Marisawright Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 There are lots of consequences of migration that people don't think about when they're young and adventurous and heading off to a new country. One problem with being a migrant is that once you've lived abroad, you don't really belong anywhere. Even if you love your adopted country, you're always aware you're adopted! And yet once you've experienced life elsewhere, when you go back to your "home" country you see it with different eyes, and you're not totally at home there either. And the longer you stay away, the less likely you'll be able to settle back in the old country again. Something that people who say "it's not a forever move" need to consider. Not to mention that if you leave it too long, there are serious tax and pension penalties if you live in Australia for most of your working life, and want to retire back to the UK - enough to make it unaffordable for some people. Another thing you don't allow for is that our needs do change with age - for women especially. You only have to browse round these forums to find women who completely changed their view on Australia after having a baby. And people who find it doesn't suit them so well once they've retired. The final thing, which thankfully is one I haven't had to face, is children. Children born in the UK and raised in Australia are likely to be curious about their roots and go back when they reach adulthood, or vice versa. Sure, children raised anywhere can travel and settled elsewhere - but it's so much easier for a child with dual citizenship! So you end up with families like my friend, who is resigned to living in straitened circumstances in Australia to be near her two daughters and their children in her old age, even though she'd much prefer to stay in her beloved (and cheaper) Spain. I am glad I've done so much travelling in my life and as far as I'm concerned, the upsides and downsides even out - but they may not for some people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Que Sera Sera Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 It's a good description for many, it's true. I've certainly never had a conventional " normal " family, so a family spread across the country or across the globe is the norm for me. But I think for many you are right it's always going to mean a lot of goodbyes in their life. On a positive note though, you can't miss someone if they don't go away, and sometimes the love is stronger and deeper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARYROSE02 Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 Well, I'm just about to head down to the Triple Aces pub to watch Spurs away to Burnley in the EPL, no doubt in the company of a mixed bag of Aussies and Pommies, and maybe even a few Asians (some of whom may well be 'Aussies' too.) And when I get home, I shall watch some SKY UK news to see what is happening in 'over there', and whilst I'm watching that, I'll probably be having a look at 'The Daily Mail' & 'The Daily Telegraph' on line, and maybe if there's something good on UKTV or UK Gold I might watch that too. The only English thing I don't do is to actually LIVE there! Into my seventh year back in OZ, and no trip back to the UK in that time, which is the longest I've ever gone. What is there for me though? No direct family, maybe see some of my cousins. I can't say that I need to see any friends, because the contact I do get from them via Facebook is probably enough. I guess I am content to think of myself as an 'English born Australian' now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JockinTas Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 It's a good description for many, it's true. I've certainly never had a conventional " normal " family, so a family spread across the country or across the globe is the norm for me. But I think for many you are right it's always going to mean a lot of goodbyes in their life. On a positive note though, you can't miss someone if they don't go away, and sometimes the love is stronger and deeper. Yes, I'm a bit like you ............... family spread all over the place. Sister worked for the Foreign Office so posted all over the world. Brother a civil engineer - worked in the Middle East, Thailand, Malaysia and Vietnam. Mum based in Scotland (she'd never leave to live anywhere else) but spent a lot of time with each of us over the years. Me, well I'm one of those folk who is happy wherever I am. Was not a happy city dweller though so took off most weekends to stay with friends on a property near Bathurst. Very happy here in Tassie though. BUT deep, deep down, Scotland will always be 'home'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Que Sera Sera Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 Yes, I'm a bit like you ............... family spread all over the place. Sister worked for the Foreign Office so posted all over the world. Brother a civil engineer - worked in the Middle East, Thailand, Malaysia and Vietnam. Mum based in Scotland (she'd never leave to live anywhere else) but spent a lot of time with each of us over the years. Me, well I'm one of those folk who is happy wherever I am. Was not a happy city dweller though so took off most weekends to stay with friends on a property near Bathurst. Very happy here in Tassie though. BUT deep, deep down, Scotland will always be 'home'. My Mum never ventured outside England either except for one week in France to visit my Sister and her first baby. I simply cannot imagine that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JockinTas Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 My Mum never ventured outside England either except for one week in France to visit my Sister and her first baby. I simply cannot imagine that. I think my Dad only ventured out of Scotland a couple of times - to Yorkshire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johndoe Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 Josh is saving like mad to take gap time out in the UK when he finishes UNI. He has 3 older brothers there and it fiulls me with dread tio think that he may not return once he finds his roots and his older brothers give him a good time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramot Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 Another nomad. English born, lived in Germany as a child for 4 years, father in army so moved lots. Went to Africa as a single female for a job. Married a pilot in the RAF, so lots of moving. Borneo for nearly 10 years, then retired here. Brother in Cyprus. 1 son in Bristol + 2 grandchildren, 2 other children (adults) plus partners here. No one else inUK as both parents were only children. Very close to my 2nd cousin and her children and grandchildren who moved here from Zimbabwe, just had a fabulous day here with 15 of us enjoying Easter Day together. Never thought I would end up having more family here than UK Have had to make home over and over in different places, have no hankering to return anywhere I have lived before as In my case I have learnt to live in the here and now. Have been here for 12 years now, which is the longest I have ever lived in one place. So although others might feel it hard to ever feel settled, I have no desire to go back to UK, and this thread has made me realise I do feel settled, and it's a nice feeling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Que Sera Sera Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 Josh is saving like mad to take gap time out in the UK when he finishes UNI. He has 3 older brothers there and it fiulls me with dread tio think that he may not return once he finds his roots and his older brothers give him a good time Whilst not the same, my girls and Grandaughter live over in Brissie so only see them twice or three times a year, but when we do it's great. Nothing is forever and yes he may go and who knows they may all come back. My Daughter left us in England 10 years ago, to go live with her Father in Perth originally then Brisbane. Who would ever have thought 10 years ago here we are too in Australia. Never ever thought OH would leave his beloved Bristol Rovers! And this was before they were relegated ! :laugh: We are a moving generation home is where you are living at the time. Therein is the key to happiness I reckon. No longing for anywhere, that truly must be awful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johndoe Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 Another nomad.English born, lived in Germany as a child for 4 years, father in army so moved lots. Went to Africa as a single female for a job. Married a pilot in the RAF, so lots of moving. Borneo for nearly 10 years, then retired here. Brother in Cyprus. 1 son in Bristol + 2 grandchildren, 2 other children (adults) plus partners here. No one else inUK as both parents were only children. Very close to my 2nd cousin and her children and grandchildren who moved here from Zimbabwe, just had a fabulous day here with 15 of us enjoying Easter Day together. Never thought I would end up having more family here than UK Have had to make home over and over in different places, have no hankering to return anywhere I have lived before as In my case I have learnt to live in the here and now. Have been here for 12 years now, which is the longest I have ever lived in one place. So although others might feel it hard to ever feel settled, I have no desire to go back to UK, and this thread has made me realise I do feel settled, and it's a nice feeling. And you deserve it after all that. I'm happy for you cause I know how hard it is for many (ex) forces people to ever feel like they're settled Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyHeart Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 It's a good description for many, it's true. I've certainly never had a conventional " normal " family, so a family spread across the country or across the globe is the norm for me. But I think for many you are right it's always going to mean a lot of goodbyes in their life. On a positive note though, you can't miss someone if they don't go away, and sometimes the love is stronger and deeper. This has certainly been my experience...with my parents..and my friends Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quoll Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 Good post MW! Those life stages jump up and bite you in the bum when you least expect it The thought that resonates with me the most is that as long as you feel you have the freedom to move as you've always had the freedom to move then all is hunky dory, you can cope with anything that life throws at you. It's really when you come to appreciate that freedom taken away from you through kids, partners, finances, whatever - that life loses its lustre somewhat. I was perfectly happy with the adventure that was Australia until my husband changed the goalposts on me and declared he had no intention of ever living in UK again. We'd both been married so long we took for granted that we knew what the other was thinking. I can honestly say that the day those iron bars clanged shut the depression kicked in big time. It's all gone now and has been since we've been back in UK. We both agree that it's not forever just while my parents need us and I can live with that. We're having a ball - doing and seeing far more together here than we had in Aus for many years. I dare say that had he not been so unequivocal at the time I could have hung on for longer without the loathing. I guess that is, too, why I encourage a belt and braces approach - keep all your options open as long as you can. But, also, never expect to move on to exactly what you had before! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johndoe Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 Good post MW! Those life stages jump up and bite you in the bum when you least expect it The thought that resonates with me the most is that as long as you feel you have the freedom to move as you've always had the freedom to move then all is hunky dory, you can cope with anything that life throws at you. It's really when you come to appreciate that freedom taken away from you through kids, partners, finances, whatever - that life loses its lustre somewhat. I was perfectly happy with the adventure that was Australia until my husband changed the goalposts on me and declared he had no intention of ever living in UK again. We'd both been married so long we took for granted that we knew what the other was thinking. I can honestly say that the day those iron bars clanged shut the depression kicked in big time. It's all gone now and has been since we've been back in UK. We both agree that it's not forever just while my parents need us and I can live with that. We're having a ball - doing and seeing far more together here than we had in Aus for many years. I dare say that had he not been so unequivocal at the time I could have hung on for longer without the loathing. I guess that is, too, why I encourage a belt and braces approach - keep all your options open as long as you can. But, also, never expect to move on to exactly what you had before! Not to sound too morbid chook, but I hope that once your parents are gone, he may have fell so much in love with the place, that you get to stay 'cause I know your heart is there Without the ex now, the only thing keeping me here is my two youngest. Josh will always manage, but Jake (autistic) is employed by the school who took him in and has security. That said, I know he would pack up tomorrow if he could spend time with his older brothers in the UK, but his future? I doubt he'd find similar work and that would detroy him as he needs to feel appreciated and useful. I love Oz but I'd go back to the UK in a heartbeat if I thought I could secure my 2 younger one's future, despite taking a huge hit by losing the Oz pension and denial Of Uk benefits...........It's taken the worst possible circumstances to have me realise that I was only here for her, but now she's gone, I realise that I'm only here for my 2 youngest..............and despite how it sounds, I do love Oz, I'm just yearning for the boys I left, my grandkids who I hardly know, and yes, those green fields and rolling hills that I always thought I would experience annualy, in retirement, with my now gone ex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARYROSE02 Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 A few beers later, and I'm back from the pub, back from mixing with those guys, and a few girls, Aussie and Pommie, who share a passion for a Pommie football club. And now I'm watching an Israeli movie on SBS World Movies. Where in the world am I? Does it truly matter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johndoe Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 A few beers later, and I'm back from the pub, back from mixing with those guys, and a few girls, Aussie and Pommie, who share a passion for a Pommie football club. And now I'm watching an Israeli movie on SBS World Movies. Where in the world am I? Does it truly matter? Yes it does, if your heart isn't there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARYROSE02 Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 Yes it does, if your heart isn't there 'Wherever I lay my heart, that's my home!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 hat ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARYROSE02 Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 hat ? Just my little pun, still keeping my sense of humour despite an awful performance from Spurs. It is 'hat' but Johndoe had said 'yes, it does, if your heart isn't there!' One of my fave all time songs, which reminds me of six months back in the UK in 1983. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marisawright Posted April 5, 2015 Author Share Posted April 5, 2015 (edited) A few beers later, and I'm back from the pub, back from mixing with those guys, and a few girls, Aussie and Pommie, who share a passion for a Pommie football club. And now I'm watching an Israeli movie on SBS World Movies. Where in the world am I? Does it truly matter? Of course it does. I love many things about Sydney but I've changed over 30 years and so has the city, and it doesn't fit me as well as it used to. If I had no choice to move anywhere else, no doubt I'd be like you - determined to see the glass half full, emphasising all the positives and dismissing the negatives as unimportant. However, I do have a choice, so there's no need for me to pretend the negatives don't exist, and I'm free to go looking for a place where the balance of positive and negative is more to my liking. And of course, the same is true for anyone considering the move. Edited April 5, 2015 by Marisawright Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted April 5, 2015 Share Posted April 5, 2015 You always sound so miserable Marisa. I thought were going back to the UK at Easter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 6, 2015 Share Posted April 6, 2015 (edited) Yes it does, if your heart isn't there You're absolutely right. We've been in Australia (in my case reluctantly) for nearly 7 years now, and whilst we enjoy a nice life here, even at it's best it's never felt quite right, always felt a bit forced, a bit fake. I've often likened the experience to being talked into crashing a party that you never really wanted to go to. You get there and think "I don't know any of these people, I don't know about the things they're talking about and I don't have anything in common with them....let's get out of here!" But going home isn't so easy either. Apart from the obvious expense, there are so many variables to weigh up. Where to start again, will the missus be happy, will our little girl be homesick for Australia, can we get her into a decent school etc? For me, it's easier just to stay put for as long as possible no matter how much of an outsider I feel here.:smile: Edited April 6, 2015 by User70277 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted April 6, 2015 Share Posted April 6, 2015 You know your wife won't go EW so don't kid yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marisawright Posted April 6, 2015 Author Share Posted April 6, 2015 You always sound so miserable Marisa. I thought were going back to the UK at Easter. We're heading to the UK at the end of the month. I'm dismayed to hear I sound miserable - I used to be such a Pollyanna! I think being in limbo - are we moving, are we not moving, where are we going, how long for, can we afford it - has been wearing me down lately! Not that I see it as "heading back". I do not see the UK as "home" any more - this is a new adventure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 6, 2015 Share Posted April 6, 2015 You know your wife won't go EW so don't kid yourself. You know my wife do you Parley?! :wink: Seriously, as parents we have an obligation to try and do the right thing for our daughter and for me that means trying to keep our life in Melbourne going until she finishes Primary School in three years time. But, that depends on whether we can still both continue working full time, something which is not guaranteed. If the UK has better employment opportunities for us then we'd give serious consideration to going home.:smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted April 6, 2015 Share Posted April 6, 2015 I don't know your wife. But I know women, so in a way I do. So I know she won't leave as she prefers it here. You'll have to suck it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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