Do I quit my job?

[ljinoz]

Hi there I'm new to the POI forum but having a fairly difficult time so wondered if there was anybody out there with any advice or who had been through something similar.

 

I've been on a 187 visa now for about 6 months and am really not happy in my job. I work in a very small office and am having trouble with the 2nd in command. I was pre-warned by a girl who no longer works for the company that this person tends to have bad mood swings and will pick one person in the office to target when this happens and was told to try to not let it bother me. If I think about it she has been pretty bad since I started with the company but it has always been on and off (she will oscillate between being awful and then being super nice). I have just recently got to a point where I don't think I can take it any longer.

 

This week especially she seems to be constantly irritated by my presence. I've noticed this week she has starting ignoring me when she comes in to the office - usually everyone will say good morning but she has stopped doing this to me and only me. Generally, she will never say please or thanks, snatches and throws paperwork at me and often just yells orders at me from her office in a really unpleasant way. She often gives me tasks to do at the last minute with a timeframe I can't possibly meet, they are often over my lunch break or right towards the end of the day meaning I have no lunch or have to stay back late which I wouldn't really mind if she said please or thank you. Also the work she gives me usually has very little information and when I ask for clarification or more details she snaps at me or rolls her eyes. If I then make a mistake I will get yelled at again. She will sometimes scribble all over my work and/or tell me its wrong before she has even read it and it usually turns out that the work was correct and she is constantly blaming me for things I haven't done. She has called me stupid fairly recently and there was an incident she made me stay back late because she had forgotten her key making me miss my lift home and then smirked when she found out I had no other way to get home. She also looks me up and down when I go into her office which I find really degrading. I really dread going in to work and whenever I have to ask her something I end up sat at my desk for about half an hour building myself up to ask her.

 

I've been racking my brains trying to work out if I've done something to upset or offend her but I can't think of anything. I've never really had a problem with anybody else in another job, I'm actually usually well liked, and am pretty quiet anyway so I can't see what I could have done. I come in to work and am pleasant, hard working and make very few mistakes in my work. I recently had my 6 month review and my manager didn't have any complaints and was happy with all aspects of my work.

 

I love living in Oz and have an amazing lifestyle here but its constantly being impacted by me going home from work upset by this individual. I also don't have very much to back up how she has been treating me as its more body language and the way she speaks to me or looks at me and tone of voice. I can certainly feel my self-esteem has been impacted and I find I will stutter when I have to go in to her office to speak to her. I'm also not very good at being assertive, although I've gotten better, so I am constantly feeling like a victim who is being shouted at and just taking it. I don't feel like I can raise it with my manager as they really value this other staff member and I know already they will tell me to suck it up.

 

Does anybody know what the implications would be if I did quit my job on a 187 visa? I am also aware that I live in a regional town so if I was able to quit my job word may get around that I had problems with another staff member and put other employers off me and also that I left my employment before the sponsorship was up. Does anyone have any words of advice? Am I being too sensitive and need to just suck it up?

[ali]

Not sure about the visa implications, but have you thought of approaching her boss and speaking to them about your situation, they may be oblivious to how she's acting.

[boganbear]

Keeps diary of every incident and have a word with her boss

[nicolac34]

The joy of a rsms visa! You think it's a golden ticket, but then it comes with this "two year rule" wherby you have to stay working for your employer or they "might" cancel your visa. So cruel.

 

There have been a few similar situations, search for 'rsms' or '857/119' - that's the old visa number that many of us are here on.

 

my situation was/is pretty similar to yours, but a little less extreme - horrible woman boss who made my life miserable. I made the decision to stick it out and I'm 7 months away from being "free" from both my employer and the regional area. Although, having said that I probably won't leave... Something changed within my boss a couple of months ago and she's started being far more pleasant, maybe, after 2 years working for her, she's realised that it won't kill her to be friendly to me... Who knows.

 

You have my every sympathy, it's an awful position to be in.

[xxlornaxx]

Thats horrible for u...next time she does sumthin like that ask her why..like why are you rolling your eyes..why are you ignoring me..or why are you being so rude. .b assertive and wait for her answer..tell her its Unprofessional,unnecessary and you dont appreciate it..be polite but firm...shes doing it coz your letting her get away wth it...if you approach her about it she may get a shock and move on to bully sum1 else...dont let her ruin your work enjoyment..she sounds awful

[Melbkitty]

I've worked with a couple of bizarre and toxic people like this in my current company and like you had never previously encountered it. It stems from low self esteem in my opinion - why else would someone behave this way and try up exert some control on people who are usually less assertive. Perhaps she knows that you don't want to rock the boat too due to your visa. I agree keep records if there is anything tangible to go to her senior about, but I deal with these individuals by feeling a bit sorry for them and not allowing it to affect me the minute I leave their company. Also just be super pleasant - they often don't know how to react when they see you are not intimidated or affected by them.

[AJ]

Thats horrible for u...next time she does sumthin like that ask her why..like why are you rolling your eyes..why are you ignoring me..or why are you being so rude. .b assertive and wait for her answer..tell her its Unprofessional,unnecessary and you dont appreciate it..be polite but firm...shes doing it coz your letting her get away wth it...if you approach her about it she may get a shock and move on to bully sum1 else...dont let her ruin your work enjoyment..she sounds awful

 

This is good but I would try and do it in front of other people as well, it might make her worse for a while but then again, if you stand up to her might stop her altogether - bullies don't like it when you fight back!

 

Or try and give it the" no problem will sort that out for you," etc be so nice its sickening haha - she is only doing it cos she knows she is intimidating you.

 

And if all else fails, put laxitives in the bitches tea

 

:wink:

Edited October 11, 2013 by AJ

[Rupert]

Your visa situation leaves you vulnerable as I am sure you know. How about a fairly direct approach, ask to have a quiet word and then in private say to her "Have I done something to upset you" and take it from there. Perhaps it will clear the air.

[ljinoz]

Thanks for the advice everyone. I think I do want to stick it out like you decided to Nicola as I know I would regret it if I left and my partner is here on my visa too so it wouldn't just be me it would impact. I'm used to working in offices where everybody is professional and I've certainly never been yelled at before in a job. I've been keeping a diary on and off about the things she has been doing (she goes through phases of being ok and then really bad depending on the week) so as soon as I have something I will go to the boss and I will start to document everything. She is just quite clever in the way its usually body language and manner too rather than her actually swearing at me or anything tangible and its also never when the boss is in earshot. I actually dread it when the boss is on leave or out of the office as that's when she tends to be at her worst. I've been trying to continue being pleasant to her and acting as if her behaviour doesn't bother me too (even though it obviously does) but I'm finding it harder and harder to just take it. Although I'm not very good at being assertive there's no way I would take this if it wasn't for my visa!

[Levi]

@ljinoz: Feel for you. Had an idiot manager when I was on a work & travel program in the USA; I'm glad it only lasted 3 months. Up and down she went with her nerves. Was over 40 from what I understood, no husband, no kids. Does your annoying person have a family? : ))

 

"I actually dread it when the boss is on leave or out of the office as that's when she tends to be at her worst." So when the actual boss is out she tries to play the boss - unsuccessfully by what I read. Just ignore her. It's a wee bit of a problem if you're not good at being assertive, then the ignoring her might be harder to do.

 

I don't know if you are a man or a woman, but man up! I've been told this a couple of times - and I'm making progress.

 

I want to close with this: are you getting your pay? If yes, then just let this attitude just slip by you. Oh and the idea with the laxative is a good one. Do it if you think you can pull it off. : )) Make sure she and only she drinks from whatever you put it into.

 

Get your money, get your 2 years and each day when you leave the office just leave the problems behind. Talk to your partner, he/she will always be there for support! Cheers

[ljinoz]

Thanks for the advice Levi. I'm female and I think I do need to man up and just try my best to ignore it, take home my money, and then at the end of the 2 years I am able to leave. Annoying person doesn't have a family no, she has just recently broken up with her on/off boyfriend for good so may be why she is being particularly awful at the moment!

[flag of convenience]

It is yet another complete abuse of power. Far too common. Sadly those on visa's (457s) can be prime victims, but same applies for those on trial periods.

By all means record every event and time and place. I would confront the person on her behaviour and give them a chance for a explaination.

Often folk in management roles are poor at their jobs and cover up their inabilities and frustrations by bullying tactics.

There are not many ways to go. Either look for another job, but perhaps not so easy and may not be an improvement anyway. The workplace has numerous psychopaths in positions of power for obvious reasons. Besides that you put up or shut up. I'd confront and demand correct treatment but we all are not in the same situation and nothing is without a price. (I do have experience in the matter) We should always stand up to bullying. Bully the bully it's a lot of fun....

Good luck.

[Petals]

I feel for you, however you do not have to put up with it. If you like the job and the others who you work with I would just ignore, be super pleasant and not let her know it bothers you. Hard to do but it can be done. That way she has nothing to complain about. I am surprised that the boss has not noticed and I think he/she knows as you say you know someone else that worked there, so its not a new thing. Sad lives some people have that they have to be so miserable t others.

[Peccavi]

Hello, your post is very interesting.

 

It seems to me that this visa situation allows exploitative behaviour by an employer or Manager in a workplace, because they know you are 'trapped'.

 

Don't spike her drink-if you are caught out with that-she becomes the victim and you of course the bad person.

Also I don't think you should 'grin and bear it'. We can do that but our insides become ever more distressed.

 

I notice something in your post: you said she is worse when the boss is not around. That is significant. You need to ask her for a private talk. Discuss with her your effort to do your job properly, and that you do not understand what you are doing to upset her. (She will deny she is 'upset' aka nasty,-but your message would have got through). Tell her how you are feeling and that you are confused because your performance report has been good.

 

Suggest to her that you do not wish to upset her in any way and have thought of approaching the boss for some advice on how to make her happier with your work,-because 'you only want her to be happy with what you are doing'. I suspect she will not want any approach to the boss.....

 

I don't think any circumstances warrant 'putting up with it'. All that does is allow bullies to thrive. They need to be countered.

 

I wish you the best of luck.

[Tickled Pink]

I would Definately advise strongly against having a 'private' talk as suggested above. You should always remain in a transparent situation so if any conversation turns sour (even if you don't want it to, the other party can make it that way...) you have an accountable witness.

 

I've had to deal with tribunal situations before (sadly, hate them) and when it comes down to incidents or arguments occurring between the two people concerned without any witnesses it gets very difficult and is almost always discounted as ' evidence'.

 

If you decide to have such a talk then I would advise having an impartial (as far as possible) person present. They don't need to be part of the conversation necessarily, but simply within earshot in the vicinity it takes place.

 

But where things are at currently? private talk? no, no, and no....

Edited October 13, 2013 by Tickled Pink

[flag of convenience]

If all else fails give her a pounding in the toilets. You'll feel better. Claim you slipped on the wet floor or momentary insanity.

[AJ]

 

Don't spike her drink-if you are caught out with that-she becomes the victim and you of course the bad person.

Also I don't think you should 'grin and bear it'. We can do that but our insides become ever more distressed.

 

 

 

 

I wish you the best of luck.

 

For goodness sake - that was a joke!

[ljinoz]

Thanks for the kind words and support from people. The way I feel today I want to pack up and fly straight back home. I feel physically sick at the thought of going in work tomorrow. The office is so small its so hard to ignore the behaviour and I have to provide PA support to the offending person and have orders yelled at me like I'm a dog.

 

Ever since we have been in Australia its like something has been telling us the country isn't for us and it seems to have pushed us to our limits. Although my partner has quite a few friends here I have very few and am constantly lonely and home sick at the moment. I have never really been a confident person but I can feel my self-esteem is getting lower and lower.

[docboat]

This sounds unacceptable behaviour. Good advice so far - especially documenting what is being done - do you have any facility (government job?) for starting a grievance process?

 

However, you might try this, when in company: (to 2IC bitch when she is misbehaving- "When you say '<whatver she said>' I feel '<insert your negative emotional response'>." That way, you have not criticised her behaviour, but made her aware of the response it evokes in you. Have a read on this method of assertiveness ... you might find that she changes her attitude. Then again, she might not, but then you have a clear conscience when she gets hauled over the coals for bullying.

 

Also, and this is a bit weird: Try using apps for brainwave entrainment and subliminal programming. In combination. They work wonderfully on getting your mind (and therefore the rest of you) into a better place, and they have absolutely no effect on the 2IC bitch. End result should be that you prosper, and she does not. Sweet revenge, but it does take time to manifest. See more under applications for manifesting the law of attraction. At the very least it will make your life even better.

 

And ooh! No - don't quit your job. At least not until you have resolved the issue. Why? Because then you leave on your own terms, proud, and not running away from a situation which will then -trust me on this! - be repeated in the future.

Edited October 13, 2013 by docboat

[Peccavi]

I would Definately advise strongly against having a 'private' talk as suggested above. You should always remain in a transparent situation so if any conversation turns sour (even if you don't want it to, the other party can make it that way...) you have an accountable witness.

 

I've had to deal with tribunal situations before (sadly, hate them) and when it comes down to incidents or arguments occurring between the two people concerned without any witnesses it gets very difficult and is almost always discounted as ' evidence'.

 

If you decide to have such a talk then I would advise having an impartial (as far as possible) person present. They don't need to be part of the conversation necessarily, but simply within earshot in the vicinity it takes place.

 

But where things are at currently? private talk? no, no, and no....

 

The difference is talk v confrontation. Confrontation is a losing game, but asking a polite question is not.

 

If this situation is becoming untenable and it appears that it is, then something has to be done to alleviate it. That is not confrontative, but bringing in a witness would be.

 

For goodness sake - that was a joke!

 

Thank-you for clarifying. I have no sense of humour so I did not realise.

[Tickled Pink]

Talk or confrontation, it makes no difference. At this point privacy should he avoided when addressing the situation, the OP needs to cover her back from any eventualities. She can go into a room with the intention only of an informal chat or talk, however, she has no control over what the other party decides to interpret it as, and therefore if it is then turned around and used against her later should the OP try and complain.

 

A 'polite question' can be easily and informally asked when others are about.... and will look far less 'confrontational' if not requested off to the side privately.I'm not suggesting that someone be actually asked to sit there and witness the conversation as if watching a tennis match! rather make sure the chat can be easily overheard by others.

 

I'm certainly not looking to veer off the OP's thread to discuss what constitutes talk or other.... I think, OP, that you are in a really unpleasant situation, and you have my sympathies. I hope you understand what I'm getting at, as I'm only concerned with helping you watch out for yourself...

Edited October 13, 2013 by Tickled Pink

[ItchyFeet76]

I can't believe that, in this day and age, people are getting away with bullying in the workplace. Regardless of how 'trapped' an employee may be (on a temp. visa or whatever), standing up for oneself and addressing a problem is not grounds for dismissal, so one should not be afraid of confronting one's boss or attempting to resolve it. Providing there is a record of all their behaviour / bullying incidents, plus witnesses willing to testify on one's behalf...

 

Or is this rather naïve of me...?!

 

Basically, what I'm saying is this: just because you're not a permanent resident doesn't give anyone the right to treat you as a second-class employee. They cannot sack you for no reason and, if they do, surely they can't just throw you out of the country? Just make sure you pre-empt such a situation by recording when / where / how they 'abuse' you, and get witnesses - like someone previously said: have a word with her but make sure it's within earshot of a colleague (whom you've already tipped off and asked to listen on your behalf).

 

Of course, perhaps we should give your boss the benefit of the doubt as she could be unaware of her behaviour if she is suffering the heartbreak of a relationship ending. That said, it wouldn't explain why she acts worse towards you when the boss is not around!!

 

I don't see the benefit in playing her at her own game - it is too risky, it could harm your professional record and, morally, you are sinking to her level. Stand your grand, try and imagine her with a sausage on her nose or something equally demeaning, and start to pity her. Perhaps show that pity and it will confuse her into backing off! If you let her hurt you it will only give her more power to do it again. Bullies thrive on the thrill of hurting people and feeling empowered by the effect they have on others.

 

If all else fails, anonymously leave a therapist's business card on her desk and see how she reacts! ;-)

 

Best of luck and don't give up on Australia because of this setback - try and make sure you're maximising your quality of life OUTSIDE of work (BBQs, day trips, exploring, meeting people, etc.).

 

I-F :-)

[nicolac34]

I can't believe that, in this day and age, people are getting away with bullying in the workplace. Regardless of how 'trapped' an employee may be (on a temp. visa or whatever), standing up for oneself and addressing a problem is not grounds for dismissal, so one should not be afraid of confronting one's boss or attempting to resolve it. Providing there is a record of all their behaviour / bullying incidents, plus witnesses willing to testify on one's behalf...

 

Or is this rather naïve of me...?!

 

Basically, what I'm saying is this: just because you're not a permanent resident doesn't give anyone the right to treat you as a second-class employee. They cannot sack you for no reason and, if they do, surely they can't just throw you out of the country? Just make sure you pre-empt such a situation by recording when / where / how they 'abuse' you, and get witnesses - like someone previously said: have a word with her but make sure it's within earshot of a colleague (whom you've already tipped off and asked to listen on your behalf).

 

Of course, perhaps we should give your boss the benefit of the doubt as she could be unaware of her behaviour if she is suffering the heartbreak of a relationship ending. That said, it wouldn't explain why she acts worse towards you when the boss is not around!!

 

I don't see the benefit in playing her at her own game - it is too risky, it could harm your professional record and, morally, you are sinking to her level. Stand your grand, try and imagine her with a sausage on her nose or something equally demeaning, and start to pity her. Perhaps show that pity and it will confuse her into backing off! If you let her hurt you it will only give her more power to do it again. Bullies thrive on the thrill of hurting people and feeling empowered by the effect they have on others.

 

If all else fails, anonymously leave a therapist's business card on her desk and see how she reacts! ;-)

 

Best of luck and don't give up on Australia because of this setback - try and make sure you're maximising your quality of life OUTSIDE of work (BBQs, day trips, exploring, meeting people, etc.).

 

I-F :-)

 

She is a permanent resident, has all the rights of PR, but it comes with the proviso that you have to remain with your employer for 2 years from the grant if visa, or they "could" cancel it. Not that I have heard of anyone cancelling this visa, but the threat is there.

 

Not naive, but maybe not realistic. I'm not confrontational either, I chose to just bottle it up and grin and bear it so to speak. To me that was preferable to saying anything, and sounds like the OP is the same.

[Rupert]

She is a permanent resident, has all the rights of PR, but it comes with the proviso that you have to remain with your employer for 2 years from the grant if visa, or they "could" cancel it. Not that I have heard of anyone cancelling this visa, but the threat is there.

 

Not naive, but maybe not realistic. I'm not confrontational either, I chose to just bottle it up and grin and bear it so to speak. To me that was preferable to saying anything, and sounds like the OP is the same.

 

 

I have certainly seen people being investigated for leaving the employer within two years, unfortunately they have not come back to say what happened.

 

The reason I would not recommend OP does anything hasty like quit is that this could easily become one persons word against another and it is not actually the employer /manager that is making life hard. I think a formal grievance process would need to be followed in order to demonstrate that OP has made every effort to abide by the visa conditions.

[ItchyFeet76]

She is a permanent resident, has all the rights of PR, but it comes with the proviso that you have to remain with your employer for 2 years from the grant if visa, or they "could" cancel it. Not that I have heard of anyone cancelling this visa, but the threat is there.

 

Not naive, but maybe not realistic. I'm not confrontational either, I chose to just bottle it up and grin and bear it so to speak. To me that was preferable to saying anything, and sounds like the OP is the same.

 

Ah ok. I don't know much about regional visas, evidently! It still shouldn't mean that she gets thrown out of the country if she loses her job over addressing this issue, and it should still be grounds for constructive dismissal if they did sack her because of this. Companies can't get away with behaving like this, not without legal ramifications. Perhaps she could speak to the immigration officials and explain her predicament to see what they advise, then?