Does anybody know whether the $250,000 personal assets required in the 12 months before applying for this visa include the $100,000 business asset requirement. I have looked on the Department of Immigration and Citizenship website but cannot find anything.
I replied to you and then scrapped it because I realised I have missed a crucial point here.
Going through your earlier threads, you are 48 and your wife is 46.
What does each of you do at the moment, please? I am wondering whether there is a less complicated route for you than the student visa/subclass 845 route? For example, if you are already a business owner in the UK then a Business Skills visa might be possible for you?
Turning to the question you have asked in this thread, the relevant clauses of the DIAC website read as follows:
Significant assets:
Quote:
Your (or your and your spouse's) total assets in Australia for the 12 months prior to applying were greater than A$250,000.
Business Assets:
Quote:
Your (or your and your spouse's) total net assets in your main business (or two main businesses) in Australia for the 12 months prior to application were greater than A$100,000.
The significant assets part does not mention "personal assets". It says "total assets." From that I conclude that the proper construction of these two sections together must be that the net business assets can be part of the total assets?
That said though, this is the sort of question which an Agent of Alan Collett's calibre would be able to answer for certain, and I personally would not attempt this route without first rate professional advice.
Also, without in any way wishing to seem cheeky, how much of a gamble are you proposing to take? I ask because if sufficient funds are very definitely invested in Oz, so as to get extra points for net assets in the points test, then the question you are asking today seems virtually irrelevant to me?
The one thing that I - personally - would not do is rely on the idea of the business succeeding other than via being so heavily capitalised by me that it could not possibly fail to turn over substantially more than the minimum required. (Personally I would do it by buying houses for rental to new migrants, but each to their own about the type of business.)
Also, my close family are all in Perth and my sister is married to an Aussie whose entire family live in Perth, so via my family and my brother in law's family I could easily scrape enough family members together to be the employees of the business, thus ensuring that the 60 points for business attributes could not possibly go wrong on me. Buying enough housing stock that the turnover couldn't possibly fail would be the other element of my own strategy with this, but doing that would take care of your own query anyway, hence I am curious about the level of risk you are proposing to take?
I'm not saying I am right and you are wrong - not by ANY means. This happens to be the one route that might possibly work for me as well, so I am deeply interested in it but I am also nervous about it, plus I am almost 52 so age is much more significant for me than for you because I would have to bung in a larger capital whack in order to be sure of at least 5 points for net assets and preferably 10.
Presumably you would aim to launch the sc 845 application without waiting for your wife to complete her studies if you possibly can?
We have been advised by an agent that this our only route into Australia due to ages 50/48 and we are both very unsure about proceeding , buying a business seems a very big step but saying that some friends I have spoke to who have had a small business before can't see why we are worrying , if you buy the right business ( has to meet all the requirements of the 845 Established Business in Australia , employ 3 turnover 200k etc ) it should be ok.
Has anyone else gone down this route , please help
We have been advised SA ( Adelaide ?) is a good location , lower prices etc and still all classed as a regional location if that helps.
I am not a migration agent but as you can see from my exchange with Rodger, I’m curious about this possibility for myself, but/and/though I am as unsure about it as you are.
I am a bit older than you though, which makes a BIG difference when you look at the Points test for the sc 845 visa:
The younger one is, the safer it is although the richer one also is then the better, from my reading of this!
Are you sure that you mean the subclass 845 visa, though? Which other visa would you use as the springboard for it? I have heard suggestions that the idea is to get a Student Visa to start with because this enables one to live in Oz, work 20 hours a week during term time and unlimited hours in the holidays, and virtually anybody with a pulse can get a Student Visa. Also, I got to the 845 visa by telling the search box to find it, but I notice that the tab at the top has “students” lit up. Hence my impression that the 845 is designed to follow on from a student visa?
You have mentioned South Australia and the “regional” thing, though. That does not seem to be a pre-requisite for the subclass 845 visa? Therefore which visa has been suggested to you as the springboard via which you might later switch to the subclass 845 visa, and would it, in fact, be an 845 visa or one of the others like the subclass 846, please? I don’t know, hence all my question marks unfortunately!
Thee and me both need to have a thorough comb through Booklet 7, I reckon, because I have not noticed the subclass 846 visa before and I’ve never heard of some of the other visas listed on the main page 4 links ago!
With people of around your ages, I have seen descriptions of the subclass 163 visa but I think that for this general “cluster” of visas (the ones with “16” in the number) you need to be the owner of a business or at any rate a successful investor in the UK?
The short answer is that I don’t know any of the answers to any of your questions myself, but if you could clarify which visa has been suggested to you as the initial springboard, then it should make it easier for both of us to try to narrow this down. There is no way that both you and I are potentially eligible for half a dozen different visas! It will boil down to one or none when push comes to shove.
In the meanwhile, what does each of you and your wife do, please? I am aware that some Agents go around suggesting a Student visa followed by an 845 visa because this route does not depend on employer-sponsorship. However, with the regional 457 visa (leading to the RSMS permanent visa) potentially a wider range of skills can be used as the means of entry to Oz than is apparent from the main web pages, and an age-exemption is possibly available as well. If it can be done then it involves much less financial risk, it seems to me:
The age exemption is irrelevant for the temporary subclass 457 visa because there is no upper age limit on those, and it is not always necessary to have a positive skills assessment in order to be able to get an RSMS visa from Day One. Additionally, I have been told anecdotally by other (lay) members of Poms in Oz that it is easier to get an RSMS visa for South Australia than for anywhere else. I’ve no idea how true (or not) this might be but the authorities in SA are rumoured to be more accommodating then the others about some of the criteria, though everything in this final section of my reply depends on the list of skills above and also on finding a willing employer-sponsor as I understand all this (which is by NO means perfectly.)
I am going to put in my 5 pennies worth into this very interesting discussion:
1) I have always interpreted the requirements to mean that you can include the business assets in the personal (significant assets) requirement. And similarly for the points test net assets requirements. I have trawled through the definitions as well as policy documents and this is the conclusion I have arrived at, even taking into consideration the DIAC's fears about "double counting".
Having said that, I am waiting on final clarification on this (it has bugged me for a while, but I've not yet had it come up as an issue with applications). I will let you know as soon as I have an answer.
2) Of course running a business is risky, and you will have to keep all EBA requirements in mind at all times during your time in Australia on the student visa.
If you have successfully operated a business before then I agree with Gill, you should consider an application for a business visa (state sponsored) at the outset. If you have no previous business experience then yes the student to EBA is the way to go.
3) For the EBA points test, full time employees can be Australian citizens or permanent visa holders but not family members.
4) The crucial difference between the EBA (845) and Regional EBA (846) is that for the Regional EBA you must be a holder of a Business (Long Stay) visa at time of application.
5) The 457 to RSMS is as Gill has suggested a great route to go down and if that is an option for you then it definitely is a simpler route (as long as you are happy with the sponsoring employer of course).
This is proving very interesting, great to find others in the same situation or considering the same route down under.
We have seen a very good Migration / Business Agent but they are very expensive
£6000 upfront to proceed, even if we only go as far as Student visas.
We have been advised to apply for a Student Visa ( 572, vocational or trade course )
Then when the course starts apply for Visa work rights, then contact business brokers and look to buy a suitable business that meets the EBA ( 845 ) conditions.
Going to a Regional area was also advised as they usually offer more help to small businesses, just the agents advice, and there may be a very slim chance of getting RSMS sponsored ( 457 ) from a Regional employer. It could also help with the option below.
Another variation was also suggested, travel out on a Business Visitor ( Long Validity ) ETA, purchase or setup a business, then sponsor yourself to work in the business, if your job is on the 457 Gazetted Occupations List, you would then have to work in the business in that role, so the business would have to be in that field.
As an example for myself I am an IT Engineer, so the business would have to be
an IT / Computer related business. You would have 4 years on this visa and you still have to meet the EBA (845) visa to get permanent residence but no Student Visa.
We have to make a decision soon as I am 48 and the EBA could take 18 months so time could be tight as I can't find anymore funds to get extra points.
Just a correction on the student visa though: your student visa will now be granted with work rights, so you don't have to make an application for work rights on arrival anymore. That's a new change, long time coming, but very logical, and one less step to worry about. The DIAC being logical. For once!
Did I read correctly - £6,000 for a student visa application? With respect to the agency concerned, on a purely time costed basis that is significantly more than most agencies will charge for handling a student visa application, particularly if the agency also receives an introducer's fee from the uni or TAFE (you might want to enquire in this regard).
I dare say the agency concerned will give good reasons for their fees (what is the value add that justifies their costs?), but you may also want to make enquiries elsewhere.
It seems the key for you will be finding the business that will enable a permanent residency visa application to proceed in due course - this is the highest risk in your strategy in my view - so I would be focussing efforts on finding a professional that can help you minimise that risk. That professional is more likely to be in Australia than in the UK.
Best regards.
__________________
Managing Director, Go Matilda, http://www.gomatilda.com
Registered Migration Agent Number 0102534 and Chartered Accountant (England & Wales, and Australia)
Offices in the UK and in Australia
PS. Another issue that would have to be addressed in due course under the 845 strategy is the requirement to have been actively involved in, and directly responsible for, the day to day management and overall performance of your main business (or two main businesses): Established Business in Australia (Subclass 845)
Additionally, I have been told anecdotally by other (lay) members of Poms in Oz that it is easier to get an RSMS visa for South Australia than for anywhere else. I’ve no idea how true (or not) this might be but the authorities in SA are rumoured to be more accommodating then the others about some of the criteria, though everything in this final section of my reply depends on the list of skills above and also on finding a willing employer-sponsor as I understand all this (which is by NO means perfectly.)
Best wishes
Gill
Gill,
Candidly, we have found the Regional Certifying Bodies in SA the most troublesome to deal with. I won't bore you with the details, but I seriously question the competencies of some in the more regional areas. They may have improved in the last few months, but our experiences in late 2007 and earlier this year were of individuals who were finding their way.
I'd do away with RCBs, but that's another story.
Best regards.
__________________
Managing Director, Go Matilda, http://www.gomatilda.com
Registered Migration Agent Number 0102534 and Chartered Accountant (England & Wales, and Australia)
Offices in the UK and in Australia
