Bemused by the Australian dream

[Home and Happy]

On ‎01‎/‎04‎/‎2017 at 7:21 AM, TopTohScnal said:

 

I left a great lifestyle back home, friends for support, not worrying too much about money, and I feel now like I've lost so much. I'm stuck, I now have my registration to work but I'm not even sure I want to... I just feel like flying back home, I've tried it but it doesn't seem to be working for me. I'm usually a very positive person that can pick myself up again but this has been so stressful, I'm not sure it's worth it. I am torn as my siblings are here but I don't think that's a strong enough pull for me to stay here. I am probably in the stage of being homesick which I'm surprised at how bad it's hit me to be honest but having not much else to focus on, it's quite overwhelming. Having read some comments on here, I miss the English countryside, a walk to a local pub, the seasons. It's all very same-y here and where my sister lived in Perth was suburban hell, totally snoozeville! Even the bush walks were dull, dried out, brown dense trees, no views at all! Give me the Lake District or Peak District any day.

i just wanted to share my experience and to say the Australian dream as been shattered for me! 

I totally relate to what you are saying, almost the same things that drove us out too.  People who think they leave the UK for a better lifestyle are often wrong. 

Snoozeville is a fair way to describe Perth..  Its the isolation and repetitiveness of it all.  Its fun for the first year then you think its okay for the next couple of years then it becomes depressingly worse because there really is nowhere to go.  Even if you could regularly afford the ticket to Melbourne or Sydney, you just get more of the same thing, just a bit grottier and more crowded.  You cant nip off to France or Spain for the weekend or drive out to the countryside either.  You are cut off from everything and its very backward.

Life in UK / Europe is far more fun, vibrant and interesting, and you are right in the heart of the action....and we have Ryanair & EasyJet to take us anywhere for £50 return.

if you have the funds to do so, are not lumbered down with kids or a  partner who insists on chaining you down while they live out their aussie fantasy then get back on the plane to freedom !

 

 

[Toots]

The "Australian Dream" hasn't worked out for loads of people and they happily go back to the UK and settle comfortably back there and that is how it should be but there are also many of us who do have a good life here and wouldn't go back to the UK.  I hope you folk who don't enjoy life here do manage to find peace back home.

[Brit Girl]

Hi Top Toh Scnal,

no worries, glad we are both on the same wave length. Sometimes it's nice to have your thoughts validated by a fellow health professional who has gone through a similar situation. Just take each day as it comes, embrace the experience, good or bad. I know that when i changed jobs in 2015 i was happier, so once you start your new job maybe things might change for the better? A nurse i know moved from Queensland and is much more settled in Perth but as you've moved to be near family, moving interstate would defeat the object really. Yes i'm definately counting down to my long service leave for sure and will put it all down to experience, hey i could even write a book about it to recoup the money spent but i don't think anyone would believe me!Haha! I hear you about the work culture, difficulty in making friends, wages and the high cost of living, nothing prepares you for any of it unitl you are living and working here! Good that you've been able to spend some time with your family,you could view it as a secondement/overseas posting that wasn't for you long term,that's what my cousin did when NZ wasn't for him.Good luck on whatever you decide, keep us posted.

[Johndoe]

On 06/05/2017 at 11:49 PM, Home and Happy said:

Life in UK / Europe is far more fun, vibrant and interesting, and you are right in the heart of the action....

 

 

That's oft quoted........europe is just a hop skip and a jump away but are there stats to show that the average Brit punter takes that hop skip and a jump? How many are frightened of driving on the wrong side of the road? Worried about language? What do you mean by "action?' The dilution, or imposition, of Brit identity because nightclubs feature Brit music, or does "action" relate to uprisings/protests in the Arabic/Algeria sectors?

[simmo]

33 minutes ago, Johndoe said:

That's oft quoted........europe is just a hop skip and a jump away but are there stats to show that the average Brit punter takes that hop skip and a jump? How many are frightened of driving on the wrong side of the road? Worried about language? What do you mean by "action?' The dilution, or imposition, of Brit identity because nightclubs feature Brit music, or does "action" relate to uprisings/protests in the Arabic/Algeria sectors?

The total number of visits abroad by UK residents has increased from 55.6 million in 2010 to a peak of 65.7 million visits in 2015. When compared with the previous year, the number of visits was higher every quarter in 2014 and 2015. There were large increases in both Quarter 1 (Jan to Mar) and Quarter 4 (Oct to Dec) of 2015; the number of visits rose in these quarters by over 10% when compared with the same quarters in 2014. https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/leisureandtourism/articles/traveltrends/2015#uk-residents-visits-abroad

[Toots]

When my husband (who is Australian) and I lived in the UK we did go to Europe a lot.  Nothing fancy in those days - a lot of backpacking and before we met we had both worked in Europe.  Him in Germany and Belgium and me in Belgium, France and Switzerland.  Then my sister went to work in Germany for 2 years so we visited her there a number of times.  I liked being off the beaten track well away from fellow tourists.  Truthfully I don't miss Europe now and I didn't much like Spain or Greece - far too hot and crowded in peak times - nicer in the winter.  Most of my old friends from the UK manage a trip or two every year.

[Home and Happy]

On ‎07‎/‎05‎/‎2017 at 3:27 PM, Johndoe said:

That's oft quoted........europe is just a hop skip and a jump away but are there stats to show that the average Brit punter takes that hop skip and a jump? How many are frightened of driving on the wrong side of the road? Worried about language? What do you mean by "action?' The dilution, or imposition, of Brit identity because nightclubs feature Brit music, or does "action" relate to uprisings/protests in the Arabic/Algeria sectors?

I go very often.  I can go there cheaper than a long weekend costs in UK.  So many places to go to and so cheap.  But some weekends we do like to stay at home go off to a country hotel and get away from it all.  How can you compare all that to being stuck in Perth doing the same thing everyday or wishing you could get out and go somewhere different apart from Kings Park, Margaret River, Freo, Busselton, Mandurah, or Swan Valley.  These places get mighty old after a couple of years, trust me you will be tearing your hair out after a while.  The isolation there from everything is just too much sometimes.  You miss out on far too much stuff stuck away down there. One of the main reasons we came back.

[Slean Wolfhead]

1 hour ago, Home and Happy said:

I go very often.  I can go there cheaper than a long weekend costs in UK.  So many places to go to and so cheap.  But some weekends we do like to stay at home go off to a country hotel and get away from it all.  How can you compare all that to being stuck in Perth doing the same thing everyday or wishing you could get out and go somewhere different apart from Kings Park, Margaret River, Freo, Busselton, Mandurah, or Swan Valley.  These places get mighty old after a couple of years, trust me you will be tearing your hair out after a while.  The isolation there from everything is just too much sometimes.  You miss out on far too much stuff stuck away down there. One of the main reasons we came back.

I think that comes down to the old FOMO and psychological contentment.   "a pervasive apprehension that others might be having rewarding experiences from which one is absent". This social angst is characterized by "a desire to stay continually connected with what others are doing".

Steve Coogan said something similar when in the Sunshine Coast, driving a 4x4 30 miles up a beach and not seeing a sign telling him he was trespassing, or an official telling him to stop, or pay a fee.   It was so empty and free that he didn't know what to do with himself, the opposite to his upbringing of British officialdom, organisation and being streamed, that he had the nagging feeling that he was "missing out on a big party going on somewhere in England". 

Australia's not for everybody and it would be very difficult if you had the mindset that you were being punished, or unable to afford to travel and make the most of it.  I can't speak for Perth, but on the other side the European culture is far more pervasive than the UK, because mainly ex-Europeans are here on equal terms with the ex-British and their Aussie/European heritage goes back generations already.  You only have to look at the surnames on any company email system and it's astonishing, but that follows on to local clubs, restaurants, social groups, sports teams.   They obviously cannot import the architecture or history, but they have direct and active lineage back to home countries and they can maintain that connection by regularly travelling back without having to live there permanently.  They also bring that influence back with them and it's welcomed, whereas the UK at the moment seems to be actively disliking Europe, except when the offer is there of a holiday in the sun.  That isn't a shock, overall, they've never liked it away from the beaches and tourist hotspots.

Edited May 9, 2017 by Slean Wolfhead

[Toots]

My sister who has just returned to Edinburgh after 5 weeks here in Tasmania has just popped over to Copenhagen for a week - really, really cheap airfare.

4 hours ago, Home and Happy said:

I go very often.  I can go there cheaper than a long weekend costs in UK.  So many places to go to and so cheap.  But some weekends we do like to stay at home go off to a country hotel and get away from it all.  How can you compare all that to being stuck in Perth doing the same thing everyday or wishing you could get out and go somewhere different apart from Kings Park, Margaret River, Freo, Busselton, Mandurah, or Swan Valley.  These places get mighty old after a couple of years, trust me you will be tearing your hair out after a while.  The isolation there from everything is just too much sometimes.  You miss out on far too much stuff stuck away down there. One of the main reasons we came back.

Are you talking about Perth or Australia as a whole?  Been here nearly 36 years and never been bored.  I don't think I've ever been bored in my life.  

Edited May 10, 2017 by Toots

[Guest263228]

On ‎7‎/‎05‎/‎2017 at 10:27 PM, Johndoe said:

That's oft quoted........europe is just a hop skip and a jump away but are there stats to show that the average Brit punter takes that hop skip and a jump? How many are frightened of driving on the wrong side of the road? Worried about language? What do you mean by "action?' The dilution, or imposition, of Brit identity because nightclubs feature Brit music, or does "action" relate to uprisings/protests in the Arabic/Algeria sectors?

Well in London , Europe came to us. My hood was very Euro centric. As for going to the mainland, in my case, the last eighteen months was around every three weeks. Most that I knew went at least once a year. I agree though in many regional parts of Britain, the mainland would likely seem a million miles away, with little travel there or interest. Quite amazing the divide...

[Guest263228]

25 minutes ago, Toots said:

My sister who has just returned to Edinburgh after 5 weeks here in Tasmania has just popped over to Copenhagen for a week - really, really cheap airfare.

Are you talking about Perth or Australia as a whole?  Been here nearly 36 years and never been bored.  I don't think I've ever been bored in my life.  

But there again one doesn't necessary need to be bored to find a place 'dull'.

[Toots]

2 minutes ago, Pura Vida said:

Well in London , Europe came to us. My hood was very Euro centric. As for going to the mainland, in my case, the last eighteen months was around every three weeks. Most that I knew went at least once a year. I agree though in many regional parts of Britain, the mainland would likely seem a million miles away, with little travel there or interest. Quite amazing the divide...

That is very true.  My father wasn't even interested in venturing to England and we only lived 80 miles from the border!  Many older folk were the same.  Different generation though.  My brother, sister and I and most of our cousins made up for our parents though.  We lived in many different countries over the years.  Dad wasn't interested in even visiting us.  After he died Mum loved travelling all over the place to stay with us in various countries.  

[Toots]

3 minutes ago, Pura Vida said:

But there again one doesn't necessary need to be bored to find a place 'dull'.

The only place I've lived in which I found "dull" after a period of a few months was Switzerland.  Beautiful scenery and close proximity to other countries but it was the people - very hard to get to know.  Mind you many people on this forum say the same about Australians.  I've never found that.

[Guest263228]

3 hours ago, Slean Wolfhead said:

I think that comes down to the old FOMO and psychological contentment.   "a pervasive apprehension that others might be having rewarding experiences from which one is absent". This social angst is characterized by "a desire to stay continually connected with what others are doing".

Steve Coogan said something similar when in the Sunshine Coast, driving a 4x4 30 miles up a beach and not seeing a sign telling him he was trespassing, or an official telling him to stop, or pay a fee.   It was so empty and free that he didn't know what to do with himself, the opposite to his upbringing of British officialdom, organisation and being streamed, that he had the nagging feeling that he was "missing out on a big party going on somewhere in England". 

Australia's not for everybody and it would be very difficult if you had the mindset that you were being punished, or unable to afford to travel and make the most of it.  I can't speak for Perth, but on the other side the European culture is far more pervasive than the UK, because mainly ex-Europeans are here on equal terms with the ex-British and their Aussie/European heritage goes back generations already.  You only have to look at the surnames on any company email system and it's astonishing, but that follows on to local clubs, restaurants, social groups, sports teams.   They obviously cannot import the architecture or history, but they have direct and active lineage back to home countries and they can maintain that connection by regularly travelling back without having to live there permanently.  They also bring that influence back with them and it's welcomed, whereas the UK at the moment seems to be actively disliking Europe, except when the offer is there of a holiday in the sun.  That isn't a shock, overall, they've never liked it away from the beaches and tourist hotspots.

I agree. But Europeans had to 'fight' for their corner of 'paradise'. They were certainly not welcomed after the war with open arms. That and the fact that European migration has dried up to largely a trickle over recent decades (besides a period of Former Yugoslav refugee intake last century) Hence social and other factors do not play out to the same extent as in UK, or England especially. Nor is there a tabloid press in Australia so anti foreigners as in UK.

Australia should be congratulated in how it turned the resentment largely around and in recent times become far more accepting to all, at least in urban locations, as a general rule. That's not to say there are not difficulties as there obviously are but hopefully recent changes may address some issues of concern and ensure an England sentiment does not evolve in this country.

While no fees there are one hell of a lot of regulations in Australia where one may park and kip over night and so on. Nothing is 'too' free in Australia. Of course with the help of a 4WD and getting away from civilisation much is possible and more than likely close to the ideal aspect of experiencing Australia.

[Guest263228]

10 minutes ago, Toots said:

The only place I've lived in which I found "dull" after a period of a few months was Switzerland.  Beautiful scenery and close proximity to other countries but it was the people - very hard to get to know.  Mind you many people on this forum say the same about Australians.  I've never found that.

Swiss are difficult to get to know. But even they will admit that. Society is structured along more formal levels. This can help or hinder. The language plays a part as well. (unless rather young, I mean formal way of address) France was much the same. And foreigners are far from beyond complaining of the difficulties there, especially if living outside of Paris. Of course most things have an element of truth about them, just impacts on the individual differently.  It takes time. But usually 'solid' friendships ensure. Australia is or has become a little 'easy come easy go' type of thing, at least in my experience.

[deerstalker36]

We've (me and my partner) moved over to WA in 2014, to come to a well paid job (which i still have) and live the more comfortable lifestyle associated with here. My partner went a bit stir crazy until she managed to fined herself a job a few months later. We had a couple of people we made friends with (poms that work at the same place i do and moved out the year before) and over time a few more (south africans who also work at the same place i do). When we moved i left my 2 daughters (grown up) back in the UK and my partner left her son (also grown up).

As has been said above the first year was good (apart from a severe bout of homesickness when i had to go into hospital for a short stay) but otherwise there were lots of places to visit, beautiful coastline, wineries, breweries etc but then the isolation begins to set in. I left a large circle of friends from different backgrounds behind and we've found it very difficult to make Aussie friends as they dont seem to want you in their clique. the constant reference to bloody Pom, no matter how well intentioned or humorous it is meant to be grates on the nerves. It's a 2 hour trip to get anywhere remotely cosmopolitan here (Perth being cosmopolitan) and no matter where you drive here, the culture is the same, the town is the same, only the scenery may change (if you drive far enough).

The Aussie lack of responsibility also grates, especially in my job where it takes an age to get anybody to do anything and to get anybody to take ownership of issues. The driving is terrible (even the Aussies say that WA has the worst drivers they've seen), the beer is terrible (they've just closed down one of the very few pubs in Perth that sells anything remotely like beer to build more high rise apartments). There's also the current Aussie attitude to wealth. I hear they never used to be bothered that much by it, now it's a case of owning as much as they can in the way of houses, cars, boats, jetskis etc etc to show they are well off, in many ways it's now worse than the UK here for that

People cite the weather as a reason to stay, but then again Nigeria is sunny most of the year and i wouldn't want to live there.

And then there is family. I miss my kids more than i thought i ever would, my eldest has had my first granddaughter who i havent seen since she was born, my partners mom has become ill and there are issues with my other daughter, all of which we cant just jump in the car and be there for them.

Theres also the sudden changes to the visas, We have PR but now have to wait another 3 years to get citizenship, as if the work i put in when i was on a 457 in saving the (state owned) company several million dollars means nothing

Dont get me wrong, Oz isnt a bad place, it's just very samey. Fly 4 hours from Heathrow and you can visit many different countries and cultures, 4 hours from Perth and you're still in Australia, it might be a different view but the culture is the same (unless you visit Bali from Perth, which is like Benidorm, full of Drunken Aussies thinking they own the place), We liked our holidays from the UK, :- Europe, North Africa, America, Caribbean, the majority of which now costs an arm and a leg and several days of travel to get there and back

So i'm now looking at moving back, applying for positions already (it's not that bad that i would move back to sit on the dole) and costing up the move. Did i do the right thing moving out? probably yes, the life experience was worth it, not having to wonder what if. Would i recommend it - yes but go with trepidation. it isnt "Britain but warmer", be prepared for racism and sexism at an elevated level, be prepared to struggle to find friends that arent immigrants themselves.

@TopTohScnal, the beaches do wear off but the sharks, stingrays and jellyfish are beautiful (i dive so i'm biased in that area). Have you been down to Busselton and done the underwater walk, it may help with the going in the water bit

so if the interviews go well, in the words of a famous book "so long, and thanks for all the fish" (diving reference)

[simmo]

3 hours ago, Toots said:

The only place I've lived in which I found "dull" after a period of a few months was Switzerland.  Beautiful scenery and close proximity to other countries but it was the people - very hard to get to know.  Mind you many people on this forum say the same about Australians.  I've never found that.

The most picture perfect place I have ever seen but yes somehow extremely dull.

[Guest263228]

I think New Zealand is more picture perfect  Parts of Europe and South America as well, but Australia certainly does have its scenic places. It is easier to avoid people as well. It certainly can be a bit dull. Rather samey as the poster before last mentioned. Still a grand enough place to spend sometime. A lifetime if not from here though? Well up to the individual. I just know not many people that came from elsewhere are still here less than twenty years later. A range of reasons of course, but those discussed in above posts, certainly feature strongly.

[simmo]

7 hours ago, Slean Wolfhead said:

whereas the UK at the moment seems to be actively disliking Europe, except when the offer is there of a holiday in the sun.  That isn't a shock, overall, they've never liked it away from the beaches and tourist hotspots.

That's the narrative being spewed out by the fake news outlets, I know of no one in the UK that actively dislikes Europe or its people.  The UK voted to leave a political ideology in favour of a more traditional democracy NOT the continent of Europe.  Yes tourists like beaches and tourist hot spots - so what? (the clues in the name) No one criticizes the Chinese or Americans (to name two) tourists outside Buckingham palace and tells them they should be exploring the hilly meadows of the south downs do they? but a Brit daring to take a simple no stress package holiday to a nice beach and hotel is looked down the nose at. T. he British are also renowned for going "off piste". Go to any hidden corner of europe that you might think is a hidden gem and i guarantee within half an hour a GB stickered car will pull up or some British wally backpacker stroll up with his map in hand. 

[Toots]

1 hour ago, Pura Vida said:

I think New Zealand is more picture perfect  Parts of Europe and South America as well, but Australia certainly does have its scenic places. It is easier to avoid people as well. It certainly can be a bit dull. Rather samey as the poster before last mentioned. Still a grand enough place to spend sometime. A lifetime if not from here though? Well up to the individual. I just know not many people that came from elsewhere are still here less than twenty years later. A range of reasons of course, but those discussed in above posts, certainly feature strongly.

My nephew who was born and educated in Thailand will soon be graduating from Edinburgh University is thinking of migrating to New Zealand.  My brother (who died 6 years ago) left his house in Queenstown to my nephew and his sister.  OH and I spent a while in March doing the house up a bit in readiness for nephew arriving next month.  He will get casual work there on a working holiday visa then see how he likes NZ.  He's already done the European backpacking thing.  It will be nice to have another family member not too far away.

[legoman]

I had  brilliant uk life, making loadsa money mortgage free o the south coast but I just had to give perth another try for my elder so and grandkids, the emotional pull and emotional blackmail from my son persuaded me too. I built up a vision of Perth etc, luckily rented house due to weak pound. My younger son disliked Oz and 19 now/

fiance' obsessed with return saying she will return without me ad younger son. older is her stepson.

I arrived first, 3 months and already know it was wrong, Job situ dire, money draining away and I a struggling,  seen gran kids 3-4 times, son if I am lucky once a week and its pretty boring in Perth, the lustre has gone. I realise my elder son in reality doesnt want t be married and if he could he would return to uk, however, he cannot so would rather I wasnt' in the hope younger son will follow too.   I now need to cut my losses and get away back and re start gas biz, rent back there til my house can be tenant free, more over my girl is arriving end of May, Itold her how I feel and she   said she keeping some household stuff round my parents for my return. No concern about me leaving, says she got to try it. she 10 pound pom lived here  for many years. she wont listen to anyone re the job market, she a care assistant. shipped 50 boxes over full of cr7p and heavily in debt as not paid storage bills. all her things.

I fear its more than just money this trip will cost. however, its not Australia or Perth its how and what we see and want. very expensive lesson learned. I await her arrival, we need to talk and then part our ways, thats life I guess. a ssaid before Australia is not better or worse than uk, its different, if its going well in the UK why change. I have definitely scratched that itch re Oz now.

[Collie]

To the OP,

I'm a little confused so please help me out with a couple of quick queries - where in Aus are you?  I see lots of references to Perth but also a couple to far north Qld and one to Adelaide.

Where are your siblings/nephews?  Are you all in the 1 city?  I get the impression that you are not which kind of defeats the purpose of your move.  Australia is bigger than Europe so there is not much point if you are in FNQ, your sister is in Perth and your brother is in Adelaide.  Apologies if I have this wrong

I have pinponged back and forward a bit over the years.  Moved back 6 years ago at 37 (I think you said that you are around 40ish).  You've had a rocky start with the delays in starting work and eating up savings.  It takes 18-24months to really settle and for it to feel like home.  Being happy at work is important, as is starting to build a social circle for yourself (this can be hard and as an expat you really need to put yourself out there, meetup.com can be good) and family is important too which is the reason for your move.

If you are in FNQ (& the siblings are not), I think you need to consider moving to one of the main cities (preferably where at least one of your siblings are).  You will have better work options and it can be easier to meet people with similar interests (other expats etc).

I'm fairly new to Perth and lived in Sydney for a long time.  There are pros and cons to all places.  Sydney is very well connected for flights away to NZ, other AU cities etc.  I was part of a great Ski and Snowboard meetup group and travelled to the snow 4-5 times per season,  Also did Mudgee Hunter Valley, Port Stephens trips etc.  Always something on in Sydney too.

The take away is to give it 18-24months, embrace it and be close to your family (ie easy to do a weekly dinner or something).  If after that time you still feel the same, at least you know you gave it a proper shot (don't die wondering) and your nephews will know you for skype calls etc.  In another year or 2 you should also have a better view of how the UK is going to shape up post Brexit (and, as a nurse, the NHS post Maggie 2.0)

Hope this helps

 

 

[Guest263228]

18 hours ago, Toots said:

My nephew who was born and educated in Thailand will soon be graduating from Edinburgh University is thinking of migrating to New Zealand.  My brother (who died 6 years ago) left his house in Queenstown to my nephew and his sister.  OH and I spent a while in March doing the house up a bit in readiness for nephew arriving next month.  He will get casual work there on a working holiday visa then see how he likes NZ.  He's already done the European backpacking thing.  It will be nice to have another family member not too far away.

Certainly a nice part of the country from all accounts. (not been to South Island yet) I know Queenstown costs a bomb though to purchase, so that are fortunate. Be a mite cols after Thailand.

[Guest263228]

10 hours ago, legoman said:

I had  brilliant uk life, making loadsa money mortgage free o the south coast but I just had to give perth another try for my elder so and grandkids, the emotional pull and emotional blackmail from my son persuaded me too. I built up a vision of Perth etc, luckily rented house due to weak pound. My younger son disliked Oz and 19 now/

fiance' obsessed with return saying she will return without me ad younger son. older is her stepson.

I arrived first, 3 months and already know it was wrong, Job situ dire, money draining away and I a struggling,  seen gran kids 3-4 times, son if I am lucky once a week and its pretty boring in Perth, the lustre has gone. I realise my elder son in reality doesnt want t be married and if he could he would return to uk, however, he cannot so would rather I wasnt' in the hope younger son will follow too.   I now need to cut my losses and get away back and re start gas biz, rent back there til my house can be tenant free, more over my girl is arriving end of May, Itold her how I feel and she   said she keeping some household stuff round my parents for my return. No concern about me leaving, says she got to try it. she 10 pound pom lived here  for many years. she wont listen to anyone re the job market, she a care assistant. shipped 50 boxes over full of cr7p and heavily in debt as not paid storage bills. all her things.

I fear its more than just money this trip will cost. however, its not Australia or Perth its how and what we see and want. very expensive lesson learned. I await her arrival, we need to talk and then part our ways, thats life I guess. a ssaid before Australia is not better or worse than uk, its different, if its going well in the UK why change. I have definitely scratched that itch re Oz now.

There are plenty of warnings out there, but as you say usually the individual needs to scratch the itch, listening or taking heed to warnings with regards to general reality on the ground. I doubt there has been a worse time to come to WA. Even in the nineties during the recession when jobs were hard to find, at least the cost of living was cheap.

Nothing like moving across the world to test a relationship as many have found to their disadvantage.

[Toots]

13 minutes ago, Pura Vida said:

Certainly a nice part of the country from all accounts. (not been to South Island yet) I know Queenstown costs a bomb though to purchase, so that are fortunate. Be a mite cols after Thailand.

He's been in Scotland (Edinburgh) for the past 5 years so now used to a chillier climate.