Heartless mothers destroying families!

[Brokenhearted]

I think it is a really complex situation - I dont know that there is any universal "right". I have immense sympathy for an active parent whose ex wants to remove their kids from the jurisdiction however I have even more sympathy for a parent who wants to return to the place where they have more support with their kids but is prevented by some no hoper of an ex who just wants to exert the power.

In Australia the chances of a parent being able to leave with their kid are extraordinarily slim (like pretty much zero if the ex says no) whereas it does seem that the UK is more likely to allow a parent to leave with a child even if the ex is a fabulous and active parent. I think maybe Aus needs to be a bit more accommodating, at least with the UK it is possible. I really really really hate it when kids are used as pawns in a power game!

I couldn't agree more, with reference to Australia needing to be a bit more accommodating. I thoroughly researched this when making the tough decision whether to emigrate with my ex and father of my two children (he was going regardless of my decision), and I got the same response each time - that it would be impossible to return to the UK with my children (without their father's permission). In one case I looked at, the father was actually in jail and had limited contact with the child (jail visits), and the courts still wouldn't let the mother and child return home.

One concern I had with there being no chance or next to no chance of leaving was that my ex (a controlling type) would allow all this power to go to his head and become even worse, knowing that I had no get-out. If the courts looked at each case a bit more on their own merits, like the UK, in other words, even if there had only been say a 20% chance of coming home, I probably would have taken the risk and gone to Australia, because that element of doubt either way would have made for a better, more equal relationship. As it is, I felt I couldn't go and now the family is broken up - surely not what the Hague Convention is trying to achieve!

[an1ta]

I wish my mum would have moved out here away from dad, he was a pig along with other things, my tried to make a better life with my and my brother but my asshole of a dad was always there being a pain,. I feel for the mum shes the one that is bring this family up, and there must be a very good reason why she wants to bring her kids to the other side of the world.

Has for the grand parents I had that from my mother inlaw.... but I wont see the my grandchildren. Well I'm sorry but u had ur kids theses are mine and they will do what there dad and I say. she always used to moan when asked to babysit so no lose.. Grand parents should not get involved at all, like mine did telling my daughter that because she was nearly 16 she could stay and live with her if her dad said so, it didnt matter what I had to say. At times like this we may all be a bit selfish with what we want, but ask most mums and they know what is best for the own children. We know our kids better than anyone I hope this lady gets what she wants . Its a great life out here for my kids and its the best thing we ever did,,,, ASK MY CHILDREN

[Dylan1]

To all who have given me support it seems I will not need to go down the court route as after speaking to my boys dad, he has texted me within 2 hrs and has put a price on their head :( although this is what I expected and in all honesty if me moving with the boys would of caused so much heartache then I would not of taken them till it would of been their choice, but now to know how little my amazing boys mean to their dad, with just 2 hrs to think about it, he wants my house.

Hi Lisa
I've just been catching up on some of your posts. I really dont know what to say except that your ex must be a proper scumbag.

I start to lose faith in human nature when I read things like your last post. For him to be willing to give his children up for your house is beneath contempt. I do hope you told him to **** off

If going to live in oz is something that you are certain you want and you think you could get a visa then you should take this matter to a court.

Go and see a solicitor as soon as possible. They are expensive and I dont know what your finances are like but the consultation should be free. They will explain the ins and outs for you. It's all rather straight forward and if you cant afford a solicitor after your first meeting then I think it is more than possible to do it yourself.

I'm trying to keep my kids at home in the U.K but I am the total opposite to your ex.

I have been told by my solicitor that my ex stands a good chance and I see my kids all the time. So bearing this in mind I dont think you will have much trouble yourself.

Anyways, good luck.

[rikyuu]

to OP, it's a concern for me as a father, although it's not happened to me, I do feel that women have the upper hand in these issues. This is only my opinion;
I believe in equal rights, but where child custody is concerned, there still seems to be a lean towards the mother getting custody and the father paying to support his kids, but then fighting to get to see them. There still seems to be this thought that fathers aren't as attached to their children as the mothers are because the fathers didn't give birth. But I can say that's completely wrong. Taking my kids away would be worse than removing my arm or leg, it would be like taking away my soul!! And don't forget, women don't just leave men because the man screwed up. He could be a great father and husband, but maybe she found someone richer, better looking, better job, less pressures etc etc.
The lack of equality on the issue is what causes the problem. If the father works full time to support his family, he won't get custody because he works. If the father doesn't work and the mother moves in with a working guy, he still won't get custody because he can't support the kids.
All relationships go through rough patches, but there is a huge incentive for the father to work at it otherwise he'll lose the kids, where-as for the mother there's a good chance she'll keep the kids and get financial support from the father.
These threats of taking the kids abroad are shocking to a father. I couldn't think of anything worse, yet a lot of people seem to think it wouldn't effect the father so much as he can call or Skype!!! That is an insult beyond belief.
I read there is a thing called the Hague convention, which prevents either parent from taking their child to another country (who signed up) without permission from each parent. There is a problem however, when one parent is from another country and wishes to take their kids there. The courts may rule that this is equally the kids home country (even if they've never lived there), if that's the parent's home country.

[2tigers]

I read there is a thing called the Hague convention, which prevents either parent from taking their child to another country (who signed up) without permission from each parent. There is a problem however, when one parent is from another country and wishes to take their kids there. The courts may rule that this is equally the kids home country (even if they've never lived there), if that's the parent's home country.

No the HC doesn't work like that. There are so many scenarios but the one you have mentioned wouldn't hold in court, it doesn't matter what country the parents come from, or where the child was born. The HC is enforceable and difficult to overturn, it does not see the other parents country as an equal home for a child, even if that child had been born there. The 'home' is where the parents have made a joint decision to live, not where they come from.

If you read the sticky on 'Chat' called 'Children - what happens if one of you wants to go home' you'll get a better idea of what the HC is.