legoman Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 I rent my house in the UK. I find that when applying for a rental here its helps to state that I am a landlord too on the application. I find being a tenant here in Perth is a lot more restrictive than being a tenant in the UK. Until you try and get your bond back. We had new hotplate and electrics done in our rental as fuses kept blowing. when we had plumbing probs I was asked if I could fix it and the tree falling onto next doors fence as the landlord has spent money on repairs already. yeah right. last rental tried to hold back on 400dolfor holes in the wall when we left. luckily their own pre inspection dvd revealed they were already there and the video I took on moving in showed them as existing. still not got money back and taking further with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flag of convenience Posted September 6, 2013 Share Posted September 6, 2013 Here is a question for you buzzy... You have great long term tennants in place, they never cause u any problems and they look after the house... You then try to put up their rent buy $30 a week say..... we say screw u (nicely of course ), we are not paying anymore... would you get rid of us and take a risk on a new people who could be a bad payer, or a nutter etc, probably agent fees and maybe a period with no tenant... Reason I ask is when I rent out my house, if i have tenants I am happy with, I will never put up the rent... but i have rented myself and every year the landlord wants to put up the rent.... time to call their bluff and say no I am not paying anymore I think.. just wondered what your view on it was Exactly the point I made. Good tenants are worth their weight in gold. Especially if they make some improvements. Sadly all too often greed wins out though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kapri Posted September 7, 2013 Share Posted September 7, 2013 When we were looking for a rental two months ago, we were often the only viewers (on any rental over $475 per week). We had our pick and one of the agents told us that the rental market was suffering. The man who came to spray our house last week said he had long term tenants in his investment property and he leaves them alone because they pay their rent on time and look after the place. He said some of his friends were complaining that they couldn't get tenants. We are renting at the right time I guess. That said, I can't wait to buy again so I can hang some pictures and get a dog! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzzy--bee Posted September 7, 2013 Author Share Posted September 7, 2013 Here is a question for you buzzy... You have great long term tennants in place, they never cause u any problems and they look after the house... You then try to put up their rent buy $30 a week say..... we say screw u (nicely of course ), we are not paying anymore... would you get rid of us and take a risk on a new people who could be a bad payer, or a nutter etc, probably agent fees and maybe a period with no tenant... Reason I ask is when I rent out my house, if i have tenants I am happy with, I will never put up the rent... but i have rented myself and every year the landlord wants to put up the rent.... time to call their bluff and say no I am not paying anymore I think.. just wondered what your view on it was I will always ask for an increase if the market will stand it, just as Caltex do, or Coles, or any business. It's a business remember, it's to make money. I will not try and get an above-market increase if the tenants are good, but there's no reason for me to give them below-market, as it will cost them more to move. I have a friend who has let out his flat in St Kilda for 12 years to the same tenant. In that time he has never given her a rent increase as she is a good tenant. He is now charging $850 less per month than competing properties. Would you forego $85000 + per year because you like your tenant? I wouldn't. A lot of people don't even earn that. BB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzzy--bee Posted September 7, 2013 Author Share Posted September 7, 2013 This thread was originally intended to help new migrants understand how they could increase their chances of getting a rental, as many people have been saying recently that it is hard for them...... BB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flag of convenience Posted September 7, 2013 Share Posted September 7, 2013 I will always ask for an increase if the market will stand it, just as Caltex do, or Coles, or any business. It's a business remember, it's to make money. I will not try and get an above-market increase if the tenants are good, but there's no reason for me to give them below-market, as it will cost them more to move. I have a friend who has let out his flat in St Kilda for 12 years to the same tenant. In that time he has never given her a rent increase as she is a good tenant. He is now charging $850 less per month than competing properties. Would you forego $85000 + per year because you like your tenant? I wouldn't. A lot of people don't even earn that. BB You write like the housing market is a free market and we all know it is not. Rent subsidies are paid to people like you from the tax payers purse so it is not like any other business. The greed you portray just furthers the fact that rent subsidies should be phased out and replaced by controlled rents. It shouldn't be allowed both ways. Housing from my view has become a major issue in Australia and wasn't touched on to my knowledge in the election build up. Due no doubt to the an unholy alliance between government, banks and the real estate industry. Affordability in a free market should be the only control on prices. Rent subsidies are give a away to landlords. While we're at it ban the purchase of foreigners buying Australian property. Just look at the laws in place frustrating the purchase of property in most Asian countries. Rent controls badly needed and stopping of inflationary real estate sales methods with auctions in particular put in the spot light. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flag of convenience Posted September 7, 2013 Share Posted September 7, 2013 This thread was originally intended to help new migrants understand how they could increase their chances of getting a rental, as many people have been saying recently that it is hard for them...... BB Rents are already way over the top. The promotion of further greed cannot be further endorsed. I'm sure most aware that bribes may be away to get a place if find it so difficult. Thankfully rent vacancies seem to be on the rise and as such this third world method of doing business will be put back in its box. Biggest hope would be for rent to decline followed by house prices and the greedy take a substantial hit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peach Posted September 7, 2013 Share Posted September 7, 2013 (edited) I will always ask for an increase if the market will stand it, just as Caltex do, or Coles, or any business. It's a business remember, it's to make money. I will not try and get an above-market increase if the tenants are good, but there's no reason for me to give them below-market, as it will cost them more to move. And that's the gamble you take.. You wouldn't believe the pleasure I took in giving notice to leave two days after I received notice that LJ Hooker were increasing my rent on behalf of the landlord. The house then sat empty for nine months and eventually new tenants moved in for $80 a week less than we we're paying. I'm thankful we only had to rent for one year before we bought - the way the rental system works here was a strong motivator to buy. Edited September 7, 2013 by Peach Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peach Posted September 7, 2013 Share Posted September 7, 2013 This thread was originally intended to help new migrants understand how they could increase their chances of getting a rental, as many people have been saying recently that it is hard for them...... BB Help?? It reads more like 'how to bribe potential landlords with financial incentives to secure a property'. I would say most people secure a rental without resorting to paying over the odds - which is what your post suggested.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cez Posted September 7, 2013 Share Posted September 7, 2013 To be fair it's not uncommon for potential tenants in Sydney to offer more than the asking rent. We found this when we were looking at the start of last year, before we bought our current property. The rental market there, especially in the popular inner suburbs, is pretty tight. We've rented t our unit now as we've temporarily relocated to singapore, but we want our tenants to be happy and also want them to look after our home. It's a two way street, some people tend to forget that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cez Posted September 7, 2013 Share Posted September 7, 2013 We had a horrendous experience renting from LJ too, to be honest I think the agents were worse than the landlords. W lived in a place where the bathroom would flood with raw sewage when it rained extremely heavily.the first time it happened we called the agents asking for a forensic style clean of the bathroom - we had no other toilet. This was on a Friday and the letting agent asked if we could wait until Monday for the clean in case it flooded again. Ie would we mind wading through raw sewage all weekend? Uh, yes, we did mind. There were other issues with the place like a thick layer of black mould which gave me some problems with my sinuses but we were too scared to complain in case it meant the agent would give us a bad reference and we would find it hard to rent anywhere else. It was a nightmare! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamffc Posted September 7, 2013 Share Posted September 7, 2013 Professional landlords who view make money out of people wanting to make a home but who cannot afford to buy, and view it as a business are the scum of the earth. Until I can afford to buy a place here, I rent my house out in the UK and feel really guilty about having a young couple in there paying my mortgage. That said I have not increased the rent in the four years that they have been there as they have caused no problems and my costs have not gone up. If I tried to squeeze as much out of them as possible there is no way that I could look myself in the mirror. I have no sympathy for landlords who bleat about problems, it's an inherent risk we all have to accept. Strange as it might seem, tenants don't view the sole purpose of their lives as being to line somebody else's pockets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legoman Posted September 7, 2013 Share Posted September 7, 2013 Professional landlords who view make money out of people wanting to make a home but who cannot afford to buy, and view it as a business are the scum of the earth. Until I can afford to buy a place here, I rent my house out in the UK and feel really guilty about having a young couple in there paying my mortgage. That said I have not increased the rent in the four years that they have been there as they have caused no problems and my costs have not gone up. If I tried to squeeze as much out of them as possible there is no way that I could look myself in the mirror. I have no sympathy for landlords who bleat about problems, it's an inherent risk we all have to accept. Strange as it might seem, tenants don't view the sole purpose of their lives as being to line somebody else's pockets. ?? Not sure I understand, Landlords buy to properties to make money and it is a business. people for some reason or other who may prefer to rent pay the mortgage for the house owner. same as authorities who buy rentals and build them. why else would someone buy other properties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flag of convenience Posted September 7, 2013 Share Posted September 7, 2013 ?? Not sure I understand, Landlords buy to properties to make money and it is a business. people for some reason or other who may prefer to rent pay the mortgage for the house owner. same as authorities who buy rentals and build them. why else would someone buy other properties. How about appreciation over time for one thing. Another a way to park money in times of low interest. Another the tax perks in Australia termed negative gearing, which has a lot to answer for. Fleecing tenants on top of all that, pretty poor way to do business. Treat folk well and more often than not it will be repaid. Rip them off through greed and expect no favours indeed rather the opposite. You could get the place thrashed on lease expiry which happened about a year ago in a house near me let to Irish. They found out in time what the previous rent was and let rip on leaving. Exiting Perth so didn't care. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzzy--bee Posted September 7, 2013 Author Share Posted September 7, 2013 Another the tax perks in Australia termed negative gearing, which has a lot to answer for. When negative gearing was abolished in the 1980s for 2 years, rents went up considerably as investors left the market, new investors did not enter the market, and the supply of rental properties diminshed. It was re-introduced because tenants advocates successfully lobbied the government for its re-introduction. Negative gearing subsidises the landlord's income, and through the free market, this is passed on to the tenants through lower rents. The other advantage negative gearing brings for the taxpayer is that the government has to provide a lot less public housing than say, the UK, where rents are a lot higher for the tenants to pay because mortgage companies there will not lend unless the rent will completely cover the mortgage. No landlord wants to be negatively geared as it means they are losing money. Fleecing tenants on top of all that, pretty poor way to do business. Treat folk well and more often than not it will be repaid. Rip them off through greed and expect no favours indeed rather the opposite. The only way a landlord can really "fleece" tenants is by failing to do repairs. The rent is set at the start of the lease, which both parties sign up to, and cannot be raised during the lease period. If, at the end of the lease, the landlord wishes to raise the rent to a point the tenant does not wish to pay, they have the option not to re-sign, without penalty. If my tenants pay on time, I do maintenance immediately on request. At the moment one of my tenants is "fleecing" me by not paying any rent at all. But it's a business and I don't take it personally, I just let my property manager sort it out. BB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flag of convenience Posted September 7, 2013 Share Posted September 7, 2013 When negative gearing was abolished in the 1980s for 2 years, rents went up considerably as investors left the market, new investors did not enter the market, and the supply of rental properties diminshed. It was re-introduced because tenants advocates successfully lobbied the government for its re-introduction. Negative gearing subsidises the landlord's income, and through the free market, this is passed on to the tenants through lower rents. The other advantage negative gearing brings for the taxpayer is that the government has to provide a lot less public housing than say, the UK, where rents are a lot higher for the tenants to pay because mortgage companies there will not lend unless the rent will completely cover the mortgage. No landlord wants to be negatively geared as it means they are losing money. The only way a landlord can really "fleece" tenants is by failing to do repairs. The rent is set at the start of the lease, which both parties sign up to, and cannot be raised during the lease period. If, at the end of the lease, the landlord wishes to raise the rent to a point the tenant does not wish to pay, they have the option not to re-sign, without penalty. If my tenants pay on time, I do maintenance immediately on request. At the moment one of my tenants is "fleecing" me by not paying any rent at all. But it's a business and I don't take it personally, I just let my property manager sort it out. BB Yes I know the history with regards negative gearing. Shame Keating didn't get cold feet over the matter. Single biggest contributor to house inflation in Australia and prevention of young getting into housing. The government if not wanting to provide such a socialist policy that involves affordable housing in the role of landlord, should then bring into force rental rights. Protect both parties both neither can exploit the other. Of course you can't raise the rent for the term of the contract, but how long is that? Six months? Nine months? A year? Doesn't give a lot of security to the renter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gbye grey sky Posted September 7, 2013 Share Posted September 7, 2013 (edited) I have a friend who has let out his flat in St Kilda for 12 years to the same tenant. In that time he has never given her a rent increase as she is a good tenant. He is now charging $850 less per month than competing properties. Would you forego $85000 + per year because you like your tenant? I wouldn't. A lot of people don't even earn that. BB 850 a month is not 85,000 a year. Try 10,200 per year. I am not a renter or a landlord so am impartial; the business analogy is fair in my view. A good business respects and takes care of it's customers but expects to charge a market rate for goods or services. A customer should expect that a provider of goods and services will want a fair profit. ROI for private landlords is generally fairly modest and never reviewing the rent will squeeze those returns. Capital appreciation is certainly not a given so the property must turn a profit on the rental income. Edited September 7, 2013 by calNgary fixed quote Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzzy--bee Posted September 7, 2013 Author Share Posted September 7, 2013 850 a month is not 85,000 a year. Try 10,200 per year. Yeh my maths was a bit crap there. I am not a renter or a landlord so am impartial; the business analogy is fair in my view. A good business respects and takes care of it's customers but expects to charge a market rate for goods or services. A customer should expect that a provider of goods and services will want a fair profit. ROI for private landlords is generally fairly modest and never reviewing the rent will squeeze those returns. Capital appreciation is certainly not a given so the property must turn a profit on the rental income. ROI for many landlords is actually negative!!! Capital growth is certainly not a given although I reckon (hope?) property is more likely than shares in the long run.... but I'm no expert... BB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownEyedGal Posted September 7, 2013 Share Posted September 7, 2013 Hi I was renting but now I'm 'lodging'. So this for me is an interesting thread. You appear to have less rights as a lodger - renting a room in a house. The deposit I provided did not go into some government deposit scheme. I also had to pay quite a bit upfront for a (furnished) room that is fortnightly renting. I'm wary of getting all my monies back when I do eventually leave. So any tips, advice would be appreciated. BEGal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzzy--bee Posted September 7, 2013 Author Share Posted September 7, 2013 (edited) Hi I was renting but now I'm 'lodging'. So this for me is an interesting thread. You appear to have less rights as a lodger - renting a room in a house. The deposit I provided did not go into some government deposit scheme. I also had to pay quite a bit upfront for a (furnished) room that is fortnightly renting. I'm wary of getting all my monies back when I do eventually leave. So any tips, advice would be appreciated. BEGal Hi, I'm not really familiar with the arrangement you have. We have short term accommodation as well as the long term rentals, We don't charge a Bond, just a $100 key deposit which we give a receipt for and return when we get the keys back. So its rather like the arrangement you would have with a hotel. If you are concerned about your Bond, I recommend you contact whoever regulates landlord/tenant in NSW. NSW laws are actually more in favour of the tenant than the laws in VIC. BB Edited September 8, 2013 by calNgary removed off track info Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winneth Posted September 10, 2013 Share Posted September 10, 2013 My job is to look for long term rental homes for people who are coming in from overseas and interstate. I also have a house that I rent out. So here are my thoughts on this. I would never ask my client to pay more than what is advertised by the agent. If the agent mentions to me to offer more rent, I would never allow my client to apply. For me, if a landlord is going to make his/her decision based on a higher rent, I would not feel comfortable that they will fix things because they will always be looking at the bottom-line. Money is a motivation but when it is backed up with greed then it becomes a problem. Also I don't like my clients looking desperate. It would appear that my clients are just happy to land a place to move in to that they will just put up with crap. When I came back to Melbourne after being away for 3 years in Japan, I offered 6 months rent in advance and got the place. It was obvious I was desperate after looking for 6 weeks. The landlord pretty much became unreachable after money changed hands. Dishwasher wasn't plumbed in, the cupboards till had to go up, etc. 10 weeks before it was done. And when it came to renewing, he jacked the price up from $390 to $510/week. Situation 2: Before I started my company, I had a friend's friend who asked for help looking for a house to rent. I was given instructions to offer $20 more, from $780 to $800 per week. Same thing happened but this time it was worse. It took two months for the agent and the landlord to fix an overflowing drain in the kitchen sink and also two weeks to fix the lock on a door. And that didn't work well for me either because I spent more time than I anticipated. Since then, when a landlord and an agent (which they are not supposed to do) takes in more than what is advertised, I question the integrity. And if my client tells me to offer more to secure the house, I just tell them that it isn't worth it and better to stick with the budget. And if they are wanting to pay more, we'd find a better place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzzy--bee Posted September 10, 2013 Author Share Posted September 10, 2013 when it came to renewing, he jacked the price up from $390 to $510/week. This either indicates that the property was very cheap to start off with or that he didn't want you there any more for whatever reason. It took two months for the agent and the landlord to fix an overflowing drain in the kitchen sink and also two weeks to fix the lock on a door. Some landlords do repairs quicker than others. These scenarios would not happen in my properties. when a landlord and an agent (which they are not supposed to do) takes in more than what is advertised, I question the integrity. Should a landlord therefore question the integrity of a tenant who is offering less than the market rate? :biggrin: BB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Posted September 10, 2013 Share Posted September 10, 2013 There have been a lot of posts on this forum recently from people asking the best way to get a rental, or from people having trouble getting a rental for various reasons, so I thought it might be useful if I explained how things work from the landlord’s perspective. I have a number of properties that I make available to tenants, mostly unfurnished on long term leases. All that I care about is Getting the maximum rent I can for the property Getting the rent paid in full on time Minimising expenditure on the property. In other words, it’s a business, just like any other business. At the basest level, in order to obtain a rental, you are going to have to persuade me, normally through my agent, that you are going to help me meet the three goals listed above. Most landlords are losing money on a monthly basis in the hope of making some capital growth in the future. So anything that mitigates that loss is a bonus. Tenants are my customers, however unlike a traditional customer / supplier relationship, the tenant / landlord relationship involves an amount of risk, as neither party normally knows each other, and the landlord does not take full payment from the tenant and then divest themselves of the asset like a shop does. So in order to minimise this risk, there are controls on both sides dictated by the various state landlord and tenant acts. So what is going to encourage me to pick you as a tenant? Firstly, don’t be put off by the number of people at inspections. In most cases, 80% of these are not in competition with you because they are either nosy neighbours or people who have bad tenancy records and will not get accepted in any event. Probably 2 people in 10 will actually submit an application and pass approval. To rise above the crowd, help the landlord with the three things above. Offer a higher rent if you really like the place. Offer a higher bond if you have a pet or there is an any other reason why the landlord might think you would be more likely than another applicant to cause damage. Offer a few months upfront – landlords always have cashflow challenges. I was extremely grateful this month when a new tenant offered 2 months upfront as another tenant was late with the rent and a third property needed a new dishwasher, all at once. If I know you will pay on time and that the place will be in as good or better condition when you leave as when you arrive, I will have no problem letting to you. So all you have to do is show me that’s going to be the case! Hope this helps. BB This whole post really sums up why I hate renting here but very much sums up the system that I have seen so far - maximum money for minimum expenditure. It's shocking. We are landlords for 2 properties in the UK and I certainly do not use these kind of rules. To me good quality tenants that will look after the properties are far more important than squeezing every last pound out of the situation and not keeping up the property - which seems to be the norm here. The tenants in the house we lived in (in the UK) offered less than we could've got if we had waited, but he had rented further down the street (I didn't know them personally) without issues so thought it was a pretty safe bet. I wouldn't raise the rent either. We had tenants in our other property for 4 or 5 years - they paid every month without fail and caused us no problems at all so why would I? If you fleece your tenants and be greedy, then chances are they won't care about looking after the property in the same way as if you treat them well. Surely that is good business sense? I have been truly dumbfounded by how things are run here. Things that need replacing or maintaining aren't done - why doesn't people want to maintain their investment? It's mind boggling to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 10, 2013 Share Posted September 10, 2013 (edited) What rubbish to the original poster. Dream world he must live in. I rent out a fair few properties and what you really want is good long term tenants who will look after your property while making a bit of a profit.maximum profit will drive a good tenent out due to the higher cost compared to others in the market. Offering a higher rent is rubbish - i would suggest try and negotiate downwards if anything, especially as people leave more and more properties become vacant. this knocks on to the max profit places becoming top end as the others reduce rent next time around for renewal and in the end you loose your decent tenant. The worst is getting sh*t heads who either wreck the place or stop paying/cant pay and then you have to pay to get them out. One other tip is to be swift about fixing things even if they seem menial to you - you arent living there, when you are and something is annoying or doesnt work, you have to put up with it every day. the good thing for the tenant right now is that the market is continuing to become quieter as time goes on. rent is and will come down more and more and landlords who want to rent out their places will have to do some work to them to keep them marketable to potential tenents. they may also have to be a little more easy on the stupid conditions of actually renting. Edited September 10, 2013 by dustyroad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GeorgeD Posted September 10, 2013 Share Posted September 10, 2013 (edited) With regards to landlords wanting to raise rents...We own our house and we pay rates. Our rates have increased over the last few years. A landlords rates will increase too...so why wouldn't they pass that increase on to tennants? Some costs go down...for example interests rates may go down but not all mortgages or martgage providers pass on this decrease, so the landlord of a specific property may not see the saving. An increase in rent isn't always because a greedy landlord is squeezing as much as they can out of you. It's often because their cost to own and maintain the property is increasing. Edited September 10, 2013 by GeorgeD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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