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The (all new) Brexit Thread

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On 18/09/2019 at 13:14, BacktoDemocracy said:

For the Constitutional crisis that lying BoJo  and his lying far right mates have created.

Its alright, no need for anyone to expand their horizons or bother to read any long complicated articles or engage some critical faculties, they have traduced democracy and ridden rough shod over Parliament and I should think they are sat there chuckling at how easy it has been, no weekend occupations of London, no banging of tinpans all over London, no disruption to transport anywhere, easy peasy, coup successful 

A constitutional crisis?

The solution would be to deliver some kind of Brexit and stop trying to block it.....the constitutional crisis you speak of has been caused by the undemocratic manner in which the majority of MP's have acted in Parliament since the referendum result......it has clearly been lost on you that over the past 4 or 5 years Parliament agreed by a huge majority to give the public a say/a referendum on our EU membership......Parliament then agreed by another huge majority to implement the result of the referendum.....Parliament then agreed by another huge majority to trigger article 50......Labour and the conservatives campaigned in 2017 on a manifesto to accept and implement the result of the referendum......we are in the position we are in now because the majority of MP's that voted in favour of the above have now decided they know better than the 52% that voted to Leave and are doing everything within their power to block Brexit.....in return we have a PM that has come out and said he is going to do everything within his power to deliver it......all the legal wranglings and proroguing of Parliament are a result of the above......

The real irony here is John Major did the very same thing when "cash for questions" was threatening his government......he prorogued Parliament to delay a report into his MP's taking bribes!......and here he is standing up in front of a judge complaining about another tory PM doing the very same thing......this demonstrates more than anything how twisted and selfish this Brexit business has got.....you can bitch all you like about BJ.....I would agree with some of it.....however he is the only MP that has put up their hand and demanded that the referendum result be delivered......ASAP.....no more delays.....the problem is all the others......

 

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2 minutes ago, kungfustu said:

the majority of MP's that voted in favour of the above have now decided they know better than the 52% that voted to Leave and are doing everything within their power to block Brexit....

They do know better, far far better.  If Brexiters knew better, they'd have come up with a plan after 3 years.  If it was remotely feasible and affordable by the people who are going to have to foot the bill, instead of the n'er'do wells who expect everybody else to suffer.......it would have been done by now. 

We can all actually see now is that they, with yourself included, are a bunch of blowhards who couldn't find their way out of a paper bag.   This is where the constitutional crisis is coming from.  Mainly because most Brexiters are loose with the truth, loose with facts, know little of how their own country has run for 500 years....and they don't bloody like it !

If you don't believe me, watch Lady Hale tomorrow.  That should set you right.

Re: John Major, that was covered extensively in the Supreme Court last week, you might have missed it, but it's a non-story and completely untrue.

 

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"Nationalism is an infantile disease, it is the measles of mankind." Albert Einstein

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9 minutes ago, Slean Wolfhead said:

They do know better, far far better.  If Brexiters knew better, they'd have come up with a plan after 3 years.  If it was remotely feasible and affordable by the people who are going to have to foot the bill, instead of the n'er'do wells who expect everybody else to suffer.......it would have been done by now. 

We can all actually see now is that they, with yourself included, are a bunch of blowhards who couldn't find their way out of a paper bag.   This is where the constitutional crisis is coming from.  Mainly because most Brexiters are loose with the truth, loose with facts, know little of how their own country has run for 500 years....and they don't bloody like it !

If you don't believe me, watch Lady Hale tomorrow.  That should set you right.

Re: John Major, that was covered extensively in the Supreme Court last week, you might have missed it, but it's a non-story and completely untrue.

 

untrue?.........😂.........here you go again.......covering yourself in glory.......🙃

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31 minutes ago, kungfustu said:

A constitutional crisis?

The solution would be to deliver some kind of Brexit and stop trying to block it.....the constitutional crisis you speak of has been caused by the undemocratic manner in which the majority of MP's have acted in Parliament since the referendum result......it has clearly been lost on you that over the past 4 or 5 years Parliament agreed by a huge majority to give the public a say/a referendum on our EU membership......Parliament then agreed by another huge majority to implement the result of the referendum.....Parliament then agreed by another huge majority to trigger article 50......Labour and the conservatives campaigned in 2017 on a manifesto to accept and implement the result of the referendum......we are in the position we are in now because the majority of MP's that voted in favour of the above have now decided they know better than the 52% that voted to Leave and are doing everything within their power to block Brexit.....in return we have a PM that has come out and said he is going to do everything within his power to deliver it......all the legal wranglings and proroguing of Parliament are a result of the above......

The real irony here is John Major did the very same thing when "cash for questions" was threatening his government......he prorogued Parliament to delay a report into his MP's taking bribes!......and here he is standing up in front of a judge complaining about another tory PM doing the very same thing......this demonstrates more than anything how twisted and selfish this Brexit business has got.....you can bitch all you like about BJ.....I would agree with some of it.....however he is the only MP that has put up their hand and demanded that the referendum result be delivered......ASAP.....no more delays.....the problem is all the others......

 

Actually a lot of the MPs who voted in favour of the Brexit withdrawal agreement had campaigned against Brexit in the referendum and many of those voting against it campaigned for Brexit.  It is those Brexiteers who voted against Brexit 3 times that should be angering you the most.

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Timeline: 309/100 Sent 7/8/13, Money Taken 9/8/13, CO appointed 3/9/13. Med 3/12/13. Police check 4/12/13. VISA GRANTED 8/4/14, Subclass100. Recce August 2014. Arrived 30 July 2015.

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8 hours ago, kungfustu said:

untrue?.........😂.........here you go again.......covering yourself in glory.......🙃

And you, i take it, are being told what to believe by the Daily Express and The Sun again, as they reported this on Saturday, yet again knowing that you can be misled whilst ignoring what had actually been said in Court.  

It's not difficult to see how you get yourself into strife if you don't follow the actual news.

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"Nationalism is an infantile disease, it is the measles of mankind." Albert Einstein

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8 hours ago, kungfustu said:

A constitutional crisis?

The solution would be to deliver some kind of Brexit and stop trying to block it.....the constitutional crisis you speak of has been caused by the undemocratic manner in which the majority of MP's have acted in Parliament since the referendum result......it has clearly been lost on you that over the past 4 or 5 years Parliament agreed by a huge majority to give the public a say/a referendum on our EU membership......Parliament then agreed by another huge majority to implement the result of the referendum.....Parliament then agreed by another huge majority to trigger article 50......Labour and the conservatives campaigned in 2017 on a manifesto to accept and implement the result of the referendum......we are in the position we are in now because the majority of MP's that voted in favour of the above have now decided they know better than the 52% that voted to Leave and are doing everything within their power to block Brexit.....in return we have a PM that has come out and said he is going to do everything within his power to deliver it......all the legal wranglings and proroguing of Parliament are a result of the above......

The real irony here is John Major did the very same thing when "cash for questions" was threatening his government......he prorogued Parliament to delay a report into his MP's taking bribes!......and here he is standing up in front of a judge complaining about another tory PM doing the very same thing......this demonstrates more than anything how twisted and selfish this Brexit business has got.....you can bitch all you like about BJ.....I would agree with some of it.....however he is the only MP that has put up their hand and demanded that the referendum result be delivered......ASAP.....no more delays.....the problem is all the others......

 

Who voted down TM's deal, don't remember it being remainers, I thought it was the ERG Gove and Boris who voted it down, we could have left with an agreement and be negotiating a deal.

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On 17/09/2019 at 07:37, newjez said:

You can't have it both ways. Either they are included in the immigration figures or they aren't.

If it's anything like here they aren't included because they're students. Doesn't mean to say a lot of them will do whatever it takes to stay.

A lot really are fake students on fake courses too. Rich parents help. They start some course then drop out and disappear into the community. There's a massive business providing support to mostly Asians, run by mostly Asians. Some of them in government.

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6 hours ago, BacktoDemocracy said:

Who voted down TM's deal, don't remember it being remainers, I thought it was the ERG Gove and Boris who voted it down, we could have left with an agreement and be negotiating a deal.

With just over two weeks left before Britain is due to leave the EU, the House of Commons voted 391 to 242 to reject Ms May’s long-negotiated and contentious Brexit deal.

more than just who you claim 

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On 19/09/2019 at 04:06, BacktoDemocracy said:

You seem to welcome the US, do you have the slightest idea what the US will do to the NHS, and to our food standards, why do you think the US has an epidemic of obesity, diabetes and opoid addiction, try doing a bit of reading instead of reading those conspiracy website.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/dec/04/post-brexit-free-trade-deal-us-rightwing-thinktanks

Just for entertainment heres a comedy sketch from UKIP 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/sep/17/ukip-leader-accused-of-insulting-party-over-conference-no-show

You seem to be a bit scared of the US for some reason BTD. 

Don't know why the US would affect the way the NHS work and as for affecting food standards there's already Maccas, KFC, pizza outlets galore and the UK's own imported currie houses. Add to that the average UK persons visits to the pub.

I think the UK has it's own obesity problems that being in or out of the EU won't change one bit. Just because maccas is there doesn't mean you have to use it plenty do mind you.

We had a UK nurse stay with us a few years back on exchange study. She was married with 3 kids and hadn't a clue how to cook. Lived on frozen take away meals. Guess you'll blame that on America.

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On 19/09/2019 at 07:15, Rallyman said:

Anybody with good qualifications can get a visa for Australia now. 

No they can't. There's a lot more to it than that.

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On 20/09/2019 at 00:36, newjez said:

Would you like to explore that with one of the socialist Scandinavian countries.

Possibly we could tax Google. Except, with brexit, the USA won't let us do that. So much for sovereignty.

The USA are still trying to find a way to tax google. 

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On 20/09/2019 at 05:47, Peach said:

Judging by the number of Chinese students driving around Canberra in Mercedes, Audis and BMWs I'd say they do alright.

The rich Chinese do allright. Paid for by the majority doing slave Labour seeing their families once a year, if their rich employer lets them.

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On 20/09/2019 at 14:58, Slean Wolfhead said:

Maybe you need to go Parley? 

My brother's been in China for 15 years.  He was lent £8k by family to put a 50% deposit down on a unit, because he earned nothing.   He's now a millionaire, two apartments worth £500,000 each (including the one he bought for £32k) .  He teaches, owns a bar, a clothes shop...two kids, free and high standard education and healthcare for all, incredible transport system which is virtually free.  My parents have never had to queue ANYWHERE, and they cannot find a bus driver to take their money because all pensioner travel is free, even for foreigners.  There are churches, mosques, freedom of religion,  protests in the streets, fighting the police, drunkenness.  No different to bloody Birmingham, except they are making all the money through rampant capitalism.  

Nobody's ever bothered him, ripped him off, hauled him in for anything.  Life of riley.  It's not how it's portrayed in our media.  A country of a 1.4billion that most westerners have got no real idea how it actually works or what life is like. 

There's a really good Aussie documentary "two men in China". Well worth a watch.

My Niece and Nephew are teaching over there but they are there for short term money with no wish to stay.

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On 20/09/2019 at 15:07, newjez said:

Sort of goes against all your tough on crime posts parley. Do they have African gangs in China?

Has an African ever managed to get a visa?

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1 hour ago, Paul1Perth said:

You seem to be a bit scared of the US for some reason BTD. 

Don't know why the US would affect the way the NHS work and as for affecting food standards there's already Maccas, KFC, pizza outlets galore and the UK's own imported currie houses. Add to that the average UK persons visits to the pub.

I think the UK has it's own obesity problems that being in or out of the EU won't change one bit. Just because maccas is there doesn't mean you have to use it plenty do mind you.

We had a UK nurse stay with us a few years back on exchange study. She was married with 3 kids and hadn't a clue how to cook. Lived on frozen take away meals. Guess you'll blame that on America.

The concerns for the NHS are due to a push for the UK "health market" to be opened to US businesses/insurers as part of any trade agreement. Increasing privatisation of the NHS is an understandable concern, depending on your political views. It is not a leave/remain issue per se.

The concerns regarding food standards is very different to fast food epidemics. The issue is the quality (or lack thereof) of raw meats in the US, the chemicals used in their preparation and the scientifically evidenced safety issues associated with this. The way food is handled and prepared for sale in the US is associated with significantly higher incidences of food poisening illness per head of population in the US.

In tandem with the push for removal of labels identifying the origin of products as part of a US trade deal, the concern is that it would lead to illness and health issues even if trying to eat healthy in the UK. Followed by a lack of free health care to treat those illnesses.

On an economic level there are concerns around the loss of EU protection of "Scotch whisky", a multi billion pound industry that could be severely impacted as part of any trade deal with the US (US has openly been pushing for use of Scotch whisky labelling for cheap shit produced in the states).

The US will be able to name it's price at the negotiating table at the moment and that is therefore concerning for food safety, for the NHS and for various UK industries and therefore the longer term economic health of whatever is left of the UK

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15 minutes ago, MacGyver said:

The concerns for the NHS are due to a push for the UK "health market" to be opened to US businesses/insurers as part of any trade agreement. Increasing privatisation of the NHS is an understandable concern, depending on your political views. It is not a leave/remain issue per se.

The concerns regarding food standards is very different to fast food epidemics. The issue is the quality (or lack thereof) of raw meats in the US, the chemicals used in their preparation and the scientifically evidenced safety issues associated with this. The way food is handled and prepared for sale in the US is associated with significantly higher incidences of food poisening illness per head of population in the US.

In tandem with the push for removal of labels identifying the origin of products as part of a US trade deal, the concern is that it would lead to illness and health issues even if trying to eat healthy in the UK. Followed by a lack of free health care to treat those illnesses.

On an economic level there are concerns around the loss of EU protection of "Scotch whisky", a multi billion pound industry that could be severely impacted as part of any trade deal with the US (US has openly been pushing for use of Scotch whisky labelling for cheap shit produced in the states).

The US will be able to name it's price at the negotiating table at the moment and that is therefore concerning for food safety, for the NHS and for various UK industries and therefore the longer term economic health of whatever is left of the UK

The UK health market has been open to US and other countries companies for years. Here my wife works for Ramsay Health. They already own and run lots of hospitals in the UK. The NHS has been slowly degrading by stealth for years. Still one of the best systems in the world though and worth fighting for.

People who like Scotch Whisky know what is and isn't. They won't change.

The French are partial to horse steaks, frogs legs aren't they. Has that ever made it to the UK. 

I reckon you are making mountains out of molehills and the food supply concerns are another smokescreen. If people are so concerned buy British. That's what we do here with vast imports of potentially dodgy seafood from Asia. Make sure we get Aussie seafood.

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14 hours ago, simmo said:

 

As I said the e.u would , 2 years ago .

The british dont want a border 

The irish dont want a border .

How will irish Republicans feel about that ?

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BUT I DONT FEEL AFRAID

AS LONG AS I GAZE AT

WATERLOO SUNSET

IAM IN PARADISE

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3 hours ago, Paul1Perth said:

Has an African ever managed to get a visa?

China has invested heavily in Africa, they offer good education to Africans, their influence is growing all across central Africa where they see itheir influence central to getting access to natural resources as key, they are investing in railways and ports in places where the west dare not set foot because of colonialism. 

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H

2 hours ago, Paul1Perth said:

The UK health market has been open to US and other countries companies for years. Here my wife works for Ramsay Health. They already own and run lots of hospitals in the UK. The NHS has been slowly degrading by stealth for years. Still one of the best systems in the world though and worth fighting for.

People who like Scotch Whisky know what is and isn't. They won't change.

The French are partial to horse steaks, frogs legs aren't they. Has that ever made it to the UK. 

I reckon you are making mountains out of molehills and the food supply concerns are another smokescreen. If people are so concerned buy British. That's what we do here with vast imports of potentially dodgy seafood from Asia. Make sure we get Aussie seafood.

There you have had it explained by someone else but there is still a wish to treat everything as a joke, it isn't  and by the way when was the NHS last your health service provider, I have to live with the consequences of this load of garbage.

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2 minutes ago, BacktoDemocracy said:

H

There you have had it explained by someone else but there is still a wish to treat everything as a joke, it isn't  and by the way when was the NHS last your health service provider, I have to live with the consequences of this load of garbage.

Where was I joking?

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9 minutes ago, BacktoDemocracy said:

China has invested heavily in Africa, they offer good education to Africans, their influence is growing all across central Africa where they see itheir influence central to getting access to natural resources as key, they are investing in railways and ports in places where the west dare not set foot because of colonialism. 

As you say China are investing for what they can get out of it. Not because of any concern about the population.

They are some of the most protectionist, racist government in the world.

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First casualty of Brexit, as one of the critical factors was the collapse of the £.    Who was it on here who said it wouldn't matter because people could just holiday at home, or pay more for their holidays?  How about the 9000 jobs that have gone, and the potential 22,000 jobs worldwide dependent on TC?  

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49791249

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"Nationalism is an infantile disease, it is the measles of mankind." Albert Einstein

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As you say China are investing for what they can get out of it. Not because of any concern about the population.
They are some of the most protectionist, racist government in the world.



And the UK, US would not invest out of self interest, you think?

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