My daughter wants to come home

I have just been reading another post, "Desperate to go come" - I am sick to my stomach today, my daughter got conned too into returning to Oz with her Australian husband with promises of a better life. He has ended up in a dead end job and he is freeloading off his family by living free in a family house. My daughter says he has changed so much since they went there, he argues and is unkind to her - even waking her middle of the night to argue with her. They have a two year old daughter and he has told my daughter she can "F.....off back home but you are not taking......" We are desperate to have her home safe. She wonders if she can get back to the UK and then say she isn't going back - how does she stand legally?

Any advice would be really helpful

Really sorry to hear of your daughters plight but unless she can get her husband to agree to a holiday in the UK with your grandchild then she cannot take the child out of the country without permission. If he is violent then she must get the police involved and all episodes of domestic violence must be documented as well as any safe guarding issues regarding your grandchild. These would strengthen her case in an Australian court. I feel that this may take quite some time to sort. Can she not leave the house with the child for a women's refuge if she fears for her safety? If it is as bad as you say, she really needs to get out. Wishing you all the best.

very sad story, hope you work it all out. someone will come along with advice.... have you tried speaking with a lawyer ?

Whilst I understand your viewpoint as a parent, there is always two sides to every story. We are all "conned" into the thoughts of a better life in Aus, so that probably isnt the husbands fault. You have to remember, its his daughter too, and ultimately you have to think of your grand daughters best interests, not just yours or your daughters. Perhaps they should take counselling over there in Aus to see if they can patch things up, before thinking about splitting up the family.

Also what you might think of as a dead end job, might be something he really loves doing. doing a job you love is far better than doing a job you hate , but are paid well for.

You will have seen what i put on the other post and i stand by it...... right ? i think so.... legal ? absolutely not !

If a child is taken from the UK without the other parents permission it is child abduction...... the same will be from Oz to UK.

However, when kids are involved there can be no argument regarding their safety...... get on that plane.... get back to the UK and fight the courts from here.......or as rachall suggested, just get out to somewhere else.

I recommend you see a solicitor in the UK on her behalf and find out where she stands etc..... he will certainly NOT advise the same as me, but then im not a lawyer, and when it comes to the safety of my kids i wouldnt give a stuff about the law, i would just want to get them back to the UK (and then worry about the law)

I hope it all works out..... can you not get out to Oz to stay with her for a while...... ?? Then as she takes you to the airport to say goodbye, she accidently gets on the plane with you !

Please..... see a solicitor asap (he will tell you the legal implications of jumping ship and what would happen back in the UK if she did this )

sending you all hugs xxxx

Oh dear, how sad - but, even more sadly, very common!!

She should approach her local Women's Services - DVCS, WIIRC etc and get some good real life support. She needs to document everything but be aware that at the moment she is like a shag on a rock with all of his family gathering around and supporting him. If she were my daughter I'd be on a plane and visiting to support (or I would be sending a burly brother if she had one!). Poor girl, my heart goes out to her and do tell her that Lifeline is always there as a referral agency 13 11 14 if she is desperate.

I totally agree, she needs to get back to the UK with her daughter Sort it out in the courts back home at least she will have family support.

Good luck

Is it not possible to just book the flight without your OH knowing, then jump on the plane back to your own country, how would the australian authority know any different, you may have just been going on holiday for all they know??

once you got back to your own country would your OH go to the trouble of making a fuss?

Is it not possible to just book the flight without your OH knowing, then jump on the plane back to your own country, how would the australian authority know any different, you may have just been going on holiday for all they know??

 

once you got back to your own country would your OH go to the trouble of making a fuss?

This is a really bad idea. Were the husband to report it to the police - under the terms of the Hague convention a court order would be issued in an Australian court for the UK police to return the children to Australia. And the UK being the UK would co-operate without question. http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/international-custody-battles-a-regular-event-20120516-1yr35.html

If the child is a UK citizen with a UK passport I dont understand why the child would be sent back to ozz if the mother took it home to the UK???

If the child is a UK citizen with a UK passport I dont understand why the child would be sent back to ozz if the mother took it home to the UK???

It is because the UK and Australia have signed the Hague Convention on the Civil Aspects of Child Abduction. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hague_Convention_on_the_Civil_Aspects_of_International_Child_Abduction)

Removing the child from either country without the other parent's permission is considered child abduction..

If the child is a UK citizen with a UK passport I dont understand why the child would be sent back to ozz if the mother took it home to the UK???

because the child is an Australian resident, nationality doesn't come into it.

I wonder which countries are not signed up to the hague convention. Just curious.

I wonder which countries are not signed up to the hague convention. Just curious.

Ummm maybe put Hague Convention into Google. It might be able to answer your question.

If the child is a UK citizen with a UK passport I dont understand why the child would be sent back to ozz if the mother took it home to the UK???

If her father is Australian, she will be a citizen by decent. I didn't read in the OP that there was violence to the child or that the child was at risk.

This is an old thread, but has been running consistently on PIO http://www.pomsinoz.com/forum/news-chat-dilemmas/47091-children-what-happens-if-you-your-partner-decide-go-home.html

hi, just a note from my own personal experience, not alot of people know about the hauge convention, i certainly did not. I lived in a different country with a dv partner. The one time it was in front of the children, i said enough is enough, I went to the police station and reported the violence. They immediately came to the property and removed my ex which allowed me to pack and prepare to move back to the uk. They came back with my ex and advised him to let me go for the sake of the children, and provided i gave them a full contact address and contact numbers they told me to go and go through the uk courts. Being at home with family is very important at a time like this, and he was given the choice to let me go or face charges. Once back i started legal proceedings and have never had an issue ..... this is just in my experience

I did not note anything suggesting violence. Imagine you were the dad and loved the child more than anything, you cant just abduct her.

I did not note anything suggesting violence. Imagine you were the dad and loved the child more than anything, you cant just abduct her.

Really ????? violence can both be physical and verbal, and i think the op mentioned the verbal

The situation is a very difficult one, especially for the parents/grandparents back here in the UK. There may be many reasons why the husband has become angry/unhappy and also many reasons why the daughter/ wife is unhappy. It is important to remember that abuse takes many forms not just physical and an unhappy relationship is ultimately going to have a detrimental effect on the child regardless of how much each parent loves the child. If the parents can't resolve their differences then two separated happy parents are better then two miserable ones staying together for the sake of the child as children pick up on these things from a very early Age.

Really ????? violence can both be physical and verbal, and i think the op mentioned the verbal

Not really, sticks and stones and all that. Fair enough, verbal abuse can be used to control and manipulate people. It is however sad that men do not stand up to their commitments to women. The are loads of tough guys nowadays who walk around with knives but, they have neither the guts nor the moral fortitude to be a man in a relationship.

The guy could be under the realisation that he is in a dead end job and he could be frustrated by this. I am not making excuses, I am trying to understand the personality change. Many people are disappointed when they realise the Oz is not the land of milk and honey.

I have just been reading another post, "Desperate to go come" - I am sick to my stomach today, my daughter got conned too into returning to Oz with her Australian husband with promises of a better life. He has ended up in a dead end job and he is freeloading off his family by living free in a family house. My daughter says he has changed so much since they went there, he argues and is unkind to her - even waking her middle of the night to argue with her. They have a two year old daughter and he has told my daughter she can "F.....off back home but you are not taking......" We are desperate to have her home safe. She wonders if she can get back to the UK and then say she isn't going back - how does she stand legally?

 

Any advice would be really helpful

As a man with two daughter, I am sorry to hear this. It is also difficult being so far away.

I googled 'Womens Aid Australia' with the view of giving you a contact in the event of things turning nasty. It didn't bear any fruits. If I were in your shoes, I would find a similar organisation in Australia and give your daughter the contacts. At least she will know that she has somewhere safe to turn when you are not there. Stay within the law as your daughter is in the right, the last things you want is to turn that around.

Some members of the forum may be able to do a similar search in Oz and come up with better results than a UK search.

I really hope that it all works out in the best interests of all involved.

Not a good idea to take the child back to the UK without the husband's permission- they could get stopped at the airport, depending on how quickly the husband reports it. The mother would have to go into hiding in the UK or face having the child taken from her because it has been abducted according to the law. It would be an absolute nightmare and the poor woman needs that like a hole in the head.

thank you all for your comments, I will certainly be taking them on board. There has been no physical violence, just verbal - but of course that is mental and emotional. I am in touch with solicitors in the UK for their advice too. Really appreciate all your input.

:goofy:

Ummm maybe put Hague Convention into Google. It might be able to answer your question.

http://travel.state.gov/abduction/resources/congressreport/congressreport_1487.html

Countries list for Hague convention