the stress of it all can put cracks into the best of relationships.  If you find it's not for you - you haven't 'failed' in the slightest, it's been an opportunity that you've taken and on to the next adventure.  Come with the knowledge that Australia is a totally different country (not England with sunshine), there will be things that are familiar and lots that isn't, don't expect things to click right away (it can take time) and forming friendships won't be instantaneous - just like the UK, they'll develop over time.  Australia isn't Utopia by any means, but it can offer you the lifestyle you're looking for.  We've been here 13 years now and haven't once regrated our move - it's been hard work at times re-establishing ourselves in a new country/making friends etc. .. but for us, it's been absolutely worth it.  

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I just want PIO to be a happy place where people are nice to each other and unicorns poop rainbows

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One thing, good or bad experience, you certainly grow as a person!

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1 hour ago, starlight7 said:

One thing, good or bad experience, you certainly grow as a person!

Yup, your selfishness and self sufficiency certainly grows as you don't have the safety net to fall back on (I don't mean selfishness in a pejorative way, just that is a survival strategy) and that generally translates as a more coping adult (my sons are distinctly more coping than their partners who haven't had the experience of living in isolation from extended family. And I am astonished at the level of support those supposedly independent women actually think they need) 

Another thing to consider when moving is that sometimes things change so even if you arrive thinking this is the best thing since sliced bread, a few decades down the track either your life or your nearest and dearest's may have cataclysmic changes and that may mean that you need to consider where you are in the world. The key is not to get trapped anywhere and that you are always free to move where and when you feel the need. 

I agree with Marisa above - Australia isn't England on the other side of the world with "better" weather and English as it's national language. Treat  it as you would any foreign country and a move will either work or it wont. If it doesn't (and I don't mean things like "no decent sausages") then move on, it's not a jail and if it becomes a jail for whatever reason then you're screwed.  If you belong you're fine but if you don't belong you're going to struggle to make it work long term and that sense of "belonging" is very ephemeral and not at all decided by logic. Of my cohort of Expat friends (and accidentally, most of my friends are expats) only one "belongs" in Australia (she was from Manchester so that may be it!) the others are all now trapped for one reason or another and all would give their eye teeth for what we have been able to do (escape for 8 years) And these are people who've  been in Australia for decades. Looking at them though, I don't know that any of them came with an intention of doing more than having a good adventure at the time and for a time it was a good adventure. Maybe that was the migrant attitude of the 60s and 70s. I dunno.

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1 hour ago, Quoll said:

Yup, your selfishness and self sufficiency certainly grows as you don't have the safety net to fall back on (I don't mean selfishness in a pejorative way, just that is a survival strategy) and that generally translates as a more coping adult (my sons are distinctly more coping than their partners who haven't had the experience of living in isolation from extended family. And I am astonished at the level of support those supposedly independent women actually think they need) 

Another thing to consider when moving is that sometimes things change so even if you arrive thinking this is the best thing since sliced bread, a few decades down the track either your life or your nearest and dearest's may have cataclysmic changes and that may mean that you need to consider where you are in the world. The key is not to get trapped anywhere and that you are always free to move where and when you feel the need. 

I agree with Marisa above - Australia isn't England on the other side of the world with "better" weather and English as it's national language. Treat  it as you would any foreign country and a move will either work or it wont. If it doesn't (and I don't mean things like "no decent sausages") then move on, it's not a jail and if it becomes a jail for whatever reason then you're screwed.  If you belong you're fine but if you don't belong you're going to struggle to make it work long term and that sense of "belonging" is very ephemeral and not at all decided by logic. Of my cohort of Expat friends (and accidentally, most of my friends are expats) only one "belongs" in Australia (she was from Manchester so that may be it!) the others are all now trapped for one reason or another and all would give their eye teeth for what we have been able to do (escape for 8 years) And these are people who've  been in Australia for decades. Looking at them though, I don't know that any of them came with an intention of doing more than having a good adventure at the time and for a time it was a good adventure. Maybe that was the migrant attitude of the 60s and 70s. I dunno.

Some like myself ‘didn’t belong’ then did.  Maybe that’s because I’m a southerner...

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1 hour ago, Bulya said:

Some like myself ‘didn’t belong’ then did.  Maybe that’s because I’m a southerner...

I'm A Southerner and have never belonged despite all sorts of logical rationalisation. I'm still waiting for the belonging penny to drop.

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20 minutes ago, Quoll said:

I'm A Southerner and have never belonged despite all sorts of logical rationalisation. I'm still waiting for the belonging penny to drop.

I don't think it matters which part of the UK you're from.  Two of my good friends and their families went back 'home' to Scotland years ago.  All these years later though the two daughters from each family (born in Australia) are now both working and living happily in Sydney.  You never know where your children will end up.

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41 minutes ago, Quoll said:

I'm A Southerner and have never belonged despite all sorts of logical rationalisation. I'm still waiting for the belonging penny to drop.

Stop trying to ‘live like a Pom’.  Took me years to  work it out.  When in Rome......

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2 hours ago, Toots said:

I don't think it matters which part of the UK you're from.  Two of my good friends and their families went back 'home' to Scotland years ago.  All these years later though the two daughters from each family (born in Australia) are now both working and living happily in Sydney.  You never know where your children will end up.

One of mine is in UK and the other would like to live in UK (hates the heat) but has kids and his ex wouldn’t let him take them with him! They’re both pretty fixed for a few years yet!  

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7 hours ago, Bulya said:

Stop trying to ‘live like a Pom’.  Took me years to  work it out.  When in Rome......

I don't, that's the trouble! I'm very Aussie when I'm there - even when I'm not there, so I'm told and I have an Australian accent and all. It's much more ephemeral than that. I was chatting to a NZ chap the other day on the top of Mt Ainslie. Lived in Australia for over 20 years and said he still doesn't feel at home - "the colours are all wrong"! I know just what he meant! 

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