BritChickx Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 (edited) I went back in2 work 2day, and everything was fine. then my manager calls me in2 the office and informs me that I have to attend a disciplinary hearing on Monday, which will decide if I am allowed to keep my job. once again I was in floods of tears. I asked her again if I was going to loose my job, and she was like I don't know. just when I thought everything might be ok, and I have to wait until Monday now to find out the decision. never been to a disciplinary hearing in my whole life, I'm so scared. I've told a few people here in oz, but haven't told anyone back home about wot is going on. wouldn't really know what to say tbh. my manager has told me I need to take annual leave @ the weekend when I was due to work. I was thinking about starting the process for my PR visa, but after 2day, I'm not even sure I want 2 stay here in oz. so confused, so upset and dnt no wot 2 do. :-( Aww, I really feel for you! If you've already given a statement then you won't need to say anything at the hearing but it might be worth just saying that you've learned a lesson in this to be a LOT more careful and always double, triple check your work. I don't think they would class it as gross misconduct. I'm sure you'll be in tears again monday and it might work to your favour if they believe it was a genuine one off. Don't let this experience put you off Australia though, they have a lot of rules and regulations to follow, I would be more worried if they didn't adhere to the rules. Hopefully you will get off with a warning. If you do and get to keep your job, then apply for your PR, incase you end up losing it in the future you will still be able to stay and look for another job. Wishing you lots of luck. Edited February 6, 2014 by BritChickx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cal2 Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 how awful, but tbh it should be routine, it is bad that you have no managerial support, I would definitely contact your union, good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkm10 Posted February 7, 2014 Author Share Posted February 7, 2014 I got the worst news imaginable i lost my job. Feel so sick and so scared. Ive got 90days to find work. I was in work 2day and with about 30mins notice my manager tells me they have brought forward the meeting, i didnt get a chance to say anything. They made up their mind and fired me on the spot. I dnt no if they are even allowed 2 do this, i wasnt suspended before this. Ive been told im not allowed 2 cum 2 work no more, they will pay me for 1month. My boss was so horrid just sat there and cold heartly sacked me and walked off. I asked if i wuld get a reference but she is going 2 put on the reference about wot happened. Im annoyed coz the nursing director was meant 2 cum 2 this meeting and she didnt. I was wondering if i shuld make an appointment 2 talk 2 her? Sum people av advised me 2 seek legal advice for unfair dismissal and 2 make sure i get a better reference? Again please help, absoutley distraught. Dnt no wot the hell 2 do whether 2 go home or stay here in oz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abz123 Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 Might be worth speaking to the citizens advice people but gut feel is that is probably more hassle than it's worth. Have they given you anything in writing? I would put your energy into finding someone who values your skills more than that crowd obviously did. Chin up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkm10 Posted February 7, 2014 Author Share Posted February 7, 2014 Thanks, no i got nothing in writing. Didnt get an opportunity to tell my side of the story. Im just remembering now they owe me annual leave pay and my pension fund money as well. Bet i av 2 fight 2 get that back. Cnt believe this has happened. I dnt even no if i stoll wana be a nurse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abz123 Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 You need the advice of an agent - hopefully one will be following this thread. As your sponsor there will be rules as to what they have to do in terms of paperwork if they terminate your employment. A verbal conversation cannot be sufficient in my mind, but I'm no expert on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flappers263 Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 take some advise and fast. Sounds like it was handled awfully and unprofessionally - you cant give someone 30 minutes notice and not allow them to explain things...I would get a solicitor fast....you might be able to argue unfair dismissal and certainly as a minimum get all your entitlements... good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tea4too Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 JKM, if you haven’t already done it, sit down and write a brief note of what has happened, from just before you made the mistake, to when you were informed that you had been dismissed. Note the dates, and times if you can remember them, whether any one else witnessed what happened or what was said. Do it now while things are relatively fresh in your mind. Then you need some advice. If you are in a union, get in touch with your local rep. Australia also has a Fair Work Commission, and their website might be a good place to check out. Not sure where you are located but WA has citizen’s advice bureau, so other states may have something similar, and they will also be a good source of information. Failing that you may need to think about approaching a solicitor who deals with employment law. Employers are required to demonstrate that they have fairly applied due process when disciplining employees - and there can be consequences if they don’t. Get busy and try to focus on what you can do. All the best, Tx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 I really would not bother fighting this, the other side will state you mis-medicated and it could have had serious consequences and they decided not to pass your probation. You will have a tough time counter arguing that, it seems pretty solid and in my view it will be futile. Focus on the future and an alternate path for yourself. You do have 90 days, but after being fired for mis medication, I don't fancy your chance of getting another sponsorship. Australia is very big on references and I can't imagine they won't bother. I would look into skilled migration if you want to stay,you are obviously already registered with the nursing body, I vaguely thought there was a quicker way of doing a skills assessment if that was the case but I don't know, it is something for you to look into. I would recommend you go to see a migration agent to discuss this. The other reality you need to face up to, is the possibility of having to leave Australia. Is it just you? Note that your employer still has to pay for your flight home Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkm10 Posted February 7, 2014 Author Share Posted February 7, 2014 Thanks for the advice guys. Unfortunately i wasnt w/ a union @ the time of the incident, im guna contact them anyway see wot they say. I am seriously thinking of going to see a solicitor i guess id prefer not to have to go to court but just threaten them so i get a fair reference. Its so awful its the weekend here, no1 is around 2 help me and this is cutting in2 my 90days. Rupert the error was nothing serious, the patient was fine, went home the same day, every1 ive spoken 2 has told me wot i did was nowhere near a sackable offence. Im thinking maybe i need 2 go bak home and work while waiting 4 PR visa, but just completley cut this job out, say i went travelling and worked in bars. I didnt know they had 2 pay 4 my flight home? They didnt pay 4 my flight out here, well if thats the case i mite choose 2 travel 1st class lol 4 all the grievance they caused me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 (edited) Thanks for the advice guys. Unfortunately i wasnt w/ a union @ the time of the incident, im guna contact them anyway see wot they say. I am seriously thinking of going to see a solicitor i guess id prefer not to have to go to court but just threaten them so i get a fair reference. Its so awful its the weekend here, no1 is around 2 help me and this is cutting in2 my 90days. Rupert the error was nothing serious, the patient was fine, went home the same day, every1 ive spoken 2 has told me wot i did was nowhere near a sackable offence. Im thinking maybe i need 2 go bak home and work while waiting 4 PR visa, but just completley cut this job out, say i went travelling and worked in bars. I didnt know they had 2 pay 4 my flight home? They didnt pay 4 my flight out here, well if thats the case i mite choose 2 travel 1st class lol 4 all the grievance they caused me. You were on probation though weren't you from the first post? So they have the option of not passing you through probation. That is why I think this will be futile. I think it is good that you are starting to think realistically about next steps and yes one option is to go back and apply from PR and close this chapter, not drag it out. Your employer does not have to pay your flights here, but they do have to pay for you to leave. Edited February 7, 2014 by Rupert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travelchic Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 Have they said if they are contacting AHPRA to let them know of the error. Not trying to be pessimistic hun, just realistic. You don't wanna be paying out for a skills assessment and pr visa only to find you've lost your pin to practice. Big hugs. Debs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 I have been mis medicated before. Luckily I was under medicated rather than over, and there were no ill effects. I'm surprised it doesn't happen more often. Nurses are so busy and juggling so many patients. Generally I know what I'm being medicated with, it's the first cycle of meds that is the danger. I feel very sorry for you. People make mistakes. As long as you weren't being negligent, I think it is very unfair. But as people have said, when you are on probation you are in a difficult position. There may have even been a quota. Good luck, and remember that while things seem pretty bad now, every day they will get just a tiny bit better. Stay strong. You will get through this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritChickx Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 Oh no, i'm so sorry!! It sounds like they were pretty ruthless, they could have gone about it in a much better way. Don't doubt yourself as a nurse, i'm sure you're a great nurse. Most people will slip up at some point in their career. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freckleface Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 While I think your employer could have managed your dismissal in a different and kinder way I wouldn't waste time and money on solicitors etc. You were on probation and through your own admission miss medicated a patient. The fact this didn't cause any harm is, I suspect, irrelevant in your employers decision making process. The fact other people you've talked to disagree with the decision is neither here nor there. Probation is the only opportunity employers have to take a close look at an employees work over a reasonable period - from their perspective they would be taking an unnecessary risk in not dismissing someone on probation for this type of error. If they didn't dismiss you and you did it again with more serious consequences they wouldn't have a leg to stand on. A reference is supposed to be a accurate reflection of your work with an employer. While I'm sure you have many good qualities which would also be mentioned the inclusion of information about your mistake isn't something you can stop them from doing. They will also say you were honest and didn't try to cover it up. As an employer I would expect to be given this information about a prospective employee. Asking them not to include it is the same as asking them to lie. You will be paid all unused annual leave and other entitlements in addition to the months salary. Your employer is also required to pay for your return flights if you don't find another employer or if you simply elect to go home. I think you are in a horrible position and I hope things work out for you but I would concentrate my efforts on moving forward rather than trying to fight the decision or attempting to obtain a falsified reference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkm10 Posted February 8, 2014 Author Share Posted February 8, 2014 I understand wot people are saying about not wasting my time/money on them or to bother getting them to change the reference. But the reference could affect my whole nursing career, i might not actually be able to get another job. i know plenty of people who made far more serious drug errors, i basically put the correct dose of drug in to small a volume to infuse. They are not reporting me to ahpra as far as im aware. This makes me even more suspicious that ive just been used as a scapegoat, they think im not safe to work @ their hospital but not concerned bout me going to work some place else. This just has to be my worst nightmare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 I understand wot people are saying about not wasting my time/money on them or to bother getting them to change the reference. But the reference could affect my whole nursing career, i might not actually be able to get another job. i know plenty of people who made far more serious drug errors, i basically put the correct dose of drug in to small a volume to infuse. They are not reporting me to ahpra as far as im aware. This makes me even more suspicious that ive just been used as a scapegoat, they think im not safe to work @ their hospital but not concerned bout me going to work some place else. This just has to be my worst nightmare. A scapegoat for what? I don't understand. You admitted you made a mistake and I don't think that your employer has any choice but to be truthful on the reference. The employer has a duty, can you imagine if they hid the facts and you went on to mis-medicate elsewhere with more serious consequences than this time? They would be in serious trouble. Because you do not want this on your reference, does not make it unfair. It is fair, it is fair to everyone. People make mistakes and recover from them. I have no doubt that you will recover from this too because most people will give someone a second chance. You could look to do a refresher course or something and in the short term you may need to be prepared to explain what happened and how it won't happen again. I thin many of us have blips on the CV which we need to explain because something didn't work out. You need to find your way to manage this, not cover it up. One of those challenges life throws at us. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MovingtoTasmania Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 I understand wot people are saying about not wasting my time/money on them or to bother getting them to change the reference. But the reference could affect my whole nursing career, i might not actually be able to get another job. i know plenty of people who made far more serious drug errors, i basically put the correct dose of drug in to small a volume to infuse. They are not reporting me to ahpra as far as im aware. This makes me even more suspicious that ive just been used as a scapegoat, they think im not safe to work @ their hospital but not concerned bout me going to work some place else. This just has to be my worst nightmare. I do agree with Rupert, you can't try to sweep this under the carpet and trying to justify by saying that other people have made far more serious drug errors doesn't come across very well. I am sure that you don't mean that in the way that it sounds but to the impartial reader of your posts, it's almost as if you are trying to abdicate responsibility for your error and inferring that since no harm came to anyone, you can't see what the problem is. As I said, I am sure you don't mean it that way and are under stress but the best way for you to handle this now is to make sure that you are open about it and explain what happened, why it happened, the circumstances surrounding it, as soon as you apply for any jobs, so that any reference to it by this employer won't come and bite you on the bum. As a new nurse, in a new environment, most people would be sympathetic to the challenges that you faced, but if you have the attitude that comes across in the post above, it won't help you. Be apologetic, sincere and sound as if you are genuinely sorry that you made the mistake, not as if you blame the manager for not continuing with your employment. Also, you haven't been sacked as such, you have simply not passed the probation period and I also think it's perfectly acceptable to apply for other jobs and say that you didn't pass the probation period and then leave the ball in the interviewer's court as to whether they want to probe further. Also, you don't have to ask the previous manager for a reference. I know that may look a little suspicious but you could even pass this off by saying that since you weren't there long, you feel that someone who's known you longer is better placed to give a reference. Obviously this last strategy of not mentioning it and not gaining a reference is a risky one but only you can decide which way you want to go at this stage. I do really hope it works out for you as it sounds like it's all been a really bad experience for you and I hope it doesn't put you off nursing for life xx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xlornax Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 I cant believe this has happened to you!! I made a medication error during probation period..we are human. .human error is all it was. .like you I followed all procedures after...I was told not to worry abt it and we discussed what was happening at the time and how as a team we could minimise chance of it happening again..I wasnt blamed or disciplined..im really shocked at your story! What abt 'no blame culture'. Since my error I have supported others through the dreaded medication error..it happens and the team and manager should support you. But you were on probation so they can end contract if they like...I think...but I dnt think it was due to medication error..they didnt want you there for some other reason. They are in the wrong not u...imo..they shouldnt b focusing on this error as reason to sack you. On the plus side..I was in aus on a 457 and didnt like my job so started applying for others..I got 3 offers of jobs wanting to take over my sponsorship and within a few weeks I was working and sponsored somewhere else. If the medication error is on the reference thats a bit weird and unnecessary..but doesnt mean no one else will employ you..your not a machine..your going to make mistakes. .and looks like you had alot of pressure on you at the time..they need to look at why that is...'root cause analysis'. Apply for other jobs and explain u need them to take over sponsorship..if you get somewhere else u can think abt pr then when everything has calmed...dont be put off nursing or aus due to this...you were treated very unfairly..dont beat yourself up...I hope it works out for you whatever you choose to do...good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 I agree with the last couple of posts. Also it does not help people trying to encourage you to go for unfair dismissal and to take legal advice, this is giving you false hope that you can win a case against your employer when there actually is not one to win. Yes you made a mistake (unfortunately during your probation period) so it is easy for your employer to let you go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xlornax Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 Another good thing is you will never make that mistake again..you can let future employers know that...that it has made you more cautious than normal and you see it as a positive experience in making you a better nurse..admit mistake to future employers..shows development and responsibility but I wouldn't use last job as a reference Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Que Sera Sera Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 (edited) I don't have experience in Australian Employment Law but I do know that in the UK If you are in your probation period and even out of your probation period but have been working with your present employer for less than one year there really isn't a great deal you can do. That is why the probation period is there. If you make a mistake in that ro!e they can let you go very easily without any official disciplinary procedure. I know you say no harm came but if they turned a blind eye and then someone did get hurt or worse they could be held responsible. I do feel sorry for you but I agree with others you are better placed in trying to move forward. I would also not be using that you were busy and stressed as a defence because surely that's the nursing environment in general which would mean you are admitting you are not capable of doing this position.Good luck for the future :wubclub: Edited February 8, 2014 by Que Sera, Sera Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy1 Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 (edited) I am looking at it from the other side too. A children's nurse made a huge mistake with one of my children and I am lucky that he is here today. I agree with the others that you were on probation and they considered it serious enough to sack you, then there is little that you can do except move forward and learn from your mistake. I do feel for you though as unlike many professions or jobs, a medical mistake can have long lasting repercussions for the person/child involved. We expect our medical staff to be superheroes (which is unfair of us I think) but they are simply human like the rest of us and do make mistakes. Luckily, you say that the child was fine, so for everybody involved there was a good outcome. Unfortunately it means you have lost your job, but it will make you wiser and more careful in the future.We all learn from our mistakes. Don't beat yourself up. I believe both Doctors and Nurses do an amazing job (and one that I know would not be able to do). Good luck. Edited February 8, 2014 by Sammy1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foo Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 I'm really sorry to hear that you have lost your job. As others have said, the result of your mistake could have been far worse and you're fortunate that it wasn't. What I would say however is that it sounds like you had a lucky escape with this employer. Granted you made a mistake and it could have been far worse, but mistakes do happen and if your employer isn't willing to give you even the opportunity to explain the situation (irrespective of whether that would change their decision or not), then it doesn't sound like they're a good employer to work for. Ask for a written reference, check that it's an accurate account of the events and then look for another sponsor. If or when you're granted an interview, explain the situation as a mistake you've made and that you will learn from and say you're looking for an employer to give you a second chance. If they then check your references it won't come as a surprise. Good luck and chin up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkm10 Posted February 8, 2014 Author Share Posted February 8, 2014 Yeh im starting to think i may as well kiss goodbye to my career its a no win no win situation, i either dont use the last reference from these employers, which would make other employers suspicious or i use the reference and no employer will consider me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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