189 Visa Application - Lawyer, Barrister, Solicitor

[LawyerAbroad]

Hi guys,

 

This is my first time posting on the site. I've lurked in the background taking all your helpful advice and now I see an opportunity to put something back in. I'm a barrister in the UK and today I had the great news that my 189 application (and my partner's) has been granted. It's been quite a long haul. In fact, if there is a slower or more expensive way of getting a 189 visa I'd love to hear that story.

 

When I first considered applying for a 189 visa I really struggled to find anything other than generic information about the process of applying as a lawyer and no information at all about how much it might cost. So, if there is anyone who is a solicitor, a lawyer or barrister who is thinking about applying, I hope this (very) long list of hoops I've had to jump through leaves you more informed than I was going into the process.

 

Yes, it does mean re-qualifying. I got off pretty lightly having to do only 4 academic subjects and 2 practical subjects. Prepare a very thorough application for exemptions (I sent photocopies of the index to university text books, lecture handouts, etc that I found in my parents' loft to demonstrate the equivalence of the subjects I studied). This involves going back to university (it can be done by remote learning). Yes, that means lectures, tutorials, homework, coursework and exams. Yes, it does mean you will need to travel to Australia for a holiday to get admitted before you can even submit your Expression of Interest.

 

DON'T apply for conditional admission like I did. You won't get it and you'll have wasted your time and money. No, you don't need a Skills Assessment Letter. Your certificate of admission as a lawyer will suffice.

 

I've attached a spreadsheet showing the costs I've spent. In summary:

 

On further study: a little under £10,000

On the process of being admitted in Australia (excluding the study costs above): a bit over £4,000, although about £1,000 of the cost of flights was returning in Premium Economy.

On the fundamentals of making a visa application: over £5,000

 

Giving a grand total of: £19,078 over 2 years.

 

10.08.16 - Initial assessment of academic qualifications by LPAB received (Constitutional Law, Law of Associations, Legal Ethics, Practice & Procedure)

01.09.16 - Initial assessment of PLT (practical legal training) qualifications by LPAB received (One elective subject plus Commercial & Corporate Practice)

22.09.16 - Offered places on University of New England courses for academic subjects (distance learning)

05.10.16 - Applied for conditional admission as lawyer

24.10.16 - Started Corporations Law course

01.12.16 - Refused conditional admission by LPAB

20.02.17 - Started Constitutional Law course

23.05.17 - Constitutional Law exam

31.05.17 - Corporations Law exam

26.06.17 - Started Professional Conduct and Civil & Criminal Procedure courses.

13.08.17 - Commercial & Corporate Practice PLT oral assessment (College of Law)

11.09.17 - Commercial & Corporate Practice result

26.09.17 - Professional Conduct exam

27.09.17 - Civil & Criminal Procedure exam

20.10.17 - UNE academic results

10.11.17 - Final assessment of academic qualifications by LPAB

12.11.17 - Administrative Law PLT elective oral assessment (College of Law)

13.11.17 - Administrative Law PLT result

19.12.17 - Applied for unconditional admission as lawyer

06.02.18 - Application for admission approved by LPAB

23.03.18 - Admission ceremony in Sydney (Supreme Court of NSW)

05.04.18 - EOI submitted - Barrister ANZSCO 271111 (75 points)

08.04.18 - EOI updated

13.04.18 - Police checks requested

18.04.18 - Invited to apply for 189 visa

19.04.18 - Medicals booked

19.04.18 - Police checks prepared / dated

26.04.18 - Police checks received

09.05.18 - Medicals undertaken

16.05.18 - Medicals submitted to Australia by clinic

18.05.18 - Decision ready 189 application submitted

06.09.18 - Direct Grant

 

 I hope you find this useful!

Australia Costs copy.xlsx

[SWMOY04]

congratulations!!

[Guest The Pom Queen]

Hi @LawyerAbroad Congratulations on your visa. 

‘Thank you also for sharing your knowledge with the forum, it will be invaluable information for a number of our members.

You think that was hard, wait until you have to start finding a Suburb, arrange removals, start packing up the house etc lol  

Which State are you heading to? 

[LawyerAbroad]

Thank you. Not got round to thinking about any of that!! Not even on the radar!

My partner and I heading down in March to check-in the visas. Stops in NSW and VIC. I've been to Brisbane and Perth before, loved both, but expect I'm on a short leash the two main cities.

Thanks again.

[Tulip1]

Sounds very well deserved after all that! Good luck 

[wrussell]

Depending on your UK experience, you probably paid far too much.

[LawyerAbroad]

9 hours ago, wrussell said:

Depending on your UK experience, you probably paid far too much.

Oh no, that would be frustrating! Sadly, I'm no spring chicken any more, with 10 years at the Bar. From my research, I was quite fortunate in having to do just 4 academic subjects.

How many did you have to do? When did you do your re-qualification / further exams? There's obviously the course fees, purchase/importation of textbooks (they can't be purchased in the UK) and the fees for overseas exams. I hoped to leave a resource in the forum for future cross-qualifiers / lawyers who want to migrate, having done very extensive research on the most affordable options for further study. Would you be able to post where you found cheaper so they can be steered to what you saw and not just what I did?

Ta!

[wrussell]

I am a registered migration agent, not a lawyer

With your 10 years at the UK bar, admissions were drawing  long bow asking you to complete anything further.

I always advise UK solicitors to apply on their own behalf, but to take professional advice before dong so.

 

[LawyerAbroad]

Oh I see. Excuse my misunderstanding, from what you said I thought you were speaking from experience.

Unfortunately, as I discovered, its a misconception on this forum that simply being experienced or having done 'X' number of years as a lawyer gets you out of doing any further study as you suggest. There are 11 academic ('Priestley') subjects and 8 Practical Subjects. All applicants for admission must evidence that their overseas study or practice has equivalence (particularised explicitly) to each and every element of the subject. That means you could have been a lawyer for 40 years, but if you never studied or practised Corporations Law (like me) or Australian Constitutional Law (like me) then you will have to undertake that further study. Frustrating and expensive!

Attached are the Uniform Principles, which set it all out and which I found very helpful.

Hope that helps.

Uniform Principles for assessing Overseas Qualifications - with LPAB deletions on 17-03-2016.pdf

[wrussell]

Quote

I thought you were speaking from experience.

I was.

I do it for a living, but do not charge anywhere near enough which induces even barristers to offer ex gratia payments.

As barrister you can no doubt review the email excerpts re a barrister who did not have to sit anything and work out who wrote what:

I share your view, in my considered professional opinion I should get 500-10000% more.  Let's hope Australia agrees.  My income at Pump Court (2007/08) was even more dreadful.  If they do not count this experience and count only 5 yrs work experience (so 60 in total), would this still be ok given at present they are working on a calculation of 65 points?

  Can't find the PayPal thing on your website but would like to contribute $360 Australian to the Australian National Treat Westly's Great Grand Kids as a Token of Deep Appreciation Fund (NSW Division).

 I am very much appreciate your constant help and guidance throughout the process (and the fact I'm far from the only person you help mainly for the sake of helping people).  To say thanks, I would be grateful if you get something for the great grandkids on my behalf.  If I use the PayPal portal on your website, would this interfere with your business accounts or would this be OK?

 

 I got a new barrister's practising certificate today and will do the bits of work I can get.  Could it be better to leave out this current employment? (Form 80 Q 19 requires: 'a payslip from your current employment should also be included – this is especially important from applicants working in government departments.'  I do not expect to have a great deal of work to show them any time soon and don’t want this to cast doubt on the previous full time employment I need for points.)

Given they say I have a class WA with nil conditions, what do they mean by:

Permission to work

When your bridging visa (class WA) is in effect, you will have full permission to work.

It's in.

 

Couldn't have done it without you.

 

Kind regards,

 

'Taking written instructions, sol/client/witness conferences, producing court docs, calling / X-examining witnesses, addresses, legal research/argument, written advice'

 

          

         1)     Does it sufficiently cover the criteria and is it ok to put same for each firm I worked at?

 

         Yes to both. I would write solicitors in full.

                  Thanks for your email.

 

Had the flu when did the English test.  Head was spinning and was coughing more than speaking. So 90 for speaking shows what nonsense the scoring is.  Was my second time taking test as didn’t get speaking result needed last time - but did get 90 for writing.  All nonsense.

 

I appreciate my position that I want to pay GST even where it may not really be owed may appear a bit over the top and that you understand the relevant law and I don’t.  However, as discussed the other day, as a barrister I have to be completely beyond any possible criticism for even getting close to the line.  Yesterday I had a Bar Readers' course lecture by a Supreme Court judge entirely about how barristers must never ever get anywhere near being on the wrong side of any potential tax obligation.

 

As discussed I would be grateful if you would be kind enough to ensure you do charge me GST on anything that could even arguably / possibly attract it.  Therefore I do need to continue to instruct the payment remains for GST.  I really appreciate all your guidance and hope this does not cause inconvenience.  Any problems, please feel free to give me a call.

 

Thanks also for the advice re 190.  My feeling is that it is better to avoid it if possible.  However, if it is announced lawyers will be taken off the SOL, I will have to consider this carefully.  Clearly this would have to be done when there is still sufficient time left to allow submitting a 190 in time to (as far as possible) guarantee an invite before 1 July.

 

Can a 190 application be added but then an invitation to apply for a visa be not taken up without prejudicing main 189 application?

 

As always, thanks for guiding me and have a good weekend.

 

Kind regards,

 

         Thanks also for the advice re 190.  My feeling is that it is better to avoid it if possible.  However, if it is announced lawyers will be taken off the SOL, I will have to consider this carefully.  Clearly this would have to be done when there is still sufficient time left to allow submitting a 190 in time to (as far as possible) guarantee an invite before 1 July.

Can a 190 application be added but then an invitation to apply for a visa be not taken up without prejudicing main 189 application?

As always, thanks for guiding me and have a good weekend.

Kind regards,

 

Some legal practitioners in Australia are both barristers and solicitors. I think my representative in Darwin, xx, circa 1991, might have been. xx was appearing in the Family Court in Alice Springs when a disaffected husband armed with an assault rifle entered to murder his wife’s representative, as one does. xx had nothing to do with the case, but was shot through the spine and was subsequently confined permanently to a wheelchair. He lost the subsequent ‘duty of care’ damages action against the Commonwealth because there was no reason to suppose there was a risk to lawyers appearing in the Family Court.

Dear Westly,

 

Thanks for your email.  Many thanks in particular for your book, I had a chance to start it and it's absolutely spot on.

Can I check I'm clear on the total cost anticipated for advising til hopefully Visa provided?  Did you say its more tax efficient to sort things before I enter Australia on 3 April?

I chased up the 651 with the DIBP call centre for Europe and have now got it.  (Wonder if we can have our own call centre after Brexit?)

The urgent issue now is:

What the hell counts as skills assessment for a barrister?

DIBP call centre for Europe could only say contact the skills basement authority.  For a SOLICITOR (now apparently defined by statute as an 'Australian Lawyer') it is clearly the Victorian Legal Admissions Board (VLAB).  (The DIBP website is even out of date on this as the authority has changed, or at least changed its name to VLAB).

VLAB themselves know nothing.  Presumably because they don’t really have to do skills assessments.  This is because admission as an Australian Lawyer/solicitor counts as a skills assessment in itself for a solicitor.  I am due to be admitted as one of these on 5 April.

After this you are allowed to sign the bar roll by The Victorian Bar Inc (Vicbar).  Hopefully Vicbar will sort this on 20 April and issue me a practicing certificate on 21 April.  Vicbar is not a skills assessment authority as far as anyone knows and is not on the DIBP's supposedly complete list.  (To add to the fun their admissions officer insists the Solicitor/Barrister terminology should not really even be used anymore.)

Vicbar are deciding whether to let me off a 'reading' period where I have to be in chambers with an experienced Mentor for a few months.  Hopefully this is irrelevant for visa purposes, otherwise I better push harder.

 

Thanks for your help Westly.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[selfhelp]

Hi Lawyer Abroad! 

Thank you for such an informative post. I have been called to the Bar in the UK and have been in practice for 5 years now. I've been looking into re-qualifying in Australia and I'm still at very preliminary stages at the moment.

I'm having trouble deciding on which state/territory I should apply to for admission. If i commit and apply to a particular state/territory does that later on limit my practice within that particular state/territory? Or is this purely to pick and choose the court in which I will be later on called if I am successful in my exams? 

Also, how did you find distance learning whilst maintaining a full time job as a barrister (I'm assuming that you continued to work) Did you find the exam/course challenging or was it relatively manageable to complete within the timeframe that you did? 

[LawyerAbroad]

On 21/11/2018 at 08:41, selfhelp said:

Hi Lawyer Abroad! 

Thank you for such an informative post. I have been called to the Bar in the UK and have been in practice for 5 years now. I've been looking into re-qualifying in Australia and I'm still at very preliminary stages at the moment.

I'm having trouble deciding on which state/territory I should apply to for admission. If i commit and apply to a particular state/territory does that later on limit my practice within that particular state/territory? Or is this purely to pick and choose the court in which I will be later on called if I am successful in my exams? 

Also, how did you find distance learning whilst maintaining a full time job as a barrister (I'm assuming that you continued to work) Did you find the exam/course challenging or was it relatively manageable to complete within the timeframe that you did? 

Hi selfhelp

My profuse apologies for my tardy reply. I haven't been on the site for a while!

About to DM you.

Kind regards

[Alltogethernow]

On 06/09/2018 at 20:01, LawyerAbroad said:

Hi guys,

 

This is my first time posting on the site. I've lurked in the background taking all your helpful advice and now I see an opportunity to put something back in. I'm a barrister in the UK and today I had the great news that my 189 application (and my partner's) has been granted. It's been quite a long haul. In fact, if there is a slower or more expensive way of getting a 189 visa I'd love to hear that story.

.........

06.09.18 - Direct Grant

 

 I hope you find this useful!

Australia Costs copy.xlsx

Good for you, having been here a year on, we haven't looked back and everyday is like a dream come true.

B

[Earlymegski]

On 06/09/2018 at 11:01, LawyerAbroad said:

Hi guys,

 

This is my first time posting on the site. I've lurked in the background taking all your helpful advice and now I see an opportunity to put something back in. I'm a barrister in the UK and today I had the great news that my 189 application (and my partner's) has been granted. It's been quite a long haul. In fact, if there is a slower or more expensive way of getting a 189 visa I'd love to hear that story.

 

When I first considered applying for a 189 visa I really struggled to find anything other than generic information about the process of applying as a lawyer and no information at all about how much it might cost. So, if there is anyone who is a solicitor, a lawyer or barrister who is thinking about applying, I hope this (very) long list of hoops I've had to jump through leaves you more informed than I was going into the process.

 

Yes, it does mean re-qualifying. I got off pretty lightly having to do only 4 academic subjects and 2 practical subjects. Prepare a very thorough application for exemptions (I sent photocopies of the index to university text books, lecture handouts, etc that I found in my parents' loft to demonstrate the equivalence of the subjects I studied). This involves going back to university (it can be done by remote learning). Yes, that means lectures, tutorials, homework, coursework and exams. Yes, it does mean you will need to travel to Australia for a holiday to get admitted before you can even submit your Expression of Interest.

 

DON'T apply for conditional admission like I did. You won't get it and you'll have wasted your time and money. No, you don't need a Skills Assessment Letter. Your certificate of admission as a lawyer will suffice.

 

I've attached a spreadsheet showing the costs I've spent. In summary:

 

On further study: a little under £10,000

On the process of being admitted in Australia (excluding the study costs above): a bit over £4,000, although about £1,000 of the cost of flights was returning in Premium Economy.

On the fundamentals of making a visa application: over £5,000

 

Giving a grand total of: £19,078 over 2 years.

 

10.08.16 - Initial assessment of academic qualifications by LPAB received (Constitutional Law, Law of Associations, Legal Ethics, Practice & Procedure)

01.09.16 - Initial assessment of PLT (practical legal training) qualifications by LPAB received (One elective subject plus Commercial & Corporate Practice)

22.09.16 - Offered places on University of New England courses for academic subjects (distance learning)

05.10.16 - Applied for conditional admission as lawyer

24.10.16 - Started Corporations Law course

01.12.16 - Refused conditional admission by LPAB

20.02.17 - Started Constitutional Law course

23.05.17 - Constitutional Law exam

31.05.17 - Corporations Law exam

26.06.17 - Started Professional Conduct and Civil & Criminal Procedure courses.

13.08.17 - Commercial & Corporate Practice PLT oral assessment (College of Law)

11.09.17 - Commercial & Corporate Practice result

26.09.17 - Professional Conduct exam

27.09.17 - Civil & Criminal Procedure exam

20.10.17 - UNE academic results

10.11.17 - Final assessment of academic qualifications by LPAB

12.11.17 - Administrative Law PLT elective oral assessment (College of Law)

13.11.17 - Administrative Law PLT result

19.12.17 - Applied for unconditional admission as lawyer

06.02.18 - Application for admission approved by LPAB

23.03.18 - Admission ceremony in Sydney (Supreme Court of NSW)

05.04.18 - EOI submitted - Barrister ANZSCO 271111 (75 points)

08.04.18 - EOI updated

13.04.18 - Police checks requested

18.04.18 - Invited to apply for 189 visa

19.04.18 - Medicals booked

19.04.18 - Police checks prepared / dated

26.04.18 - Police checks received

09.05.18 - Medicals undertaken

16.05.18 - Medicals submitted to Australia by clinic

18.05.18 - Decision ready 189 application submitted

06.09.18 - Direct Grant

 

 I hope you find this useful!

Australia Costs copy.xlsx

Hi, I have found this thread really interesting.

 

j was wondering for some advice. My partner and I lived in Australia 2 years ago on a working holiday visa for 10 months. We can back to the UK so I could complete my training contract. I qualified as a solicitor last year and left my job after 3 months to work in policy as I didn’t think working a a solicitor was cut out for me.

we are thinking of moving back on a 189 visa. My partner is in construction and on the skilled list but im not sure if we will get 65 points. I’m thinking of looking at what I would need to do for my qualifications to be recognised to apply for the Visa although I wouldn’t intend to practise as a solicitor once I was there. 

Is the first step for me to get my qualifications assessed by the relevant state and then be informed of the list of courses I need to take? If it’s just so that I have an eligible career on the skilled list and not to practise in aharealia as I would look for policy work, would I need to do the same amount of courses as you ?

I’m finding the whole process really confusing...

thanks for all your help 

!

[VERYSTORMY]

1 hour ago, Earlymegski said:

Hi, I have found this thread really interesting.

 

j was wondering for some advice. My partner and I lived in Australia 2 years ago on a working holiday visa for 10 months. We can back to the UK so I could complete my training contract. I qualified as a solicitor last year and left my job after 3 months to work in policy as I didn’t think working a a solicitor was cut out for me.

we are thinking of moving back on a 189 visa. My partner is in construction and on the skilled list but im not sure if we will get 65 points. I’m thinking of looking at what I would need to do for my qualifications to be recognised to apply for the Visa although I wouldn’t intend to practise as a solicitor once I was there. 

Is the first step for me to get my qualifications assessed by the relevant state and then be informed of the list of courses I need to take? If it’s just so that I have an eligible career on the skilled list and not to practise in aharealia as I would look for policy work, would I need to do the same amount of courses as you ?

I’m finding the whole process really confusing...

thanks for all your help 

!

If you want to gain a visa as a main applicant you need to pass the skills assessment which will mean you undertaking the extra study required. If your partner has a occupation on the current skilled list, that may be a more sensible approach given cost involved. 

[LawyerAbroad]

4 hours ago, Earlymegski said:

Is the first step for me to get my qualifications assessed by the relevant state and then be informed of the list of courses I need to take? If it’s just so that I have an eligible career on the skilled list and not to practise in aharealia as I would look for policy work, would I need to do the same amount of courses as you ?

Hi, so yes the first step is to get your qualifications assessed by one of the State Legal Admissions Board. Whether you would have the same number of courses as me, just comes down to what they say. I had to do four academic and two practical legal training, which I know is fewer than most people.

This isn't a quick process and there is always the risk you will start cross-qualifying, only to find that Barrister / Solicitor is taken off the list! It has been flagged for removal in years past.

Good luck

[Earlymegski]

Thanks all

[Amber Snowball]

6 minutes ago, MigrationAgentPerth said:

Hi There,

You're facing some issues to applying for visa subclass 189. According to me you need some experts who provides the best migration agent services in australia. I had also applied for visa 500 for australia with the help of Migration Agent Perth team. In my way, they are one of the best Migration agents in australia. They support me each & every steps of applying student visa 500. I think The individuals who are not sponsored by family, employer or the state government can apply for the 189 Visa Perth and can work permanently anywhere in Australia. The applicants are required to fill the EOI (Expression of Interest) form to apply for skilled visa in Australia. Click here for more information.

It looks like you are advertising your own company. 

You need to contact admin about doing that.

 I ‘d advise people not to click on the unidentifiable enbedded links in the interim.

[KC24]

 

On 06/09/2018 at 11:01, LawyerAbroad said:

Hi guys,

 

This is my first time posting on the site. I've lurked in the background taking all your helpful advice and now I see an opportunity to put something back in. I'm a barrister in the UK and today I had the great news that my 189 application (and my partner's) has been granted. It's been quite a long haul. In fact, if there is a slower or more expensive way of getting a 189 visa I'd love to hear that story.

.....

 

 I hope you find this useful!

Australia Costs copy.xlsx

Thank you so much LawyerAbroad, I've been hunting everywhere for more information on this process and couldn't find anything!
My husband and I are looking to move to Australia and re-qualify in QLD. We are in a slightly different position in that my husband is a NZ citizen and we're doing the spouse visa route (largely because of the hassle of the 189 - looking at your post this was the right choice!), but as we're in for a long wait for my visa anyway I was hoping to get the ball rolling with re-qualification in the meantime. We may end up getting the assessment while still in the UK and study part-time while already in Australia. 

Having trawled through the Uniform Principles, I was starting to think we might be able to satisfy some of the "Experienced Practitioner" requirements by providing evidence of our experience to date - is this what you did? I've managed to track down detailed course descriptions for most of my courses which, on my reading of the Principles, covers many of the requirements but upon reading your posts it seems the relevant Board is looking for more information. I appreciate each application is subject to its own assessment and depends on the individual's experience not just PQE, but with your 10 years at the bar vs our 5yr PQE in private practice, I'm not filled with much hope for any exemption! What advice would you give in terms of evidence to support our experience?

On 21/11/2018 at 08:41, selfhelp said:

Also, how did you find distance learning whilst maintaining a full time job as a barrister (I'm assuming that you continued to work) Did you find the exam/course challenging or was it relatively manageable to complete within the timeframe that you did? 

I'd be interested to know your response to selfhelp's question above? 

I know we won't get away without any study (we're Scottish qualified so will definitely need to study Equity & Trusts). Were you free to pick any Australian university for the studies, or were you restricted to the state you were looking to get admitted to? The QLD LPAB guidance lists about 6-7 universities and I'm finding it difficult to find fees for single-course study, so your spreadsheet was very useful even as an indicator. Bond University was the only university with published fees and it's looking like $5k per course - as Scottish solicitors we could be studying up to 5 courses each so that's $50k right there!

Might just re-train to be an accountant.

[LawyerAbroad]

12 hours ago, KC24 said:

Having trawled through the Uniform Principles, I was starting to think we might be able to satisfy some of the "Experienced Practitioner" requirements by providing evidence of our experience to date - is this what you did?

Hi KC24,

Really glad this post was of some interest / use to you. So I broke the subjects down into two categories. 1) Those I could try to get exemption from based on my university studies. 2) Those I could try to get exemption from based on being a practising barrister (that included trust accounting).

For items in (1), I put together as much as I could. For example, I studied the Law of Evidence at university. I went to my parents' attic and found my old text book (photocopied the Contents pages), found all my old lecture /tutorial handouts and put them into a file. In my submission I explained how what I studied was very similar / identical to Evidence in Aus. And I did that for every subject that I was looking for exemption for. I remember doing the same for Administrative Law and the other subjects.

For items in (2), I wrote quite a lengthy piece for each item. For example, for trust accounting I explained that I am Direct Access qualified (I sent over the lever arch of study material for that course). I explained, making reference to  the course material, how I understood the restrictions on dealing with client money, etc etc and how I deployed that in practice.

I used the University of New England. They are very quick at responding to online queries and will provide individual course quotes. The university was very easy to deal with overall and I would recommend it. Don't forget about the (not insignificant) cost of buying textbooks and shipping them over. I used the UNE book shop.

So I did continue to work. I had the luxury of being self-employed, which meant I could take the days off for the 3 hour exams, which I took at the University of Leeds. All the exams were open book, which took some of the pressure of revision, but I still prepared crib sheets with key cases, etc so I wasn't wading through my course notes or text book. The study during the term was intense. Its an 11 week course (I think) for each subject. You have your 3 hour exam during week 12. So if you get behind with the work you end up in a bad place! Every week involves at least 100 pages plus of text book reading across two textbooks, usually. In addition there is a 2-3 hour lecture to watch AND a 1 hour tutorial. That is all per 1 subject. I studied over 2 semesters and did 2 subjects in both semesters. So that was 200 pages, 2 letters, etc. In week 5 (again I think) there is a 2,500 word coursework per subject to complete that is usually 30-40% of your final grade.

Is that any help?

[KC24]

2 hours ago, LawyerAbroad said:

Hi KC24,

Really glad this post was of some interest / use to you. So I broke the subjects down into two categories. 1) Those I could try to get exemption from based on my university studies. 2) Those I could try to get exemption from based on being a practising barrister (that included trust accounting).

For items in (1), I put together as much as I could. For example, I studied the Law of Evidence at university. I went to my parents' attic and found my old text book (photocopied the Contents pages), found all my old lecture /tutorial handouts and put them into a file. In my submission I explained how what I studied was very similar / identical to Evidence in Aus. And I did that for every subject that I was looking for exemption for. I remember doing the same for Administrative Law and the other subjects.

For items in (2), I wrote quite a lengthy piece for each item. For example, for trust accounting I explained that I am Direct Access qualified (I sent over the lever arch of study material for that course). I explained, making reference to  the course material, how I understood the restrictions on dealing with client money, etc etc and how I deployed that in practice.

I used the University of New England. They are very quick at responding to online queries and will provide individual course quotes. The university was very easy to deal with overall and I would recommend it. Don't forget about the (not insignificant) cost of buying textbooks and shipping them over. I used the UNE book shop.

So I did continue to work. I had the luxury of being self-employed, which meant I could take the days off for the 3 hour exams, which I took at the University of Leeds. All the exams were open book, which took some of the pressure of revision, but I still prepared crib sheets with key cases, etc so I wasn't wading through my course notes or text book. The study during the term was intense. Its an 11 week course (I think) for each subject. You have your 3 hour exam during week 12. So if you get behind with the work you end up in a bad place! Every week involves at least 100 pages plus of text book reading across two textbooks, usually. In addition there is a 2-3 hour lecture to watch AND a 1 hour tutorial. That is all per 1 subject. I studied over 2 semesters and did 2 subjects in both semesters. So that was 200 pages, 2 letters, etc. In week 5 (again I think) there is a 2,500 word coursework per subject to complete that is usually 30-40% of your final grade.

Is that any help?

Hi LawyerAbroad

This is so helpful I cannot thank you enough. Thank you for taking the time to provide such a detailed response, it’s greatly appreciated.

As we’re both full time private practice it’s looking likely that we’ll wait until we’re in Australia to start any study, but use the time we’re still in the UK to prepare a full response to the assessment application. I’m kicking myself slightly for being so ruthless in throwing out my course materials but I’m sure I could track down a friend who has a bit more nostalgia and loft space.

Thank you again for your help, congratulations on your visa and all the best with your move!

 

 

[selfhelp]

Hi LawyerAbroad,

Since my last post on here two months ago, I’ve submitted my qualifications for assessment and am still waiting to hear back from the admissions board. Should be hearing back any day now, I will keep everyone updated!

Following your post I managed to trace some course outline materials from my undergraduate days. Wasn’t able to find much since I’m no longer in the UK and obtaining further materials from the university I studied at would probably take too long. Doesn’t help either that I had sold my textbooks after graduation! Thank goodness for colleagues and friends who had kept some of their course materials. 

Im still in the midst of drafting my statements for each subject I’m seeking exemption for in the practical training, which I will submit sometime at the beginning of February. Fingers crossed I’ll be exempted from a reasonableness number of subjects. My only concern is the volume of work and studies while I am working a full time job. I have a number of trials coming up this year and I’m hoping I’ll be able to juggle distance learning and work at the same time.

Ive written a few emails to UNE to find out about their exam centers. As I’m currently residing in Asia, I’m concerned that I may need to travel abroad to take the exams. I wonder if I am able to take the exams online. How were you able to get quick responses from the university? Would you mind sharing the email address if you have a particular person you wrote to?

 

[LawyerAbroad]

22 hours ago, KC24 said:

Thank you again for your help, congratulations on your visa and all the best with your move!

Hope it goes well for you. Don't forget to update on how it works out!

PS. Also might be worth contacting your university and they may be able to provide you with the tutorial schedule and reading lists from when you were at university. My university couldn't help, but I was able to get a subject list from BVC provider, which was useful for PLT exemption.

[LawyerAbroad]

20 hours ago, selfhelp said:

I’ve submitted my qualifications for assessment

Brilliant. Congrats on getting it all together. It's an effort!

 

20 hours ago, selfhelp said:

How were you able to get quick responses from the university? Would you mind sharing the email address if you have a particular person you wrote to?

I didn't use any particular email, just the online portal for submission of questions ... https://www.une.edu.au/askune

[KC24]

On 27/01/2019 at 11:27, selfhelp said:

Since my last post on here two months ago, I’ve submitted my qualifications for assessment and am still waiting to hear back from the admissions board. Should be hearing back any day now, I will keep everyone updated!

 

All the best selfhelp! Looking forward to hearing how it goes. 

 

On 28/01/2019 at 08:20, LawyerAbroad said:

PS. Also might be worth contacting your university and they may be able to provide you with the tutorial schedule and reading lists from when you were at university. My university couldn't help, but I was able to get a subject list from BVC provider, which was useful for PLT exemption.

This was a top tip. My university are helpfully looking out course materials and I'm going to start pulling together materials over the next few weeks.  Thanks again!