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On 15/02/2021 at 21:52, Perthbum said:

Its winter, today is 12c and sunny, does not feel like winter, we do not get the winters we had decades ago when it was always very cold, look at the record temps in Oz over the last couple decades, warming is now considered a fact by almost all climate scientists.

Have a look at the two links I posted and you can see that the average temperature of the world has not increased since 1950.

Also, you are talking subjectively about UK winters. It wasn't always very cold any more than that it was very warm in summer. You always get odd winters like 1962/63 and summers like 1976 but they are not the norm.

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50 minutes ago, MARYROSE02 said:

Have a look at the two links I posted and you can see that the average temperature of the world has not increased since 1950.

The period since 1950 isn't even a century.   You can't look at changes in planetary temperature over that time and see any meaningful patterns.

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Scot by birth, emigrated 1985 | Aussie husband applied UK spouse visa Jan 2015, granted March 2015, moved to UK May 2015 | Returned to Oz June 2016

"The stranger who comes home does not make himself at home but makes home itself strange." -- Rainer Maria Rilke

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On 15/02/2021 at 06:01, MARYROSE02 said:

There is an easy solution which Australia has continually rejected - nuclear power. We have the uranium and are happy to sell it to other countries to for their own nuclear power stations.

Too dangerous? Why have other nations embraced it? And course if global warming really IS the greatest threat to humanity in the history of the planet, well it is the lesser of two evils. 

I thought that Australia is on target to reduce its emissions but as we only produce a tiny percentage of the whole future generations need other countries to do something other than saying they will do something.

My brother tells me, from looking at figures from NASA, that the average temperature of the planet has not actually gone up in the last seventy years. It took me a while to figure out what he meant but in the first link it refers to an average temperature of 59 degrees F  in the years 1950 to 1980, and in the second link the goalposts have been moved to show an average temperature of 57 degrees F. Crafty eh?

https://www.nytimes.com/1988/03/29/science/temperature-for-world-rises-sharply-in-the-1980-s.html

https://www.climate.gov/news-features/understanding-climate/climate-change-global-temperature

I really don't think you could call nuclear an easy option. Have a look at how the new UK nuclear power plant is going, and how expensive it is going to be. Look at the problems Japan has had, not to mention Chernobyl and three mile island. Australia would be mad to embark on nuclear. 

No, Australia should be looking at solar wind and hydrogen to store it. Australia is full of natural energy sources. They would be mad not to use them.

That is the way forward. Even many of the oil companies are waking up to this reality. Not because of climate change, but because it is becoming cheaper and better.

Edited by newjez

Nearly there! Don't drop the ball now guys! Vaccines are weeks away. Stay safe!

 

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15 hours ago, Marisawright said:

The period since 1950 isn't even a century.   You can't look at changes in planetary temperature over that time and see any meaningful patterns.

In that case why are the alarmists doing just that? Every climatic extreme is blamed on Global Warming. There is no other possible explanation.

Edited by MARYROSE02
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9 hours ago, newjez said:

I really don't think you could call nuclear an easy option. Have a look at how the new UK nuclear power plant is going, and how expensive it is going to be. Look at the problems Japan has had, not to mention Chernobyl and three mile island. Australia would be mad to embark on nuclear. 

No, Australia should be looking at solar wind and hydrogen to store it. Australia is full of natural energy sources. They would be mad not to use them.

That is the way forward. Even many of the oil companies are waking up to this reality. Not because of climate change, but because it is becoming cheaper and better.

How many ACTUAL deaths have occurred due to nuclear power accidents? And remember, even if nuclear power IS dangerous, the alarmists keep telling us that CLIMATE CHANGE IS THE GREATEST THREAT TO HUMANITY IN OUR HISTORY. So, the problems with nuclear power are the lesser of two evils but when you say that the alarmists "move the goal posts".

And can you name any major industrial economy which is now powered exclusively by renewable power?

I actually have no problem with 100 per cent renewables; I just want to see someone else prove it can be done. Australia's contribution to the world's emissions is so tiny it's irrelevant what we do. Let the likes of China, the USA or India show us the way. The alarmists want Australia to destroy its coal mining industries and exports and the countries which buy our coal will just turn to other sources of coal not end their own coal fuelled power stations.

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2 hours ago, MARYROSE02 said:

In that case why are the alarmists doing just that? Every climatic extreme is blamed on Global Warming. There is no other possible explanation.

The alarmists might be doing it. I have no idea who they are.  Climatologists - the people who have spent years studying the subject and really know what they are talking about - take a much longer view over centuries.  And over 90% of them agree that the planet is warming, and that is what is causing the climate extremes.

Edited by Marisawright
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Scot by birth, emigrated 1985 | Aussie husband applied UK spouse visa Jan 2015, granted March 2015, moved to UK May 2015 | Returned to Oz June 2016

"The stranger who comes home does not make himself at home but makes home itself strange." -- Rainer Maria Rilke

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2 hours ago, MARYROSE02 said:

How many ACTUAL deaths have occurred due to nuclear power accidents?

I'm not sure what deaths from nuclear power accidents has to do with anything.  The problem with nuclear power is that it doesn't solve climate change or environmental damage - it just delays it.   It takes a lot of power to construct a nuclear power plant in the first place because of all the concrete and safety features.  Then they have only a limited life, and decommissioning is then a problem for the next generation. 


Scot by birth, emigrated 1985 | Aussie husband applied UK spouse visa Jan 2015, granted March 2015, moved to UK May 2015 | Returned to Oz June 2016

"The stranger who comes home does not make himself at home but makes home itself strange." -- Rainer Maria Rilke

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28 minutes ago, Parley said:

I don't think the poor people in Texas feel like the planet is getting warmer.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/feb/16/texas-weather-snow-storm-latest-news-power-outages-deaths

My godson lives in Dallas and he says the weather is really nasty.  Tens of thousands without electricity.  It was sleeting and freezing cold when I spoke to him a day so ago.  Also spoke to my friend in Minneapolis where there is deep snow but that is par for the course there.  I thought is was a nice city when I was there but the weather is extreme with bitterly cold snowy winters and very hot summers.  

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22 minutes ago, Toots said:

My godson lives in Dallas and he says the weather is really nasty.  Tens of thousands without electricity.  It was sleeting and freezing cold when I spoke to him a day so ago.  Also spoke to my friend in Minneapolis where there is deep snow but that is par for the course there.  I thought is was a nice city when I was there but the weather is extreme with bitterly cold snowy winters and very hot summers.  

I think i could only live on the West Coast of USA.

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30 minutes ago, Parley said:

I think i could only live on the West Coast of USA.

I lived just outside San Luis Obispo and that area had a very nice climate -  not too hot and not too cold.  Got a fair bit of fog some days but usually cleared by midday.  

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8 hours ago, MARYROSE02 said:

How many ACTUAL deaths have occurred due to nuclear power accidents? And remember, even if nuclear power IS dangerous, the alarmists keep telling us that CLIMATE CHANGE IS THE GREATEST THREAT TO HUMANITY IN OUR HISTORY. So, the problems with nuclear power are the lesser of two evils but when you say that the alarmists "move the goal posts".

And can you name any major industrial economy which is now powered exclusively by renewable power?

I actually have no problem with 100 per cent renewables; I just want to see someone else prove it can be done. Australia's contribution to the world's emissions is so tiny it's irrelevant what we do. Let the likes of China, the USA or India show us the way. The alarmists want Australia to destroy its coal mining industries and exports and the countries which buy our coal will just turn to other sources of coal not end their own coal fuelled power stations.

Most nuclear power stations are very safe. But when they do go wrong they go very wrong. But they major argument is cost. They are a very expensive way of producing energy.

Alot of the technology, especially for storage is being refined, but Scotland is pretty close to being 100% renewable.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-54441613&ved=2ahUKEwjIgbeM6_LuAhWioFwKHQewDfkQFjABegQIAhAG&usg=AOvVaw3oLMReM7MY4Bti3LUNyq8_&ampcf=1

You are combining two different arguments here. Firstly whether Australia should use alternative energy. The answer is obviously yes as it becomes cheaper and more reliable.

Whether Australia should export coal is another matter. 


Nearly there! Don't drop the ball now guys! Vaccines are weeks away. Stay safe!

 

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8 hours ago, Parley said:

I don't think the poor people in Texas feel like the planet is getting warmer.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/feb/16/texas-weather-snow-storm-latest-news-power-outages-deaths

An entirely predictable consequence of the planet warming. Should not be a surprise to you or  anyone 

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Scot by birth, emigrated 1985 | Aussie husband applied UK spouse visa Jan 2015, granted March 2015, moved to UK May 2015 | Returned to Oz June 2016

"The stranger who comes home does not make himself at home but makes home itself strange." -- Rainer Maria Rilke

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7 hours ago, Parley said:

I think i could only live on the West Coast of USA.

You would not want to live there. San Francisco has become a sewer, with tent cities of homeless people strewn across the city. In SFC you can legally shoplift up to an amount of $900 without being arrested or at least charged with a crime. Police are rarely seen and the woke state government in California does nothing but .... woke! 

 

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Just now, Dusty Plains said:

You would not want to live there. San Francisco has become a sewer, with tent cities of homeless people strewn across the city. In SFC you can legally shoplift up to an amount of $900 without being arrested or at least charged with a crime. Police are rarely seen and the woke state government in California does nothing but .... woke! 

 

People are leaving California in droves.


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11 hours ago, MARYROSE02 said:

How many ACTUAL deaths have occurred due to nuclear power accidents? And remember, even if nuclear power IS dangerous, the alarmists keep telling us that CLIMATE CHANGE IS THE GREATEST THREAT TO HUMANITY IN OUR HISTORY. So, the problems with nuclear power are the lesser of two evils but when you say that the alarmists "move the goal posts".

And can you name any major industrial economy which is now powered exclusively by renewable power?

I actually have no problem with 100 per cent renewables; I just want to see someone else prove it can be done. Australia's contribution to the world's emissions is so tiny it's irrelevant what we do. Let the likes of China, the USA or India show us the way. The alarmists want Australia to destroy its coal mining industries and exports and the countries which buy our coal will just turn to other sources of coal not end their own coal fuelled power stations.

If Australia doesn't export coal to China, then china will burn slightly more expensive coal from somewhere else, or they will burn natural gas, which is better than coal, but not as good as most people think. A lot of methane can be released with natural gas.

But, I would prefer us to be exporting hydrogen, and we will be at some stage in the not too distant future.

We are moving towards alternative energy, not because of the environment, but because it will make sense economically. Australia has the potential to become the Dallas of alternative energy.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://amp.smh.com.au/politics/federal/hydrogen-heating-up-australia-s-exports-ambitions-taylor-20201114-p56elw.html&ved=2ahUKEwjltdy3jfPuAhXDUMAKHVbVA0IQFjABegQIAhAG&usg=AOvVaw0IRxI9h4WmnMv3zqFdFz0N&ampcf=1


Nearly there! Don't drop the ball now guys! Vaccines are weeks away. Stay safe!

 

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18 minutes ago, Parley said:

People are leaving California in droves.

I wonder where they are all going?  I saw some really rundown towns the last time I was in the USA.  It has certainly changed since I lived there way back when.  It was a fab place to be then  -  even though I was glad to leave.

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9 hours ago, Parley said:

I don't think the poor people in Texas feel like the planet is getting warmer.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/feb/16/texas-weather-snow-storm-latest-news-power-outages-deaths

So, what are you saying parley? If someone says stop doing something or something bad will happen, and something bad happens that is a different type of bad, then we should keep doing that thing?

Does that make sense?

Shouldn't that reinforce the warning to stop doing the thing? 

I think you need to revisit your argument.


Nearly there! Don't drop the ball now guys! Vaccines are weeks away. Stay safe!

 

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14 minutes ago, Toots said:

I wonder where they are all going?  I saw some really rundown towns the last time I was in the USA.  It has certainly changed since I lived there way back when.  It was a fab place to be then  -  even though I was glad to leave.

Places like Las Vegas, Texas and Tennessee.

California charges high State income taxes where some other have 0 or low tax.


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1 hour ago, Marisawright said:

An entirely predictable consequence of the planet warming. Should not be a surprise to you or  anyone 

But it is, because they’re poorly educated 

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On 17/02/2021 at 21:44, MARYROSE02 said:

In that case why are the alarmists doing just that? Every climatic extreme is blamed on Global Warming. There is no other possible explanation.

https://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/

 

This graph, based on the comparison of atmospheric samples contained in ice cores and more recent direct  measurements, provides evidence that atmospheric CO2 has increased  since the Industrial Revolution.  (Source: [[LINK||http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/paleo/icecore/||NOAA]])

Edited by Perthbum
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On 18/02/2021 at 20:51, newjez said:

So, what are you saying parley? If someone says stop doing something or something bad will happen, and something bad happens that is a different type of bad, then we should keep doing that thing?

Does that make sense?

Shouldn't that reinforce the warning to stop doing the thing? 

I think you need to revisit your argument.

Nothing bad is happening newjez. This is just the normal climate variations that have been happening for hundreds of years.

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I want it all, and I want it now.

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7 hours ago, Parley said:

Nothing bad is happening newjez. This is just the normal climate variations that have been happening for hundreds of years.

Except it isn’t.  

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