Lynne78 Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 One of the reasons we are moving back is that my husband (an electrician, although he also has welding qualifications) has really struggled to find work. We believed the hype that Australia was crying out for tradies and good money was to be made. Thank goodness I had a job to come to, that became permanent, otherwise we would have been stuffed. He has had a few different jobs, both as welder and electrician, but all were casual that ended as soon as each company ran out of work. He initially had to do a course to get his Grade A Licence, then last year after getting sick of applying for countless jobs, he did a course to allow him to start his own business. Started in October, got pretty busy in January, but now very slow, which is making saving up to go home a chore. Anyway, he got a phone call the other day from a woman from some government department (he can't remember which) asking if he was in a position to hire any electricians. No. Was he busy with work? No. Seems that was the same response from everyone else she had contacted. He asked how many electricians she was looking to find jobs for. About 250. He then told her (one of his favourite rant topics) that a big problem is that a large proportion of the jobs advertised don't actually exist. Companies advertise ghost jobs,( perhaps to gain cv's for when they actually have jobs?) He was very upset last year when he was offered a job that he had applied for about 3 months previously - by this time he was halfway through the course that we had paid $3000 for. She hadn't realised this and said it explained a lot. The guys he keeps in touch with from his course are having similar difficulties. It makes me wonder how many other people have found themselves in the same position. Have others expected it to be easy to find work only to be faced with this harsh reality? It is very disheartening to be applying for countless jobs , often with absolutely no response, then to find out half of them don't exist anyway (he had quite a heated discussion on that topic when offered that job!). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunbury61 Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 One of the reasons we are moving back is that my husband (an electrician, although he also has welding qualifications) has really struggled to find work. We believed the hype that Australia was crying out for tradies and good money was to be made. Thank goodness I had a job to come to, that became permanent, otherwise we would have been stuffed. He has had a few different jobs, both as welder and electrician, but all were casual that ended as soon as each company ran out of work. He initially had to do a course to get his Grade A Licence, then last year after getting sick of applying for countless jobs, he did a course to allow him to start his own business. Started in October, got pretty busy in January, but now very slow, which is making saving up to go home a chore. Anyway, he got a phone call the other day from a woman from some government department (he can't remember which) asking if he was in a position to hire any electricians. No. Was he busy with work? No. Seems that was the same response from everyone else she had contacted. He asked how many electricians she was looking to find jobs for. About 250. He then told her (one of his favourite rant topics) that a big problem is that a large proportion of the jobs advertised don't actually exist. Companies advertise ghost jobs,( perhaps to gain cv's for when they actually have jobs?) He was very upset last year when he was offered a job that he had applied for about 3 months previously - by this time he was halfway through the course that we had paid $3000 for. She hadn't realised this and said it explained a lot. The guys he keeps in touch with from his course are having similar difficulties. It makes me wonder how many other people have found themselves in the same position. Have others expected it to be easy to find work only to be faced with this harsh reality? It is very disheartening to be applying for countless jobs , often with absolutely no response, then to find out half of them don't exist anyway (he had quite a heated discussion on that topic when offered that job!). bloody disgraceful ...seriously ...powers that be enticing people over to a new life , knowing that work is tight ...bastards . If that women has the figures that 250 electricians are out of work in the perth area , that should be relayed immediately to the immigration dept , and the findings flagged up , for all prospective immigrants At least those emigrating would have the chance to re think or move to another state ...bastards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MovingtoTasmania Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 bloody disgraceful ...seriously ...powers that be enticing people over to a new life , knowing that work is tight ...bastards .If that women has the figures that 250 electricians are out of work in the perth area , that should be relayed immediately to the immigration dept , and the findings flagged up , for all prospective immigrants At least those emigrating would have the chance to re think or move to another state ...bastards Doubt that would ever happen....how much revenue do the Australian Government make from Visa fees and charges?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slean Wolfhead Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Doubt that would ever happen....how much revenue do the Australian Government make from Visa fees and charges?? Probably less than having to deal with people who run onto serious trouble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunbury61 Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Doubt that would ever happen....how much revenue do the Australian Government make from Visa fees and charges?? I get your point MTT , but it isn't right ......people uproot their families , leave families behind , go through the gambit of emotions . The least they can expect are the facts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petals Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 This is not just Western Australia, its all States in Aus. All the agencies do this and have been doing it for yonks hence all the people who never get a reply from an agency. The problem here in Aus is that since the 90's most larger firms who employ trades people have downsized and all the work is actually being handled by small contractors. The large firms use the contractors so that they can avoid super, health and insurance for workers. Therefore anyone who migrates is behind the eight ball because they do not have current Australian certificates and Australian experience. As I said in a post the other day it makes it very hard unless both members of the family are able to get skilled work with a skill that is required here. That way at least one may be lucky enough to get work while the other looks. Its really tightening up in the labour market now and with the May budget supposed to be a downer do not expect it will improve any time soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MovingtoTasmania Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Probably less than having to deal with people who run onto serious trouble. I suspect that half the problem is that they don't have to deal with the people that run in to serious trouble as ultimately, it wouldn't surprise me if any agency responded in a very curt manner that the terms and conditions of the visa are no state assistance (in certain circumstances, not all). Which is probably why they get away with this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MovingtoTasmania Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 I get your point MTT , but it isn't right ......people uproot their families , leave families behind , go through the gambit of emotions .The least they can expect are the facts No I agree, it isn't right but there's no government on Earth that isn't money mad, money grabbing and greedy. Sad but true. Programmes such as Wanted Down Under and Phil Spencer Secret Agent don't help either as they perpetuate the myth that Australia can make all your troubles go away and too many migrants don't research enough/only believe what they want too as opposed to the hard facts of life. Moving to any country is likely to be a struggle but moving to a country that has seen it's "gold rush" days, it even a bigger struggle. Mention Australia to many Joe Bloggs average British Citizen on the street, and their response is likely to be "oh you're so lucky, it's hot all the time, great weather blah blah". Are they interested in the other side of the coin? The expense of day to day living, the fact that when daily life sets in, it doesn't matter what country you're in, life is life anywhere? No not really. Perhaps I'm putting too cynical and pessimistic a slant on this but at the end of the day, moving country is not going to be a panacea for all of life's ills unless you are running from a persecution so severe as to be life-threatening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 There are loads of people who try to warn the would be migrants that the streets are not paved with gold. I always try to remove rose tints when I see them, trouble is then you get called negative or bitter or worse. I have lost count of number of times that has happened, even though the truth is that I am a "happy migrant" and things have worked out for me. Must say I don't understand why you think a recruitment agent would make up jobs just to collect CVs, there is no benefit in having those CVs unless a job is found. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MovingtoTasmania Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 There are loads of people who try to warn the would be migrants that the streets are not paved with gold. I always try to remove rose tints when I see them, trouble is then you get called negative or bitter or worse. I have lost count of number of times that has happened, even though the truth is that I am a "happy migrant" and things have worked out for me. Must say I don't understand why you think a recruitment agent would make up jobs just to collect CVs, there is no benefit in having those CVs unless a job is found. Totally agree with you Rupert. Saying that I settled happily in the UK, but now I'm not happy, although originally I was in two minds and swinging madly between it's the best thing since sliced bread to OMG, what are we doing, and then spending lots of time persuading myself that it was the best thing since sliced bread. I'm probably in a slightly different situation because I am from Australia albeit many decades ago! Ultimately what swung it for me was the fact that I am not happy in the UK anymore. Too much water under this bridge and now I want to leave and consequences be damned so to speak. Saying that, if I or Mr MtT failed to get jobs, we have relatives to help us and also at a push Centrelink (although I would rather work in McD's then claim benefits!). As for the recruitment agency thing, I suspect that they may have so many applicants for jobs that they can cherry pick the ones they perceive as the "best". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 It is the case in IT too, there was a skill shortage when I was there but it was in very specific areas and the level of experience required to migrate is not sufficient for a lot of roles, the level of language ability in a lot of migrants was not sufficient either for the level of the roles that are difficult to recruit. As a native English speaker with 15 years experience I had no problems, but met far too many taxi drivers who were unable to get IT work they were qualified for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Must say I don't understand why you think a recruitment agent would make up jobs just to collect CVs, there is no benefit in having those CVs unless a job is found. As a manager who uses recruitment agencies I can say that without question they advertise jobs that they are not recruiting for - they will advertise roles they think may becoming vacant based on 'intelligence'. Lets say you are about to place someone in another company, you know the company they are leaving will have a vacancy even before they do so you begin advertising that role straight away ready to pounce - that role could be filled internally or the person not replaced or the employer may choose to use another agency. I would be wined and dined frequently by recruitment agents and the agenda was always 'future requirements' - they would advertise roles that I think I might want in the coming months - roles that I may or may not want in the end. They will also poach genuine roles from other agents - if you know the market place well it is often not that hard to work out where a position is - it was amazing how often a very similar role to one I was recruiting for would be advertised by an agency I wasn't dealing with and I would then get CV's on spec. Recruitment is a cut-throat sales role and CV's are a valuable asset. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 As a manager who uses recruitment agencies I can say that without question they advertise jobs that they are not recruiting for - they will advertise roles they think may becoming vacant based on 'intelligence'. Lets say you are about to place someone in another company, you know the company they are leaving will have a vacancy even before they do so you begin advertising that role straight away ready to pounce - that role could be filled internally or the person not replaced or the employer may choose to use another agency. I would be wined and dined frequently by recruitment agents and the agenda was always 'future requirements' - they would advertise roles that I think I might want in the coming months - roles that I may or may not want in the end. They will also poach genuine roles from other agents - if you know the market place well it is often not that hard to work out where a position is - it was amazing how often a very similar role to one I was recruiting for would be advertised by an agency I wasn't dealing with and I would then get CV's on spec. Recruitment is a cut-throat sales role and CV's are a valuable asset. Thanks although I am extremely well versed in matters of recruitments agents after a 22 year professional career. My comment was to the other posters statement that they are just "collecting CVs", to point out that they don't do that for the hell of it as there is no benefit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perthbum Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 More chance of getting work in the UK as a sparkie...disgrace that they are still ripping tradesmen off with their false promises. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flag of convenience Posted April 5, 2014 Share Posted April 5, 2014 The onus is on a big Australia hence rapid population expansion. More people cut business costs and stimulate the over inflated housing market. Global finance and business increasingly call the shots with government facilitating to a large degree their wants and demands. Driving a taxi if able to get it may seem a reasonable option in the future. Legal area another oversubscribed arena. I suspect living in an unreal world if those on high wages expect the party to continue into the distant future. Just take a look at the area of the world we live in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynne78 Posted April 5, 2014 Author Share Posted April 5, 2014 Must say I don't understand why you think a recruitment agent would make up jobs just to collect CVs, there is no benefit in having those CVs unless a job is found. Clearly I am not as savvy as you when it comes to the world of recruitment. I assumed that that an ad for a job is for a job that actually exists, or as in my workplace, if there is no current job applicants are requested to apply to a pool from which names will be taken when a job does become available. To advertise for the reasons that Lady R mentions I find incredibly misleading and unfair. It's fine not to hear any response from a job application when you are wanting a change, but when you have been unemployed for 6 months and have already applied for countless jobs (not knowing that they don't exist), it is soul destroying to not even get the courteous "sorry you have been unsuccessful" letter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert Posted April 5, 2014 Share Posted April 5, 2014 Clearly I am not as savvy as you when it comes to the world of recruitment. I assumed that that an ad for a job is for a job that actually exists, or as in my workplace, if there is no current job applicants are requested to apply to a pool from which names will be taken when a job does become available. To advertise for the reasons that Lady R mentions I find incredibly misleading and unfair. It's fine not to hear any response from a job application when you are wanting a change, but when you have been unemployed for 6 months and have already applied for countless jobs (not knowing that they don't exist), it is soul destroying to not even get the courteous "sorry you have been unsuccessful" letter. I think you should try not to dwell, it is energy sapping. As I say, I don't believe that recruitment agents collect CVs and make up opportunities for fun. There is no incentive for them to do this. As for not getting the "you have been unsuccessful" well it is pretty standard practice for only successful applicants to be contacted, there is no point taking it personally and getting upset that you didn't appear to be worthy of a rejection letter. It is not that and it is nothing personal, it is just a very common process these days, here and in UK. I think it would be pretty soul destroying to get a bunch of rejection letters anyway to be honest, when I have received them personally with the bog standard wording "other candidates more closely matched blah blah blah", it winds me up more than not getting a reply. Honestly, your self esteem will not be boosted by rejection letters. Hope that things start to pick up for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flybyknight Posted April 5, 2014 Share Posted April 5, 2014 same situation here tbh, i was sponsored into victoria by the government to fix some planes. the maintenance that hasn't gone overseas has gone to Brisbane (temporarily it seems) which has left me soul searching for the career i would like to be in so i can retrain. so far not looking good, the career i'd love would be renewable energy engineering (hydro/wind etc) but the boy Abbott has decided that these technologies are evil and against Australian interests, so is slashing funding. I'm in 2 minds, do i retrain in the hope that a new; more worldly government will be in power when i qualify, or do i look at a different goal. all in all not the start i pictured when i boarded the plane 18 months ago, but other than this Australia is just gorgeous, we will make it work. it's so worth it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flybyknight Posted April 5, 2014 Share Posted April 5, 2014 as far as the ghost job thing is concerned, its huge with agencies etc. they put out a generic well paid basic qualified job ad (seek's full of them!). farm for cv's, so they can reverse market the good ones. it means they have a good pool to choose from to put the best 'in their view' candidate into a company. it makes them look good. the thing to take from this; don't ever wait for a phone call or email. the amount of times i was told we'll call/mail, before i learnt wasted nearly a month. to get a job here pepper the market with a good resume (ideally done by a pro), it's better to walk from one job to the next than to spend time out of work. dont ever wait, just go mad! the job i'm in atm was offered by a different member of staff at the same agency i got the previous job. they asked me not to tell the previous employer (who had taken the time and effort to train me) that it was indeed the same agency who had taken a commission off them; who was offering me a stronger position. i guess everyone's in it for the cash, agencies even rip off the businesses they support! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest95262 Posted April 5, 2014 Share Posted April 5, 2014 well I suppose the lesson here is don't move to another country without either securing a job first or actually visiting said country to look at the job situation yourself, no way would I spend all that money with out doing either of those, seems crazy. anyway there is work in Brisbane not mega money but I managed to find electrical work after about 1 week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supercad Posted April 5, 2014 Share Posted April 5, 2014 Companies advertise ghost jobs,( perhaps to gain cv's for when they actually have jobs?) This is real problem and really annoys me to. The problem is it is not regulated and the government use sites like Seek for there job advertising figures so have no real incentive to stop this behaviour. Brisbane seems really bad for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dxboz Posted April 5, 2014 Share Posted April 5, 2014 Unfortunately with the slowing down of the mines there was bound to be an over supply of tradies with all the guys working in mines coming back to town looking for work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 5, 2014 Share Posted April 5, 2014 This is the big Australian con though isn't it... They advertise and say there's jobs and its great over here. people come in droves and bring their money here. they spend the money setting themselves up and buy cars n houses etc.. this brings money into those who have been here for ever or a long time. its what keeps the economy going...growth of population. The whole economy is built on prospecting of property. If they didn't come the country would collapse. many go home after a while, others that manage to get lucky may stay. Thats the way it is and what Australia is all about...hot air Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dxboz Posted April 5, 2014 Share Posted April 5, 2014 Government is always slow to respond and to be fair it isn't that long ago there was a mining boom. Australia's economy has never been built on prospecting of property. I saw an economy built on just that go bust when the GFC hit - Dubai. Australia never was or never will be like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert Posted April 5, 2014 Share Posted April 5, 2014 This is the big Australian con though isn't it... They advertise and say there's jobs and its great over here. people come in droves and bring their money here. they spend the money setting themselves up and buy cars n houses etc.. this brings money into those who have been here for ever or a long time. its what keeps the economy going...growth of population. The whole economy is built on prospecting of property. If they didn't come the country would collapse. many go home after a while, others that manage to get lucky may stay. Thats the way it is and what Australia is all about...hot air Who is they? I don't recall ever seeing any enticing advertising about moving to Australia. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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