Newbie - Moving to from Scotland to Sydney on 457 Visa in December

I am looking for some advice, myself, husband and our 4 kids aged 15,7,5 and 4 will be relocating to NSW in December this year. My new job is based in Parramatta CBD, however would prefer to settle a short drive or train ride from work, have been looking at Penrith, Campbelltown and Baulkenhills. Can anyone recommend family suburbs that don't cost the earth for rentals, but are child friendly with good schools? We will rent for first few years before buying.

Finding it very hard to find fair priced arrival accommodation, any thoughts?

Thanks :smile:

I am looking for some advice, myself, husband and our 4 kids aged 15,7,5 and 4 will be relocating to NSW in December this year. My new job is based in Parramatta CBD, however would prefer to settle a short drive or train ride from work, have been looking at Penrith, Campbelltown and Baulkenhills. Can anyone recommend family suburbs that don't cost the earth for rentals, but are child friendly with good schools? We will rent for first few years before buying.

 

Finding it very hard to find fair priced arrival accommodation, any thoughts?

 

Thanks :smile:

A bit bit too vague to really comment upon to be honest. What are you thinking of in terms of budget? That is the single most deciding factor when it comes to Sydney. And we have no idea what you think is affordable.

I don't believe there really is any such thing as a child friendly suburb, there are children living happily in every suburb, perhpas a CBD suburb is not right for chilldren, but beyond that I think anything can work.

Hi

Sorry for being vague, i'm new to this. Hoping for 600 a week or less however require 4 bedrooms. My girls currently go to gymnastics and i'm keen on the gym so would like to have these things local.

For the arrival accommodation was thinking we could get a 3 bed for around 3 weeks, would that be long enough to secure a more permanent rental?

Baulkham Hills (The Hills in general), the surrounds and Kellyville etc are all good family areas with decent sized houses. Are you aware though that you will be liable for school fees of $5,000 per child and possibly $6,000 for your child that is 15 (depending whether they will be in year 10 or 11). What are your plans for the 4 year old? Will he start kindergarten (first year of school) or attending preschool? Our son went to preschool 3 days (9pm to 3pm) a week and this cost us $800.00 a month (non-rebatable).

Some info cut and pasted about when your child needs to start school:

Your child can start Kindergarten at the beginning of the school year if they turn five on or before 31 July in that year. By law, all children must be enrolled in school by their sixth birthday. Kindergarten enrolment begins around April the year before your child will start Kindergarten.

Hope this helps.

Thanks Purpleal, Yes i'm aware of the schooling costs which will hit us pretty hard in the first 2 years however was going to put them into a catholic school, and cost drops slightly for each child.

I'm unsure about my youngest as her turns 4 in December this year so think he will be pre-school?

Hoping my husband will find work within the firs few months and we will manage from there.

$600 a week or less for a 4 bed house in Sydney is going to be stretching the budget... I don't think you're going to have the luxury of being too fussy about area or possibly condition of the house.

Hi

 

Sorry for being vague, i'm new to this. Hoping for 600 a week or less however require 4 bedrooms. My girls currently go to gymnastics and i'm keen on the gym so would like to have these things local.

 

For the arrival accommodation was thinking we could get a 3 bed for around 3 weeks, would that be long enough to secure a more permanent rental?

Ok so your budget is really low for a four bedroomed house in Sydney. This is going to put you in less desirable areas and less desirable school catchment areas. Good schools are in good neighbourhoods and good neighbourhoods cannot be obtained for $600 and a four ned house.

I kind of think you need to go back to some fundamentals. Why are you moving? What do you hope to achieve?

We could increase our rental costs however want to keep it realistic until mu husband obtains work, and my salary will increase after 6 months.

I have seen some very nice rental properties for under 600, so hoping to keep as close to that as we can.

Can anyone advise where i can find out what schools are better than others?

Wait until you see the properties in person... its very common for extremely old photos to be used that no longer represent the property accurately, or from angles that hide things etc. I don't rent anymore, but believe me, over the years I've seen some shockers - yet on the website they looked lovely!

Thanks Purpleal, Yes i'm aware of the schooling costs which will hit us pretty hard in the first 2 years however was going to put them into a catholic school, and cost drops slightly for each child.

 

I'm unsure about my youngest as her turns 4 in December this year so think he will be pre-school?

 

Hoping my husband will find work within the firs few months and we will manage from there.

Your youngest will be due to start kindergarten at the end of January 2018. Pre-school here isn't compulsory, and are mostly privately run. There are a few government run pre-schools, but they tend to be in low socio-economic areas and/or almost impossible to get a place in. Alternatively there are privately run pre-schools which kids would usually attend two or three days per week from 9-3. However these also tend to be over-subscribed. One other alternative would be a pre-achool program in a long day care centre. Our girls attended one of those because I couldn't get them into preschool in our area, and this cost $90 per day for each of them.

With respect to schools, you can look at the myschool website to compare, but to be honest you are better off going and seeing the schools in person. The ratings on this website are based on the NAPLAN exams, which is a bit of a dubious way to compare schools, in my opinion.

With respect to accommodation, you will probably struggle with a budget of $600 a week in many areas. I would usually recommend Sutherland Shire which is more affordable, but with work in Parramatta it would be a long and difficult commute. You would probably be better off either in the Baulkham Hills/Castle Hill/Kellyville area or out west a bit towards Penrith. I don't really know those areas, so I'll leave that for other posters who know better.

Temporary/holiday accommodation in December is likely to be expensive with this being our main summer and Christmas holidays. Have a look at airb&b, and stayz.com.au for holiday rentals or you could perhaps find a serviced apartment somewhere. I would think that somewhere away from Sydney CBD/the beach areas would be cheaper. Maybe you could look at the Blue Mountains for temporary accommodation. It might be a bit cheaper, being away from the coast. I think you can get the train from the Blue Mountains to Parramatta (I'm sure I've heard one of the other PIO members talking about that at some point).

You're aware that this is a temporary visa and if your employer terminates your contract you could have to leave within 90 days or find another sponsor. There is no guarantee that you will get PR at the end of it. You do run a risk with your eldest child's education there as you will have hauled them out of the UK system just as the important years start - is there a chance they could stay with relatives until after A levels? That way they wouldn't burn any bridges in case they need to return to UK education at some point.

I agree with the others, the schools reflect the suburbs and general rule of thumb is that the nice suburbs come with a price tag well above your estimate especially if you want a big house.

Also, all depending on his skill set, your DH could well be behind the 8 ball getting a meaningful job - reports from temporary dependents are not encouraging unless there is a highly specific skill set in demand. Employers tend not to want to invest in staff that could disappear at the drop of a hat when they have plenty of home grown applicants unfortunately. Good luck!

Yes I am aware of the regulations of the temp visa however I believe and does my employer that there are long term opportunities with planned expansions in the business, (I also asked the question during interviews).

I had not thought about the possibility of leaving my son behind, but given your suggestion I will speak with him and progress how he wishes.

Given the opportunity to move to a different lifestyle, it is one we are willing to take.

There are lots of home grown applicants but I disagree about companies not taking people on temp visas, other wise why are they offering visa sponsorship to applicants from different countries?

Yes I am aware of the regulations of the temp visa however I believe and does my employer that there are long term opportunities with planned expansions in the business, (I also asked the question during interviews).

 

I had not thought about the possibility of leaving my son behind, but given your suggestion I will speak with him and progress how he wishes.

 

Given the opportunity to move to a different lifestyle, it is one we are willing to take.

 

There are lots of home grown applicants but I disagree about companies not taking people on temp visas, other wise why are they offering visa sponsorship to applicants from different countries?

It happens, they employ people on a 457 knowing they are tied to them, and so working conditions can be challenging, the promise of PR in the end is the thing that keeps people hanging on but the employer knows they will leave as soon as they get it, so it never happens, they just get someone else on a 457, hopefully this won't happen to you and you'll get PR if you want it, but it can be a precarious existence as at any time you're only 90 days from having to leave Australia.

Of course many people have arrived on a 457 and gone on to PR, but just be aware.

Another significant expense will be your children's gymnastics. Kids sport here is not cheap, and in fact it has been criticised in recent years that lower income families are often priced out of participation which goes against the recommendations of keeping children active and reducing the obesity crisis. I know of people that pay around $200 per term for their child - I understand thats pretty average, and based on twice weekly sessions. That doesn't include any competition fees, club leotard, track suit etc.

Australia can be a great lifestyle - to those that can afford it. As a 457 visa holder you will pay for everything here. No child care rebate, no rental assistance, no family payment assistance. If any of your children need orthodontics or glasses - will need to be covered by you. Child care tends to be about $90 a day ish. If your husband is going to work factor that in too. Also, if you're travelling into the CBD cost of pubic transport might be around $50 a week ish for return journey based very crudely on Penrith to Parramatta.

You don't say what your annual wage will be, or what qualifications your husband has but be prepared you are moving to a very expensive city as a family of 6... and on only the one wage.

Yes I am aware of the regulations of the temp visa however I believe and does my employer that there are long term opportunities with planned expansions in the business, (I also asked the question during interviews).

 

I had not thought about the possibility of leaving my son behind, but given your suggestion I will speak with him and progress how he wishes.

 

Given the opportunity to move to a different lifestyle, it is one we are willing to take.

 

There are lots of home grown applicants but I disagree about companies not taking people on temp visas, other wise why are they offering visa sponsorship to applicants from different countries?

Sorry, I wasn't clear. Companies have to demonstrate that they can't find home grown talent before they fill the 457 on a temporary basis. But I was talking about the dependents of people on temporary visas - they aren't a hugely attractive proposition to employers because they could be here today and gone tomorrow by nature of the visa so if they are going to train someone up for a significant role they will take someone who isn't subject to the vagaries of a temporary visa if they can. 457 visa holders usually get paid less than an Australian with comparable skills could earn which is often why they have trouble filling those positions and get cheap labour effectively.

Unfortunately, too, you will be up for the full whack of preschool /childcare fees - could be up to $500pw because temp visa holders aren't entitled to any child care rebates.

We could increase our rental costs however want to keep it realistic until mu husband obtains work, and my salary will increase after 6 months.

 

I have seen some very nice rental properties for under 600, so hoping to keep as close to that as we can.

 

Can anyone advise where i can find out what schools are better than others?

You are maybe not taking this in. Your budget is *really* low for a four bedroomed house in Sydney. I do not know what you have seen but at this price you are looking in an undesirable area and as such the schools will also be undesirable as these things go hand in hand and one tends to drive the other.

Again I just have to question what you are moving from and what you hope to achieve. Moving on a 457 visa with several children and a low budget seems like a pretty unattractive option to me.

Thanks Quoll.

I am aware we do not qualify for any help when we come to OZ, but we do have savings which will allow us to pay the yearly school fees.

In Scotland there is no opportunity for youngsters, (no apprenticeships) we are all hoping this move will become a permanent one. We work hard and want the best opportunity for our children.

Don't want to be a negative Nellie and keep banging on about the risks but I'd have a read of this thread you might find it interesting http://www.pomsinoz.com/forum/moving-back-uk/247072-advice-wanted-what-do.html

I really hope your wage is very close to or above the 100k mark... with rent ($30,000 a year straight off if you stay to your budget), bills, food, transport, school fees (approx. $15,000 a year for 3 school aged kids), child care fees (maybe about $12,000 a year based in 3 days a week, 48 weeks a year), kids sports/activities, unanticipated extras - like medical bills/prescription charges, clothing and shoes in addition to relocating costs (all the bits and pieces really add up), you are going to need to be in that range with only one of you working. If you were a one or to child family it would be doable on less, but with 6 it doesn't matter how hard you work if the money isn't coming in you're going to seriously struggle in Sydney.

Thanks Quoll.

 

I am aware we do not qualify for any help when we come to OZ, but we do have savings which will allow us to pay the yearly school fees.

 

In Scotland there is no opportunity for youngsters, (no apprenticeships) we are all hoping this move will become a permanent one. We work hard and want the best opportunity for our children.

Youth Unemployment is a huge issue in NSW (and most of the rest of Australia too) http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/youth-unemployment-hits-a-new-high-as-people-locked-out-of-workforce-20150219-13jiax.html

It's not a given that opportunities are going to be better at all - UK is generally on the up, Australia is struggling more at the moment. Some areas worse than others and very much an environment of "who you know" rather than ability /capacity. Maybe just a move out of Scotland would do the trick but Scotland is a very attractive proposition if you intend to go to Uni as seems to be the usual pathway these days.

Working in the Parramatta CBD I would suggest that you look at the suburbs of Northmead, Winston Hills, Baulkham Hills and perhaps North Rocks. All are very good suburbs and as well as being close to Parramatta have all of the amenities that a family would want. The rentals, listed on realestate.com.au, in these suburbs range from $540 t0 900 for a 4 bedroom place. There are good catholic schools in these suburbs as well as sports facilities. Hope this helps.

Hello Nicola please be sure you have researched everything before you make the move. The living costs are very high in Sydney and as you will be coming on a 457 visa no help will be available to you. There's no certainty that you will achieve a pr visa either. Many have come on 457 visa's hoping to achieve a pr visa and sadly it's all gone very wrong. Add to it that you have a 15 year old whose education will most likely suffer if you have to return. As other have said unless you will be earning a high salary you will struggle in Sydney. Whatever you do i wish you and your family the best of luck. Please don't take the advice and the pointing out of pitfalls as negative for warned is for armed and all that.

I had to smile when I read "Please don"t take the advice and pointing out of pitfalls negative, fore warned is fore armed." Why did I smile? I have read all the posts and there is not one positive amongst them. No mention of the fact that theymight just have a decent life here. Another thing that bothers me is people are constantly told they will struggle if they don't have a large salary. Not everyone in Sydney has a "large" salary yet they seem to get on fine - mostly because they have learned to shop smart. I'm not saying things will be easy - emigrating never is and it is harder now than when I came with my family 50 years ago. However, if your prepared for the fact that it will probably be tough for the first few years you can still build a good life for your family.

I had to smile when I read "Please don"t take the advice and pointing out of pitfalls negative, fore warned is fore armed." Why did I smile? I have read all the posts and there is not one positive amongst them. No mention of the fact that theymight just have a decent life here. Another thing that bothers me is people are constantly told they will struggle if they don't have a large salary. Not everyone in Sydney has a "large" salary yet they seem to get on fine - mostly because they have learned to shop smart. I'm not saying things will be easy - emigrating never is and it is harder now than when I came with my family 50 years ago. However, if your prepared for the fact that it will probably be tough for the first few years you can still build a good life for your family.

Funnily enough, I've always found the advice on here to be a bit "blue sky" regarding Sydney. Although I didn't post much, I was glued to the forums for months before I went over. Nothing on here prepared me for the culture shock of having to compete with 30-40 other people for what I would consider "student houses" (ugly 70s decor, broken windows not repaired, etc.) in not-so-great areas (Blacktown and environs), dealing with arrogant letting agents who considered themselves too important to even talk to the plebs who wanted to rent properties through them. Bear in mind, I'm an Aus citizen, had a job in finance lined up, and had a very comprehensive rental pack (20 pages plus) - still no chance! Yes, there may be 4-bed properties on the websites at a reasonable price, but what's the competition for them like..?