Struggling to decide ... slap me!

[flag of convenience]

PR also takes longer (457s can be granted in a matter of weeks, sometimes) and yes, your Super would be tied up as a PR. 457s can be risky but if you're aware of the risks and accept (or even prepare for) them, then I don't see the problem. Not everyone is eligible for PR and the 457 has helped many people achieve their dream of a life in Australia.

 

we are looking for 457 sponsorship too, but in a different industry (IT Security). We tried to emigrate a couple years back and failed, mainly due to the economy / job market (a big IT sec company got bought out and all their pen-testers were let go, flooding the market so my husband wasn't needed), but we're giving it one last go. Our aim is ultimately PR but, failing that, we will consider it a temporary move, a change of a scenery, and then return to our old life in the UK. Life is bloody short (as your profession surely reminds you every day), and you don't get a second chance. Grab any opportunity you can but just make sure you're aware of what could go wrong, and be prepared for the worst. That's our plan, anyway. We have 3 young children (5, 6, 9) and wanted to do it before my eldest was in double digits... At least the rules have changed now and you get 90 days to find a new job, not 30. And come 1 July there may well be some more changes to the system....so we're hoping to get our 457 granted before then, just in case the new rules thwart our plans!

 

Best of luck anyway 

 

Ps you're right, there are no school fees on a 457 in Qld

 

Sorry but why should a declining economy, where a vocation is not required through the normal pattern of immigration being acceptable as a 457?

 

Just how does Australia benefit from a surplus of say accountants, when locals are finding it tough but imports are whisked through and into position by a 457?

[northshorepom]

Hardly anti 457 as well you know.

 

I think it is, and always has been. The demographic of this forum has always appeared to me to be those who are, or are intending to, migrate for good. There appear to be many fewer people who are just travelling with work and/or doing a year or a few years elsewhere with work - there are other forums where the demographic appears to be different, BritishExpats forum for example

 

Not saying it's right or wrong, just an observation

 

As a result, people who have been offered a job in Aus and come on here looking for info are regularly given dire warnings about 457s and/or recommended to get a PR visa instead. Even if that is not particularly relevant or appropriate for them - there's an assumption that all here are here to migrate, rather than just work away on a temporary basis

 

You see the 457 visa as a rort. I just see it as a work permit. Every country has a work permit system, otherwise multinational companies would find id quite hard to operate and move their people around.

[Gbye grey sky]

I think it is, and always has been. The demographic of this forum has always appeared to me to be those who are, or are intending to, migrate for good. There appear to be many fewer people who are just travelling with work and/or doing a year or a few years elsewhere with work - there are other forums where the demographic appears to be different, BritishExpats forum for example

 

Not saying it's right or wrong, just an observation

 

As a result, people who have been offered a job in Aus and come on here looking for info are regularly given dire warnings about 457s and/or recommended to get a PR visa instead. Even if that is not particularly relevant or appropriate for them - there's an assumption that all here are here to migrate, rather than just work away on a temporary basis

 

You see the 457 visa as a rort. I just see it as a work permit. Every country has a work permit system, otherwise multinational companies would find id quite hard to operate and move their people around.

 

I agree with your point but it happens that so many potential migrants look to the 457 as a means to PR. And often they give up their jobs/careers and uproot their families on that basis.

 

See relatively few posters on here needing advice when they are using a 457 for its proper purpose, which is as you describe.

[flag of convenience]

I think it is, and always has been. The demographic of this forum has always appeared to me to be those who are, or are intending to, migrate for good. There appear to be many fewer people who are just travelling with work and/or doing a year or a few years elsewhere with work - there are other forums where the demographic appears to be different, BritishExpats forum for example

 

Not saying it's right or wrong, just an observation

 

As a result, people who have been offered a job in Aus and come on here looking for info are regularly given dire warnings about 457s and/or recommended to get a PR visa instead. Even if that is not particularly relevant or appropriate for them - there's an assumption that all here are here to migrate, rather than just work away on a temporary basis

 

You see the 457 visa as a rort. I just see it as a work permit. Every country has a work permit system, otherwise multinational companies would find id quite hard to operate and move their people around.

 

No it's a definite rort. Far from only high calibre multi national concerns use it and what may once have been a worthwhile idea has been greatly degraded. I recall you have vested interest in the scheme so would expect a continued defence of a clearly abused system.

 

I suppose a little akin to the rorts around the housing rort that you clearly recognised in early posts only to subscribe to at a later stage. You got to be in it to win it I suppose. Regardless of the arguments against.

 

As I said 457 is regarded by a number as a way to rort the system or at the very least to avoid the limitations of a migration visa in the expectation and/or hope of PR as well as a cheaper way of getting in.

[flag of convenience]

I agree with your point but it happens that so many potential migrants look to the 457 as a means to PR. And often they give up their jobs/careers and uproot their families on that basis.

 

See relatively few posters on here needing advice when they are using a 457 for its proper purpose, which is as you describe.

 

Which furthers my point at the incorrect use of this visa. Both in the sense described as well as increasingly employing semi skilled workers.

[ItchyFeet76]

I don't understand your question, FoC - do you mean why should it BE acceptable to come on a 457 in a declining economy? It's not very easy to understand in the way you've written it, I'm afraid, but I'd be happy to explain our situation if you let me know what your question is [emoji106]

 

I don't think anyone would choose a 457 over PR if the latter were possible, and I don't think it's a 'rort' to hire someone from abroad when there are no skilled locals to do that job (and no interest from said locals in learning that skill, or even a decent pathway to attaining that qualification in the relevant country because it's so new that there is not enough uptake so not financially viable to educate locals for said qualification).

 

And I disagree that it's a back door, because that infers that it's a sneaky way in, and yet it is in fact an approved channel to a legitimate visa, as actively advertised on the government's official website.

 

But we're digressing. The OP clearly understands the risks involved and I'm sure he isn't interested in the way this thread is going (ie a 457-bashing thread), so maybe this isn't the right arena in which to discuss these issues [emoji6]

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Marisawright]

This forum has always been anti-457. I don't know why

 

I don't see people being anti-457. What I do see is people anxious to make sure prospective migrants are fully aware of the risk they're taking with a 457 - and you yourself admit there are risks. If you read the posts by some newbies, they're so excited to get a 457 offer, they've often closed their eyes to the possible hiccups - like tax treatment, or what will happen if they don't like the job, etc. Pointing out the things they need to consider isn't being negative, it's just being realistic.

[Quinkla]

He misjudged the day of his retirement by less than a week and has ended up losing £8k a year, mainly due to the year he was out of the country.

Is that right? I thought GP pensions were based on 1.4% of total lifetime income corrected for inflation. At that rate, to lose 8k a year by retiring one week earlier, you'd have to be on a salary of 30m.

[Johndoe]

I think it is, and always has been. The demographic of this forum has always appeared to me to be those who are, or are intending to, migrate for good. There appear to be many fewer people who are just travelling with work and/or doing a year or a few years elsewhere with work - there are other forums where the demographic appears to be different, BritishExpats forum for example

 

Not saying it's right or wrong, just an observation

 

As a result, people who have been offered a job in Aus and come on here looking for info are regularly given dire warnings about 457s and/or recommended to get a PR visa instead. Even if that is not particularly relevant or appropriate for them - there's an assumption that all here are here to migrate, rather than just work away on a temporary basis

 

You see the 457 visa as a rort. I just see it as a work permit. Every country has a work permit system, otherwise multinational companies would find id quite hard to operate and move their people around.

 

Common sense observation and I for one have missed your postings.........welcome back

[Johndoe]

I agree with your point but it happens that so many potential migrants look to the 457 as a means to PR. And often they give up their jobs/careers and uproot their families on that basis.

 

See relatively few posters on here needing advice when they are using a 457 for its proper purpose, which is as you describe.

 

Accepted, but if those migrants look to a WHV as a a means to PR, then then there's enough warnings on this and other forums to waken them to what it actually is.........A working holiday visa...............and if they come unstuck, then who to blame?.............they gambled. they lost.................and many do................with their families in tow..............and (to my mind) bigger fools them,

[caramac]

Is that right? I thought GP pensions were based on 1.4% of total lifetime income corrected for inflation. At that rate, to lose 8k a year by retiring one week earlier, you'd have to be on a salary of 30m.

 

It seems more complicated than that. He did explain it to me, but I couldn't explain it again on here - way above my head! It's something to do with his lifetime earnings and tax, I think, but the upshot is that he's down that much each year. Could it be through extra tax? I don't know. He's a psych, not a gp.

My oh applied for his pension forecast yesterday to see whether it'd be best for him to retire this year, next year or the one after, and it does seem more complicated than it should be.

[Petals]

I think the 457 visa is a can of worms. There are many who have had trouble free transition to other visas and permanent residency, others who hate the job and get taken to the cleaners by employers and find it difficult to move jobs, and then there are those where the business closes and they are left without a job and cannot find one and have to return to the UK. It is a quick way to come but its like taking a lottery ticket and hoping. If people are worriers etc then its not a visa I would suggest.

 

Also there are other considerations these days when making the move, governments are tightening up all over the western world on pension payments and who gets what and when and where people have to be to get the pension and how long etc etc. This is only going to get worse so people who migrate and want to return home because they do not like it may find that its not possible anymore and they have to stay. One could say that is how it was for the migrants of old when they came over on the sailing ships they knew they had to make a fist of it. Retirement seems a long way off when we are young and also gets forgotten in the in between years when we are bring up our families, there seems to be plenty of time. Well there isn't it arrives very quickly and its complicated and needs to be taken into account. People cannot claim the pension when they retire unless they are resident in Australia on the day they retire. These all things people need to consider when migrating.

[ItchyFeet76]

I think the 457 visa is a can of worms. There are many who have had trouble free transition to other visas and permanent residency, others who hate the job and get taken to the cleaners by employers and find it difficult to move jobs, and then there are those where the business closes and they are left without a job and cannot find one and have to return to the UK. It is a quick way to come but its like taking a lottery ticket and hoping. If people are worriers etc then its not a visa I would suggest.

 

Also there are other considerations these days when making the move, governments are tightening up all over the western world on pension payments and who gets what and when and where people have to be to get the pension and how long etc etc. This is only going to get worse so people who migrate and want to return home because they do not like it may find that its not possible anymore and they have to stay. One could say that is how it was for the migrants of old when they came over on the sailing ships they knew they had to make a fist of it. Retirement seems a long way off when we are young and also gets forgotten in the in between years when we are bring up our families, there seems to be plenty of time. Well there isn't it arrives very quickly and its complicated and needs to be taken into account. People cannot claim the pension when they retire unless they are resident in Australia on the day they retire. These all things people need to consider when migrating.

 

Good point Petals, and I think that's where the 457 can actually be advantageous. People come temporarily for a couple years and then return home, safe in the knowledge that their UK pension is safe (and the benefit of the 457 being that you can claim back your super (less tax) on return to the UK. If they can get PR then they have the option of staying and assessing whether they're happy to receive their UK pension without inflation (plus their Aussie super). Sometimes you have to suck it and see, and thankfully the new rules now allow 90 days to find a new sponsor if the worst happens ?