I'm a bit confused about state sponsorship, help!!

[tumblealot]

Hello everyone,

Its so nice that everyone is so friendly and helpful on this site.

My question is;

We are applying for state sponsorship to bump up our points (i think its a 175 visa, my oh is a hairdresser). we are looking to go to queensland (Brissie if pos) but they are not doing sponorship for hairdressers. We have been told that we can apply for sponsorship to another state, and when our visa is granted, we can 'change' our minds and go and live in whatever state we want. The government would let us live in a different state to the one we originally applied for. we thought this was a bit weird and thought whats the point of state sponsorship in the first place?

Has anyone come across this problem or been told similar things by an agent?

I would be grateful for any responses.

Thanks so much, tumblealot x

[Gollywobbler]

Hello tumblealot

You are describing a State Sponsored subclass 176 visa. Your Agent is right in saying that QLD does not have Hairdressing on its list for this visa:

Skilled Sponsored Eligible Skills List

It is, for example, on the corresponding link for West Australia:

http://www.migration.wa.gov.au/media...kills-list.pdf

Some of the other States probably offer it as well.

If somebody applies for State Sponsorship because they want to live in the State concerned, obviously there is no problem. If they have no intention of living in the Sponsoring State, essentially it is a breach of the trust upon which the visa relies.

Provided, however, that the State and DIAC both believe that the desire to move to the Sponsoring State was genuine at the outset and genuine at the time of the grant, but later the person had a genuine change of mind for a genuine reason, that is within the confines of both the law and the policy.

DIAC know that they would have a hard job to prove what somebody's real intentions were so in practice neither they or the State tend to bother to take the point against the person concerned. Therefore lots of people do tend to treat the State offering the sponsorship as nothing more than a stepping stone to getting a visa enabling them to move to a different State of their choice.

However, do bear in mind that if you arrive at Brisbane Airport with a 176 visa, the Immigration Officer would be able to do a couple of quick checks, which would establish that WA sponsored you for the visa. If your 176 visa has not been used for entry to Oz before, it would not take too much brain-power to ask you about your occupation, to ask which State sponsored you for a visa, and then ask you why you have chosen to travel to Brisbane instead of to Perth?

In practice it would be very unlikely that this would happen because their Service Standards at airports require DIAC to try to get all the passengers through Immigration Control within 30 minutes of the person joining the queue. They do not have time to grill everybody and there is no reason why they should single you out.

However, I've had a quick look at some of your earlier posts.

Initially your Agent said that you would be eligible for a skilled 175 visa as long as OH scores 7.0 or above in each of the four modules of the IELTS. In that case, you must be 5 or 10 points short of the 120 points needed for the 175 visa, I would think.

With the 176 visa, you only need 100 points and State Sponsorship is worth 10 of the points, so it is much easier to qualify for the 176.

However I would suggest that you do the points tests for both visas yourselves and see whether you could find 120 points for the 175:

Skilled – Independent (Migrant) visa (subclass 175)

Skilled – Independent (Migrant) visa (subclass 175)

Open the Points test page in 2 separate browsers, so that you can treat one of them as an on-line form and complete it, and look at the other for the information in the links.

Skilled – Sponsored (Migrant) visa (subclass 176)

Skilled – Sponsored (Migrant) visa (subclass 176)

You should study Booklet 6 as well:

Information Booklets - Applications & Forms - Visas & Immigration

Best wishes

Gill

[AndyandYvonneD]

Hi,

The state sponsored visa is a 176, the state sponsors you but this sponsorship on your behalf is only a moral decision to move there not a legal requirement to do so. I think this is what your agent will be talking about.

Hope this helps

Yvonne

[Gollywobbler]

Hi,

The state sponsored visa is a 176, the state sponsors you but this sponsorship on your behalf is only a moral decision to move there not a legal requirement to do so. I think this is what your agent will be talking about.

Hope this helps

Yvonne

Hi Yvonne

It is not quite "only a moral decision to move there...."

Please see this thread:

http://www.pomsinoz.com/forum/migrat...s-176visa.html

The visa system is founded on trust - and on good faith - on the part of the applicants and Australia respectively.

Australia does "play the white man" towards its new migrants. Australia keeps its own end of the legal and moral bargain. Are brand new migrants to the place absolved from treating Australia with similar respect, I wonder?

I've seen too much of "it is only a moral obligation" on here lately: and I'm the first to admit that I have repeated it myself before I understood the way that the whole thing actually works.

JAJ is right, though, and I was wrong (quoted in the thread above and again below.)

The obligations on STNI visa holders are moral rather than legal, so as long as you intended in good faith at the time to settle in Tasmania, there is no basis in law to cancel your visa later on.

JAJ used to be a registered migration agent though he has now moved on to doing something else. He might be a bit straight laced compared to some other RMAs, but that does not by itself make JAJ wrong.

I'm just a bit chary after reading his statement.

If I were in tumblealot's position, first I would do the points tests for both visas myself instead of just relying on what my Agent says. If her OH could score 120 points via doing the IELTS, it would be worth considering, I reckon.

If doing the IELTS would not get him up to 120 points, I wouldn't simply leap for a 176 visa sponsored by a State on the other side of the continent simply in order to grab PR from Day One.

One thing that would concern me in tumblealot's shoes is that the State lists are not plucked out of thin air. Hairdresser is not on the QLD list because QLD reckon that they do not need to dangle a carrot in order to convince Hairdressers to choose Brisbane, the Gold Coast and the Sunshine Coast. How strong is the demand for new Hairdressers in Brisbane, then? A lot of people chasing a small number of jobs need not expect super-high earnings, for instance.

You are probably not aware of this but I looked through some of tumbletot's earlier posts. The Agent they selected seemed like the bees knees till she got their money. Since then, the woman very rarely bothers to return phone calls or e-mails.

The fact that the Agent told Hubby that he would be eligible for a 175 (as long as he did the IELTS) and then abruptly changed tack about which visa without really explaining why suggests to me that this Agent is not that bothered about the best interests of tumblealot and her Hubby, and not that careful about the advice she gives either.

Evidently she has worked out their points twice and has arrived at differing totals. Why? An Agent ought to be able to work the points test out accurately the first time, shouldn't she?

Hence my feeling that Step One is for the couple to do the points for both visas themselves, and then see where it takes us after that.

Best wishes

Gill

Best wishes

Gill

[tumblealot]

Hello tumblealot

You are describing a State Sponsored subclass 176 visa. Your Agent is right in saying that QLD does not have Hairdressing on its list for this visa:

Skilled Sponsored Eligible Skills List

It is, for example, on the corresponding link for West Australia:

http://www.migration.wa.gov.au/media...kills-list.pdf

Some of the other States probably offer it as well.

If somebody applies for State Sponsorship because they want to live in the State concerned, obviously there is no problem. If they have no intention of living in the Sponsoring State, essentially it is a breach of the trust upon which the visa relies.

Provided, however, that the State and DIAC both believe that the desire to move to the Sponsoring State was genuine at the outset and genuine at the time of the grant, but later the person had a genuine change of mind for a genuine reason, that is within the confines of both the law and the policy.

DIAC know that they would have a hard job to prove what somebody's real intentions were so in practice neither they or the State tend to bother to take the point against the person concerned. Therefore lots of people do tend to treat the State offering the sponsorship as nothing more than a stepping stone to getting a visa enabling them to move to a different State of their choice.

However, do bear in mind that if you arrive at Brisbane Airport with a 196 visa, the Immigration Officer would be able to do a couple of quick checks, which would establish that WA sponsored you for the visa. If your 176 visa has not been used for entry to Oz before, it would not take too much brain-power to ask you about your occupation, to ask which State sponsored you for a visa, and then ask you why you have chosen to travel to Brisbane instead of to Perth?

In practice it would be very unlikely that this would happen because their Service Standards at airports require DIAC to try to get all the passengers through Immigration Control within 30 minutes of the person joining the queue. They do not have time to grill everybody and there is no reason why they should single you out.

However, I've had a quick look at some of your earlier posts.

Initially your Agent said that you would be eligible for a skilled 175 visa as lonng as OH scores 7.0 or above in each of the four modules of the IELTS. In that case, you must be 5 or 10 points short of the 120 points needed for the 175 visa, I would think.

With the 176 visa, you only need 100 points and State Sponsorship is worth 10 of the points, so it is much easier to qualify for the 176.

However I would suggest that you do the points tests for both visas yourselves and see whether you could find 120 points for the 175:

Skilled – Independent (Migrant) visa (subclass 175)

Skilled – Independent (Migrant) visa (subclass 175)

Open the Points test page in 2 separate browsers, so that you can treat one of them as an on-line form and complete it, and look at the other for the information in the links.

Skilled – Sponsored (Migrant) visa (subclass 176)

Skilled – Sponsored (Migrant) visa (subclass 176)

You should study Booklet 6 as well:

Information Booklets - Applications & Forms - Visas & Immigration

Best wishes

Gill
Best wishes

Gill

Hi Gill,

Thank you for your reply, it is a wealth of information.

The only thing is, i'm not sure if it has helped me make up my mind of whats the best thing to do. I know you said its very unlikely that it would be found out, and it seems to be a thing that people do, but its a risk. I guess its a silly worry but i dont want to risk our dream.

Thanks for your help again and ill have to do a bit more research.

[tumblealot]

Hi Yvonne

It is not quite "only a moral decision to move there...."

Please see this thread:

http://www.pomsinoz.com/forum/migrat...s-176visa.html

The visa system is founded on trust - and on good faith - on the part of the applicants and Australia respectively.

Australia does "play the white man" towards its new migrants. Australia keeps its own end of the legal and moral bargain. Are brand new migrants to the place absolved from treating Australia with similar respect, I wonder?

I've seen too much of "it is only a moral obligation" on here lately: and I'm the first to admit that I have repeated it myself before I understood the way that the whole thing actually works.

JAJ is right, though, and I was wrong (quoted in the thread above and again below.)



JAJ used to be a registered migration agent though he has now moved on to doing something else. He might be a bit straight laced compared to some other RMAs, but that does not by itself make JAJ wrong.

I'm just a bit chary after reading his statement.

If I were in tumblealot's position, first I would do the points tests for both visas myself instead of just relying on what my Agent says. If her OH could score 120 points via doing the IELTS, it would be worth considering, I reckon.

If doing the IELTS would not get him up to 120 points, I wouldn't simply leap for a 176 visa sponsored by a State on the other side of the continent simply in order to grab PR from Day One.

One thing that would concern me in tumblealot's shoes is that the State lists are not plucked out of thin air. Hairdresser is not on the QLD list because QLD reckon that they do not need to dangle a carrot in order to convince Hairdressers to choose Brisbane, the Gold Coast and the Sunshine Coast. How strong is the demand for new Hairdressers in Brisbane, then? A lot of people chasing a small number of jobs need not expect super-high earnings, for instance.

You are probably not aware of this but I looked through some of tumbletot's earlier posts. The Agent they selected seemed like the bees knees till she got their money. Since then, the woman very rarely bothers to return phone calls or e-mails.

The fact that the Agent told Hubby that he would be eligible for a 175 (as long as he did the IELTS) and then abruptly changed tack about which visa without really explaining why suggests to me that this Agent is not that bothered about the best interests of tumblealot and her Hubby, and not that careful about the advice she gives either.

Evidently she has worked out their points twice and has arrived at differing totals. Why? An Agent ought to be able to work the points test out accurately the first time, shouldn't she?

Hence my feeling that Step One is for the couple to do the points for both visas themselves, and then see where it takes us after that.

Best wishes

Gill

Best wishes

Gill

Hello Gill again,

After reading your 2nd post, a lot of what you say makes sense, and i agree with what you say about morals and people taking Aus and the system for granted. We are going to seriously consider taking the IELTS exam anyway to get the extra points, and go for the 175 visa. We will also do the points test ourself for each category.

I agree that my agent doesn't always seem to have our best interests at heart and also there def seems to be a lack of consistant info. I dont want to change agent company completely, because we got such a confident feeling with the other agents. But i think we need to bring our concerns to the attention of the company, at the end of the day, all we want is the correct information and advice to the best route to get us to Aus.

Thank you again x