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bigfishybob

Nursing Position Equivalent Roles - Sister/Matron

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Hi All,

Is anyone aware of what the equivalent roles are in Aus for Sister, Senior Sister, Matron?  Are the roles/responsibilities broadly comparable or does it work a bit differently?

Has anyone moved from the UK into one of these sorts of roles in Australia?  Or is there generally an expectation that you would find a job as a nurse first, then work your way up?  I would be interested in anyone's experience of either stepping down and working their way back up or moving directly into a more senior role, and how they found the transition.

We're planning on visiting Brisbane/SC/GC in May and were hoping to visit a couple of hospitals, with a view to meeting someone to discuss what it's like working at the hospital and what sort of vacancies they currently have.  Planning on contacting HR and seeing if this is feasible/practical.  Has anyone else done this?

In terms of searching for available roles, how do people generally go about this?  Contact hospitals directly, searching online, applying through agencies?

Did anyone managed to secure a role prior to moving out?

I'm asking on behalf of my wife, but I'm very interested to hear how it works too, as I've done a fair amount of searching and it doesn't seem entirely clear. 

Apologies, lots of questions, any info/experiences greatly appreciated!

Regards

BFB

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I was a G grade/band 7 in the UK prior to moving to Aus and initially in Aus worked on the ward for a few months and applied for positions as they came up working my way back up to an equivalent position.  I moved 11 years ago and had a job lined up, now I would make sure that you're in a position to move if you get offered a job (registration/visa in place), as if met with two suitable candidates they're likely to go with the one whose more readily available.  

Roles and responsibilities are similar - what is different is the processes and procedures and even the recruitment process.  I don't know about over East, but certainly, there are less jobs advertised in nursing than there was previously.  Whilst not impossible to go straight into a senior position, your wife may have to think about getting a foot in the door and taking a step back.

Here in WA, all government jobs (public hospitals) are advertised on jobs.wa .. there may be something similar over East.

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Thanks for this.  I'm expecting she will have to take a step back to learn the ropes, which doesn't seem unreasonable, generally more straightforward to find and apply for jobs internally also. 

Do you know what the equivalent roles are?  i.e. Sister = ?, Senior Sister = ?, Matron = ? (broad speaking)

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Here in WA (might be similar in QLD),  Staff Nurse = level 1 (they go in increments here for length of service/experience e.g. 1.9), Senior Staff nurse (Clinical Nurse) = Level 3,  Sister (clinical nurse specialist/manager) Level 3 and above.  Our director of nursing is Level 7


I just want PIO to be a happy place where people are nice to each other and unicorns poop rainbows

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6 hours ago, bigfishybob said:

Thanks for this.  I'm expecting she will have to take a step back to learn the ropes, which doesn't seem unreasonable, generally more straightforward to find and apply for jobs internally also. 

Do you know what the equivalent roles are?  i.e. Sister = ?, Senior Sister = ?, Matron = ? (broad speaking)

Hi, taking a step back is not a bad idea imo. The system is different in Australia and then varies between states as well, why add to the stress of moving and starting a new job with having responsibility for staff as well?

I don’t recognise the bandings that Ali quotes as I am in Vic and it differs here, so Qld will be different again. A lot is the same and a lot is different. Patient care is patient care at the end of the day but how that care is structured and funded varies a lot.

I do agree with Ali that there are less posts for nurses advertised than when I moved here 12 years ago and even 5 years ago.

There is a new hospital on the SC so may be jobs available there. I don’t understand acute nursing, been in the community forever! ?

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Many thanks both.

This is the document I’ve been looking at, which makes reference to Grades and also roles such as Associate Nurse Unit Manager and Nurse Unit Manager.  Which seem like similar sorts of roles to Sister/Matron, but I have no idea to be honest:

nurses-midwives-wagerates.pdf

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Here in WA the Nurse unit manager is a level 4 and the ANM a level 3 (clinical nurse specialist).  It's not impossible to get this role but I would as Amber suggested also go for the Clinical nurse positions.  I took a step back to go forward, it got my foot in the door and also allowed me time to learn new processes and the Australian way of working without any pressure.    Are you coming on an independent visa?  I ask because sometimes moving around on a sponsored visa can be difficult and you lack the opportunity to then go for secondments/promotional positions with other health services.


I just want PIO to be a happy place where people are nice to each other and unicorns poop rainbows

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Applying for 189 on my visa (IT Developer).  As the skills assessment looked less intimidating for my job type.  Though still have AHPRA to do, which could take a while.

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56 minutes ago, bigfishybob said:

Here is the link in case the document did not embed properly:

https://www.health.qld.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0020/441443/nurses-midwives-wagerates.pdf

Hi, again different to Victoria but you are looking at it ok imo. NUM runs the ward, ANUM is the 2nd in charge etc. Matron was only just making her comeback when I left so I don’t fully understand the UK roles and responsibilities anymore. You don’t seem to be wide of the mark in your reading of this. 

Next option is to search jobs on seek.com.au or health websites and read the PDs for each and see if they match skills and experience, or what you would expect to be doing at that level. Might add another dimension to your research.

Have fun! 

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I think in the hospital my wife works at, they have Matrons who are typically in charge of one area i.e Respiratory / Medical Assessment Unit etc...  Each of these areas will then have a number of wards (3-4), with a Sister in charge of each of the wards.  Presumably a senior sister would oversee multiple sisters (less clear on this point)...  You also then have a Nurse Director overseeing multiple Matrons (and Deputy Nurse Director assisting them).

I've attached wiki's breakdown of Nursing Roles in the UK, annoyingly I can't see an equivalent for Nursing in Australia.  Though based on what you've said maybe:

NUM = Senior Sister

ANUM = Sister

OR

NUM = Sister

ANUM = ? (assistant to sister?)

Doesn't appear to show any layers of management between NUMs and Nursing Director?  (Maybe one can draw the conclusion that there are too many layers of management in the UK :) or just that different systems, different ways of operating)

Thanks again for your time, much appreciated.

Nursing Roles[edit]

For more information, see Registered Nurse.

Traditionally, on completion of training, nurses would be employed on a hospital ward, and work as staff nurses. The ward hierarchy consists of:

  • Staff Nurses/General Nurse/Staffer of Nursing – the first grade of qualified nursing staff. These nurses are responsible for a set group of patients (e.g. administering medications, assessing, venepuncture, wound care and other clinical duties). Under Agenda for Change they attract a Band 5 salary but sometimes a Band 6 salary.
  • Senior staff nurses/Staffer Manager – these nurses carry out many of the same tasks, but are more senior and more experienced than the staff nurses. Many NHS Trusts do not have Senior Staff Nurses as the role is seen to be superfluous.
  • Junior/Deputy Ward Sister; Charge Nurse; Deputy Ward Manager – responsible for the day-to-day running of the ward, and may also carry specific responsibilities for the overall running of the ward (e.g. rostering) in accordance with the wishes of the ward manager. These nurses are assigned band 6. In some NHS Trusts, these will be known as Sisters/Charge Nurses.
  • Ward Manager/Ward Sister/Charge Nurse/Nurse Manager/Clinical Ward Nurse Lead – this nurse is responsible for running a ward or unit, and usually has budgetary control. He/she will employ staff, and be responsible for all the local management (e.g. rostering, approving pay claims, purchasing equipment, delegation duties or tasks). These nurses are band 7. They are generally Senior Staff Nurses or Charge Nurses as well.
  • Senior Ward Sister; Senior Charge Nurse; Senior Ward Manager – if there is a need to employ several nurses at a ward manager level (e.g. in A&E), then one of them often acts as the senior ward manager. These nurses attract a banding anywhere between 7 and 8c.

 

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Correction:

Each ward has a Senior Sister in charge and each Senior Sister has 2 Sisters working under them on the ward.  So, the following seems accurate:

NUM = Senior Sister 

ANUM = Sister

??? = Matron

Regards

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7 hours ago, bigfishybob said:

I think in the hospital my wife works at, they have Matrons who are typically in charge of one area i.e Respiratory / Medical Assessment Unit etc...  Each of these areas will then have a number of wards (3-4), with a Sister in charge of each of the wards.  Presumably a senior sister would oversee multiple sisters (less clear on this point)...  You also then have a Nurse Director overseeing multiple Matrons (and Deputy Nurse Director assisting them).

I've attached wiki's breakdown of Nursing Roles in the UK, annoyingly I can't see an equivalent for Nursing in Australia.  Though based on what you've said maybe:

NUM = Senior Sister

ANUM = Sister

OR

NUM = Sister

ANUM = ? (assistant to sister?)

Doesn't appear to show any layers of management between NUMs and Nursing Director?  (Maybe one can draw the conclusion that there are too many layers of management in the UK :) or just that different systems, different ways of operating)

Thanks again for your time, much appreciated.

Nursing Roles[edit]

For more information, see Registered Nurse.

Traditionally, on completion of training, nurses would be employed on a hospital ward, and work as staff nurses. The ward hierarchy consists of:

  • Staff Nurses/General Nurse/Staffer of Nursing – the first grade of qualified nursing staff. These nurses are responsible for a set group of patients (e.g. administering medications, assessing, venepuncture, wound care and other clinical duties). Under Agenda for Change they attract a Band 5 salary but sometimes a Band 6 salary.
  • Senior staff nurses/Staffer Manager – these nurses carry out many of the same tasks, but are more senior and more experienced than the staff nurses. Many NHS Trusts do not have Senior Staff Nurses as the role is seen to be superfluous.
  • Junior/Deputy Ward Sister; Charge Nurse; Deputy Ward Manager – responsible for the day-to-day running of the ward, and may also carry specific responsibilities for the overall running of the ward (e.g. rostering) in accordance with the wishes of the ward manager. These nurses are assigned band 6. In some NHS Trusts, these will be known as Sisters/Charge Nurses.
  • Ward Manager/Ward Sister/Charge Nurse/Nurse Manager/Clinical Ward Nurse Lead – this nurse is responsible for running a ward or unit, and usually has budgetary control. He/she will employ staff, and be responsible for all the local management (e.g. rostering, approving pay claims, purchasing equipment, delegation duties or tasks). These nurses are band 7. They are generally Senior Staff Nurses or Charge Nurses as well.
  • Senior Ward Sister; Senior Charge Nurse; Senior Ward Manager – if there is a need to employ several nurses at a ward manager level (e.g. in A&E), then one of them often acts as the senior ward manager. These nurses attract a banding anywhere between 7 and 8c.

 

Thanks for this. I’m so out of touch with the UK system now.

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1 hour ago, bigfishybob said:

Correction:

Each ward has a Senior Sister in charge and each Senior Sister has 2 Sisters working under them on the ward.  So, the following seems accurate:

NUM = Senior Sister 

ANUM = Sister

??? = Matron

Regards

Yes, looks about right. Nothing to compare exactly to Matron In Victoria at least. Maybe adon??

We have staff nurse, anum, num, adon, don. But because of management structures, which differ between hospitals, there are clinical nurse consultants (so have a specialist area like continence), managers of patient flow, acute and emergency, sub acute etc. These are senior management and can be nurses or allied health and sit below the directors who oversee multiple managers.

Other side areas that may be of interest could be HARP the hospital admissions risk program,  PAC the post acute care program,  HITH the hospital in the home program. There are lots of others and these are Victorian names for each program but other states will have  similar type things probably. These roles pay better than a staff nurse, probably anum level usually (grade 3 or 4 in Vic) and get you out and about with a caseload.

If nothing else this shows states vary widely as public health is a state run responsibility and then within each state each health network can also vary.

Just to add in Victoria some networks have a GEM at home program which geriatric medicine in the home setting but still classed as an in patient, same as HITH.

Looks daunting but you’ll work it out. If the first job doesn’t suit you start looking for another that will and once here it is so much easier to get your head around as you are “living” it.

Best of luck.

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