Better education - UK or Australia?

[jennlx]

I was just wondering what the general consensus is on this from UK expats... I am getting stressed out by the whole issue! My child is still very young, but the more I look into education in general, the more worried I get! My son is going to a day nursery here in the UK and although the price is extortionate, I do love the Ofsted-guidelines and the amount of teaching he receives at a relatively young age. Comparably, in Australia, they don't seem to have a similar framework so would he just be sitting in front of a few secondhand toys all day? What about state primary schools in Australia - are they any good, compared to the UK? I'm from Melbourne but we went to private schools so I don't know anything about state schools, beyond the snobby attitude towards them (the local state high school near us literally was full of kids who had been expelled from other schools in the region) although we were aware of the couple that were excellent (e.g. MacRobertson). My OH and myself don't earn much and getting to Oz will be all of meagre savings and if it all goes wrong, we would really struggle to return back to the UK so I am stressing majorly over the whole thing. I really just want the best for my kids - any feedback much appreciated!!!

[david lockett]

Hi.
You have to decide that you want to come to OZ. or not don,t dither about we are in our 60,s and we don,t regret coming at all ,my son and his family have been here for 15yrs. and the education
their children have is the best in state schools ,I help out at the state school and it is 21-1 much
better than the U.K. and the opportunities for them to get on are much better,we live on the Gold Coast ,so make that decision and stop getting stressed. David.

[Jibbah24]

Hi....

I brought my family back to Melbourne after 20 years in the UK, and schools and the kids generally has always been a driving factor for returning. My two have been in our local primary school since June and they have been doing really well. The school is very well equipped and they are enjoying the teaching style whilst still being challenged.

Both are making really good progress and have settled in very well. We did a lot of research using the Better Education website which gives a guide as to how well a school does in the standard tests, however, this is only a guide as you can sometimes have a poor year with results in even the best schools.

The kids have so many more opportunities to try different things at schools in Australia and I am yet to see one that hasn't been very well equipped.

My wife is a primary school teacher so she is pretty thorough!!

Good luck and don't worry about this issue.....you will not be disappointed!

[snifter]

I don't know. I don't feel its better or worse. Its different. I'm married to an Aussie who went through the Aussie school system and came out the other side with a great degree and has been in work since then. And know people who are teachers in Aus. The way they explain it, they have a different approach to things and I actually like the sound of it.

I'm going to quote this post from another thread as I think it explains it far better than I ever could. Thread here

I am just curious but how do people judge what is a "good" education? I often find that parents cannot quantify it but I think it is important to note that these days we are not filling children's heads with facts but encouraging independent learning and critical thinking. In my experience, education in the US is very "textbook" and children learn historical dates, facts etc from a textbook but here in Aus we are teaching children to be able to find out information for themselves as the facts in books are often out of date by the time the books are published. I often hear parents judging primary teachers on the homework they hand out, whereas the reality is that time and time again it has been proved that homework in the primary years does not raise student achievement. Most teachers hate giving it because they know this but parents want it (but don't know why they want it!). I do find as a teacher lots of people think they know everything about education - mainly because they went to school themselves.... Sorry to hijack this thread!

Its the part about 'important to note that these days we are not filling children's heads with facts but encouraging independent learning and critical thinking' that stands out for me. Perhaps being able to talk to Aussie teachers has helped me understand the differences, perhaps its that I don't have this worry about the schooling is going to be sub standard or let my son down badly or fail. I think you get good and not so good schools anywhere.

Australia isn't a 3rd world country or some backwater place (although some might say otherwise but then some say that about the UK aswell ). Like anywhere, if you look around you should be able to find a good nursery for your child. Much like here, there are good and not so good.

Also I don't hold much in the UK education system in the early years and feel we start our children far to early in school when it should be more play based and actual learning begin later. If you look at some Scandinavian countries that lead the world in education, the kids there don't start school till 7. 7. They catch up very quickly to the same level as our kids here in the UK who have been at school since 4 or 5. So what does that tell you? I think that alone speaks volumes and wonder why we can't change (don't get me started on why, its an endless minefield and will not happen in the next 20 years if ever alas). We are one of only a handful of countries in Europe who start their kids so young at school. I don't look forward to lots of 'teaching' when my son is young here in the UK. I don't believe in the long term it will be what helps him do well later on in his school life. Nor do I believe Ofsted is the best thing to judge our schools or their acheivements. It helps in some ways but I'd not place my trust in it overly and prefer to go on my gut feeling, word of mouth, parental feedback and all those other things.

I am more than happy that when we move back to Aus (hubby is an Aussie, me from UK) our son will be just fine in the Aussie education system. We'll do our utmost to ensure we find what we feel is a good school for him, same as we would if we were in the UK.

[LKC]

I can only speak from my own experience of having two children, but I have been happy. Our eldest daughter started kindy this year at almost 5 and has absolutely amazed me with her progress. I help out once a week with reading, and compared to the start of the year, the children are all doing well. They are all polite and well mannered, enthusiastic and they seem to have a very well rounded education that includes things like public speaking and things that wouldn't be done at school in the UK. There are 20 students in Sophies class, with one or sometimes two teachers, plus parents are encouraged to go in and help, so there is usually a parent or two in the class too. The children are encouraged to mix with the older children which I think is a great idea, because it means that the older children feel responsible towards the younger ones. She attends a state school.

Daycare is expensive, I pay $75 per day, two days per week. The only reason I send our youngest is because I work from home and there are things that I do for my work that involve chemicals and a soldering torch (I make jewellery and run an internet shop), plus I have paperwork and computer work to do, and I can't really do those things with her around. Pre-school and the like don't seem to be so heavily subscribed to, with most children that I know only going maybe one or two days per week until school at five or six.

In my opinion, it is the parents who make the child rather than the school, and so providing you get a reasonably good school and are willing to put in some work yourself rather than leave it to the teachers, it will be fine.

[LKC]

I don't know. I don't feel its better or worse. Its different. I'm married to an Aussie who went through the Aussie school system and came out the other side with a great degree and has been in work since then. And know people who are teachers in Aus. The way they explain it, they have a different approach to things and I actually like the sound of it.

I'm going to quote this post from another thread as I think it explains it far better than I ever could. Thread here



Its the part about 'important to note that these days we are not filling children's heads with facts but encouraging independent learning and critical thinking' that stands out for me. Perhaps being able to talk to Aussie teachers has helped me understand the differences, perhaps its that I don't have this worry about the schooling is going to be sub standard or let my son down badly or fail. I think you get good and not so good schools anywhere.

Australia isn't a 3rd world country or some backwater place (although some might say otherwise but then some say that about the UK aswell ). Like anywhere, if you look around you should be able to find a good nursery for your child. Much like here, there are good and not so good.

Also I don't hold much in the UK education system in the early years and feel we start our children far to early in school when it should be more play based and actual learning begin later. If you look at some Scandinavian countries that lead the world in education, the kids there don't start school till 7. 7. They catch up very quickly to the same level as our kids here in the UK who have been at school since 4 or 5. So what does that tell you? I think that alone speaks volumes and wonder why we can't change (don't get me started on why, its an endless minefield and will not happen in the next 20 years if ever alas). We are one of only a handful of countries in Europe who start their kids so young at school. I don't look forward to lots of 'teaching' when my son is young here in the UK. I don't believe in the long term it will be what helps him do well later on in his school life. Nor do I believe Ofsted is the best thing to judge our schools or their acheivements. It helps in some ways but I'd not place my trust in it overly and prefer to go on my gut feeling, word of mouth, parental feedback and all those other things.

I am more than happy that when we move back to Aus (hubby is an Aussie, me from UK) our son will be just fine in the Aussie education system. We'll do our utmost to ensure we find what we feel is a good school for him, same as we would if we were in the UK.

Totally agree with the above. Dd1 has been learning to write, and they don't only teach her to write letters by rote, but right from the very first day they have been taught how to write good stories. I am absolutely flabbergasted sometimes when I see the quality of the writing. And this is in a kindy class! I am totally of the opinion that you should teach a child to ask questions and to think for themselves. If they don't know the answer, do they know where to find the answer?

I also agree that we start them too early in the UK.

[Rudi]

I think it really depends on what you define as a good education and what outcomes you are looking. If you are looking for a purely academic education which gets your child into university then stay in the UK. If you are looking for a more rounded, but possibly less academically focused education (particularly at primary school level), which gets you to university and then gains you pretty much the same degree as you would get in the UK then come to Australia.

Children do not need to learn to read and write at pre-school. The whole point of a pre-school is to socialise your children and let them learn to be with other children, how to interact with them, how to play together, how to follow rules etc. There is PLENTY of time to learn to read and write in school. It certainly does not harm children to learn these academic activities later.

love

Rudi
x

[jennlx]

Thanks very much for your responses - music to my ears, really! And LKC, you made a very good point: I have been so busy trying to provide for my son financially, I did tend to expect someone else to come along and educate him - a tad embarrassing to admit.

Also I come from a very 'academic' background and this was very much the focus of my parents. The result? One brother is a security guard, the other in IT and the other an electrician. All food for thought!

Is it then of your opinion that the 'state' schools are of no worse quality than state schools in the UK? I always presumed that as most primary schools in the UK are state, they would be better than in Australia, where there tend to be a lot more private schools.

[julie38]

Hi
We are coming to Oz in January and my youngest has just turned 7 but has never attended an english school as we live in France.My worry is will she be picked on as her reading and writing in english is very basic.We have 2 older girls and they read and write fine with the exception of a few spellings.
Can anyone tell me at what age in Oz do they start to read and write.
Will she really stand out,we are reading loads with her but they are still in the French system and it is very demanding.That's one of our reasons for moving to Australia.Our girls start school at 8.30 and finish at 5.30 (there is no school Wednesdays)they have homework every evening.
julie

[Quoll]

6 of one and half a dozen of the other I should think.

I know of several UK families who returned because they thought the ACT system was not doing enough for their kids (probably quite justifiably - almost half of ACT kids go to private schools and just over half go private for HS!!!)

By the end of honours it will be pretty much the same no matter which side they are educated on. My son (privately educated in Australia) has had no problems with establishing a good career in UK but he does make comments about the quality of degree that some of his colleagues seem to have experienced and it wasnt favourable towards his alma mater (but then, perhaps one shouldnt be comparing Oxbridge with ANU?) where group assessments often with people who speak little to no English contributing to the group mark are the norm.

On balance, what I have seen of my friends and their kids and from working in schools for a long time, I would go for the UK - far more rigor and accountability from teachers for starters but I know that ACT is probably less inclined to rigor than other states are. I do think it is a bit of an indictment though that close to half the parental population choose to put their hands in their pockets to pay for an education when there is a freebie on offer across the street (and many have tried the free option first!).