Traveling as Australian Citizen with UK passport

[Parley]

3 hours ago, Quinkla said:

This is scare-mongering garbage. The Australian authorities have no right to seize a UK passport, especially not one held by an Australian citizen. 

That is what they told me they could do when I asked them. So I doubt it is garbage.

[Nemesis]

35 minutes ago, Parley said:

That is what they told me they could do when I asked them. So I doubt it is garbage.

It is garbage. While he will have issues trying to travel they cannot and will not seize his UK passport. 

People have travelled before without having their oz passport, especially when it is soon after gaining citizenship.

The route I have seen agents successfully recommend is to arrive EARLY, very early, with all documents, make sure you speak to a Supervisor and explain the issue  

At the transit stop the visa and/or passport are checked again before boarding so some explanation will be needed but hopefully the airline will smooth out that path. He is not likely to be stopped from boarding there but the system WILL have a flag on it saying there is an issue with his documents because of what will have to be done in London. Anything out of the ordinary will get a flag on the flight details. 

 

 

[Quoll]

7 hours ago, pete fish said:

We have checked the VEVO site and his RRV has definitely been removed and I agree I don't think it would be wise to try and request a tourist visa, but good call anyway. The added problem is that London HC appears to be closed next week, but I guess we would have to deal with Canberra in any case.

The Australian High Commission isn’t closed next week, only on Monday (Queens Birthday).

You can’t get a tourist visa when you’re a citizen.

[Quoll]

1 hour ago, Parley said:

That is what they told me they could do when I asked them. So I doubt it is garbage.

You should have heard the grilling I got when I tried to leave Melbourne on my UK passport, as the counter staff at Canberra told me I must do (as my two passports were now “linked” in the database somewhere.) I questioned that at the time but, no, they insisted. Then all hell broke loose at Melbourne and I was seriously castigated in broken English by someone who had been an Aussie for significantly less time than I had. All they had to say was “show the Aussie one”. 

However, though they may bluster and harangue I doubt they’d confiscate the U.K. passport. It’s just their little power trip.

[Amber Snowball]

22 minutes ago, Quoll said:

You should have heard the grilling I got when I tried to leave Melbourne on my UK passport, as the counter staff at Canberra told me I must do (as my two passports were now “linked” in the database somewhere.) I questioned that at the time but, no, they insisted. Then all hell broke loose at Melbourne and I was seriously castigated in broken English by someone who had been an Aussie for significantly less time than I had. All they had to say was “show the Aussie one”. 

However, though they may bluster and harangue I doubt they’d confiscate the U.K. passport. It’s just their little power trip.

Sounds about right. Lots of eye rolling about having to deal with morons like me who handed over the UK passport as I thought they would want to know I was allowed to enter the UK without a visa. Angry, little people in immigration. I personally would do whatever necessary to have the correct documents to avoid any confrontation with the aussie border staff. 

[Nemesis]

2 hours ago, Amber Snowball said:

Sounds about right. Lots of eye rolling about having to deal with morons like me who handed over the UK passport as I thought they would want to know I was allowed to enter the UK without a visa. Angry, little people in immigration. I personally would do whatever necessary to have the correct documents to avoid any confrontation with the aussie border staff. 

The thing is that when leaving the country Immigration don't care whether you can get in to your destination - that's an airline issue.

i do sympathise though as I got a roasting from them once too, I had both passports together in my hand, gave them the ozzie one and was told I should not even be carrying the UK one - totally wrong advice of course and none of their business as I hadn't even given it to them to look at. 

[Quinkla]

Once you have Aussie citizenship, the relationship changes and border staff become your servants whose wages you pay. Never, ever forget that. 

[Amber Snowball]

4 minutes ago, Quinkla said:

Once you have Aussie citizenship, the relationship changes and border staff become your servants whose wages you pay. Never, ever forget that. 

Love it! Not sure I’m game to point that out to them but you have made me laugh! 

[FTA]

The plot thickens.

He managed to slip through their grasp on the way out, which it seems they get very angry about.

They now have egg on their faces and will be out to prove a point.

Good luck. I find acting very ashamed and guilty, and making them feel very important, mixed with a bit of grovelling is the best approach.

[FTA]

17 minutes ago, Quinkla said:

Once you have Aussie citizenship, the relationship changes and border staff become your servants whose wages you pay. Never, ever forget that. 

True, but they also have the power to strip search you with latex gloves at any time.

[Amber Snowball]

1 minute ago, FTA said:

True, but they also have the power to strip search you with latex gloves at any time.

[Quinkla]

3 minutes ago, FTA said:

True, but they also have the power to strip search you with latex gloves at any time.

Generally speaking, they don't. They need to have extremely high levels of confidence that you are concealing illegal things internally before they are allowed to do that, and the paperwork to conduct such a search is considerable - think obtaining court orders. If they do strip search you without cause, it is your lucky day. You would be entitled to significant compensation that is likely to be at least into six figures. 

[starlight7]

What is it with these people at airports? Quite a significant number of them seem to be very obnoxious and rude ( not all, there are some nice ones). The very worst place for rude airport staff I have ever encountered in Australia is Darwin.  Absolutely foul officious nasties. Similar to some of the Cambodian ones, they can be quite scary, too.

[ramot]

It's the random security checks that get me. We travel quite frequently and very rarely do we get through security without either my husband or me being stopped for a "random" check. Obviously both of of us in our 70's must fit some sort of profile? Hit the jackpot a couple of weeks ago flying back from Sydney, both of us checked, I was obviously very suspicious as I was checked top to bottom, shoes, bag opened the lot. 

Had to laugh once when yet again I was chosen for the full works flying back from Heathrow, when several other passengers of dubious nationality also in the queue were totally ignored. Easy target or what? 

[FTA]

3 hours ago, starlight7 said:

What is it with these people at airports? Quite a significant number of them seem to be very obnoxious and rude

How many kids do you know aspire to do this job? That’s right, zero. It’s a kind of default job for dummies, and people who don’t like their job, tend to be bitter and angry. The big women with short hair are the worst.

[Amber Snowball]

9 hours ago, ramot said:

It's the random security checks that get me. We travel quite frequently and very rarely do we get through security without either my husband or me being stopped for a "random" check. Obviously both of of us in our 70's must fit some sort of profile? Hit the jackpot a couple of weeks ago flying back from Sydney, both of us checked, I was obviously very suspicious as I was checked top to bottom, shoes, bag opened the lot. 

Had to laugh once when yet again I was chosen for the full works flying back from Heathrow, when several other passengers of dubious nationality also in the queue were totally ignored. Easy target or what? 

Someone told me recently that they target people who don’t look like they will make a fuss. Not sure how true that is and more worryingly how that helps security.

[ramot]

7 hours ago, FTA said:

How many kids do you know aspire to do this job? That’s right, zero. It’s a kind of default job for dummies, and people who don’t like their job, tend to be bitter and angry. The big women with short hair are the worst.

They are the ones who pick on me, not sure if my ample body shape is relevant?????

Would be interesting to know how effective these random checks really are, have never seen anyone frogmarched away from a check.

Edited June 10, 2018 by ramot

[pete fish]

20 hours ago, Parley said:

Considering you can get an emergency passport issued in 1 day why did he do all the subterfuge ? Just to save the cost of buying a passport I expect.

His British passport may well be seized when he re-enters. I have been told they do that for people who knowingly flout the rules.

Even overseas you can get a temporary passport issued quickly.

No subterfuge Parley, when we found that his RRV was cancelled he was away in North Wales and we couldn't contact him and the HC web page information regarding Emergency Passports was that you needed good reason, bereavement etc and they would want to see evidence or proof of the emergency. The second tier urgent currently has a 3 week wait for an interview. If we have missed something we would be happy to be educated. He would willing pay the cost of an emergency document if you could get one, which will probably be the outcome anyway I guess.

This was a genuine error, or more like didn't check the rules thoroughly. He told us his visa would only get cancelled if he applied for a Passport. Yep we should have checked on his behalf before he left Aus , but then he is only 37 ! 

 

[Parley]

32 minutes ago, pete fish said:

No subterfuge Parley, when we found that his RRV was cancelled he was away in North Wales and we couldn't contact him and the HC web page information regarding Emergency Passports was that you needed good reason, bereavement etc and they would want to see evidence or proof of the emergency. The second tier urgent currently has a 3 week wait for an interview. If we have missed something we would be happy to be educated. He would willing pay the cost of an emergency document if you could get one, which will probably be the outcome anyway I guess.

This was a genuine error, or more like didn't check the rules thoroughly. He told us his visa would only get cancelled if he applied for a Passport. Yep we should have checked on his behalf before he left Aus , but then he is only 37 ! 

 

No. It is his responsibility to sort out not yours.

I'd be surprised if he genuinely didn't know the rules. I'm sure they would tell them when they becomes citizens what they are required to do.

I am actually surprised he was able to leave on his British passport in the first place. I thought they would check the leaving passport and realise there is no valid visa attached to it, as all visas are cancelled when you become a citizen. He should have been sent away at that point to get a passport and bad luck if you miss your flight.

[Quinkla]

2 minutes ago, Parley said:

I am actually surprised he was able to leave on his British passport in the first place... He should have been sent away at that point to get a passport and bad luck if you miss your flight.

Based on what law? Australian citizens are free to leave the country whenever they want. 

[Parley]

10 minutes ago, Quinkla said:

Based on what law? Australian citizens are free to leave the country whenever they want. 

You require a valid Australian passport to prove your citizenship.

You could not rock up with no passport or an expired passport and expect to leave just because you are a citizen which is basically what you are saying in your statement.

You need to be a citizen with a valid Australian passport.

[Quinkla]

2 minutes ago, Parley said:

You require a valid Australian passport to prove your citizenship.

You could not rock up with no passport or an expired passport and expect to leave just because you are a citizen which is basically what you are saying in your statement.

You need to be a citizen with a valid Australian passport.

You do not need a valid Australian passport to prove your citizenship. Actually, the DIBP database will link your Australian citizenship to your overseas passport initially. A check on that passport in Vevo will show Aussie citizenship. And yes, you can rock up with an expired passport and expect to leave - although without a valid travel document for admission to the country at the far end then an airline would not give you a boarding pass. 

[Parley]

1 minute ago, Quinkla said:

You do not need a valid Australian passport to prove your citizenship. Actually, the DIBP database will link your Australian citizenship to your overseas passport initially. A check on that passport in Vevo will show Aussie citizenship. And yes, you can rock up with an expired passport and expect to leave - although without a valid travel document for admission to the country at the far end then an airline would not give you a boarding pass. 

Well next time you go to England, try and travel with no passport and just your citizenship statement and report back to us.

I'm sure you screaming at the customs staff that you are allowed to do it will go down very well

[Quinkla]

Just now, Parley said:

Well next time you go to England, try and travel with no passport and just your citizenship statement and report back to us.

I'm sure you screaming at the customs staff that you are allowed to do it will go down very well

If you read what I said, you will see that it says you would need a valid passport - but not necessarily an Australian one. A valid British passport would allow me to leave Australia and travel to the UK. Getting back to Australia would be more problematic, but that would be in terms of persuading the airline that I would be admitted to Australia in order for them to allow me to board - and it seems that DIBP does have a facility to allow airlines to check. If I managed to get to the Australian border, the border staff would have to let me in because, as a citizen, it is my right to enter. They may huff and puff about it, but they would have to take reasonable steps to satisfy themselves of my entitlement and then act upon it. 

Just an observation: threads like this are more useful if people comment based on law and fact, not just a sense of how they think the world ought to be.

[Parley]

I agree starting silly arguments is pointless.

The links have already been provided by snifter as to what the requirements are. They are accepted and followed by 99.9% of travellers. But there are always a tiny fraction of people who try to point score and game the system.