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newjez

Do we need to steal another generation???

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Needs more than opportunity. We need to enforce education as we enforce white education. They can do the cultural stuff after they have a good education to fall back on. It time to stop this left wing pandering and get tough. We need to drag the race into the modern times. Kicking and screaming if need be.

 

Good luck with that one!

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Needs more than opportunity. We need to enforce education as we enforce white education. They can do the cultural stuff after they have a good education to fall back on. It time to stop this left wing pandering and get tough. We need to drag the race into the modern times. Kicking and screaming if need be.

Bit Draconian and won't ever happen

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Bit Draconian and won't ever happen

 

 

What? Insisting that blacks are treated as whites are?

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My post was in reply to perthbums when he made out that aborigines were a lovely bunch of people living an idylic lifestyle in paradise before the white men came. Not what's happening now. I agree that they have a lot of respect for traditional law as it's pretty horrific and wouldn't be allowed in normal society. The young bloke would be very worried what might happen to him. Unfortunately most have zero respect for Australias laws which apply to everyone else. I saw on the news last night the police trying to clear the illegal camp that's been on Herrison Island for months. The abuse they had to put up with, people right in their face, abusing and threatening them and the cops just have to take it. Just one guy arrested and nothing will happen to him.

Take a look at the footage, see how proud they really are and then come up with a few solutions. It's not easy and it's Aboriginals that have to help themselves, not continually blame settlement, invasion, whatever you want to call it for their problems.

 

The word 'Aborigine' (NOT aboriginal or indigenous, but aborigine) brings back to me connotations of 70's/80's ignorant racism and im shocked an 'immigrant POM' would use such a word, possibly need to reflect back within yourself and question where you actually picked up that offensive word, and why you still choose to use it?

 

 

[h=3]“Aborigine”[/h]‘Aborigine’ comes from the Latin words ‘ab’ meaning from and ‘origine’ meaning beginning or origin. It expresses that Aboriginal people have been there from the beginning of time.

‘Aborigine’ is a noun for an Aboriginal person (male or female).

The media, which is still using this name, has been called on to abandon using ‘Aborigine’ because its use has “negative effects on Aborigial and Torres Strait Islander peoples’ self-esteem and mental health” [6].

 

 

 

Edited by Phoenix16

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My personal view is that history has dealt the indigenous community a horrific blow, in 'more recent' years the stolen generation is just just shameful, but lets not forget though that if you were a teenage single mother in the 70's/80's you were also very likely to have your child taken away from you against your wishes, if you were a British orphan in the 50's/ 60's you were likely to be shipped half way across the world to OZ, put into a religious institution and if you were only worked to death you were lucky as there were plenty of nefarious characters hiding under the respectability of religion ready to abuse you. But how many times do we apologise? the past cannot be changed, we can only move forward, and I will say that i often wonder when we finally have apologised enough and can look forward when in my most recent job we were providing psychological counselling to 10 year olds who were traumatised as a consequence of the stolen generation. I think the time has come to acknowledge that in reality these children were not directly affected, they were not even born then but unfortunately its the legacy of the family choosing to make them and future generations victims, how do we change this?

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What? Insisting that blacks are treated as whites are?[/

You can't enforce anything based on a persons colour that racial prejudice

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What? Insisting that blacks are treated as whites are?[/

You can't enforce anything based on a persons colour that racial prejudice

 

 

That's what I said.

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The word 'Aborigine' (NOT aboriginal or indigenous, but aborigine) brings back to me connotations of 70's/80's ignorant racism and im shocked an 'immigrant POM' would use such a word, possibly need to reflect back within yourself and question where you actually picked up that offensive word, and why you still choose to use it?

 

 

“Aborigine”

 

‘Aborigine’ comes from the Latin words ‘ab’ meaning from and ‘origine’ meaning beginning or origin. It expresses that Aboriginal people have been there from the beginning of time.

‘Aborigine’ is a noun for an Aboriginal person (male or female).

The media, which is still using this name, has been called on to abandon using ‘Aborigine’ because its use has “negative effects on Aborigial and Torres Strait Islander peoples’ self-esteem and mental health” [6].

 

 

 

 

 

 

How is that article meant to be helpful? Wtf? I think we're losing track of what's important here. Let's cure the leprosy, educate the child, then worry about what we call them tomorrow.

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Needs more than opportunity. We need to enforce education as we enforce white education. They can do the cultural stuff after they have a good education to fall back on. It time to stop this left wing pandering and get tough. We need to drag the race into the modern times. Kicking and screaming if need be.

 

 

........of course they can.....'do their cultural stuff '

........when they shape up to our ideals...!

.........best not to adapt any of our educational ,cultural or living ideas to suit them,...

.........when we get....them.....to our liking....

..........we can look further afield......there are some tribes still living in the...'dark ages in Papua New Guinea....

..........drag them all ......into the ideals of the supreme race...!

..........they can all become a sneetch and have a star on their belly....!

 

...........we bemoan the fact that large migrant groups....

...........with different cultural views are erroding ....OUR.....cultural heritage....

...........yet we have the God given right to enforce ours on others.....

............we want a melting pot of cultures....

.............people ....all the same......but only if we can choose the colour....!!!!

Edited by Tink
extra bit !

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Needs more than opportunity. We need to enforce education as we enforce white education. They can do the cultural stuff after they have a good education to fall back on. It time to stop this left wing pandering and get tough. We need to drag the race into the modern times. Kicking and screaming if need be.

As long as Aus accepts that they have cultural differences and should be treated differently how do you propose we force them to send their kids to school? Taking away kids from families has already come back to bite the government in the bum, they aren't going to attempt that again.

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The word 'Aborigine' (NOT aboriginal or indigenous, but aborigine) brings back to me connotations of 70's/80's ignorant racism and im shocked an 'immigrant POM' would use such a word, possibly need to reflect back within yourself and question where you actually picked up that offensive word, and why you still choose to use it?

 

 

[h=3]“Aborigine”[/h]‘Aborigine’ comes from the Latin words ‘ab’ meaning from and ‘origine’ meaning beginning or origin. It expresses that Aboriginal people have been there from the beginning of time.

‘Aborigine’ is a noun for an Aboriginal person (male or female).

The media, which is still using this name, has been called on to abandon using ‘Aborigine’ because its use has “negative effects on Aborigial and Torres Strait Islander peoples’ self-esteem and mental health” [6].

 

 

 

Probably off the TV when they are referred to as Aborigine by just about everyone. Never thought of it as being a negative term. Would blackfella suit you better? Jeez talk about not seeing wood for trees.

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Oh well then, call me ignorant and racist. I use the word Aborigine. Must start to be far more politically correct.

 

Intersting link: http://www.abc.net.au/news/2011-12-15/dillon---political-correctness3a-an-impediment-to-reconciliati/3731552


Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take but by the moments that take our breath away :smile:

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........of course they can.....'do their cultural stuff '

........when they shape up to our ideals...!

.........best not to adapt any of our educational ,cultural or living ideas to suit them,...

.........when we get....them.....to our liking....

..........we can look further afield......there are some tribes still living in the...'dark ages in Papua New Guinea....

..........drag them all ......into the ideals of the supreme race...!

..........they can all become a sneetch and have a star on their belly....!

 

...........we bemoan the fact that large migrant groups....

...........with different cultural views are erroding ....OUR.....cultural heritage....

...........yet we have the God given right to enforce ours on others.....

............we want a melting pot of cultures....

.............people ....all the same......but only if we can choose the colour....!!!!

 

 

I think a lot of people view culture or ethnicity as cosmetic or symbolic only.. It runs deeper.

 

We have a culture of competition in our society which is fair enough if you've been a player since you were born. Life's going to be pretty tough if you're thrust into it.

 

Although maybe a different approach to all that would be refreshing. I'm pretty sure building strong communities is again becoming emphasised and valued. Money means squat if you haven't got community.

Edited by speakeasy

We all live wherever we feel the most smug, I mean, snug.

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........of course they can.....'do their cultural stuff '

........when they shape up to our ideals...!

.........best not to adapt any of our educational ,cultural or living ideas to suit them,...

.........when we get....them.....to our liking....

..........we can look further afield......there are some tribes still living in the...'dark ages in Papua New Guinea....

..........drag them all ......into the ideals of the supreme race...!

..........they can all become a sneetch and have a star on their belly....!

 

...........we bemoan the fact that large migrant groups....

...........with different cultural views are erroding ....OUR.....cultural heritage....

...........yet we have the God given right to enforce ours on others.....

............we want a melting pot of cultures....

.............people ....all the same......but only if we can choose the colour....!!!!

 

Bloody oath.

 

Our ideals, are

 

Not dying of leprosy

Not having a massive over representation in our jails

Giving their kids a chance of getting a fulfilling job

Giving their kids not only a chance to not only finish school but get a university education

Giving them a chance not to be alcoholics

Giving them a chance to live beyond fifty

 

You can dream all you want, but I would prefer it if their dreaming didn't come from sniffing petrol.

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I think a lot of people view culture or ethnicity as cosmetic or symbolic.

 

We have a culture of competition in our society which is fair enough if you've been a player since you were born. Life's going to be pretty tough if you're thrust into it.

 

Although maybe a different approach to all that would be refreshing. I'm pretty sure building strong communities is again becoming emphasised and valued. Money means squat if you haven't got community.

 

 

Aren't communities just another word for a giant squat with freeloaders?

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It's always going to be hard to change the intrinsic values and beliefs of people. I'm very happy with my way of life - it works for me and I think I'm doing okay, so if someone who thought I'd have a much better quality of life by doing it their way tried to force it upon me then I'd be fighting to resist it. Trying to force me to live an Aboriginal life for instance would be totally alien to me and the thought of being made to change everything I'd been brought up to believe in and move over to that way of living would be a nightmare.

 

For others, my way of life would be a nightmare. For those that have been born in to tremendous wealth and grown up in mansions and had brand new flash, powerful sports cars they may visit my house and wonder how on earth anyone can live in such a small space with only one reception room and have a bedroom that doesn't even have an ensuite! And then, on top of that, have to drive around in a 5 year old car that takes 11 seconds to go from 0-60mph! The thought of downsizing from a mansion with large grounds to a house of my size with a small garden would be devastating - purely because it's not what they are used to and not what they want to get used to.

 

I believe ISIS want everyone to be Muslim and think that is the best way forward for the world. Well, I'm certainly resisting that - even though they think, or know from their own experiences that they live perfectly well and happily with that way of life, they're not going to drag me into it. I'm note even going to try it to see if it is a better way of life because I'm perfectly happy with the way of life that I have and have known.

 

It's going to be very hard to change the culture of anyone if they don't want to change their culture themselves. I don't want to change mine, and nobody whether it's with the best intentions for my future or not, will persuade me otherwise. So if we apply the way we would react to a forced change upon ourselves to the forced change we think should be put upon the Aboriginal people then it's easier to understand how hard it's going to be.


Don't Let It Happen To You : What Every Mother Should Know Before Emigrating. Available on Amazon by Rachel Tilley.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Dont-Let-Happen-You-Emigrating-ebook/dp/B00FV80PTM/ref=sr_1_1?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1451572986&sr=1-1&keywords=rachel+tilley

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Bloody oath.

 

Our ideals, are

 

Not dying of leprosy

Not having a massive over representation in our jails

Giving their kids a chance of getting a fulfilling job

Giving their kids not only a chance to not only finish school but get a university education

Giving them a chance not to be alcoholics

Giving them a chance to live beyond fifty

 

You can dream all you want, but I would prefer it if their dreaming didn't come from sniffing petrol.

 

.........and what about their ideals...?

.........Most assessments on the Australian indigenous families are based on the dominant Australian community's perception of what constitutes .......living......

..........decision making is a family and community affair.....

...........cultural and beliefs need understanding before blatant dismissing and changing....

...........many of the negative results have come from our heavy handed approach at forcing a people...

...........to assimilate into our ways....

...........understanding.....acceptance and discussion in their way......of how to accept helpful and progressive ideas........not a my rules approach...

 

Aren't communities just another word for a giant squat with freeloaders?

 

.............and that's a shame if that's your only experience of.....community.....

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Probably off the TV when they are referred to as Aborigine by just about everyone. Never thought of it as being a negative term. Would blackfella suit you better? Jeez talk about not seeing wood for trees.

There is a suburb called Blackfella Creek in Adelaide don't think they will change its name to be politically correct

I know Aboriginal people and they call themselves Abos and laugh about it

Society has gone over board to be correct that's just my opinion

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There is a suburb called Blackfella Creek in Adelaide don't think they will change its name to be politically correct

I know Aboriginal people and they call themselves Abos and laugh about it

Society has gone over board to be correct that's just my opinion

 

 

There is also a tree/plant called blackboy and we used to live close to a little park when we lived in Mullaloo, WA called Blackboy Park which had a few of said plants scattered around it.


Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take but by the moments that take our breath away :smile:

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It's always going to be hard to change the intrinsic values and beliefs of people. I'm very happy with my way of life - it works for me and I think I'm doing okay, so if someone who thought I'd have a much better quality of life by doing it their way tried to force it upon me then I'd be fighting to resist it. Trying to force me to live an Aboriginal life for instance would be totally alien to me and the thought of being made to change everything I'd been brought up to believe in and move over to that way of living would be a nightmare.

 

For others, my way of life would be a nightmare. For those that have been born in to tremendous wealth and grown up in mansions and had brand new flash, powerful sports cars they may visit my house and wonder how on earth anyone can live in such a small space with only one reception room and have a bedroom that doesn't even have an ensuite! And then, on top of that, have to drive around in a 5 year old car that takes 11 seconds to go from 0-60mph! The thought of downsizing from a mansion with large grounds to a house of my size with a small garden would be devastating - purely because it's not what they are used to and not what they want to get used to.

 

I believe ISIS want everyone to be Muslim and think that is the best way forward for the world. Well, I'm certainly resisting that - even though they think, or know from their own experiences that they live perfectly well and happily with that way of life, they're not going to drag me into it. I'm note even going to try it to see if it is a better way of life because I'm perfectly happy with the way of life that I have and have known.

 

It's going to be very hard to change the culture of anyone if they don't want to change their culture themselves. I don't want to change mine, and nobody whether it's with the best intentions for my future or not, will persuade me otherwise. So if we apply the way we would react to a forced change upon ourselves to the forced change we think should be put upon the Aboriginal people then it's easier to understand how hard it's going to be.

 

Slightly off subject but responding to adapting to complete changes in lifestyle I for one had that happen, from a good life as a child eg nanny etc. to living eating sleeping in one room with my mother in some one else's house, when my parents marriage ended, and quess what we coped, got on with life, and in my case made something of my life, as did my brother who was taken in by friends. A car would have been an unimaginable luxury, even a 5 year old one, let alone our own bathroom!

So rightly or wrongly I take a bit of offence at your example. I might not have changed my culture, but had to accept and adapt to a total change in lifestyle, then leave school age 16 but certainly managed to change my life for the better. I am proof, this is possible as is my mother, and my brother

This was in the 1950's when you had to get on with life with very little state help.

 

Again apologise for going off subject, but really object to the insinuation about "rich people" are all so insular.

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.........and what about their ideals...?

.........Most assessments on the Australian indigenous families are based on the dominant Australian community's perception of what constitutes .......living......

..........decision making is a family and community affair.....

...........cultural and beliefs need understanding before blatant dismissing and changing....

...........many of the negative results have come from our heavy handed approach at forcing a people...

...........to assimilate into our ways....

...........understanding.....acceptance and discussion in their way......of how to accept helpful and progressive ideas........not a my rules approach...

 

 

 

.............and that's a shame if that's your only experience of.....community.....

 

 

Movement is needed from both sides.

 

We have a responsibility. They have a responsibility.

 

There needs to be a coming together to accept a suitable way forward.

 

You can't let freeloaders bring everyone down.

 

You can't ask an eight year old if they would prefer to go to school or muck about in the bush.

 

Parents need to take responsibility for their children, and if they can't, then we as a society do.

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One thing is blatantly obvious reading this thread (and many, many others over the years on PIO), is that 'political correctness' is used as code for 'not being able to insult/abuse people who are less entitled than us', ie a bad thing, because we are entitled and therefore we should bloody well be able to call them whatever we like.

 

The fact that minority groups often use derogatory terms like 'poof', 'blackfella' and 'nigger' to describe themselves is used as justification for us to call them the same. Think of it as your family: you might well happily label your brother a $unt but if someone outside the family uses the same term to describe him, you're likely to jump to his defence. Likewise, you're more comfortable describing yourself as fat/ugly/stupid or whatever than someone else insulting you with the same description. Its about respect: treat people in the same way you wish to be treated yourself.

 

With respect in mind, I'm sure the OP wouldn't appreciate his kids being taken away from him on the basis of eg his ethnicity in some misguided attempt to correct past injustice with a whole new one. I agree that education is the key to breaking the cycle of indigenous poverty though. We need to invest vast resources in educating indigenous people AND make every effort to keep their families together. Anything other than that is a gross violation of their rights to a family. It requires a recognition on the part of entitled white Australians (which many are not willing to give by the sounds) that an ancient and fragile culture which had been around for 40,000 years has been decimated and the indigenous people alive today are a product of 200+ years of institutionalised racism.

 

Fixing the problem is complicated and difficult, what with the high levels of alcohol induced violence in indigenous communities, but simplistic approaches never work.


My Brain Hurts!

 

 

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One thing is blatantly obvious reading this thread (and many, many others over the years on PIO), is that 'political correctness' is used as code for 'not being able to insult/abuse people who are less entitled than us', ie a bad thing, because we are entitled and therefore we should bloody well be able to call them whatever we like

If your referring to me saying its political correctness Harpodom I do not use the words in an insulting way at all

I believe in speaking to people the way I like to be spoken to

Think of it as your family: you might well happily label your brother a $unt but if someone outside the family uses the same term to describe him, you're likely to jump to his defence

As a matter of fact the Aboriginal who I spoke of, the one who uses the not correct words , is my granddaughters partner and their son my great grandson is part Aboriginal

I feel too much offense is taken on what is said when often its how its said that is offensive

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Movement is needed from both sides.

 

.........an agreement of.....how......

 

We have a responsibility. They have a responsibility.

 

.........we have a responsibility.......and they should have a choice of wether to accept it...

 

There needs to be a coming together to accept a suitable way forward.

 

............done in a way that respects both sides and how it's to happen...

 

You can't let freeloaders bring everyone down.

 

........??

 

You can't ask an eight year old if they would prefer to go to school or muck about in the bush.

 

........no but you can ask his parents what their hopes and plans are for him....

 

Parents need to take responsibility for their children, and if they can't, then we as a society do.

 

............responsibility according to who.....?

............that children don't go to school but have responsibility and cultural choices to family and community...

............so as long as no harm is done......be their choice..!.....those of family and community...

.............our idea of education.......may not be every bodies....

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I had a very good experience today with a few of the aboriginal locals. I majorly mucked up and gave him a box of proper bottles of Jack Daniels instead of stubbies. He was honest and told me, most other people would have been out the door with them.

 

2 other guys brought in some art work to sell, they were amazing. The pub bought one, I'll get a picture of it. I was gutted that I couldn't buy them, they seemed quite shy about what people thought about it. I'm definitely going to buy something though bit it'll Just have to be smaller

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