Move home? :-0

[juliaoz01]

So we moved to Perth from the north east England back in April. We had lived in Sydney in 2004 for a year in our twenties as backpackers and just loved it. Since then we have been back about 6 times. We love the east coast but have found housing very expensive and work (welding anyway) not particularly well paid. So, we settled on Perth as housing is cheaper, work is better paid and there’s more opportunities and the climate is better. However, we both are very miserable here. We always wanted to move here for a ‘better’ quality of life but that’s just not happening. My partner has managed to get work ok but the days are very long and we hardly see him. When we do he’s knackered. He is getting more and more depressed as he doesn’t get to spend the time he wants with our four year old son. I am pregnant with twins and due pretty much any time now. It has been really hard to meet people, and the acquaintances we have formed all tend to be from the UK or New Zealand. Australians either can’t understand us which is fair enough, or just don’t get us. Especially at work my partner has found it hard just getting along with people which is very unusual. 

We also have 3 dogs and aside from the beach there’s just nowhere to take them. They have to either be on a lead or arent allowed. The beaches are nice but finding one without huge rips and that are dangerous is hard work.

I feel like such a whinger but worst of all I feel like a fraud. We spent the last 14 years desperate to get back here, but I think we aren’t the people we were then and Australia isn’t the country to fulfill the dreams we had in our twenties. But we left England because we weren’t happy and thought life here would be that much better. But the isolation, the work and the amount of rules and regulations they have here for everything is just making things so much harder. Aside from the weather, I don’t know if I want our children growing up here as there are so many social issues. I know 9 months isn’t a long time but we have that feeling of dread in the pit of our stomach all the time and it’s just eating away at us. Is this normal and/or has anyone else moved out here just to feel like they’ve made a big mistake?

[Toots]

31 minutes ago, juliaoz01 said:

So we moved to Perth from the north east England back in April. We had lived in Sydney in 2004 for a year in our twenties as backpackers and just loved it. Since then we have been back about 6 times. We love the east coast but have found housing very expensive and work (welding anyway) not particularly well paid. So, we settled on Perth as housing is cheaper, work is better paid and there’s more opportunities and the climate is better. However, we both are very miserable here. We always wanted to move here for a ‘better’ quality of life but that’s just not happening. My partner has managed to get work ok but the days are very long and we hardly see him. When we do he’s knackered. He is getting more and more depressed as he doesn’t get to spend the time he wants with our four year old son. I am pregnant with twins and due pretty much any time now. It has been really hard to meet people, and the acquaintances we have formed all tend to be from the UK or New Zealand. Australians either can’t understand us which is fair enough, or just don’t get us. Especially at work my partner has found it hard just getting along with people which is very unusual. 

We also have 3 dogs and aside from the beach there’s just nowhere to take them. They have to either be on a lead or arent allowed. The beaches are nice but finding one without huge rips and that are dangerous is hard work.

I feel like such a whinger but worst of all I feel like a fraud. We spent the last 14 years desperate to get back here, but I think we aren’t the people we were then and Australia isn’t the country to fulfill the dreams we had in our twenties. But we left England because we weren’t happy and thought life here would be that much better. But the isolation, the work and the amount of rules and regulations they have here for everything is just making things so much harder. Aside from the weather, I don’t know if I want our children growing up here as there are so many social issues. I know 9 months isn’t a long time but we have that feeling of dread in the pit of our stomach all the time and it’s just eating away at us. Is this normal and/or has anyone else moved out here just to feel like they’ve made a big mistake?

Sounds to me like you need to move home.  You say you have a feeling of dread in the pit of your stomach and it's eating away at you both.  That is no way to live.  There are loads of people who have moved back to the UK for various reasons and most seem to have settled back there just fine.

Sorry things haven't worked out but at least you gave it a try and you now understand that the UK isn't as bad as you thought.  You will probably see it through different eyes now after your experience in Perth.

All the best.

 

 

 

[nicolesmith]

Sorry, this won't be an answer to your post, but I just wanted to ask as we are considering a move back to the UK next year...you mentioned that you don't know if you want your kids growing up here as there are so many social issues.  Is that compared to the UK?  Would you mind saying what some of those issues are? We've always thought the UK had more issues than here, and it's been a concern for us, so I would love to hear your opinion of the difference between the two countries.

 

As an aside, I wonder if things are different in Perth.  You mentioned that your partner has found it difficult getting on with people there.  We visited Perth four years ago and my hubby who gets on with literally everyone, found that every time he opened his mouth to say something in any shop or restaurant in Perth, the person he was speaking to seemed to be really offended and was very snippy in response.  We've never encountered that ANYWHERE else, just Perth.  It was so weird.

I know some people like Perth, but for us the week we spent there was plenty enough for us to realise that we never wanted to go back there.  It just wasn't for us.  And yet we love the East Coast, Queensland in particular.  Could you make the move over to the east coast, or do you have a requirement to stay in WA?

Do you have permanent residence here?  

[Antipodista]

What a tough position you are in But congratulations on your pregnancy!

 In my experience, whilst you might be able to start tolerating feeling displaced a bit better, if you are feeling this now when this is supposed to be the migration honeymoon period, things won’t improve. You could try the East Coast but do you have the resources to do so? Do you have a lot of family support in the UK? My views on Aus totally changed once I had babies there. 

The positive to it all is that you’ve given things a go and you are both on the same page - when one loves it and one hates it that’s worse than tricky! See how you feel after Christmas. There’s no shame in going home if you choose and being satisfied that you had a go at it and scratched the itch that you’ve had for years!

[Marisawright]

Go home. Your feelings will only get worse as time goes by. You’re not crazy for not liking Perth. Sydney and Perth are as different as London and Dundee. Just because you felt at home in one, doesn’t mean you can settle in the other.

My niece did the same as you. Did her WHV in Sydney and loved every second. A few years later, working for a company inLondon, she got the chance of a transfer to the Perth office. She hated Perth and only stayed for six months.

Edited December 4, 2018 by Marisawright

[juliaoz01]

6 hours ago, nicolesmith said:

Sorry, this won't be an answer to your post, but I just wanted to ask as we are considering a move back to the UK next year...you mentioned that you don't know if you want your kids growing up here as there are so many social issues.  Is that compared to the UK?  Would you mind saying what some of those issues are? We've always thought the UK had more issues than here, and it's been a concern for us, so I would love to hear your opinion of the difference between the two countries.

 

As an aside, I wonder if things are different in Perth.  You mentioned that your partner has found it difficult getting on with people there.  We visited Perth four years ago and my hubby who gets on with literally everyone, found that every time he opened his mouth to say something in any shop or restaurant in Perth, the person he was speaking to seemed to be really offended and was very snippy in response.  We've never encountered that ANYWHERE else, just Perth.  It was so weird.

I know some people like Perth, but for us the week we spent there was plenty enough for us to realise that we never wanted to go back there.  It just wasn't for us.  And yet we love the East Coast, Queensland in particular.  Could you make the move over to the east coast, or do you have a requirement to stay in WA?

Do you have permanent residence here?  

Hi Nicole

Thanks for your reply. With regards to social issues, I find that there are many across the spectrum! Ranging from what I consider worrying social issues such as the problems they have with crystal meth here, to the social issues they have in just general lack of manners and general hospitality. I’ve never found Australians as being unfriendly however, but in Perth they are very secular and we both feel very much like outsiders. It’s like if you’re not from here you are missing some big piece of the puzzle. I find some things very disturbing in that I have been to places where couples are physically fighting and people just look away, or they are off their heads on drugs. Of course I have witnessed things like that in the uk, more to do with being drunk but in broad daylight when I have our 4 year old son with me it’s quite confronting. I’m from the north east where people will talk to anyone in general and you can chat away to people like you’ve known them all your life, so I just find it very much like it’s closed ranks here. Sometimes it’s nice don’t get me wrong! And it’s certainly not everyone. I don’t like the men here at all on the whole. A lot of them they have no manners and treat women like crap. They’ll happily just watch me struggle to pick up things or to get out of the car when I’m 8 months pregnant. In fact they seem to find it amusing. 

Your husband is bang on about them being snippy. They have a huge chip on their shoulder, I have no idea why but they do. Perhaps it’s down to the fact they feel inferior to the rest of Australia, but if they adjusted their attitudes maybe they would be respected a bit more. The shops here close early and restaurants you’re lucky if they’re open past 8.30. I know there are more options in the city but you’d expect there to be really! It is weird, that’s definitely what the W stands for in WA! We have permanent residency and have spent a lot of time on the east coast. We’d love to move to Sydney but i just don’t know how we could realistically make it work from a financial point of view. The houses there are just so expensive. We want to live somewhere where you have a life - restaurants, shopping, museums and that’s a bit more cultured as well as beaches, parks etc. Sydney would be perfect but I don’t know if we could do it financially. I’ve been to Brisbane and liked that too, so that’s an option rather than just going. I just worry that if we moved over and still didn’t settle, that’s more money gone. Probably a lot less than moving home and wishing we’d stayed in Australia though!

Are you in the uk or Australia? I feel such a failure for thinking like this and so soon, like everything we have dreamed of is just crashing down around us

[juliaoz01]

5 hours ago, Antipodista said:

What a tough position you are in But congratulations on your pregnancy!

 In my experience, whilst you might be able to start tolerating feeling displaced a bit better, if you are feeling this now when this is supposed to be the migration honeymoon period, things won’t improve. You could try the East Coast but do you have the resources to do so? Do you have a lot of family support in the UK? My views on Aus totally changed once I had babies there. 

The positive to it all is that you’ve given things a go and you are both on the same page - when one loves it and one hates it that’s worse than tricky! See how you feel after Christmas. There’s no shame in going home if you choose and being satisfied that you had a go at it and scratched the itch that you’ve had for years!

Thank you - twins as well! 🥴

have you made the move back to the uk or are you in Australia? How did things change for you once you had children? Do you mean for the better or worse? I do think that if you’re not in to sport especially over here you are on the backfoot already. I don’t know, my son might be but I do know already how incredibly bright he is and he will go far academically. I thought schooling would be better here but what he’s expected to know at his age here he learned 2 years ago! If it’s like that and he’s 4 what will it be like when he’s 16?!

We own our home here in Perth but we couldn’t buy as house on the Gold Coast or Sydney similar to what we have here. Plus wages are generally lower over there for welders which is why we chose Perth. I love the east coast don’t get me wrong, Sydney is probably one of my favourite places in the world and if we could afford to buy a house there we’d make it work somehow. Yeah our family are pretty good back home. Mine are my parents only grandkids

I think you’re right, we will have the twins keeping us very busy soon and I think before we know it we will have been here a year. We are looking to go back to visit next Christmas and I think that will sway us. Whether we are seeing it through rose coloured glasses still, and the best bits we remember and the rest we have blocked out! 

[Drumbeat]

32 minutes ago, juliaoz01 said:

I’m from the north east where people will talk to anyone in general and you can chat away to people like you’ve known them all your life, so I just find it very much like it’s closed ranks here.

Sorry to hear you're having a tough time Juliaoz01. I'm also from the North East so can appreciate your comment above.

I've been here nearly 30 years and I agree Perth people aren't particularly friendly (even my WA born husband agrees). Older people and country folk are the exception to this and are usually lovely.

Are any of the parents coming over to help when the twins are born? You say you left England because you weren’t happy, do you think the same issues will be there if you return? If the answers yes then maybe it's worth considering a move to the East Coast.

Best wishes with whatever you decide.

 

[Quoll]

Congratulations on your impending new arrivals!

My 2c worth - go home before it's too late and while you might have some chance to retrieve part of your old life. If you've the feeling of dread now then the best you are likely to hope for is desensitisation and a perpetual feeling of being alien. I'm guessing that your dissatisfaction with UK before you left was mainly because you thought the grass was greener in Australia after your backpacking years.

[juliaoz01]

1 hour ago, Drumbeat said:

Sorry to hear you're having a tough time Juliaoz01. I'm also from the North East so can appreciate your comment above.

I've been here nearly 30 years and I agree Perth people aren't particularly friendly (even my WA born husband agrees). Older people and country folk are the exception to this and are usually lovely.

Are any of the parents coming over to help when the twins are born? You say you left England because you weren’t happy, do you think the same issues will be there if you return? If the answers yes then maybe it's worth considering a move to the East Coast.

Best wishes with whatever you decide.

 

Do you still live in Perth? They are a strange breed here, not all of them I might add! I have met some nice people but I do find them guarded. For example I met a lovely lady at my sons school and used to talk to her every week when we collected our kids. Queue to last week which was the end of term and she just disappeared without a word! No I hope things go well with the babies, have a nice Christmas...just a bit odd. 

Yes my mam arrives day after Boxing Day, be interesting to see what her take is on things. My dad was due to come too but my sister is poorly and has nobody to look after her so he has to stay. I think that has made things worse as I’d love them both to be here. Yes the same issues will always be there if we went home. The last five years have been hard work as we have both had health problems. I think we became so fixated on coming out here and when I had a miscarriage at the start of the year it was the final straw for us. We just wanted a new start. We both miss friends and family but also our social life in terms of eating out, being able to have a few drinks etc and not feeling as isolated. The main issue with the uk was always the weather and we were fed up of low wages and rising costs. However, the grass really isn’t greener here. I don’t feel like you have as much freedom here despite the better weather. We brought our dogs here and I hate seeing their sad little faces because it’s so hard to take them out in the country (they’re border collies). Ok it’s hard being heavily pregnant and I’m willing to see if things improve but when we are both unhappy it’s hard to keep the other one up at times. Like someone said earlier if we feel like this in the honeymoon period.....it’s so dispiriting and I do feel like the stereotypical whinging Pom! 

[juliaoz01]

18 minutes ago, Quoll said:

Congratulations on your impending new arrivals!

My 2c worth - go home before it's too late and while you might have some chance to retrieve part of your old life. If you've the feeling of dread now then the best you are likely to hope for is desensitisation and a perpetual feeling of being alien. I'm guessing that your dissatisfaction with UK before you left was mainly because you thought the grass was greener in Australia after your backpacking years.

Thank you - two 🥴🥴 Exciting times but nerve wracking too! 

I know what you mean. I worry about moving back and people having moved on, even though I’m told by ex pats here nobody moves on back home! I just find it hard to meet people here. I’ve gone to school things with my son and I get the odd chat going then it just fizzles. I don’t think I’m particularly boring! I am pretty friendly and easy going and will talk to pretty much anyone. Even in our street you find people just don’t want to talk. If I worked it might be easier but with having twins that’s a fair way off. Yes, you’re right about backpacking. We felt so free and had so much fun in Sydney. I’ve been back 5 times since and seen a lot of Australia. Once we had our son we just wanted to come back to give him a better shot at life really. There’s so many people in the UK. However I feel guilty bringing him away from his family to a place that I don’t think will benefit him as much as I had thought in the long run. Ok he will enjoy the outdoors a lot more, but aside from that I don’t know what else there is here for him

[Antipodista]

Have you thought about Melbourne? That’s a bit of a halfway house, though I suspect the wage thing will be the same.

Im back in the UK for now and locked in what seems like a perpetual struggle with my husband about it. I was never bowled over by Aus but grew to like it...then came to dislike it! I didn’t realize that though until I got back here. Once I had my kids the sense of homesickness just became intolerable and I missed being able to show my kids the things I loved about my childhood - autumn leaves and conkers, cold Christmases where everyone makes a massive fuss, playing in the snow, snowdrops and the buds in spring, strawberry and apple picking, national trust places and castles...its only since I’ve been back that you realize the diversity of things to do with kids here and I didn’t find it there. I bounced between the beach (which is nice but not the be all and end all) and the local RSL and shopping mall. That was it and it just was not for me. Also I found it far easier to make meaningful connections here, it’s more relaxed. I got sick in Aus of sitting in the playgrounds by myself hoping to hear an English accent or a conversation I could get involved in. I didn’t realize how lonely I was.

that being said some people thrive there (most, if the hype is to be believed. There is a sense of “if you don’t love Aus there must be something wrong with you - don’t believe that!) I’d give it a few more months and if you have the resources try another area. Have the babies (the maternity healthcare was great in my experience) and see how you settle. But you aren’t mad for not loving it and if you do go home - that’s ok. It’s not for everyone (even though we get told that it is!!)

[juliaoz01]

3 hours ago, Antipodista said:

Have you thought about Melbourne? That’s a bit of a halfway house, though I suspect the wage thing will be the same.

Im back in the UK for now and locked in what seems like a perpetual struggle with my husband about it. I was never bowled over by Aus but grew to like it...then came to dislike it! I didn’t realize that though until I got back here. Once I had my kids the sense of homesickness just became intolerable and I missed being able to show my kids the things I loved about my childhood - autumn leaves and conkers, cold Christmases where everyone makes a massive fuss, playing in the snow, snowdrops and the buds in spring, strawberry and apple picking, national trust places and castles...its only since I’ve been back that you realize the diversity of things to do with kids here and I didn’t find it there. I bounced between the beach (which is nice but not the be all and end all) and the local RSL and shopping mall. That was it and it just was not for me. Also I found it far easier to make meaningful connections here, it’s more relaxed. I got sick in Aus of sitting in the playgrounds by myself hoping to hear an English accent or a conversation I could get involved in. I didn’t realize how lonely I was.

that being said some people thrive there (most, if the hype is to be believed. There is a sense of “if you don’t love Aus there must be something wrong with you - don’t believe that!) I’d give it a few more months and if you have the resources try another area. Have the babies (the maternity healthcare was great in my experience) and see how you settle. But you aren’t mad for not loving it and if you do go home - that’s ok. It’s not for everyone (even though we get told that it is!!)

Oh my you pretty much summed up exactly how I feel with regards to kids and showing them all the stuff we had as kids. I’m exactly the same, I didn’t really appreciate all the things we have culturally to show our kids until I come here. Granted there are things, it’s not a complete culture less void! For example the gruffalos child was just on at the theatre here. But in general, things like railway museums and steam railways (son is train mad), museums, being able to go to the woods even though it’s raining....you do miss it. I do find exactly like you say - I hang out (it did until it required a crane to get me there!), at playgrounds hoping to connect with someone English! Invariably they will be the only ones who will speak anyway. Aside from the beach and playgrounds there isn’t a great deal to do with him. And now it’s snake season I’m paranoid as hell! There was a gigantic spider in his bedroom the other week and that absolutely freaked us out even though heath thought it was brilliant! 

We are busy having our garden done and I’m hoping once we have a pool in it might make us appreciate being here a bit more. I had considered Melbourne, it is expensive but not Sydney expensive. The main niggle I have with moving is that we do have family in Perth as my mams cousin lives ten minutes away. I worry that if we have struggled to adjust with support and having them here, how would we manage completely alone? In general we get on very well with them. They are at just complete polar opposites in their opinions on it here. He hates it, been here 35 years and aside from the weather he can’t stand it. He hates going home because he settles straight back in to life in the uk. However he makes very little effort with people here. Whether that is the result of 35 years of misery I don’t know! But he doesn’t socialise at all but will as soon as he is back in England. She loves it in general. After a week back in the uk she can’t wait to get back. Granted she misses her kids and grandkids a lot. However, she still works and likes her job (he hated his and was there 30 years!), and has a good social life. She accepts it isn’t perfect but thinks they’ve all had a better life than if they stayed in England. They left in their mid twenties however, I am 40 in January so maybe it is an age thing now. 

I agree I have found healthcare here on the whole much better, even the public system which does put the nhs to shame. Prescriptions are the biggest thing but the standard of healthcare on the whole is much better and appointments are great as you don’t wait months and months to be seen! 

Youre spot on in that we are told it’s better here and we’d be mad to go back. That’s what puts me off too - how many people will say are you crazy for coming back when most of them have never been here. Living somewhere and going on holiday are two entirely different things. I love turkey but I’d never move there! I’d like to see wanted down under do a follow up programme about people who return back to the uk after emigrating, that’d be very interesting 

[Marisawright]

Forget the “life is better in Australia” rubbish. That was true twenty years ago but not now. Personally I prefer Australia but it’s just a personal preference. Neither country is better, they’re just different. Your kids will have just as bright a future wherever you live.

There is a thread on these forums somewhere full of stories from people who went home and are loving it

Edited December 4, 2018 by Marisawright

[can1983]

1 hour ago, Marisawright said:

Forget the “life is better in Australia” rubbish. That was true twenty years ago but not now. Personally I prefer Australia but it’s just a personal preference. Neither country is better, they’re just different. Your kids will have just as bright a future wherever you live.

There is a thread on these forums somewhere full of stories from people who went home and are loving it

I agree the days of a clear choice that Australia has better opportunities are long gone. Now it is more balanced. Personally I don't see the appeal of an 'all British' family moving anywhere in Australia leaving family behind in the UK. The days of 5 bedroom house on a five acre block on a cleaners wage are long gone.

I think if I didn't have a half Australian family I wouldn't have moved here.

[s713]

11 hours ago, juliaoz01 said:

Hi Nicole

Thanks for your reply. With regards to social issues, I find that there are many across the spectrum! Ranging from what I consider worrying social issues such as the problems they have with crystal meth here, to the social issues they have in just general lack of manners and general hospitality. I’ve never found Australians as being unfriendly however, but in Perth they are very secular and we both feel very much like outsiders. It’s like if you’re not from here you are missing some big piece of the puzzle. I find some things very disturbing in that I have been to places where couples are physically fighting and people just look away, or they are off their heads on drugs. Of course I have witnessed things like that in the uk, more to do with being drunk but in broad daylight when I have our 4 year old son with me it’s quite confronting. I’m from the north east where people will talk to anyone in general and you can chat away to people like you’ve known them all your life, so I just find it very much like it’s closed ranks here. Sometimes it’s nice don’t get me wrong! And it’s certainly not everyone. I don’t like the men here at all on the whole. A lot of them they have no manners and treat women like crap. They’ll happily just watch me struggle to pick up things or to get out of the car when I’m 8 months pregnant. In fact they seem to find it amusing. 

Your husband is bang on about them being snippy. They have a huge chip on their shoulder, I have no idea why but they do. Perhaps it’s down to the fact they feel inferior to the rest of Australia, but if they adjusted their attitudes maybe they would be respected a bit more. The shops here close early and restaurants you’re lucky if they’re open past 8.30. I know there are more options in the city but you’d expect there to be really! It is weird, that’s definitely what the W stands for in WA! We have permanent residency and have spent a lot of time on the east coast. We’d love to move to Sydney but i just don’t know how we could realistically make it work from a financial point of view. The houses there are just so expensive. We want to live somewhere where you have a life - restaurants, shopping, museums and that’s a bit more cultured as well as beaches, parks etc. Sydney would be perfect but I don’t know if we could do it financially. I’ve been to Brisbane and liked that too, so that’s an option rather than just going. I just worry that if we moved over and still didn’t settle, that’s more money gone. Probably a lot less than moving home and wishing we’d stayed in Australia though!

Are you in the uk or Australia? I feel such a failure for thinking like this and so soon, like everything we have dreamed of is just crashing down around us

We're leaving Perth after 10 years and returning to the UK and I would echo a lot of your post (I am a bloke by the way).

The older generation in Perth are mostly fine but the young blokes are horrible. I would hate to have a daughter here having to choose a partner from this lot, they are sexist as hell and a lot are drinkers (or worse) and prone to very anti-social behaviour. I know that's a generalisation but it doesn't mean it isn't true.

You're right about the drink and drug problems here, they're rife. My opinion is that most drugs in the UK tend to be more social e.g. Friday night drugs, drugs here are lifestyle drugs, you will see their effects all day, every day.

We live in Joondalup and it's a ghost town, like most suburbs are. Looks nice on pictures, one of those perfect Facebook lives that has little behind the veneer.

Unlike you though, I have the same opinion of the other States, I spend a fair amount of time on the road and, whilst I do find WA people scruffier and weirder, I think Aussies in general are fairly similar wherever.

After typing that, I still have to confess I have enjoyed most of our time here, it was worth doing. I just don't want to do it anymore, there is more to life than what's here.

Edited December 4, 2018 by s713

[s713]

Lo and behold, in today's news. Looks like this is the Hillary's/North Beach drive.

https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/beauty/face-body/is-australia-sexist-documentary-asks-if-men-and-women-are-equal-in-the-21st-century/news-story/4c89cf7404ccd1d5f73d8307f7ae3020

 

[Toots]

1 hour ago, can1983 said:

I agree the days of a clear choice that Australia has better opportunities are long gone. Now it is more balanced. Personally I don't see the appeal of an 'all British' family moving anywhere in Australia leaving family behind in the UK. The days of 5 bedroom house on a five acre block on a cleaners wage are long gone.

I think if I didn't have a half Australian family I wouldn't have moved here.

Yes I agree with you. 

We have often said that if we had children in the UK we wouldn't have moved to Australia as we were settled and happy very near Liverpool, England.  By the way OH is Australian.  Life was easy in those days and we had the kids after we'd been here 3 years.  Started off in Sydney.  Moved to Perth where I had 2 children then moved back to Sydney.  Now retired in Tasmania.

As far as men - young men in particular go, yes some are right bogans but there are plenty of decent ones too.  My OH for a start    Some of the females aren't much better.  I certainly hope we've made a good job of bringing up two lads.  Neither of them are living in Australia just now.  They and most of their friends are living and working overseas for the time being.

Edited December 5, 2018 by Toots

[nicolesmith]

12 hours ago, juliaoz01 said:

Hi Nicole

Thanks for your reply. With regards to social issues, I find that there are many across the spectrum! Ranging from what I consider worrying social issues such as the problems they have with crystal meth here, to the social issues they have in just general lack of manners and general hospitality. I’ve never found Australians as being unfriendly however, but in Perth they are very secular and we both feel very much like outsiders. It’s like if you’re not from here you are missing some big piece of the puzzle. I find some things very disturbing in that I have been to places where couples are physically fighting and people just look away, or they are off their heads on drugs. Of course I have witnessed things like that in the uk, more to do with being drunk but in broad daylight when I have our 4 year old son with me it’s quite confronting. I’m from the north east where people will talk to anyone in general and you can chat away to people like you’ve known them all your life, so I just find it very much like it’s closed ranks here. Sometimes it’s nice don’t get me wrong! And it’s certainly not everyone. I don’t like the men here at all on the whole. A lot of them they have no manners and treat women like crap. They’ll happily just watch me struggle to pick up things or to get out of the car when I’m 8 months pregnant. In fact they seem to find it amusing. 

Your husband is bang on about them being snippy. They have a huge chip on their shoulder, I have no idea why but they do. Perhaps it’s down to the fact they feel inferior to the rest of Australia, but if they adjusted their attitudes maybe they would be respected a bit more. The shops here close early and restaurants you’re lucky if they’re open past 8.30. I know there are more options in the city but you’d expect there to be really! It is weird, that’s definitely what the W stands for in WA! We have permanent residency and have spent a lot of time on the east coast. We’d love to move to Sydney but i just don’t know how we could realistically make it work from a financial point of view. The houses there are just so expensive. We want to live somewhere where you have a life - restaurants, shopping, museums and that’s a bit more cultured as well as beaches, parks etc. Sydney would be perfect but I don’t know if we could do it financially. I’ve been to Brisbane and liked that too, so that’s an option rather than just going. I just worry that if we moved over and still didn’t settle, that’s more money gone. Probably a lot less than moving home and wishing we’d stayed in Australia though!

Are you in the uk or Australia? I feel such a failure for thinking like this and so soon, like everything we have dreamed of is just crashing down around us

Hi Julia, 

Thanks for your reply - I really appreciate it, and found it very helpful.

We are currently in Australia, having spent the previous 6 years in NZ.

The reason I asked about PR is because if you have Aussie PR, you will automatically be granted residence in NZ on arrival at the airport. https://www.newzealandnow.govt.nz/why-choose-nz/compare-new-zealand/australia

 We applied for Aussie PR and were granted it back in 2011, because I had loved it here as a backpacker in the early 2000s. The only thing was that once we got PR and came here, we didn't feel as if it suited us as a family.  So we went across to NZ to visit friends and from there we were going to go back to the UK.

Anyway, long story short, we were given residence on arrival (as is any Aussie PR holder) and we loved it there, so we stayed.  After two years we applied for NZ PR and got it, and after five years, we became citizens.

We absolutely loved it there, but sold up to go back to the UK because having the kids sit in a house at the end of the world away from family, just seemed a bit empty.  But nothing has come together on the work front yet, so we have ended up here in Aus, this time on our NZ passport.  I do enjoy my time here, and we love the better weather.  But whilst we feel as though Oz suits us better this time around, we are still missing family and so hope to get something sorted out on the work front so that we can move closer (at least somewhere in the northern hemisphere, if not the UK).

So basically I was wanting to say that NZ could also be an option if you didn't fancy anywhere else in Australia, but if you are wanting to move back for the culture and for family, then I guess NZ wouldn't really do anything for you either, though it is lovely there!   

[can1983]

21 minutes ago, nicolesmith said:

Hi Julia, 

Thanks for your reply - I really appreciate it, and found it very helpful.

We are currently in Australia, having spent the previous 6 years in NZ.

The reason I asked about PR is because if you have Aussie PR, you will automatically be granted residence in NZ on arrival at the airport. https://www.newzealandnow.govt.nz/why-choose-nz/compare-new-zealand/australia

 We applied for Aussie PR and were granted it back in 2011, because I had loved it here as a backpacker in the early 2000s. The only thing was that once we got PR and came here, we didn't feel as if it suited us as a family.  So we went across to NZ to visit friends and from there we were going to go back to the UK.

Anyway, long story short, we were given residence on arrival (as is any Aussie PR holder) and we loved it there, so we stayed.  After two years we applied for NZ PR and got it, and after five years, we became citizens.

We absolutely loved it there, but sold up to go back to the UK because having the kids sit in a house at the end of the world away from family, just seemed a bit empty.  But nothing has come together on the work front yet, so we have ended up here in Aus, this time on our NZ passport.  I do enjoy my time here, and we love the better weather.  But whilst we feel as though Oz suits us better this time around, we are still missing family and so hope to get something sorted out on the work front so that we can move closer (at least somewhere in the northern hemisphere, if not the UK).

So basically I was wanting to say that NZ could also be an option if you didn't fancy anywhere else in Australia, but if you are wanting to move back for the culture and for family, then I guess NZ wouldn't really do anything for you either, though it is lovely there!   

Aren't NZ house prices crazy these days because everyone wants somewhere to move to if the world ends due to nuclear holocaust

[nicolesmith]

13 minutes ago, can1983 said:

Aren't NZ house prices crazy these days because everyone wants somewhere to move to if the world ends due to nuclear holocaust

Yep, that and there are also loads of Chinese people buying up the properties in Auckland, forcing the prices there higher.  I think the prices are slowing down a bit now, certainly outside of the Auckland area, and where we were there have been a couple of price reductions recently due to the houses not selling.

I had heard that Golden Bay in the South Island has a community of Americans who moved there in the 80s waiting for 'the end', and they are still there!

[Toots]

4 hours ago, nicolesmith said:

Yep, that and there are also loads of Chinese people buying up the properties in Auckland, forcing the prices there higher.  I think the prices are slowing down a bit now, certainly outside of the Auckland area, and where we were there have been a couple of price reductions recently due to the houses not selling.

I had heard that Golden Bay in the South Island has a community of Americans who moved there in the 80s waiting for 'the end', and they are still there!

Wealthy Chinese and Russians have bought properties  worth 2 billion quid in London in the past year.   Hard to believe they were communist countries not so long  ago though I think China still is??   Sydney and Melbourne also inundated with property buyers from China.

[Toots]

6 hours ago, s713 said:

Lo and behold, in today's news. Looks like this is the Hillary's/North Beach drive.

https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/beauty/face-body/is-australia-sexist-documentary-asks-if-men-and-women-are-equal-in-the-21st-century/news-story/4c89cf7404ccd1d5f73d8307f7ae3020

 

At least the whole sexism thing isn't being swept under the carpet.  I'm glad this program is being aired on SBS.  Unfortunately most sexist bogan types probably don't watch SBS so they won't see how awful it looks.  They would probably think is was funny anyway. 

[Bumblebee]

On 04/12/2018 at 16:13, juliaoz01 said:

So we moved to Perth from the north east England back in April. We had lived in Sydney in 2004 for a year in our twenties as backpackers and just loved it. Since then we have been back about 6 times. We love the east coast but have found housing very expensive and work (welding anyway) not particularly well paid. So, we settled on Perth as housing is cheaper, work is better paid and there’s more opportunities and the climate is better. However, we both are very miserable here. We always wanted to move here for a ‘better’ quality of life but that’s just not happening. My partner has managed to get work ok but the days are very long and we hardly see him. When we do he’s knackered. He is getting more and more depressed as he doesn’t get to spend the time he wants with our four year old son. I am pregnant with twins and due pretty much any time now. It has been really hard to meet people, and the acquaintances we have formed all tend to be from the UK or New Zealand. Australians either can’t understand us which is fair enough, or just don’t get us. Especially at work my partner has found it hard just getting along with people which is very unusual. 

We also have 3 dogs and aside from the beach there’s just nowhere to take them. They have to either be on a lead or arent allowed. The beaches are nice but finding one without huge rips and that are dangerous is hard work.

I feel like such a whinger but worst of all I feel like a fraud. We spent the last 14 years desperate to get back here, but I think we aren’t the people we were then and Australia isn’t the country to fulfill the dreams we had in our twenties. But we left England because we weren’t happy and thought life here would be that much better. But the isolation, the work and the amount of rules and regulations they have here for everything is just making things so much harder. Aside from the weather, I don’t know if I want our children growing up here as there are so many social issues. I know 9 months isn’t a long time but we have that feeling of dread in the pit of our stomach all the time and it’s just eating away at us. Is this normal and/or has anyone else moved out here just to feel like they’ve made a big mistake?

I think we can have ideas of what it'll be like before we arrive, when we are dreaming, and then the reality is very different! Like you say you are different people to back then, I think kids change everything too.

I'd go home. Esp if you are both feeling the same way about it. I stuck it out for 8-9 years trying to make it work and now I'm moving back alone with two kids. 

I agree with you, we too came for opportunity and a 'better' life but that didn't happen, what is 'better' anyway? The kids have no family here, I have no support and the reality is it was better, in my case, for one person only. There are heaps of problems in Australia and we have no reason to be here. Even if UK's not great at least its ours! 

Good luck with your decision. Go with your gut, the head gets in the way. Don't worry about what other people think either, time is relative and when you are unhappy 9months can feel like 9years! 

 

 

[Home and Happy]

On 04/12/2018 at 05:13, juliaoz01 said:

So we moved to Perth from the north east England back in April. We had lived in Sydney in 2004 for a year in our twenties as backpackers and just loved it. Since then we have been back about 6 times. We love the east coast but have found housing very expensive and work (welding anyway) not particularly well paid. So, we settled on Perth as housing is cheaper, work is better paid and there’s more opportunities and the climate is better. However, we both are very miserable here. We always wanted to move here for a ‘better’ quality of life but that’s just not happening. My partner has managed to get work ok but the days are very long and we hardly see him. When we do he’s knackered. He is getting more and more depressed as he doesn’t get to spend the time he wants with our four year old son. I am pregnant with twins and due pretty much any time now. It has been really hard to meet people, and the acquaintances we have formed all tend to be from the UK or New Zealand. Australians either can’t understand us which is fair enough, or just don’t get us. Especially at work my partner has found it hard just getting along with people which is very unusual. 

We also have 3 dogs and aside from the beach there’s just nowhere to take them. They have to either be on a lead or arent allowed. The beaches are nice but finding one without huge rips and that are dangerous is hard work.

I feel like such a whinger but worst of all I feel like a fraud. We spent the last 14 years desperate to get back here, but I think we aren’t the people we were then and Australia isn’t the country to fulfill the dreams we had in our twenties. But we left England because we weren’t happy and thought life here would be that much better. But the isolation, the work and the amount of rules and regulations they have here for everything is just making things so much harder. Aside from the weather, I don’t know if I want our children growing up here as there are so many social issues. I know 9 months isn’t a long time but we have that feeling of dread in the pit of our stomach all the time and it’s just eating away at us. Is this normal and/or has anyone else moved out here just to feel like they’ve made a big mistake?

It’s not all it’s made out to be. Listen to your gut feeling and seriously think about going back home.  It was the isolation and boredom  that drove us out of Perth.  I’ve had some good job offers to go back, but we would never do it again.  Life in U.K. is great and I would never throw all this away to go and live away out there again.