Please reassure me that PR is worth it

Hi all,

So I'm having a bit of an emotional time and am in need of reassurance... or indeed information from those who have passed through the curtain!

I've been here almost 4 years now, initially on Working Holiday and ever since on 457. My first employer was bought out by a larger firm, prompting me to leave after 14 months, and I've now been with my second employer for 20 months.

Last year I ordered a Skills Assessment, believing that I would pass that step for a 186 Direct Entry, but actually failed on a technicality (I have an Advanced Diploma rather than Degree) and was advised by an immigration lawyer not to bother appealing.

I'd hoped to therefore gain PR through employer nomination at 24 months, but I've just found out that an admin error with my employer means they won't actually consider nominating me until January (at 28 months).

The thing is, I've been having a really bad time with my employer. I suffered harassment from a senior colleague last year and brushed it under the carpet to avoid causing any trouble, but it really affected me emotionally. In the meantime I was held back from an overdue promotion and have generally felt under appreciated and excluded for some time. While I love my work, the thought of walking into the office fills me with dread and I frequently cry myself to sleep.

I recently took 12 weeks to visit home (8 weeks of work secondment in Paris, 4 weeks holiday in the UK) and reset - I came back relaxed and refreshed but then had more bad news from the HR department and fell back into a funk again.

In the meantime I'm getting other job offers. One of my ex-clients almost bit my hand off this morning when I asked them about working directly - they've even created a specific role for me and are meeting with their COO tomorrow to discuss whether they can bring me in (it's a government department so they have restrictions to deal with). And I've been looking at other great opportunities with employers that get me excited.

But is it really worth it to reset the clock on the 24-month PR nomination?

How good is it to get PR? Can I / should I buckle down and stick with this shitty job for one more year to get it out of the way?

I don't think you would have much luck being sponsored on a 457 by a government department and if you did it would likely be very short term. Unless your skills are really out of the box they would be hard pressed to say they couldn't find an Australian to fill the role. It's hard enough for PRs to get government jobs as they are restricted to local government. APS requires citizenship.

Suppose it all depends on how long you want to stay in Australia - PR certainly gives you more security and none of this faffing about with employers you don't get along with. You could also, I suppose, be at risk of being terminated before January (providing they don't change their mind about sponsoring you for PR) if you aren't getting along well and then have 90 days to find another employer.

Mmm. Well, we'll find out about the government job today... I am pretty unique :-P And it's no ordinary role.

I guess I'm looking for personal stories where someone really felt a positive impact from getting their PR. My visa status has felt like a hanging weight for the last four years. It seems like every time I try and do something to build a personal life, it gets in the way. For example I've always wanted to foster children and had some great conversations with the NSW fostering agency who suggested doing their training programme with a view to taking on respite care... but I couldn't even apply to begin the training without PR.

Termination from my current job, although technically possible, is extremely unlikely in the next 6 months. I'm one of their top performers and am consistently profitable, despite the pain I've had.

And tonight I've had another job offer from a rival agency in London. 50% pay rise if I take that one :-O So I really need to be talked into staying in my current job!

An offer on th the table is always better than a might be! It certainly would be much more secure with PR, I can't imagine much worse than living in a knife edge knowing you could be out within 90 days but it sounds like you've got an excellent offer there! Just on the down side of Australia - you will be competing with people who do have the degree - that does count for a lot in Australia especially if they are Australian.

The degree doesn't count for anything in my career. It was 14 years ago and academia values my Advanced Diploma at the same level anyway.... but also with that amount of work experience and a great portfolio no-one even looks at the qualification.

It's ONLY DIBP that cares!

P.S. Actually there is a massive shortage of my skills in Australia - the last report I read concluded that 72% of the workforce would have to come from overseas.

It is worth it if you want to stay in Australia as simple as that.

The question is whether staying in Australia is worth the pain for you. Let's say worst case scenario you took a new 457 position and it didn't result in sponsorship and you had to come back to the UK, how would you feel?

If you'd be devastated then stick with the employer offering sponsorship. FWIW I was sponsored by a government department, they recruited me from the UK to fill a role that had been vacant for 5 years and had I needed it I would have been sponsored for PR (colleagues were but I pre-empted it with independent PR) so it is possible.

I think it's possible you may find work is the same everywhere in Australia though, maybe it is a culture clash or something but your experience isn't uncommon.

Out of the pan into the fire comes to mind. Sometimes the devil we know etc . I guess it comes down to whether you really want to stay in Australia or return to the UK. In my misspent youth I went after a super job and changed and it was not so super. Government departments have a lot of regulations and as has been said you need to be resident to work for the government. A lot of the gov jobs are now 12 month contracts as well and no permanency. Its the modern world. If only we had a crystal ball. Also depends how miserable you are. You do not mention anything but the job, do you do other stuff, sometimes we need to have other interests than work.

Thanks!

I genuinely don't know how long I want to stay in Australia. I don't feel I'm 'done' with it yet, but the visa restrictions cloud my judgement. Personally I think I'll live in a few more countries along the way to 'settled' - have some friends in Cambodia I'd like to join at some point.

One extra pull is that my Dad, who's visited me every year so far, is really keen on moving out here one day. And he's too old to do it through work (61). So I do feel an obligation to get PR so that I can sponsor him...

You do not mention anything but the job, do you do other stuff, sometimes we need to have other interests than work.

No. Literally nothing. I don't know a single person in this country beyond my colleagues (and ex colleagues). I have no hobbies that I keep up with any more...

My work is project based so I travel domestically * a lot * and therefore can't commit to anything

I was on 457 but applied for permanent as soon as I could and it was worth it for me as I wanted to live and settle in Australia so depends what your plans are I guess..it also meant I had more job opportunities as didn't need to seek sponsorship to change jobs...what visa would your dad be eligible for then?

what visa would your dad be eligible for then?

Parent visa (subclass 103): https://www.border.gov.au/Trav/Visa-1/103-

Personally I think PR is definitely worth going for first. I spent 5 years as a temporary resident and it certainly takes a niggling weight off your shoulders when you get pr.

Thanks!

 

I genuinely don't know how long I want to stay in Australia. I don't feel I'm 'done' with it yet, but the visa restrictions cloud my judgement. Personally I think I'll live in a few more countries along the way to 'settled' - have some friends in Cambodia I'd like to join at some point.

 

One extra pull is that my Dad, who's visited me every year so far, is really keen on moving out here one day. And he's too old to do it through work (61). So I do feel an obligation to get PR so that I can sponsor him...

Don't know whether it's as easy as you are assuming. It will be really expensive that's for sure.

Don't know whether it's as easy as you are assuming. It will be really expensive that's for sure.

Do you mean Dad's visa? I never assumed it would be easy. It can take up to 30 years, assuming he doesn't meet the love of his life in that time. Meanwhile he's doing perfectly well on 12-month tourist visas, going back to Europe in our winter.

But it's his dream and I have to fulfil my obligations to help make it happen!

No. Literally nothing. I don't know a single person in this country beyond my colleagues (and ex colleagues). I have no hobbies that I keep up with any more...

 

My work is project based so I travel domestically * a lot * and therefore can't commit to anything

That sounds like the problem then. You need to get out, meet a few people outside work and start enjoying yourself a bit more. Work is just a place to go to earn money to have a good time when we're not there. Not let work become your life.

Join a gym or surf club or something.

If it really is his dream he has waited a long time to do anything about it.

If it really is his dream he has waited a long time to do anything about it.

Yeah - he dedicated his whole life to working hard, paying a mortgage and raising us kids. By the time we left home he'd never travelled outside of Europe.

Since I moved here and he's come to visit, it's opened up a whole new world for him... as a man going through divorce this is where he wants his real life to begin!

That sounds like the problem then. You need to get out, meet a few people outside work and start enjoying yourself a bit more. Work is just a place to go to earn money to have a good time when we're not there. Not let work become your life.

Join a gym or surf club or something.

Wholeheartedly agree! It's tough though - I never know where I'm going to be more than a couple of weeks in advance.

Last winter I found myself in Canberra for a few months, and we were about to sign another Canberra-based contract so I auditioned for a local theatre company and got the part in a musical. After two rehearsals, I heard that the contract had changed and I'd have to divert to Brisbane.

Gyms usually require some kind of commitment, as do dance classes (I inquired after several). I love spending time with animals but can't commit to keeping and looking after them so I occasionally visit a disappointing Cat Cafe. I have gone along to random Meetup groups like "Under 40's Barefoot Bowls" - in fact my 30th birthday when I first got here was a karaoke night with strangers! - but lack of regular contact means we just fall out of touch again.

Don't get me wrong - I am truly dedicated to my work and love what I do. But you're right: one needs another way to be happy when things aren't going so well...

Gyms usually require some kind of commitment, as do dance classes (I inquired after several). .

Adult classes don't require commitment usually. Many adult dance classes will let you pay by the class - but even if you have to pay by the term, it's only 8 or 10 weeks and if you're on a good salary you won't mind missing a few classes. All dance teachers understand that adults have other commitments and very few of us can guarantee to attend every single week, so you will never be given a hard time (especially if you let them know in advance that you're missing a class).

What kind of dance are you interested in?

And once you get PR then you're back on the Immi treadmill to get Citizenship. We moved over with PR and only recently understood that our PR visa only lasts for 5 years then you have to renew with another 5 year visa. After that you can only get one year at a time...

 

What kind of dance are you interested in?

Pole dancing :jiggy:

I used to teach beginner's classes back in London, but since I came here I've become very fat and out-of-practice!

When I first got to Sydney I joined a school in Surry Hills and loved it, but started having to miss blocks of terms, meaning I couldn't move up to the next level. And at $50 a week, when you miss 5 weeks it seriously hurts!

I tried a couple of other schools nearer the CBD but they both gave the same story - I'd have to buy a whole term in advance. And I can literally be sent to a different state/territory with less than 2 weeks notice (last time I was sent to Canberra long-term it was on 9 hours notice).

You guys have inspired me though! I've just found a French conversation meetup this weekend in Melbourne, so I've signed up for that ;-)

And once you get PR then you're back on the Immi treadmill to get Citizenship. We moved over with PR and only recently understood that our PR visa only lasts for 5 years then you have to renew with another 5 year visa. After that you can only get one year at a time...

That's not correct, the visa is permanent, it's only the right to enter the country after 5 years that expires.

If you never travel abroad you don't need another visa, a Resident's Return Visa is required to return into Australia after the 5 years and depending on how long you have spent in the country will be for 1 or 5 years

I wouldn't stay in a job where I cried myself to sleep nights,it just isn't worth your mental health. Really. Sod that for a lark. Work on changing your job before you do anything else. If you end up having a break down you may not be able to get pr anyway.

The degree doesn't count for anything in my career. It was 14 years ago and academia values my Advanced Diploma at the same level anyway.... but also with that amount of work experience and a great portfolio no-one even looks at the qualification.

 

It's ONLY DIBP that cares!

 

P.S. Actually there is a massive shortage of my skills in Australia - the last report I read concluded that 72% of the workforce would have to come from overseas.

What is it that you do if you don't mind me asking? I would be interested to know as my son is currently looking to re train and trying to decide what to go for, he has been looking at areas where job prospects are good.

What is it that you do if you don't mind me asking? I would be interested to know as my son is currently looking to re train and trying to decide what to go for, he has been looking at areas where job prospects are good.

Service Design. Best way in is to study Human-Computer Interaction, Industrial Design or Anthropology / Psychology, then to pick up an internship with a design consultancy. You've gotta love it though! What's he into?